Is this whole thing a Haskell Mk2? (13 Viewers)

[SkyBlueCRJ]

They’re not really a regulatory body though, they simply govern the running of a competition.

Really? The EFL board can enforce law (E.g. Fine players and clubs) and can push for their own laws to be implemented (E.g. Safe standing) so surely they are?

 

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[SkyBlueCRJ]

Their legislation is based on whether UK laws permit him to be involved in business.

If they didn’t allow him, it’d open up a whole raft of legal challenges that the EFL are not capable of or have the appetite to be involved in.

And they can’t suspend a sale because they don’t own or have an interest in any football club

So effectively as i've repeatedly stated their laws are completely outdated and bare no weight whatsoever.

They can't suspend a purchase but they can block a purchase due to the fit and proper owners test. Right that makes sense...

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

Really? The EFL board can enforce law (E.g. Fine players and clubs) and can push for their own laws to be implemented (E.g. Safe standing) so surely they are?

Fines are not the same thing as business ownership though are they? Fines are just part of the membership rules

Business ownership though is governed through the laws carried out by parliament.

You can’t just prevent someone from owning a business because you don’t agree with their methods - they have to be barred legally

And safe standing will be implemented, only if the government agree to it.

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

So effectively as i've repeatedly stated their laws are completely outdated and bare no weight whatsoever.

They can't suspend a purchase but they can block a purchase due to the fit and proper owners test. Right that makes sense...

They can only suspend a purchase for a finite amount of time. The investigation is merely an excercise to find something that would hold wait in the judicial courts.

Again, they have no laws, they’re simply following the countries legal process. There’s never been anything that can do, I don’t understand why you think they ever could

 

[SkyBlueCRJ]

Fines are not the same thing as business ownership though are they? Fines are just part of the membership rules

Business ownership though is governed through the laws carried out by parliament.

You can’t just prevent someone from owning a business because you don’t agree with their methods - they have to be barred legally

And safe standing will be implemented, only if the government agree to it.

I'm not discussing a parliamentary regulating body I'm discussing a sporting regulating body. The two are obviously different? A sports governing body is a sports organisation or party that has a regulatory or sanctioning function?

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

I'm not discussing a parliamentary regulating body I'm discussing a sporting regulating body. The two are obviously different? A sports governing body is a sports organisation or party that has a regulatory or sanctioning function?

The sports governing body have no say over anything other than how their competition runs.

You’re discussing club ownership - this can only be affected by the laws of the country

 

[SkyBlueCRJ]

They can only suspend a purchase for a finite amount of time. The investigation is merely an excercise to find something that would hold wait in the judicial courts.

Again, they have no laws, they’re simply following the countries legal process. There’s never been anything that can do, I don’t understand why you think they ever could

The fit and proper owners test was introduced for directors and owners of football clubs independently by the Premier League, EFL and National League. Why do you keep bringing in the country's legal process?

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

The fit and proper owners test was introduced for directors and owners of football clubs independently by the Premier League, EFL and National League. Why do you keep bringing in the country's legal process?

Because the questions raised were based on what the EFL can do about dodgy owners.

They brought this in so they could try to regulate ownership of the clubs, this in reality has never been effective or of use because said owners haven’t done anything that stops them running a business in the eyes of the law

Hence why the likes of the Bolton owner, Leeds owner and the forest owner have been allowed to run clubs

 

[SkyBlueCRJ]

Because the questions raised were based on what the EFL can do about dodgy owners.

They brought this in so they could try to regulate ownership of the clubs, this in reality has never been effective or of use because said owners haven’t done anything that stops them running a business in the eyes of the law

You've just agreed with my point so why are you attempting to refute it?

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

I understand your premise but I'm afraid it's far too black and white and no offence intended but it sums up why the EFL and the F.A. are both criticised for being ineffective. Plus, I don't understand what interfering in general business practices has to do with anything really as obviously the F.A. or the EFL wouldn't get involved in such matters, unless it puts a club into harms way. If an owners choices interferes with the physical existence of a football club then the EFL should be granted sufficient powers to stop this. So I say again, that's not interfering in general business practices, that's representing and acting in the interests of its 72 members and its fans. Which is actually one of their main USP's.

Forgive me, I was catching up with previous responses as I was getting in this debate.

My point related to the fact that they couldn’t actually get the powers you spoke of, without interfering with general laws in the country

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

The problem people have is that they look at “fit and proper” as a moral/ethical thing.

The fact is you only fail it if you have broken the law. SISU from a football fans point of view are a nightmare - we all want them to chuck millions in without adding to the debt, but reality is they’re not going to. That isn’t unfit - that’s prudent.

With the stadium issue, all they have to argue is, is that the lease was unsustainable .they couldn’t afford it - again that’s not wrong.

The EFL cannot deem them unfit, because they’re following their legal rights to whatever justice they feel they’re owed.

The reason why I would despise Sisu and I am sure it is the same for other people is not because they didn’t chuck millions at us. That isn’t the issue at all. It is the totally incompetent way that they have run the club which has resulted in the Northampton fiasco, losing the chance to buy into the stadium, leaving us homeless and lots of other misdemeanours that most people could state. They are not fit and proper persons to own this club because they have severely, maybe fatally damaged it. The top and bottom of it is that the club is a community asset that they haven’t cared for and don’t care for. Our club is a hostage in whatever game they are playing.

 

[Grendel]

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The reason why I would despise Sisu and I am sure it is the same for other people is not because they didn’t chuck millions at us. That isn’t the issue at all. It is the totally incompetent way that they have run the club which has resulted in the Northampton fiasco, losing the chance to buy into the stadium, leaving us homeless and lots of other misdemeanours that most people could state. They are not fit and proper persons to own this club because they have severely, maybe fatally damaged it. The top and bottom of it is that the club is a community asset that they haven’t cared for and don’t care for. Our club is a hostage in whatever game they are playing.

A community asset valued as such by the local council?

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

The reason why I would despise Sisu and I am sure it is the same for other people is not because they didn’t chuck millions at us. That isn’t the issue at all. It is the totally incompetent way that they have run the club which has resulted in the Northampton fiasco, losing the chance to buy into the stadium, leaving us homeless and lots of other misdemeanours that most people could state. They are not fit and proper persons to own this club because they have severely, maybe fatally damaged it. The top and bottom of it is that the club is a community asset that they haven’t cared for and don’t care for. Our club is a hostage in whatever game they are playing.

We look at it from a fans point of view. The cold hard fact of the business world would see it as a business that was losing 7 million a year to breaking even.

And As Grendel said, if it was such a treasured community asset, then the council wouldn’t have put the final nail in the coffin that all but makes Coventry City unsaleable

 

[chiefdave]

Really? The EFL board can enforce law (E.g. Fine players and clubs) and can push for their own laws to be implemented (E.g. Safe standing) so surely they are?

The reality is things like fines are part of the rules of competition but even then it doesn't follow that should someone decide to challenge them in court they would hold up. Its just nobody has ever bothered to challenge them as its not worth the hassle.

They can push for law changes but they can't do it themselves. What you're suggesting is the league operates under a set of rules outside the law. To use your example they say safe standing is allowed yet the law says it isn't. Who do you think would win that battle, the EFL or the law?

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

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A community asset valued as such by the local council?

A quarter of a million people on the streets after the cup win, surely the largest ever gathering in the city centre. Production in local factories improved in the week after a win. Just two examples of the impact the local football team can have. Even for those who don’t go, the football club matters. The council does seem to have washed their hands of our club. Shame on them for that.

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

A quarter of a million people on the streets after the cup win, surely the largest ever gathering in the city centre. Production in local factories improved in the week after a win. Just two examples of the impact the local football team can have. Even for those who don’t go, the football club matters. The council does seem to have washed their hands of our club. Shame on them for that.

They also made sure SISU were the only game in town, so you can thank them for that aswell

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

We look at it from a fans point of view. The cold hard fact of the business world would see it as a business that was losing 7 million a year to breaking even.

And As Grendel said, if it was such a treasured community asset, then the council wouldn’t have put the final nail in the coffin that all but makes Coventry City unsaleable

I think most sensible people wouldn’t just expect someone to come in and lose a shed load of money. What they would want, particularly after the experience of Sisu running (ruining) the club, is to have owners who clearly care, who are transparent and who communicate. I think a lot of difficult decisions would be accepted if the circumstances are made clear. Sisu don’t care about the club, the fans or the city and everyone knows this.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

I was disputing the point about what made good owners. Why would I want to thank the council for ensuring we got Sisu?

 

[Grendel]

I think most sensible people wouldn’t just expect someone to come in and lose a shed load of money. What they would want, particularly after the experience of Sisu running (ruining) the club, is to have owners who clearly care, who are transparent and who communicate. I think a lot of difficult decisions would be accepted if the circumstances are made clear. Sisu don’t care about the club, the fans or the city and everyone knows this.

Nor do the council

 

[oldskyblue58]

The "laws" that govern the game are not written in statute. The FA has "rules of the game & FA Regulations", the EFL simply "EFL regulations". They are basically rules of the competition. They are not like the Companies Act 2006 for example covered by an act of parliament. Many of the rules carry with them an element of discretion for the Board to utilise if it sees fit

I would suspect placing a restriction on property would not suit many of the owners in any case because of the loans & securities that underpin the finances at the clubs. The owners are of course the ones that would have to vote in the change. But how do you force a restriction on stadium owners who are not FA/EFL members

Yes i think all clubs should be self sustaining but not sure i see that ever happening, too many egos and too much money at risk and too many fans demanding money being spent

The regulations carry force with the clubs because to be in the EFL, for example, you have to agree to abide by the rules. The laws that govern The FA limited for example are covered by the Companies Act but the FA regulations are internal and in addition to that (which is how they get away with the football creditors rule)

The problem with HM Government imposing statutes etc on the game is that it could well be viewed as political interference and get the FA suspended from FIFA, so losing its privileged position in controlling the game. I doubt they will take that risk

Also the more rules you put in place often the more loop holes are available.

Its not a bad idea i accept to link a club to a stadium, but as has already been said most unlikely to happen. The best i think you would get is permanently linking a club to a city or town(as is pretty much the case now), but even that has problems

 

[Captain Dart]

They’re not really a regulatory body though, they simply govern the running of a competition.

For a non regulatory body they sure have a lot of regulations.

 

[chiefdave]

A quarter of a million people on the streets after the cup win, surely the largest ever gathering in the city centre. Production in local factories improved in the week after a win. Just two examples of the impact the local football team can have. Even for those who don’t go, the football club matters. The council does seem to have washed their hands of our club. Shame on them for that.

Look at the way the city responded to things like the JPT win and the play offs. Even at that level it was a bigger deal than anything else in recent times.

 

[ccfcway]

pretty sure my old man had a Haskell Mk2

 

[Nick]

SISU could also help to resolve the crisis once and for all by agreeing to sell the Club to new owners who would secure a long-term sustainable future for the Sky Blues in Coventry.

We understand that an offer for the Club was made last year and is still on the table.

Another thing that was obvious.

Explains the silence to the other parties.

Just goes to show that agendas aren't always the same in all of this.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

The fit and proper owners test was introduced for directors and owners of football clubs independently by the Premier League, EFL and National League. Why do you keep bringing in the country's legal process?

I'd have thought because the legal framework supercedes anything said by a regulatory body. The league know that if there isn't a legal reason to bar directors/owners there's a real chance they will have litigation from those potential owners if they do. That's why so many unsuitable people get through the test - they're pretty much toothless.

Why I've never understood in the admin process they say all football creditors must be paid ahead of others - totally unenforceable because that's not what Insolvency Law states, which would have them down as trade creditors. If they actually enforced that you'd see a lot more careful management of transfer fees.

 

[Nick]

Does anybody remember when somebody at Wasps told Italia that spiel about Wasps saving us after we had died and we should sit and watch it happen or something and he tried to push it on here?

Looks quite relevant now as well.

 

[Nick]

Shock, people saying Hoffman is preparing a bid after speaking to him in the casino.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Shock, people saying Hoffman is preparing a bid after speaking to him in the casino.

Let’s jump in his car

He’s gonna take us home

 

[covcity4life]

Let’s jump in his car

He’s gonna take us home

And put sisu out flag on fishers

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

And put sisu out flag on fishers

Next week on the TIT Crowd

 

[Nick]

Anybody else catching up yet?

 

[shepardo01]

People maybe (hopefully!!) starting to see other villains...ccc/wasps (as well as SISU)... so a bid is made public, which will NEVER be accepted (SISU going nowhere) ...so que outrage (of the people that have no idea of anything other than "sisu bad- everybody else good") at not accepting bid... deflect away from others again....
This is where people think that somehow they can just acquire the club!??
BUT... it will be.....
No deal, efl never going to kick us out, so obvious groundshare.
Come on people... Get pressure on the people that don't want it on them... (wonder why!!!!!!????)

 

[fernandopartridge]

Shock, people saying Hoffman is preparing a bid after speaking to him in the casino.

He's going to prepare a bid if Dale lands black on the roulette table

 

[Nick]

How obvious was it months ago?

 

[fernandopartridge]

How obvious was it months ago?

It doesn't really matter though, does it? The 'campaign' if one exists will do nothing to encourage SISU to sell to Hoffman, the only reason they will sell is if it is to their benefit.