Why will they not sell up (5 Viewers)

[Irish Sky Blue]

[QUOTE="robbiekeane, post: 1764445, member: 8735"]Can you genuinely please bullet point the things they have done that you’re talking about that make them the worst? Honestly interested[/QUOTE]

Copied from a previous post is below. As I mentioned above, all parties are to blame for this mess. What Sisu has done to this club should not be marginalised or forgotten.

Sisu took this club away from it’s home city for more than a year, holding it and it’s supporters ransom, simply to try and distress ACL. (See comments from judges in JR cases)

Sisu have had a consistent policy of non communication. They never articulate what their plans are for the football club, the way forward, what they want to achieve. We hear nothing from Sepalla.

When information is given out through the likes of Fisher, much of it is blatantly untrue or can change on a whim.
“We are building our own ground”
“Three sites have been identified”
“We are never returnining to the Ricoh”
“We are still building our own stadium”(on returning to the Ricoh)
“ The Butts Park we want as our new stadium”
“ It has always been our intention to stay at the Ricoh”
“The Ricoh has always been plan A”

They have poisoned relationships with parties in the city and in the county that have adversely affected the club.(John Sharp wanting nothing to do with Sisu, Anderson,when he was CEO, saying how hard it was to engage with local businesses)

They have cut the infrastructure of the club to the bone,

Our training ground can still be sold for housing.(The new site identified by Fisher, but kept secret for “commercial reasons” still hasn’t been revealed and no work has begun)

For a long time we looked like losing our academy site. Only the incompetence of Wasps in lacking funds to buy the Higgs and build their own complex saved our bacon, nothing to do with anything that Sisu had done. Had Wasps plan not failed we may in fact have no academy or have an academy of lesser status possibly operating on school fields. Here too Fisher had said that we had no need of the Higgs Centre, we were building our own academy. (Yet more BS from him).

Yes we have had a promotion and the Checkatrade win. We have also had two relegations, have finished in our lowest league position ever, had the lowest gates for league matches probably since before the war, certainly since the early sixties (that’s not including the year and a bit in Northampton)

Sisu have alienated fans and divided those that remain. They have lost an enormous amount of “the customers” that they had when they came.

Sisu are not good owners. They are crap owners, the worst we have ever had. They have no regard for the football club and treat it’s supporters with contempt. Yes, they have tried to run the club as a break even business, a fair enough aim. However, they made little attempt to build the business up, to grow it so that the break even figure is higher. The real reason for the break even policy is so that the club is not costing them money, while they hold on to it and pursue their endless, futile legal action. Nothing to do with what is best for the club.
Sisu have been a total disaster for this club and no amount of rewriting history will ever change that.

 

---

[chiefdave]

Yes that's the one the same one that lives and breaths Cov City and is probably one of our only genuine hopes to get out of this mess eventually - Even top businessmen like him cannot negotiate a deal if the other party will not even speak

The same one that got us into this mess with Ranson?

Do you seriously believe if Hoffman made a genuine offer for an amount SISU deem acceptable they would say no just because it was him? Every time he offers something it turns out to be not quite what it seems. If he offered £20m up front rather than little up front, some more if and when Ryton is sold, some more if and when we get to the PL then he might have a chance.

 

[ccfcway]

I don’t get this site sometimes.

Point is whatever sisu have done is reversible, what the council and wasps have done isn’t

Don’t agree. All council need to do is give us the planning permission for the new stadium we need for the year round revenues. Ball in Sisu court to apply for planning and get the fans behind it.

 

[lordsummerisle]

Yes that's the one the same one that lives and breaths Cov City and is probably one of our only genuine hopes to get out of this mess eventually - Even top businessmen like him cannot negotiate a deal if the other party will not even speak

Wasn't he on the board with Sisu agreeing with Uncle Ray that they should shut down the Academy to save money and get Uncle Joe to soft-soap the fans?

Then get into the important business of making sure they still got a decent dinner in the directors box?

The same one who was getting into a consortium with a fantasist with millions from online poker?

 

[chiefdave]

The football club is very salable.

If you were interested in buying a football club and you weren't a CCFC fan what would make you want buying us a better option than every other club in the country?

 

[ccfcway]

If you were interested in buying a football club and you weren't a CCFC fan what would make you want buying us a better option than every other club in the country?

Potential. With the right ownership and building relationships, the only way is up

 

[oldfiver]

We have been experiencing the worst period in our history over several years and it now is going to get potentially worse
Playing before 4000- 5000 fans
The playing budget will no doubt be reduced
The manager and some of the players like the fans deciding at some point soon enough is enough
Why will these people not sell up? they can still continue there legals - why are they making the fans suffer more and more - It will get to the point that any sale will be worthless

The Club have already stated the playing budget will not be cut
SISU have undertaken to have a new stadium - that is legally committed to the EFL. If the Council continue to block a development with in the City boundary the club will have to drift over the border.
The only interest from the Club has been through Hoffman, who has discussed with WASPs and the Trust some form of shared ownership and playing at the Ricoh. WASP's would be the main beneficiaries to owning CCFC so why not come out and say so. That of course would please their "other parties" but would show how this scenario has been planned from years ago.

Also there are approximately 12 Clubs thought to be up for sale in the FL - even Smuthwaite is looking at Notts County - so plenty of others to choose from.

 

[Nick]

Copied from a previous post is below. As I mentioned above, all parties are to blame for this mess. What Sisu has done to this club should not be marginalised or forgotten.

Sisu took this club away from it’s home city for more than a year, holding it and it’s supporters ransom, simply to try and distress ACL. (See comments from judges in JR cases)

Sisu have had a consistent policy of non communication. They never articulate what their plans are for the football club, the way forward, what they want to achieve. We hear nothing from Sepalla.

When information is given out through the likes of Fisher, much of it is blatantly untrue or can change on a whim.
“We are building our own ground”
“Three sites have been identified”
“We are never returnining to the Ricoh”
“We are still building our own stadium”(on returning to the Ricoh)
“ The Butts Park we want as our new stadium”
“ It has always been our intention to stay at the Ricoh”
“The Ricoh has always been plan A”

They have poisoned relationships with parties in the city and in the county that have adversely affected the club.(John Sharp wanting nothing to do with Sisu, Anderson,when he was CEO, saying how hard it was to engage with local businesses)

They have cut the infrastructure of the club to the bone,

Our training ground can still be sold for housing.(The new site identified by Fisher, but kept secret for “commercial reasons” still hasn’t been revealed and no work has begun)

For a long time we looked like losing our academy site. Only the incompetence of Wasps in lacking funds to buy the Higgs and build their own complex saved our bacon, nothing to do with anything that Sisu had done. Had Wasps plan not failed we may in fact have no academy or have an academy of lesser status possibly operating on school fields. Here too Fisher had said that we had no need of the Higgs Centre, we were building our own academy. (Yet more BS from him).

Yes we have had a promotion and the Checkatrade win. We have also had two relegations, have finished in our lowest league position ever, had the lowest gates for league matches probably since before the war, certainly since the early sixties (that’s not including the year and a bit in Northampton)

Sisu have alienated fans and divided those that remain. They have lost an enormous amount of “the customers” that they had when they came.

Sisu are not good owners. They are crap owners, the worst we have ever had. They have no regard for the football club and treat it’s supporters with contempt. Yes, they have tried to run the club as a break even business, a fair enough aim. However, they made little attempt to build the business up, to grow it so that the break even figure is higher. The real reason for the break even policy is so that the club is not costing them money, while they hold on to it and pursue their endless, futile legal action. Nothing to do with what is best for the club.
Sisu have been a total disaster for this club and no amount of rewriting history will ever change that.

Do you ever thing that things have changed because of other parties along the way also?

Do you think that PR campaigns from other parties would have helped with alienating and dividing fans?

The training ground hasn't been sold and what do you think to Wasps trying to say the Academy had to leave the Higgs if CCFC wanted to play at the Ricoh?

It was literally in another thread about John Sharp being willing to work with SISU, again you don't seem to realise that.

This is the issue when you look at things from one angle only, multiple parties can cause particular outcomes but you don't seem to see it that way. Nice copy and paste list though.

 

[ccfcway]

The only interest from the Club has been through Hoffman, .

Is it ?. Or is it that they are the only ones who have gone public ?

 

[ccfcway]

Also there are approximately 12 Clubs thought to be up for sale in the FL - even Smuthwaite is looking at Notts County - so plenty of others to choose from.

And we own nothing. Wouldn’t surprise me if our actual market value was the lowest of all of them

 

[Ashdown]

[QUOTE="robbiekeane, post: 1764445, member: 8735"]Can you genuinely please bullet point the things they have done that you’re talking about that make them the worst? Honestly interested

Copied from a previous post is below. As I mentioned above, all parties are to blame for this mess. What Sisu has done to this club should not be marginalised or forgotten.

Sisu took this club away from it’s home city for more than a year, holding it and it’s supporters ransom, simply to try and distress ACL. (See comments from judges in JR cases)

Sisu have had a consistent policy of non communication. They never articulate what their plans are for the football club, the way forward, what they want to achieve. We hear nothing from Sepalla.

When information is given out through the likes of Fisher, much of it is blatantly untrue or can change on a whim.
“We are building our own ground”
“Three sites have been identified”
“We are never returnining to the Ricoh”
“We are still building our own stadium”(on returning to the Ricoh)
“ The Butts Park we want as our new stadium”
“ It has always been our intention to stay at the Ricoh”
“The Ricoh has always been plan A”

They have poisoned relationships with parties in the city and in the county that have adversely affected the club.(John Sharp wanting nothing to do with Sisu, Anderson,when he was CEO, saying how hard it was to engage with local businesses)

They have cut the infrastructure of the club to the bone,

Our training ground can still be sold for housing.(The new site identified by Fisher, but kept secret for “commercial reasons” still hasn’t been revealed and no work has begun)

For a long time we looked like losing our academy site. Only the incompetence of Wasps in lacking funds to buy the Higgs and build their own complex saved our bacon, nothing to do with anything that Sisu had done. Had Wasps plan not failed we may in fact have no academy or have an academy of lesser status possibly operating on school fields. Here too Fisher had said that we had no need of the Higgs Centre, we were building our own academy. (Yet more BS from him).

Yes we have had a promotion and the Checkatrade win. We have also had two relegations, have finished in our lowest league position ever, had the lowest gates for league matches probably since before the war, certainly since the early sixties (that’s not including the year and a bit in Northampton)

Sisu have alienated fans and divided those that remain. They have lost an enormous amount of “the customers” that they had when they came.

Sisu are not good owners. They are crap owners, the worst we have ever had. They have no regard for the football club and treat it’s supporters with contempt. Yes, they have tried to run the club as a break even business, a fair enough aim. However, they made little attempt to build the business up, to grow it so that the break even figure is higher. The real reason for the break even policy is so that the club is not costing them money, while they hold on to it and pursue their endless, futile legal action. Nothing to do with what is best for the club.
Sisu have been a total disaster for this club and no amount of rewriting history will ever change that.

[/QUOTE]
It's all marginalised on SBT ! Except SBT represents perhaps 5% of the fan base. Most realise all of the points above are pertinent to our demise, most also realise others fucked us over. Ultimately SISU have failed dismally with a single club in a City the size of Coventry. They fucked up from the beginning and they continue to fuck up. They lie and cajole and threaten and wonder why deals couldn't be struck with the the parties that mattered.

 

[Paxman II]

If you were interested in buying a football club and you weren't a CCFC fan what would make you want buying us a better option than every other club in the country?

Major one city club with historical premier league status
An excellent stadium and infrastructure
Local catchment area in excess of 500k (the wider area of being central midlands over 2 million)
A 250 year lease
Expansion plans already approved
Brand
Premier league rugby football club comes with (if required)
Additional facilities of the Ricoh for unrelated events.
Hotels and casinos
Further hotel site with permission
Relatively small investment in player squad needed to challenge for premier league and a further big pay day.

To name a few...

 

[Otis]

Copied from a previous post is below. As I mentioned above, all parties are to blame for this mess. What Sisu has done to this club should not be marginalised or forgotten.

Sisu took this club away from it’s home city for more than a year, holding it and it’s supporters ransom, simply to try and distress ACL. (See comments from judges in JR cases)

Sisu have had a consistent policy of non communication. They never articulate what their plans are for the football club, the way forward, what they want to achieve. We hear nothing from Sepalla.

When information is given out through the likes of Fisher, much of it is blatantly untrue or can change on a whim.
“We are building our own ground”
“Three sites have been identified”
“We are never returnining to the Ricoh”
“We are still building our own stadium”(on returning to the Ricoh)
“ The Butts Park we want as our new stadium”
“ It has always been our intention to stay at the Ricoh”
“The Ricoh has always been plan A”

They have poisoned relationships with parties in the city and in the county that have adversely affected the club.(John Sharp wanting nothing to do with Sisu, Anderson,when he was CEO, saying how hard it was to engage with local businesses)

They have cut the infrastructure of the club to the bone,

Our training ground can still be sold for housing.(The new site identified by Fisher, but kept secret for “commercial reasons” still hasn’t been revealed and no work has begun)

For a long time we looked like losing our academy site. Only the incompetence of Wasps in lacking funds to buy the Higgs and build their own complex saved our bacon, nothing to do with anything that Sisu had done. Had Wasps plan not failed we may in fact have no academy or have an academy of lesser status possibly operating on school fields. Here too Fisher had said that we had no need of the Higgs Centre, we were building our own academy. (Yet more BS from him).

Yes we have had a promotion and the Checkatrade win. We have also had two relegations, have finished in our lowest league position ever, had the lowest gates for league matches probably since before the war, certainly since the early sixties (that’s not including the year and a bit in Northampton)

Sisu have alienated fans and divided those that remain. They have lost an enormous amount of “the customers” that they had when they came.

Sisu are not good owners. They are crap owners, the worst we have ever had. They have no regard for the football club and treat it’s supporters with contempt. Yes, they have tried to run the club as a break even business, a fair enough aim. However, they made little attempt to build the business up, to grow it so that the break even figure is higher. The real reason for the break even policy is so that the club is not costing them money, while they hold on to it and pursue their endless, futile legal action. Nothing to do with what is best for the club.
Sisu have been a total disaster for this club and no amount of rewriting history will ever change that.
It's all marginalised on SBT ! Except SBT represents perhaps 5% of the fan base. Most realise all of the points above are pertinent to our demise, most also realise others fucked us over. Ultimately SISU have failed dismally with a single club in a City the size of Coventry. They fucked up from the beginning and they continue to fuck up. They lie and cajole and threaten and wonder why deals couldn't be struck with the the parties that mattered.

Three things always resonate with me.

1. They took the club out of Coventry

2. They want something like 60m for the club,which is just laughable and just constantly leaves between a rock and a hard place

3. They have given us 6 years of legal battles and therefore led to constant uncertainty.

 

[chiefdave]

In its current state, what’s it actually worth ?.

Not a great deal but I suspect you're not asking what is the cost of buying Otium but rather what is the cost of buying the assets while leaving behind the debt and that is the problem. If you buy the assets the debt doesn't disappear, that remains in the old company. Any deal will have to involve paying at least some of that off.

 

[chiefdave]

Don’t agree. All council need to do is give us the planning permission for the new stadium we need for the year round revenues. Ball in Sisu court to apply for planning and get the fans behind it.

Why would they apply for planning with no indication from the council they will sell the land to the club?

Is it too much to ask of the council that the football club gets the same treatment as Wasps. They've given them an option on land for a hotel once planning is approved.

 

[chiefdave]

An excellent stadium and infrastructure
A 250 year lease
Expansion plans already approved
Premier league rugby football club comes with (if required)
Additional facilities of the Ricoh for unrelated events.
Hotels and casinos
Further hotel site with permission

We don't have any of those. You've listed reason someone might want to take over Wasps.

Major one city club with historical premier league statusLocal catchment area in excess of 500k (the wider area of being central midlands over 2 million)
Brand
Relatively small investment in player squad needed to challenge for premier league and a further big pay day.

How does that make us a better option than other cities? Plenty of one city clubs and plenty of clubs with Premier League history.
The player investment needed at CCFC is no different to any other club.

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Was there? The Hoffman who was recently reported to be backed by a wealthy rugby club owner?

No he wasnt.
The backer who is a st holder recently sold his company for over 100M.
Now that is fact, has nothing to do with rugby.

 

[shepardo01]

No he wasnt.
The backer who is a st holder recently sold his company for over 100M.
Now that is fact, has nothing to do with rugby.

You are talking about Rich Overson. Yes, he is part of consortium along with Hoffman. I heard months ago and posted on here that Richardson was also part of the consortium long before Newbon put it out. Hoffman - Fact Overson - Fact Richardson - Very heavily rumoured from a number of sources.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

Do you ever thing that things have changed because of other parties along the way also?

Do you think that PR campaigns from other parties would have helped with alienating and dividing fans?

The training ground hasn't been sold and what do you think to Wasps trying to say the Academy had to leave the Higgs if CCFC wanted to play at the Ricoh?

It was literally in another thread about John Sharp being willing to work with SISU, again you don't seem to realise that.

This is the issue when you look at things from one angle only, multiple parties can cause particular outcomes but you don't seem to see it that way. Nice copy and paste list though.

Copy and paste was from my own post on another thread. Can’t see a problem with that as it answers the question I was asked.

I’ve said multiple times that Wasps should not be here and that they are culpable too. CCC are the other party that have caused the problems our club now face. They need to be part of the blame game too. It’s just a shame that quite a few are now exonerating, Sisu, can’t see anything wrong with the way that they have run the club. Sisu have been a disaster too. No amount of white wash will change that.

 

[shy_tall_knight]

SISU got the club for nothing in 2007 threw a load of money at it to try to get to the premiership but after the end of the 2008/09 season stopped being a net investor. Since then they have been bereft of a clear strategy.

They continue to own the club in the vain hope that they can recover their investment not for any love of the club or for any ambitious plans to invest in the club. I like the quote wanting a Ferrari price tag when only having a fiesta for sale. Very surprised at the love-in going on in here for SISU, they have been disastrous owners and we should all want new owners

 

[Colin Steins Smile]

SISU got the club for nothing in 2007 threw a load of money at it to try to get to the premiership but after the end of the 2008/09 season stopped being a net investor. Since then they have been bereft of a clear strategy.

They continue to own the club in the vain hope that they can recover their investment not for any love of the club or for any ambitious plans to invest in the club. I like the quote wanting a Ferrari price tag when only having a fiesta for sale. Very surprised at the love-in going on in here for SISU, they have been disastrous owners and we should all want new owners

I feel that SISU's focus one the value of the club is linked to the potential value of damages that they could receive IF and that is a BIG "IF' their complaint of state aid is upheld be the European commission.
As a hedge fund they've put all their energy and resources, post 2009, into litigation.

 

[robbiekeane]

They took the club out of Coventry

So what should they have done? Continued to pay 1.3 million a year for 24 days a year access to a stadium? So that’s what, 25% of what Wasps paid for a 250 year lease? Would you have preferred us to still be in that situation?

Don’t tell me they should have stayed and negotiated a better deal with the council...who were already dropping their pants for Wasps by this point. No chance would they have negotiated it and I’m sure our owners knew this.

With the recent revelations, I for one am glad that SISU broke that lease

 

[Sick Boy]

Major one city club with historical premier league status
An excellent stadium and infrastructure
Local catchment area in excess of 500k (the wider area of being central midlands over 2 million)
A 250 year lease
Expansion plans already approved
Brand
Premier league rugby football club comes with (if required)
Additional facilities of the Ricoh for unrelated events.
Hotels and casinos
Further hotel site with permission
Relatively small investment in player squad needed to challenge for premier league and a further big pay day.

To name a few...

What are you on about??

 

[Sick Boy]

Three things always resonate with me.

1. They took the club out of Coventry

In the long-term it got the club out of the rip off rental agreement. Imagine being in League 2 and still having to pay that level of rent.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

So what should they have done? Continued to pay 1.3 million a year for 24 days a year access to a stadium? So that’s what, 25% of what Wasps paid for a 250 year lease? Would you have preferred us to still be in that situation?

Don’t tell me they should have stayed and negotiated a better deal with the council...who were already dropping their pants for Wasps by this point. No chance would they have negotiated it and I’m sure our owners knew this.

With the recent revelations, I for one am glad that SISU broke that lease

Read what the judge in one of the JR cases said about the club being taken to Northampton. He was in no doubt that the only reason we were there was to distress ACL, something borne out by our rapid return to the Ricoh once Wasps were about to appear. They are despicable people using our club as a pawn, a bargaining chip in their power game. They have no regard for the club, it’s fans or this city. The days on which they and Wasps are forced out of Coventry will be days for celebration.

 

[Nick]

No he wasnt.
The backer who is a st holder recently sold his company for over 100M.
Now that is fact, has nothing to do with rugby.

I am on about a different one, not the one investing into the Academy

 

[robbiekeane]

Read what the judge in one of the JR cases said about the club being taken to Northampton. He was in no doubt that the only reason we were there was to distress ACL, something borne out by our rapid return to the Ricoh once Wasps were about to appear. They are despicable people using our club as a pawn, a bargaining chip in their power game. They have no regard for the club, it’s fans or this city. The days on which they and Wasps are forced out of Coventry will be days for celebration.

I don’t give a shit what the government appointed judge said in a case against a city council

 

[Sick Boy]

I reckon the reason they’re so nervous is that they suspect there will be further investigation following on from the initial one. God bless the EU

 

[oldfiver]

Richard Overson WAS part of an initial consortium. He withdrew his interest before tha last offer was made. The final consortium group main players were (allegedly) WASPS, the Trust and Hoffmann

You are talking about Rich Overson. Yes, he is part of consortium along with Hoffman. I heard months ago and posted on here that Richardson was also part of the consortium long before Newbon put it out. Hoffman - Fact Overson - Fact Richardson - Very heavily rumoured from a number of sources.

 

[skyblue025]

I reckon the reason they’re so nervous is that they suspect there will be further investigation following on from the initial one. God bless the EU

What next if the EU find nothing? What will SISU's next move be? I can't see an end to it while SISU remain in charge. The council will do nothing to help them, they have pissed Wasps off despite them desperately needing the football clubs money.
Fucked over from every side and no sign of it ending.

 

[chiefdave]

What next if the EU find nothing? What will SISU's next move be?

They would have to start a new judicial review but I think there is a time limit so that couldn't be based around the bail out or sale.

Additionally 'In mid-April, SISU signed an undertaking to irrevocably cease all proceedings against Wasps relating to the sale and lease of the Ricoh Arena', not sure if that is still valid since Wasps pulled out but assuming it is they can't take any action against Wasps.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

I don’t give a shit what the government appointed judge said in a case against a city council

The point is that the judge, unlike ourselves is in possession of all of the facts. He is also impartial and so looks at the evidence to form his opinion. To not give a shit about those facts is perhaps a betrayal of your own bias?

 

[Sky Blue Harry H]

Very few people on here love SISU. I can't stand them
But I want to support CCFC and don't see why anyone would want to boycott the team to try and get at SISU (as it hurts the team, not SISU). If you can't get to Brum, fair enough, but to say 'only away games' I just don't get the logic. Somebody explain that bit of logic. Total boycott I don't agree with, but there is a more twisted logic to that than 'away games only'. Anyway, I may try and shut up about the subject as this will become another Brexit type split. God bless all of us CCFC fans, we have had to put up with a lot of uncertainty. Thank God for those recent Wembley appearances!

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

SISU got the club for nothing in 2007 threw a load of money at it to try to get to the premiership but after the end of the 2008/09 season stopped being a net investor. Since then they have been bereft of a clear strategy.

They continue to own the club in the vain hope that they can recover their investment not for any love of the club or for any ambitious plans to invest in the club. I like the quote wanting a Ferrari price tag when only having a fiesta for sale. Very surprised at the love-in going on in here for SISU, they have been disastrous owners and we should all want new owners

We all want new owners - but then what? Be stuck with a shitty rental deal on Wasps terms?

I don’t get this site sometimes.


Don’t agree. All council need to do is give us the planning permission for the new stadium we need for the year round revenues. Ball in Sisu court to apply for planning and get the fans behind it.

What you mean you don’t agree? The point was making was SISUs ills are reversible - when they fuck off, we’ll still be left with our football stadium owned by a franchise rugby team with the choice of building a new stadium or being hamstrung by renting a ground in Wasps terms

 

[Paxman II]

I'm just fantasing here folks, but if I had the backing of some 50/60m, and lets face it not a huge amount by todays values I would buy up WASP along with the stadium and then buy out SISU for around the 25m or so they seek in order to exit.
Now you have the lot including a very valuable asset on a 250 year lease, a premier division rugby club and a medium size football club with enormous potential.
So, who do we know?