Ricoh (10 Viewers)

[wince]

The debt was ACLs debt. £14m to be precise, owed to Yorkshire bank. For the 50% share in ACL owned by CCC, w**ps paid that debt off! So they didn't buy debt, the bought the stadium for the price of the debt.
In terms of SISU "getting wind" of the stadium sold, that's why they came back. They came back because they'd come to a reasonable rent agreement to come back. Only 3 days after the Gillingham game, the council were talking about building bridges and CCFC maybe owning part of the ricoh

I agree with you the Op was was the stadium undersold I said there was two prices ,and that is what the court has found ,ain't gonna argue with you because as have said all 3 to blame , percentages are irrevelent ,hate them all ,they are all to blame you and me are not

 

---

[chiefdave]

Do we all agree that wasps got it on the cheap?

While I appreciate they aren't all comparing exactly the same thing you can't help but have doubts when you look at some of the figures:

Build cost £115.8m
June 2006 Initial 50 year lease £21m
October 2014 Sale price to Wasps £5.5m
October 2014 200 year lease extension £1m
April 2015 valuation £48.5m
March 2017 valuation £60m

Will be interesting to see the next valuation. Surely has to drop. Loss of a minimum of 23 major event days, hundreds of thousands of customers, significant decrease in value of naming rights etc

The key for me is obtaining best value for the taxpayer and the way the council conducted the sale didn't achieve that. Even if you ignore the outright lies about the performance of ACL repeatedly made by the council conducting a sale in secret is not on.

To achieve best value the 200 year lease extension should have already been in place, or at the very least made known it was available. It then should have been properly marketing allowing bids from all interested parties.

All you need is one other interested party besides Wasps and the price starts going up returning more money to the taxpayer.

 

[MalcSB]

The debt was ACLs debt. £14m to be precise, owed to Yorkshire bank. For the 50% share in ACL owned by CCC, w**ps paid that debt off! So they didn't buy debt, the bought the stadium for the price of the debt.
In terms of SISU "getting wind" of the stadium sold, that's why they came back. They came back because they'd come to a reasonable rent agreement to come back. Only 3 days after the Gillingham game, the council were talking about building bridges and CCFC maybe owning part of the ricoh

I assume you meant “that’s NOT why they came back”?

 

[oldfiver]

While I appreciate they aren't all comparing exactly the same thing you can't help but have doubts when you look at some of the figures:

Build cost £115.8m
June 2006 Initial 50 year lease £21m
October 2014 Sale price to Wasps £5.5m
October 2014 200 year lease extension £1m
April 2015 valuation £48.5m
March 2017 valuation £60m

Will be interesting to see the next valuation. Surely has to drop. Loss of a minimum of 23 major event days, hundreds of thousands of customers, significant decrease in value of naming rights etc

The key for me is obtaining best value for the taxpayer and the way the council conducted the sale didn't achieve that. Even if you ignore the outright lies about the performance of ACL repeatedly made by the council conducting a sale in secret is not on.

To achieve best value the 200 year lease extension should have already been in place, or at the very least made known it was available. It then should have been properly marketing allowing bids from all interested parties.

All you need is one other interested party besides Wasps and the price starts going up returning more money to the taxpayer.

Did they not make about £50m on the sale to Tesco?

 

[COVKIDSNEVERQUIT]

It's a buyers market. They agreed a price and paid it. SISU were given a price by Higgs for 50% agreed it, then backed out and offered them a 1/3 of the asking price because they were a charity. Had they paid the agreed price we wouldn't be in the mess we are in now. Yes they got it cheap but SISU could of had it cheap as well but chose not too.

You can't come on here spreading gossip like that, you'll upset the natives.

 

[skyblue025]

Care to explain how it went from £5.5m for 50% to c.£6.5m for 100%?

The quote I initially highlighted says about CCC not being able to keep talks going on indefinitely, and speed being of the essence to enact their intentions.

They also paid the debt off not just the purchase price of 6.5 million.

 

[oldfiver]

But the complaint is not against WASPS.
If they have done nothing wrong why are they so worried about the result of enquiry into another organisation?

SISU beat you too it the complaint is in.

Do you think SISU have a chance of winning in the EU or do you think its another delaying tactic knowing Wasps financial state and hoping they go bust in the time it takes for investigation. Genuine question.

 

[chiefdave]

They also paid the debt off not just the purchase price of 6.5 million.

Its not really been paid off though as they've taken out more debt to pay the original debt. They've gone from owing a £14.4m loan to being over £55m in the hole.

 

[skyblue025]

Yes a similar amount that SISU have put into us apparently.

 

[chiefdave]

Yes a similar amount that SISU have put into us apparently.

Not sure I'd use us as a model of financial stability!

 

[SBAndy]

They also paid the debt off not just the purchase price of 6.5 million.

They didn’t pay the loan off, they took it on and then refinanced it. I’ll say this til I’m (sky) blue in the face, everyone feared that if SISU got hold of the ground they’d mortgage it to the hilt. That is exactly what Wasps have done and no one batted an eyelid.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Or and don’t rule this out the Ricoh is sold to a third party.

If it’s been said by you, I think we can safely rule it out.

 

[Sick Boy]

Knowing them they’ll somehow manage to increase the value.

 

[SBAndy]

Knowing them they’ll somehow manage to increase the value.

I’m of a mind to email Gerald Eve (the surveyors used to carry out the last valuation) with a polite notice, as I’d imagine they will be conducting this one as well. Last time a valuation was carried out their comments were as follows:

“Our valuation is totally dependent on the accuracy of the information which has been supplied to us and upon the assumptions set out herein. If they prove to be incorrect or inadequate, the accuracy of the valuation may be affected.“

It’s important to notify them that this is a company who has been flagged up as falsifying information within their statutory accounts and are under investigation by the FCA. I maybe wouldn’t take what they say at face value.

 

[Grendel]

They also paid the debt off not just the purchase price of 6.5 million.

No they didn’t

 

[Sick Boy]

No they didn’t

It’s actually amazing some of the crap people come out with trying to defend them.

 

[WillenhallSkyBlues]

I’m still in absolute disbelief that a load of cov fans have spent the last two days defending the wasps and the council on Twitter and pinning solely the blame onto sisu. It’s an equal 33.3% split in my eyes.

The Coventry council tax payer did not want the red carpet treatment to be rolled out for a franchise rugby club from London that would put our historic football club at risk. We already had a rugby team!

 

[Sick Boy]

I’m still in absolute disbelief that a load of cov fans have spent the last two days defending the wasps and the council on Twitter and pinning solely the blame onto sisu. It’s an equal 33.3% split in my eyes.

The Coventry council tax payer did not want the red carpet treatment to be rolled out for a franchise rugby club from London that would put our historic football club at risk. We already had a rugby team!

They go on about Northampton and then defend a franchise rugby club taking the stadium built for us and being permanently moved to the city away from its actual home. It’s simply mind boggling.

 

[Nick]

They go on about Northampton and then defend a franchise rugby club taking the stadium built for us and being permanently moved to the city away from its actual home. It’s simply mind boggling.

Coventry City watch from gloom while Wasps make a buzz at Ricoh Arena

All you need to read.

“It was dire, particularly when compared with the Wasps match which really was a fantastic sporting occasion,”

 

[Warwickhunt]

The illegal part is that CCC GAVE W**ps am unfair advantage. In that they wasn't willing to sell to SISU/CCFC, let alone at the greatly reduced price and greatly increased terms that w**ps were offered.

The EU judgement will be against Civil mesdemenours and not Technical as the JR's were veiwed. I believe the EU will find that CCC did in fact supply State Aid and will get fined accordingly and us poor suffering fans will get hit once again when they have to up the Rates to cover the fine. Oh! what a joy to be a City fan, every man and his dog craps on us? Dont know what the Sunderland fans have got to moan about personally:sour::sour::sour::sour:

 

[usskyblue]

Organised little bunch aren’t they? The poor fuckers have even lost their stranglehold of the Facebook page. This forum is their best chance to recruit some new thickasshit fact dodgers to pin the blame solely on SISU.

 

[stupot07]

It's a buyers market. They agreed a price and paid it. SISU were given a price by Higgs for 50% agreed it, then backed out and offered them a 1/3 of the asking price because they were a charity. Had they paid the agreed price we wouldn't be in the mess we are in now. Yes they got it cheap but SISU could of had it cheap as well but chose not too.

It was never put on the open market.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[Nick]

Organised little bunch aren’t they? The poor fuckers have even lost their stranglehold of the Facebook page. This forum is their best chance to recruit some new thickasshit fact dodgers to pin the blame solely on SISU.

What's happening on Facebook?

 

[usskyblue]

What's happening on Facebook?

A sprinkling of common sense. Not all frothy bald boycott wallers

 

[Otis]

Coventry City watch from gloom while Wasps make a buzz at Ricoh Arena

All you need to read.

“It was dire, particularly when compared with the Wasps match which really was a fantastic sporting occasion,”

ALL you need to read? What about Tim Fisher and his comment (this is 2014 remember) 'The club has made giant strides recently on completing on the land on the outskirts of the city.'

He said 'Sisu is not playing a game, but genuinely planning on building the stadium.'

 

[chiefdave]

ALL you need to read? What about Tim Fisher and his comment (this is 2014 remember) 'The club has made giant strides recently on completing on the land on the outskirts of the city.'

He said 'Sisu is not playing a game, but genuinely planning on building the stadium.'

What on earth has that got to do with the comments made by the trust regarding Wasps?

 

[Otis]

What on earth has that got to do with the comments made by the trust regarding Wasps?

Nowt, but at times I think Sisu get off lightly and all focus elsewhere.

I think that comment is a stark reminder of what we have under this ownership.

 

[clint van damme]

Can't believe fans are arguing about which out of town hedge fund got the best deal, oh yeah well SISU perhaps did get done over in the end out of spite after much provocation but that wouldn't have given CCFC the Arena would it ?! No we would be slaves to SISU and their own demands. People are acting like Joy cares any more about the football club than Nick Eastwood.

I've can't remember anyone saying joy cares about the club.
I've seen plenty defending Eastwood.
He's from the same mould as Fisher

 

[slyblue57]

A sprinkling of common sense. Not all frothy bald boycott wallers

I regularly now post on the Facebook CCFC page . Theres still a vast majority of Sisu is the devil incarnate and Wasps have done no wrong brigade. There are far more now slagging off London Wasps and the Council tho. It needs more people posting against the Wasps / Council PR machine.
pusb

 

[Sick Boy]

Coventry City watch from gloom while Wasps make a buzz at Ricoh Arena

All you need to read.

“It was dire, particularly when compared with the Wasps match which really was a fantastic sporting occasion,”

Didn’t realise that was a Trust quote, it’s hard to imagine another club’s Trust coming out with that sort of stuff. Shocking

 

[Deleted member 5849]

They go on about Northampton and then defend a franchise rugby club taking the stadium built for us and being permanently moved to the city away from its actual home. It’s simply mind boggling.

Let's hope we don't use MK away to show the city what they're missing this time out...

 

[Malaka]

FFS! When CCFC said they didn't want, who would you expect would want to buy it? WASP's needed somewhere, our smart owners played a game, as after all, you can't do much with a sports stadium if no one plays sport in it (or so they thought). That was the gamble, they lost, WASP's moved in. Game Over!

 

[clint van damme]

FFS! When CCFC said they didn't want, who would you expect would want to buy it? WASP's needed somewhere, our smart owners played a game, as after all, you can't do much with a sports stadium if no one plays sport in it (or so they thought). That was the gamble, they lost, WASP's moved in. Game Over!

Even if you accept that how can anyone justify the lease extension?
If CCFC die I think that will go down as the most damaging blow of all and was nothing but a total act of spite.

 

[Nick]

I just posted on social media that the trust should be targeting all parties and not just wasps or sisu. Somebody said they agree and then went off about excusing sisu and only mentioning wasps.

You couldn't make up some people, it's just weird.

 

[Nick]

Where are the fans saying wasps had no choice to move and what are they saying now ccfc have no choice? They are backing it fully I guess?