The Ricoh (8 Viewers)

[The coventrian]

I'm hardly the thick one when you just proved the guys point without realising.

Chin up.

Nothing's been proven you sap. I havent had a season ticket since 17. So fucking what? Does that mean I havent been to a game since? No it doesnt. Of course I've been to games. Go and argue with some other fucker you bore .

 

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[peaches and cream]

Firstly, congratulations on your car crash of a season. Only saved by Saracens and coincided with kicking put the Citys 130year football club. Went from bad to worse. Dreadful attendances, even worse on pitch performances. Cant say it hasn't made a LOT of people in the city smile.

The best deal that can be done is w**ps fuck off back to London where they belong!



Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

Thank you for such a pleasant reply, thankfully only part of it is correct if you look back at posts from Oct/Nov when Wasps were one from the bottom and everyone was telling me how shit we were and almost nailed on for relegation i pointed out that we had a lot of promising young players coming through combined with some quality new signings and established players coming back from long term injury, i also pointed out that once they had time to settle and get match time together they would improve drastically. from 27/12 to 07/03 when the games stopped we were in a great run of form and won 5 and lost 2 putting us 5th only 2pts from 4th and a play off place, hardly a car crash and hardly being saved by Saracens (Leicester were probably breathing a sigh of relieve though) so poor attendances i'll agree with you but car crash and even worse on pitch performances, dream on sunshine.

 

[Nick]

Nothing's been proven you sap. I havent had a season ticket since 17. So fucking what? Does that mean I havent been to a game since? No it doesnt. Of course I've been to games. Go and argue with some other fucker you bore .

Which is why I said "hardly" bother....

 

[oldfiver]

Firstly congratulations on promotion i don't think there is anybody that can say it isn't deserved, secondly i think all parties need to take a deep breathe calm down a sort out a deal that is profitable for both parties.

Well said - HOWEVER can someone on your forum start telling the supporters some truth?

There are no legals outstanding between SISU and WASPS - this has been confirmed by the WASPS Board
The outstanding "matter" is a complaint from SISU against CCC
For some reason WASPS are fearful a decision will go against CCC which appears to invoke some indemnities costing WASPS a lot of money
If those two parties have been up to some dubious dealings that is THEIR problem
If that is the case I would like to know what went on both as a CCFC supporter and a local ratepayer

 

[The coventrian]

You really don't help yourself or your point when you have outbursts like this (reminds me of certain Twitter accounts....) And I also refuse to believe that you are older than say 15 due to the way you post so I call bollocks on being a season ticket holder for that long

I used to keep all my season tickets but this is the earliest one I can find. So I'm calling bollocks on you. Sorry about the poor quality.

 

[mr_monkey]

I used to keep all my season tickets but this is the earliest one I can find. So I'm calling bollocks on you. Sorry about the poor quality.

Then start talking like an adult rather than ranting and raving like a loon, people will be so much more responsive to you if you did (just a bit of friendly advice )

 

[The coventrian]

Then start talking like an adult rather than ranting and raving like a loon, people will be so much more responsive to you if you did (just a bit of friendly advice )

Because I am a loon.

 

[mr_monkey]

Thank you for such a pleasant reply, thankfully only part of it is correct if you look back at posts from Oct/Nov when Wasps were one from the bottom and everyone was telling me how shit we were and almost nailed on for relegation i pointed out that we had a lot of promising young players coming through combined with some quality new signings and established players coming back from long term injury, i also pointed out that once they had time to settle and get match time together they would improve drastically. from 27/12 to 07/03 when the games stopped we were in a great run of form and won 5 and lost 2 putting us 5th only 2pts from 4th and a play off place, hardly a car crash and hardly being saved by Saracens (Leicester were probably breathing a sigh of relieve though) so poor attendances i'll agree with you but car crash and even worse on pitch performances, dream on sunshine.

Tbf I think the replies on here are pretty pleasent compared to what I'm sure a lot of people really feel about wasps but then you know that and that's why the day after we get promoted you pop back on here

 

[oldfiver]

I used to keep all my season tickets but this is the earliest one I can find. So I'm calling bollocks on you. Sorry about the poor quality.

I had had a season ticket ( a junior one I might say ) 35 years before that - it was a little book with tear out pages

 

[peaches and cream]

Well said - HOWEVER can someone on your forum start telling the supporters some truth?

There are no legals outstanding between SISU and WASPS - this has been confirmed by the WASPS Board
The outstanding "matter" is a complaint from SISU against CCC
For some reason WASPS are fearful a decision will go against CCC which appears to invoke some indemnities costing WASPS a lot of money
If those two parties have been up to some dubious dealings that is THEIR problem
If that is the case I would like to know what went on both as a CCFC supporter and a local ratepayer

Most supporters know the truth the issue is that most people that participate in forums like this are massively biased to the club they support and as such are totally blinkered.
People keep going on about legals call it whatever you want but Wasps will always try to protect themselves from anything that could cost them millions, now i have no idea if there is a case to answer by CCC as i like everyone else do not have all the information or the legal knowledge.

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

Most supporters know the truth the issue is that most people that participate in forums like this are massively biased to the club they support and as such are totally blinkered.
People keep going on about legals call it whatever you want but Wasps will always try to protect themselves from anything that could cost them millions, now i have no idea if there is a case to answer by CCC as i like everyone else do not have all the information or the legal knowledge.

So maybe they should ask the council to protect them?

 

[peaches and cream]

Tbf I think the replies on here are pretty pleasent compared to what I'm sure a lot of people really feel about wasps but then you know that and that's why the day after we get promoted you pop back on here

most replies are pretty pleasant well today anyway, some days i get dogs abuse and before anyone comments yes i'm fully aware of why.

 

[peaches and cream]

So maybe they should ask the council to protect them?

maybe they should, if CCC are happy with what they have done it shouldn't be an issue

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

members of my family are season ticket holders and I have no ill feeling towards CCFC or their supports (regardless of the abuse i receive), Wasps are now in Coventry and regardless of what is going to happen long term something needs to be done to start to rectify this shit sandwich immediately, i'm sure somebody will come out with comments like "well if you fuck off back to London that will solve everything" but right here right now that's not going to happen so lets all grow up and find a sensible short term solution.

It will help then if CCFC stop being seen as a cash cow to be milked-it goes both ways. You're right, I don't want Wasps here, you're also right that until they go bust, they're not leaving. So offer a fair deal rather than an extortionate one as I think we know who will be getting the bigger crowds next season, freebies excluded.

 

[Paxman II]

I think WASP did not want or even feel the need to bring CCFC back to the Ricoh at the time the complaint was made to the European body. Fearful of such a complaint being upheld, it could easily scupper their business and ownership of the stadium. They see it as SISU tactic and hence the 'drop the legals' comment before any negotiation stance. Understandable from their erspective, but SISU can not withdraw the complaint, it must run its course.
But WASP are now in a different position from then. They are very much on the back foot with losses mounting. The pandemic has impacted their model drastically. No conferencing, No casino, no hotel and no rugby while still maintaining a stadium and overhead beyond their means. They have an opportunity to attract a championship side back, increase rent, increase revenue, increase sponsorship of the stadium, and gain good will in the process. It matters not about the European result that may eventually come down. How does that effect anything to do with a tenant at the ground? If it came down against them, they would have to deal with that at that time. In fact having the football club back, building good will may be their saviour in the long run. If they are forced to pay more for the stadium then CCFC may want to invest and take part ownership. If WASP choice was survival in that scenario, then why wouldn't they? The alternatative of course is that the purchase be null and void, and the lease revert back to the council. In that scenario it still makes no difference if they had CCFC there as a tenant. CCFC could of course out bid them to gain the lease or make a joint offer. Which ever way you look at it, it's clear WASP have nothing to gain by refusing to negotiate CCFC's return to the Ricoh at this time.

 

[Grendel]

Most supporters know the truth the issue is that most people that participate in forums like this are massively biased to the club they support and as such are totally blinkered.
People keep going on about legals call it whatever you want but Wasps will always try to protect themselves from anything that could cost them millions, now i have no idea if there is a case to answer by CCC as i like everyone else do not have all the information or the legal knowledge.

The forum is Stalinist - I’ve been banned four tunes now I think and my 5th incarnation is getting the dreaded Spam and complaints notification

 

[ovduk78]

That might happen it might not and none of us know for sure how things will pan out, everyone can argue about who's fault the current situation is but that won't change anything so surely the best thing short term would be to sort out a deal, no deal is ever going to be perfect for either side but as a starting point i don't see why they can't agree a sensible rent with CCFC paying all match day cost and then keeping all match day profits.

As Wasps can't seem to be able to get a stadium sponsor when 1 is finally sorted out due to CCFC being back at the stadium can we have all that money too?

 

[Grendel]

As Wasps can't seem to be able to get a stadium sponsor when 1 is finally sorted out due to CCFC being back at the stadium can we have all that money too?

I’m sure that’s one of the points of dispute

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The forum is Stalinist - I’ve been banned four tunes now I think and my 5th incarnation is getting the dreaded Spam and complaints notification

I never had a ban G

 

[ovduk78]

I’m sure that’s one of the points of dispute

Do you know what we are asking for or are being offered or just that it is a known sticking point?

 

[tisza]

Firstly congratulations on promotion i don't think there is anybody that can say it isn't deserved, secondly i think all parties need to take a deep breathe calm down a sort out a deal that is profitable for both parties.

Big difference between profitable and equitable

 

[Grendel]

I never had a ban G

You are a non threat I guess

 

[EAst ender]

Dont mind going back to ricoh, but somethings got to be done about the surface, cut up every week, id rather play on great pitch at st andrews

That's easily sorted as we have done in BS3 with a Desso 4 pitch, like a bowling green every week for us and the Bears. The problem is the cost (I think it was £2M) would only add to your financial dilemma.
Yes, your income will shoot up as you well know but do you spend that money on a return to the Ricoh? Do you spend that money on the team to consolidate / push on in the Championship or do you spend that money subsidising Birmingham and stay at St Andrews? Can you survive without spending it on the team?
I've no doubt your current players will be getting a hefty pay rise on promotion but your powers that be have a real problem in how best to spend that increased revenue.
FWIW, as an outsider, it seems ludicrous to have a great complex like the Ricoh lying empty most of the time and you playing in Birmingham. There must be a way for you to return which would, obviously, benefit CCFC with bigger crowds and associated incomes, plus give some benefit to whoever owns the stadium, without making it too difficult for you to go back? An example, the modernised Ashton gate is used every day, apart from Xmas day, bringing in serious money. What a waste if the Ricoh isn't doing at least the same.
Have no doubt, the Championship is a blinding division but it's really difficult nowadays. Like yourselves, we won L1 easily a few years ago but really found it hard after promotion.
It's a real dilemma and I wish you every success. Unfortunately, in the modern Championship, money generally wins.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

You are a non threat I guess

Lol

 

[Peter Billing]

That's easily sorted as we have done in BS3 with a Desso 4 pitch, like a bowling green every week for us and the Bears. The problem is the cost (I think it was £2M) would only add to your financial dilemma.
Yes, your income will shoot up as you well know but do you spend that money on a return to the Ricoh? Do you spend that money on the team to consolidate / push on in the Championship or do you spend that money subsidising Birmingham and stay at St Andrews? Can you survive without spending it on the team?
I've no doubt your current players will be getting a hefty pay rise on promotion but your powers that be have a real problem in how best to spend that increased revenue.
FWIW, as an outsider, it seems ludicrous to have a great complex like the Ricoh lying empty most of the time and you playing in Birmingham. There must be a way for you to return which would, obviously, benefit CCFC with bigger crowds and associated incomes, plus give some benefit to whoever owns the stadium, without making it too difficult for you to go back? An example, the modernised Ashton gate is used every day, apart from Xmas day, bringing in serious money. What a waste if the Ricoh isn't doing at least the same.
Have no doubt, the Championship is a blinding division but it's really difficult nowadays. Like yourselves, we won L1 easily a few years ago but really found it hard after promotion.
It's a real dilemma and I wish you every success. Unfortunately, in the modern Championship, money generally wins.

And herein lies the problem, the lease is now owned by Wasps, they are losing £10m every year (before covid) and are £55m in debt (again before covid). The council allowed them to mortgage the place to the heavens and they are stuck in perennial financial paralysis. Do they pay for the pitch? Do we underpin them with income? Indeed, tough choices.

 

[chiefdave]

Its clear from the coordinated push between Wasps, Council, Telegraph and Wasps blogs that they are looking to get us back. The question is can a workable deal be done.

First and foremost Wasps have to drop the ridiculous indemnity demand. There's nothing anyone can do about the EC investigation other than wait and the only way Wasps or the council will have to pay out is if they are found to be in the wrong.

From our perspective we need access to the revenue we generate to put us on a level with the rest of the league. Some of that is quite straightforward, its easy to calculate things like f&b, parking etc. Gets trickier when it comes to things like naming rights or companies wanting to use the Ricoh's businesses facilities to be associated with a successful football club.

In return we should pay a fair rent and also fair matchday costs. Things like stewarding shouldn't be viewed by Wasps as an opportunity to make money out of us. In return we should pay a fair rent. Given its a unique situation a fair rent is tricky to calculate. If I was in Dave Boddy's position I would be trying to find out how much other clubs pay out annually on their grounds. Granted other clubs don't pay rent but there are other costs associated such as maintenance, if he can get an idea of that figure it would give us a starting point.

Past that we all know the pitch issue needs resolving, we also need the club shop and ticket office moving back to the stadium. Other than that its mainly cosmetic, equal branding for both clubs rather than Wasps logo's dominating everything. So for example the club crests in the stadium should be the same size as Wasps.

The final issue is primacy. That is an EFL requirement. We got away with it in L1 but with the increased likelihood of being on TV in the Championship it will need resolving. I'm sure CCFC / EFL / Wasps / Rugby Premiership could arrange that. Wasps have 11 home league games, at most 3 domestic cup games and 5 European cup games. That's 19 home games in total. We'll have 23 away games in the Championship alone. Surely the sensible option would be for everyone to get together and ensure there wasn't a clash.

 

[ccfcricoh]

That's easily sorted as we have done in BS3 with a Desso 4 pitch, like a bowling green every week for us and the Bears. The problem is the cost (I think it was £2M) would only add to your financial dilemma.
Yes, your income will shoot up as you well know but do you spend that money on a return to the Ricoh? Do you spend that money on the team to consolidate / push on in the Championship or do you spend that money subsidising Birmingham and stay at St Andrews? Can you survive without spending it on the team?
I've no doubt your current players will be getting a hefty pay rise on promotion but your powers that be have a real problem in how best to spend that increased revenue.
FWIW, as an outsider, it seems ludicrous to have a great complex like the Ricoh lying empty most of the time and you playing in Birmingham. There must be a way for you to return which would, obviously, benefit CCFC with bigger crowds and associated incomes, plus give some benefit to whoever owns the stadium, without making it too difficult for you to go back? An example, the modernised Ashton gate is used every day, apart from Xmas day, bringing in serious money. What a waste if the Ricoh isn't doing at least the same.
Have no doubt, the Championship is a blinding division but it's really difficult nowadays. Like yourselves, we won L1 easily a few years ago but really found it hard after promotion.
It's a real dilemma and I wish you every success. Unfortunately, in the modern Championship, money generally wins.

Would love a nice pitch like that but as you say, who pays for it, we wont in someone elses ground, and the owner wont as they dont need it!

Hopefully there are some heads bashed together somewhere!

Appreciate your comments, i had a quick look and since your promotion you've finished 18th - 17th - 11th - 8th and now sit just outside the playoffs with every chance of making it. Whilst i appreciate money talks, that is consistent improvement and i would take that now if that's our next 4 seasons. Doesn't look like too much struggling from the outside anyway! How much did you strengthen in your first season? was it a mass overhaul?

 

[EAst ender]

Would love a nice pitch like that but as you say, who pays for it, we wont in someone elses ground, and the owner wont as they dont need it!

Hopefully there are some heads bashed together somewhere!

Appreciate your comments, i had a quick look and since your promotion you've finished 18th - 17th - 11th - 8th and now sit just outside the playoffs with every chance of making it. Whilst i appreciate money talks, that is consistent improvement and i would take that now if that's our next 4 seasons. Doesn't look like too much struggling from the outside anyway! How much did you strengthen in your first season? was it a mass overhaul?

Not initially but we went for players we clearly had no chance of getting (Andre Grey, Dwight Gayle), we signed Jonathon Kodjia eventually, Once Johnson came in we spent a few bob on experienced loans to stay up but it was a close run thing and we would probably have gone back down with just our promotion side. Since then we seem to have sold an expensive one and bought promise although this year we seem to have spent slightly differently with the signing of Nahki Wells and possibly Benik Afobe. The redeveloped stadium and extremely wealthy owner has given us that opportunity. That's why it seems so daft to have a facility like the Ricoh, which has more than we have, standing dormant most of the time.

 

[chiefdave]

we wont in someone elses ground

We paid for a new pitch at Sixfields didn't we?

 

[ccfcricoh]

We paid for a new pitch at Sixfields didn't we?

I dont know is the honest answer, but if we did, i doubt it was an all singing and all dancing one to cope with Rugby and Football.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Not initially but we went for players we clearly had no chance of getting (Andre Grey, Dwight Gayle), we signed Jonathon Kodjia eventually, Once Johnson came in we spent a few bob on experienced loans to stay up but it was a close run thing and we would probably have gone back down with just our promotion side. Since then we seem to have sold an expensive one and bought promise although this year we seem to have spent slightly differently with the signing of Nahki Wells and possibly Benik Afobe. The redeveloped stadium and extremely wealthy owner has given us that opportunity. That's why it seems so daft to have a facility like the Ricoh, which has more than we have, standing dormant most of the time.

Well this is the key difference, we don't have one and as long as the Ricoh is out of bounds we're very unlikely to attract one. If we finished 21st I'd consider that an excellent season just because we're likely to have the smallest or next to smallest budget in the league depending on who wins the L1 play offs. Would just be nice if we weren't constantly competing with some kind of in built disadvantage!

 

[chiefdave]

I dont know is the honest answer, but if we did, i doubt it was an all singing and all dancing one to cope with Rugby and Football.

I'd have no problem with the club contributing to a new pitch if it meant a decent playing surface. After all if we had our own ground we'd incur that cost but it would have to be reflected in the rent. Would also need to be some sort of agreement about what other events took place. No point us paying out for a pitch to then have Wasps hiring out the ground to someone else and the pitch being ruined.

Having said that we were told we were all supposed to be grateful that Wasps had paid out for a fantastic state of the art pitch which turned out to be terrible so really that needs to be looked into by them. Although I suspect what we were told doesn't match the reality and it was actually done on the cheap.

 

[EAst ender]

Well this is the key difference, we don't have one and as long as the Ricoh is out of bounds we're very unlikely to attract one. If we finished 21st I'd consider that an excellent season just because we're likely to have the smallest or next to smallest budget in the league depending on who wins the L1 play offs. Would just be nice if we weren't constantly competing with some kind of in built disadvantage!

Fair comment BSB. When the likes of Villa (eg) come down with £100m in their back pockets, it's an unfair advantage for all of us but makes it nigh on impossible for the promoted sides.
You never know, you might do a 'Sheffield Utd' and shoot straight through but most, ourselves included, really found it hard post promotion.
It's a blinding league regardless and a very good standard now.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Fair comment BSB. When the likes of Villa (eg) come down with £100m in their back pockets, it's an unfair advantage for all of us but makes it nigh on impossible for the promoted sides.
You never know, you might do a 'Sheffield Utd' and shoot straight through but most, ourselves included, really found it hard post promotion.
It's a blinding league regardless and a very good standard now.

I think you have much more in common with Brighton in terms of the rich owner and bumper ground. That would change if we had a rich dude who could buy out the Ricoh but that seems very unlikely. Definitely agree on the standard though which is the main upshot of the stupid money flying around.

 

[fernandopartridge]

I said to a couple of people on here a while ago that I'd had a pretty reliable indication that a return had been agreed (presumably in principle) prior to the covid outbreak. I am not going to say any more suffice to say I found out about the previous Ricoh return ahead of the formal press release.

I think the club will be working hard to drive the hardest bargain with Wasps, and think part of that will be keeping options open as long as possible.