Trump is my favourite comedian of the year already (5 Viewers)

[skybluetony176]

He still managed to get 70 million US citizens to vote for him

Can’t be right. He’s claiming voter suppression.

 

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[usskyblue]

He still managed to get 70 million US citizens to vote for him

The shit in a paper bag theory works with entrenched Republicans too. Just change the color of the tie

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I don't deny the underlying narrative that the party united around one moderate candidate to squeeze out Bernie, but you make it sound like a coincidence they picked Biden. They could have just as easily picked Buttigieg, who'd already won Iowa, or Harris, who impressed at the early debates. Instead they picked Biden - not just because of his status in the party, but because of his dominant performance in SC where they saw he had the demographic appeal to flip states like, oh I dunno, Georgia.

It makes no sense to say the party would deliberately pick a senile candidate with no mass appeal, when they had so many other options available. Unless of course, you have an axe to grind or you're one of the many people who have underestimated the next president's appeal. Admittedly, I don't see it myself, but I have to admit it's there.

You do realise the consensus among voters was that they preferred Bernie on the policy (and loads of exit polls back that up) but they thought Biden was more likely to beat Trump. ‘Not Trump’ was also the dominant reason given for supporting him in this election.

Pete didn’t win Iowa and polled at nearly 0 with black voters. It was all about not having a progressive nominee and in a split field Bernie was on course to win.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

You can’t fix stupid

A lot of voters are turned off by the Democrats stances on cultural issues e.g. defund the police, socialised healthcare and so on. There’s a lot of finger pointing among Dem Representatives because they’ve performed way below expectations across the board.

Frankly, the fact that the gap in the Rust Belt states is this close, goes to show Democrats are not getting the traction with its traditional working class base. There are some parallels to be drawn between them and Labour haemorrhaging its working class votes.

As thing stand, Biden will win a Pyrrhic victory. A reduced majority in congress and a likely Republican held senate will hamper Biden’s legislative agenda a lot.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

A lot of voters are turned off by the Democrats stances on cultural issues e.g. defund the police, socialised healthcare and so on. There’s a lot of finger pointing among Dem Representatives because they’ve performed way below expectations across the board.

Frankly, the fact that the gap in the Rust Belt states is this close, goes to show Democrats are not getting the traction with its traditional working class base. There are some parallels to be drawn between them and Labour haemorrhaging its working class votes.

As thing stand, Biden will win a Pyrrhic victory. A reduced majority in congress and a likely Republican held senate will hamper Biden’s legislative agenda a lot.

The funny thing is Bernie would have been the ideal candidate to win more of the rust belt vote running on economic populism. Instead they do what they always do which is to try and move further right and congratulations, he pipped Georgia by the narrowest of margins mostly because of a demographic shift in the state.

The more Biden speaks the less people like him-hence why he managed to slide from 1st in the primary polls to 5th and only won once his mates in the party forced everyone to support him.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

The funny thing is Bernie would have been the ideal candidate to win more of the rust belt vote running on economic populism. Instead they do what they always do which is to try and move further right and congratulations, he pipped Georgia by the narrowest of margins mostly because of a demographic shift in the state.

The more Biden speaks the less people like him-hence why he managed to slide from 1st in the primary polls to 5th and only won once his mates in the party forced everyone to support him.

He’s not a good candidate, to be frank. He’s won, but he is not in a strong position from day 1. The Republicans are well poised for 2022 and if they take Congress, his presidency is more or less gridlocked until 2024.

Not to mention, there’s a decent chance he may not see out the whole term. Frankly, something that was played down during the election by Dems, and it being talked up now it looks like Biden has won.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

He’s not a good candidate, to be frank. He’s won, but he is not in a strong position from day 1. The Republicans are well poised for 2022 and if they take Congress, his presidency is more or less gridlocked until 2024.

Not to mention, there’s a decent chance he may not see out the whole term. Frankly, something that was played down during the election by Dems, and it being talked up now it looks like Biden has won.

Failure to wins the Senate means even if he tries to do anything half decent it will be blocked and the Supreme Court is going to stay at a horrendous 6-3. Really well played by the Dems to not fight Barrett's appointment at all as part of a political calculation

 

[David O'Day]

A lot of voters are turned off by the Democrats stances on cultural issues e.g. defund the police, socialised healthcare and so on. There’s a lot of finger pointing among Dem Representatives because they’ve performed way below expectations across the board.

Frankly, the fact that the gap in the Rust Belt states is this close, goes to show Democrats are not getting the traction with its traditional working class base. There are some parallels to be drawn between them and Labour haemorrhaging its working class votes.

As thing stand, Biden will win a Pyrrhic victory. A reduced majority in congress and a likely Republican held senate will hamper Biden’s legislative agenda a lot.

The Senate thing isn't true, there are 2 more seats up for grabs in January in Georgia

 

[David O'Day]

Biden is likely to win and yet some clowns act like he's lost

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The Senate thing isn't true, there are 2 more seats up for grabs in January in Georgia

Winning those is far from a given

 

[David O'Day]

Winning those is far from a given

No but it's also a lie to say they haven't regained control of the senate

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

The Senate thing isn't true, there are 2 more seats up for grabs in January in Georgia

Hence the use of ‘likely’.

The consensus among Democrats is that they have underperformed at all levels of this election.

Why? Because they went into the election believing they could extend their lead in Congress, and win both the Senate and presidency.

If I was American, the democrats would be my ‘natural’ home.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Hence the use of ‘likely’.

The consensus among Democrats is that they have underperformed at all levels of this election.

Why? Because they went into the election believing they could extend their lead in Congress, and win both the Senate and presidency.

If I was American, the democrats would be my ‘natural’ home.

I suspect though you would also be quite pissed off at them refusing to support a single payer healthcare system and in fact running away from it even when asked. They are Republican-lite and nothing more

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I suspect though you would also be quite pissed off at them refusing to support a single payer healthcare system and in fact running away from it even when asked. They are Republican-lite and nothing more

The reality is that socialised healthcare isn’t as popular in the USA as it is in Europe. Despite Bernie Sanders’ popularity.

Context is important too. Republicans in NY and CA are pretty liberal, generally. Meanwhile, even Democrats running in southern/Midwest states are generally pretty conservative.

Traditionally, US politics was more bipartisan than in the UK, for example. In more recent years, US politics is increasingly partisan and well, it’s why recent US governments have been plagued by gridlock and inefficiency. Hence, presidents use more and more executive orders to get their agendas through.

 

[usskyblue]

I liked Bernie but he wanted universal healthcare and (unfortunately) that’s a complete non-starter here.

Americans have convinced themselves it’s a disaster... as they drive past their Dr’s Ferrari in preferred parking while trying to figure out how to deal with cancer and being financially ruined at the same time.

Two weeks at Universal every couple of years won’t give you the full picture. You have to live here to realize how effed up things are.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The reality is that socialised healthcare isn’t as popular in the USA as it is in Europe. Despite Bernie Sanders’ popularity.

Context is important too. Republicans in NY and CA are pretty liberal, generally. Meanwhile, even Democrats running in southern/Midwest states are generally pretty conservative.

Traditionally, US politics was more bipartisan than in the UK, for example. In more recent years, US politics is increasingly partisan and well, it’s why recent US governments have been plagued by gridlock and inefficiency. Hence, presidents use more and more executive orders to get their agendas through.

That in itself is right wing framing. Put as 'Medicare for All' it's an overwhelmingly popular policy with the population. Same goes for legalising weed, raising the minimum wage, getting out of various foreign wars etc.

But yet you have Biden saying he wouldn't pass it even if all he had to do was sign the bill. In fact in the debates he ran away quickly from the notion that he'd give people healthcare. Americans are far more progressive than their legislators

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I liked Bernie but he wanted universal healthcare and (unfortunately) that’s a complete non-starter here.

Americans have convinced themselves it’s a disaster... as they drive past their Dr’s Ferrari in preferred parking while trying to figure out how to deal with cancer and being financially ruined at the same time.

Two weeks at Universal every couple of years won’t give you the full picture. You have to live here to realize how effed up things are.

To be fair you're in God's waiting room where you are

 

[usskyblue]

To be fair you're in God's waiting room where you are

Stereotype all you like but Tampa is diverse and so are the growing suburbs. It’s the reason it’s blue, along with St.Pete which Biden just flipped.

That said, I’ll be the first to admit, I’m getting older myself and will probably move back down to the Sarasota area at the beginning of the year. You know that’s retirement country when the restaurants are packed at 4pm for people having dinner.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I liked Bernie but he wanted universal healthcare and (unfortunately) that’s a complete non-starter here.

Americans have convinced themselves it’s a disaster... as they drive past their Dr’s Ferrari in preferred parking while trying to figure out how to deal with cancer and being financially ruined at the same time.

Two weeks at Universal every couple of years won’t give you the full picture. You have to live here to realize how effed up things are.

560,000 personal bankruptcies a year due to healthcare. They are bloody mad

 

[wingy]

Can’t be right. He’s claiming voter suppression.

As usual he's plugging a converse theory ,when all the percieved wisdom while I've been an adult suggests favourable polls would lead to the Boden vote becoming depressed/suppressed through overconfidence and apathy .
We've seen happen in this country.

 

[shmmeee]

Turns out the polls weren’t that bad:

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Stereotype all you like but Tampa is diverse and so are the growing suburbs. It’s the reason it’s blue, along with St.Pete which Biden just flipped.

That said, I’ll be the first to admit, I’m getting older myself and will probably move back down to the Sarasota area at the beginning of the year. You know that’s retirement country when the restaurants are packed at 4pm for people having dinner.

My late grandad lived in Fort Lauderdale for years, when he eventually got cancer the insurance company was so obsessed with profit they offered to fly him back to the UK instead of pay for his treatment

 

[skybluetony176]

As usual he's plugging a converse theory ,when all the percieved wisdom while I've been an adult suggests favourable polls would lead to the Boden vote becoming depressed/suppressed through overconfidence and apathy .
We've seen happen in this country.

The big irony is that Trump spent the whole campaign promoting the suppression of postal votes.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Turns out the polls weren’t that bad:

Trump did do better than expected, though. Just not by quite enough

 

[shmmeee]

Trump did do better than expected, though. Just not by quite enough

Within margins of error but sure

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

That in itself is right wing framing. Put as 'Medicare for All' it's an overwhelmingly popular policy with the population. Same goes for legalising weed, raising the minimum wage, getting out of various foreign wars etc.

But yet you have Biden saying he wouldn't pass it even if all he had to do was sign the bill. In fact in the debates he ran away quickly from the notion that he'd give people healthcare. Americans are far more progressive than their legislators

Biden, like Obama, are centre-right politicians. No questions about it.

There a lot more people in the US who consider themselves ‘democratic socialists’ than we give credit for. However, is there enough of these people across all the US states to win an national election? In states like Arizona, Florida, PA, Wisconsin and Michigan. A lot of PA voters owe their livelihoods to shale gas so a Green New Deal is a tough sell, for example.

My educated guess is that most of these people are largely concentrated on the west coast and the north east of the country. Oregon, Cali, NY, Washington and a few others.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Biden, like Obama, are centre-right politicians. No questions about it.

There a lot more people in the US who consider themselves ‘democratic socialists’ than we give credit for. However, is there enough of these people across all the US states to win an national election? In states like Arizona, Florida, PA, Wisconsin and Michigan. A lot of PA voters owe their livelihoods to shale gas so a Green New Deal is a tough sell, for example.

My educated guess is that most of these people are largely concentrated on the west coast and the north east of the country. Oregon, Cali, NY, Washington and a few others.

I'd watch Bernie's town halls in West Virginia, Texas and so on with loads of people you'd think would disagree with everything he says. One he did with FOX in Texas had them nearly all agreeing with him while the hosts who were all set for a hit piece didn't quite know what to do. His problem now is he's become a bit too focused on the 'woke' arguments. The 2016 Bernie was bang on, 2020 was still good but had lost his lustre.

A guy who just makes left wing economic populist arguments and avoids the woke stereotype would wipe the floor. Even in deep southern states like Arkansas most Democratic primary voters wanted single payer. In some national polls it even gets a majority of Republicans. Mass investment in infrastructure should also be a key part of a progressive platform that would have big support in the neglected states especially. Ending the wars is another quick win and something that very few beyond hardcore Trumpers and neocons would argue against.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Bizarre trump is wishing to stop the military from getting a vote

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I'd watch Bernie's town halls in West Virginia, Texas and so on with loads of people you'd think would disagree with everything he says. One he did with FOX in Texas had them nearly all agreeing with him while the hosts who were all set for a hit piece didn't quite know what to do. His problem now is he's become a bit too focused on the 'woke' arguments. The 2016 Bernie was bang on, 2020 was still good but had lost his lustre.

A guy who just makes left wing economic populist arguments and avoids the woke stereotype would wipe the floor. Even in deep southern states like Arkansas most Democratic primary voters wanted single payer. In some national polls it even gets a majority of Republicans. Mass investment in infrastructure should also be a key part of a progressive platform that would have big support in the neglected states especially. Ending the wars is another quick win and something that very few beyond hardcore Trumpers and neocons would argue against.

I don’t disagree, and the evidence suggest that in 2016, Bernie would have beaten Trump handily. Ultimately, we’ll never know as it never came to pass.

The left in the USA, and to lesser degree in the UK too, has moved away from economic issues and attached itself to cultural issues. In my view, this trend generally explains why the ‘left’ is losing support to right wing populists across the western world.

Working class voter across the rust belt swapped to Trump in 2016 because he actually spoke about issues that affected them. Such as, the loss of manufacturing jobs to developing nations and so on.

Frankly, if a more polished Republican articulates these arguments in 2024, they’ll go back to Republican if the Democrats continue to be preoccupied with the cultural issues.

My outlook for the Biden presidency is not very positive.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I don’t disagree, and the evidence suggest that in 2016, Bernie would have beaten Trump handily. Ultimately, we’ll never know as it never came to pass.

The left in the USA, and to lesser degree in the UK too, has moved away from economic issues and attached itself to cultural issues. In my view, this trend generally explains why the ‘left’ is losing support to right wing populists across the western world.

Working class voter across the rust belt swapped to Trump in 2016 because he actually spoke about issues that affected them. Such as, the loss of manufacturing jobs to developing nations and so on.

Frankly, if a more polished Republican articulates these arguments in 2024, they’ll go back to Republican if the Democrats continue to be preoccupied with the cultural issues.

My outlook for the Biden presidency is not very positive.

Yep agree with a lot of that and when I hear politicians go more on the cultural stuff even I go 'right but I don't care about that'

 

[wingy]

Last leg hilarious sharp minds absolutely tearing the Trump theory to shreds I mean we all know that , but laying out the absolute logic of why it's charade .
The thickness of any of those Hicks who are buying his line must have IQ lower than a chimpanzee .

 

[wingy]

They think he will resign in a couple of weeks citing a fix and Pence will give him immunity from prosecution .

 

[djr8369]

The funny thing is Bernie would have been the ideal candidate to win more of the rust belt vote running on economic populism. Instead they do what they always do which is to try and move further right and congratulations, he pipped Georgia by the narrowest of margins mostly because of a demographic shift in the state.

The more Biden speaks the less people like him-hence why he managed to slide from 1st in the primary polls to 5th and only won once his mates in the party forced everyone to support him.

Your points are well and good but you have to realise half the country think anyone remotely left is a commie. I like Bernie but think he would have got mauled.

 

[fernandopartridge]

560,000 personal bankruptcies a year due to healthcare. They are bloody mad

They are stupid

 

[fernandopartridge]

I'd watch Bernie's town halls in West Virginia, Texas and so on with loads of people you'd think would disagree with everything he says. One he did with FOX in Texas had them nearly all agreeing with him while the hosts who were all set for a hit piece didn't quite know what to do. His problem now is he's become a bit too focused on the 'woke' arguments. The 2016 Bernie was bang on, 2020 was still good but had lost his lustre.

A guy who just makes left wing economic populist arguments and avoids the woke stereotype would wipe the floor. Even in deep southern states like Arkansas most Democratic primary voters wanted single payer. In some national polls it even gets a majority of Republicans. Mass investment in infrastructure should also be a key part of a progressive platform that would have big support in the neglected states especially. Ending the wars is another quick win and something that very few beyond hardcore Trumpers and neocons would argue against.

It's a great point about economic populism, you can see the same is / will be reflected here by Labour. Trying to drift to the right to appeal to voters who aren't and never will be interested while losing those who might be.