How much does it cost to employ 315 nurses? (11 Viewers)

[Grendel]

Any idea anyone?

 

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[fernandopartridge]

Min salary for a Band 5 nurse is 24907 + 20% on costs, so £30k * 315 = £9.45m

 

[Grendel]

Min salary for a Band 5 nurse is 24907 + 20% on costs, so £30k * 315 = £9.45m

So less than the £11 million the taxpayer has funded to house Mr Peter Sutcliffe during his years of incarceration

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

So less than the £11 million the taxpayer has funded to house Mr Peter Sutcliffe during his years of incarceration

Yep

 

[fernandopartridge]

What's the significance of the 315?

 

[shmmeee]

So less than the £11 million the taxpayer has funded to house Mr Peter Sutcliffe during his years of incarceration

And?

You have any idea how much the death penalty costs?

Costs

Studies consistently find that the death penalty is more expensive than alternative punishments.

deathpenaltyinfo.org

 

[Grendel]

What's the significance of the 315?

Id averaged the average wage on wiki and it came to 315 when divided by £11 million

 

[Grendel]

And?

You have any idea how much the death penalty costs?

Costs

Studies consistently find that the death penalty is more expensive than alternative punishments.

deathpenaltyinfo.org

Depends on the legal right to appeal actually - also in his case even on that assumption it’s not going to cost £11 million

 

[skybluetony176]

Id averaged the average wage on wiki and it came to 315 when divided by £11 million

Good old wiki Grendull

 

[Ian1779]

Boris spaffed £50m on a bridge that never even got built. That’s about 1600 nurses I reckon.

We should do the same with the Dido Harding projects...

 

[Grendel]

Boris spaffed £50m on a bridge that never even got built. That’s about 1600 nurses I reckon.

We should do the same with the Dido Harding projects...

how relevant - guess old Pete deserved his life of relative comfort then

 

[Ian1779]

how relevant - guess old Pete deserved his life of relative comfort then

Not saying he did, and I agree that you may have a point about how we spend money on housing horrific people like this.

But the comparison is meaningless (and deliberately emotive for a reason) when there are so many other things that money is wasted on.

 

[skybluetony176]

Boris spaffed £50m on a bridge that never even got built. That’s about 1600 nurses I reckon.

We should do the same with the Dido Harding projects...

Chicken feed compared to the money he needlessly spanked on the Boris Busses redesign.

 

[shmmeee]

Depends on the legal right to appeal actually - also in his case even on that assumption it’s not going to cost £11 million

It’s not just for him though is it? It’s an entire system and studies consistently show the death penalty isn’t a cost saver, or a deterrent.

Make the argument on vengeance or moral reasons by all means, but not cost or deterrence. It won’t lower crime and it will cost more. There’s still arguments to make, they’re just a little harder.

 

[dutchman]

And?

You have any idea how much the death penalty costs?

Costs

Studies consistently find that the death penalty is more expensive than alternative punishments.

deathpenaltyinfo.org

How is a US study relevant to the UK system of justice?

 

[skybluetony176]

How is a US study relevant to the UK system of justice?

We don’t have the death penalty in the U.K., we do have an appeal system though. The US has the death penalty and an appeal system. Who else are you going to compare with if you want a full and factual discussion on the cost of keeping serial killers alive vs an alternative?

 

[dutchman]

Who else are you going to compare with if you want a full and factual discussion on the cost of keeping serial killers alive vs an alternative?

Not the USA, that's for certain.

 

[SBT]

This is all great discussion, because as we all know, the most important determining factor of justice is price

 

[skybluetony176]

Not the USA, that's for certain.

So who then? If you want a proper discussion about it you’ve got to factor everything in.

 

[dutchman]

When murderers were hanged quickly

Fifty years ago the last murderers were hanged in the UK. It brought to an end an era of extraordinarily swift capital punishment.

www.bbc.co.uk

Fifty years ago the last murderers were hanged in the UK. It brought to an end an era of extraordinarily swift capital punishment.
At 08:00 on Thursday 13 August 1964, two keys turned in the locks of two prison cell doors - one in Manchester, the other in Liverpool. Moments later, two men were dead, hanged for the crime of capital murder.
Gwynne Evans and Peter Allen, two petty criminals who killed a man in a bungled burglary, were the last two people to be executed for murder in the UK.
Justice came swiftly. The trial of 24-year-old Evans and Allen, who was 21, began on 23 June at Manchester Assizes. On 7 July the men were found guilty and sentenced under the 1957 Homicide Act to suffer death "in the manner prescribed by law".
Their appeal was heard just two weeks later - and dismissed the next day. A final appeal for clemency was rejected by the Home Secretary on 11 August. Less than five weeks elapsed between conviction and execution.

"The average wait on death row in the US is 13 years."

 

[skybluetony176]

When murderers were hanged quickly

Fifty years ago the last murderers were hanged in the UK. It brought to an end an era of extraordinarily swift capital punishment.

www.bbc.co.uk

How’s a system that hasn’t been in place for half a century relevant? You’ll be brining back public stonings next. The country has changed massively in that period, if capital punishment ever did come back it absolutely will have an appeal process.

 

[dutchman]

How’s a system that hasn’t been in place for half a century relevant? You’ll be brining back public stonings next. The country has changed massively in that period, if capital punishment ever did come back it absolutely will have an appeal process.

There was an appeal process back then, it was just a lot faster than in the USA and presumably much cheaper.

 

[skybluetony176]

There was an appeal process back then, it was just a lot faster than in the USA and presumably much cheaper.

Cheaper? Try telling Dereck Bentley that. It cost him his life and ultimately the Tax payer millions in appeals after his death to get initially a pardon and then his conviction overturned. There’s a reason why the appeal process is now exhaustive and it’s so you don’t wrongly send a 19 year old with the mental age of a 13 year old to the gallows.

 

[dutchman]

Cheaper? Try telling Dereck Bentley that. It cost him his life and ultimately the Tax payer millions in appeals after his death to get initially a pardon and then his conviction overturned. There’s a reason why the appeal process is now exhaustive and it’s so you don’t wrongly send a 19 year old with the mental age of a 13 year old to the gallows.

How much would it have cost to keep him in Broadmoor for the rest of his life?

 

[skybluetony176]

How much would it have cost to keep him in Broadmoor for the rest of his life?

He wouldn’t have been in broadmoor for the rest of his life. The guy who actually committed the crime was out in 10 years. Derek Bentleys wrongful conviction cost the British taxpayer 40 years of appeals after his death and the cost of having his body exhumed from the prison cemetery to be buried in his family plot with his parents and sister who didn’t live to see his wrongful conviction overturned.

 

[dutchman]

He would still be convicted if the same crime was committed today.

 

[skybluetony176]

He would still be convicted if the same crime was committed today.

Would he? Doubtful. And if he had have been it wouldn’t have taken 40 years to overturn his wrongful conviction by today’s standards.

 

[dutchman]

Would he? Doubtful. And if he had have been it wouldn’t have taken 40 years to overturn his wrongful conviction by today’s standards.

You think he would walk free after a policeman has been shot dead by his accomplice do you? I can just see the tabloid headlines.

 

[skybluetony176]

You think he would walk free after a policeman has been shot dead by his accomplice do you? I can just see the tabloid headlines.

Of course I don’t. I think he’d have been convicted of being an accomplice and been out in two years at considerably less cost than wrongly convicting him of murder, sending him to the gallows and a drawn out and costly appeal after he’d died from hanging.

 

[dutchman]

Of course I don’t. I think he’d have been convicted of being an accomplice and been out in two years at considerably less cost than wrongly convicting him of murder, sending him to the gallows and a drawn out and costly appeal after he’d died from hanging.

If as you say he had a "mental age of a 13 year old" he would be sent to a maximum security hospital and probably institutionalised for the rest of his life at enormous cost to the taxpayer.

 

[skybluetony176]

If as you say he had a "mental age of a 13 year old" he would be sent to a maximum security hospital and probably institutionalised for the rest of his life at enormous cost to the taxpayer.

Seriously. What planet do you live on? Nicolae Ceaușescu’s Romania?

 

[dutchman]

Where do you think they would send a policeman's murderer's accomplice with a mental age of thirteen then? Disneyland?

 

[shmmeee]

How is a US study relevant to the UK system of justice?

Because the US has a death penalty and we don’t?

Which bits of the US system would you gut? Fair trial? Appeal?

Just be a man and say you want them dead because you’re angry. Don’t hide behind “oh I just want to save money” like a pussy.

 

[shmmeee]

I swear the right are the biggest feelings over facts snowflakes around.

“wah I want to kill bad men and pretend it’s for cost reasons”

“wah I want to drive my car and not be reminded of the consequences”

“wah I didn’t lose the election it was all fraud”

“wah modern manufacturing doesn’t employ as many people and I lost my job for life that needed no education”

Bunch of fucking babies. Man up and deal with the real world. Facts don’t care about your feelings.

It’s never. “Yeah I just want to kill people” or “I don’t care about the survival of the species I want to drive a loud car”. Own your fucking ridiculous positions. You just look silly denying reality to save face.

 

[skybluetony176]

Where do you think they would send a policeman's murderer's accomplice with a mental age of thirteen then? Disneyland?

He’d have gone to an age appropriate prison. You do realise that there’s plenty of inmates in prison with learning issues. Broadmoor is for dangerous prisoners with severe mental health issues. It’s not a case of you couldn’t pass your 11+ so it’s straight of to a secure mental health unit for you.