Ccfcisparks
Well-Known Member
Have you got stats or a study to backup your claim considering its a "Fact"
Stats figures for how much each Championship club has spent (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter Gibbo
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Grendel
Well-Known Member
Wigan, Blackburn, Wolves, Sunderland, Ipswich Leeds (points deduction maybe?) Hull , soon to be Sheffield Wednesday , Man City, forest, Norwich, Leicester
In 2 years unless they get back Bournemouth and Swansea I confidently predict
Ccfcisparks
Well-Known Member
And where are your stats confirming that they were at the top end of the wage budget in the league?
Ccfcisparks
Well-Known Member
Sheffield Wednesday have had a points deduction also.
A look at Blackburn in the season they got relegated shows they were in the bottom 1/3rd for wage bill in the Championship.
Ccfcisparks
Well-Known Member
Hull had the 15th worst wage bill last year, I wouldnt consider that a top end budget either. Its like you pick these teams without the stats to back them up, almost like you are clutching at straws?
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
I dont think there is an example anywhere of the biggest spending club being relegated to be fair
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
We can twist this how much we like ..
We are one of the leagues smallest playing budgets .
Teams that struggle who have big wage bills are often on a decline after a recent upturn and are offloading wages gradually year on year .
There is no argument to be had
Norwich , Watford and bournemouth
All amongst the biggest playing budgets in the league
We are one of the leagues smallest playing budgets .
Teams that struggle who have big wage bills are often on a decline after a recent upturn and are offloading wages gradually year on year .
There is no argument to be had
Norwich , Watford and bournemouth
All amongst the biggest playing budgets in the league
Who would most likely win when Team A played Team B?
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Yea it's a silly argument really , look at Bournemouth squad after offloading a few players to cut the wage bill .
Look at Watfords .
Should either miss out on promotion , they'd cut further and have to replace well for less money .
Sheffield wednesday and Derby have both seen year on year decline since missing out through the playoffs, eventually all their top players are gone and they are stuck with average Joe's on pretty big money still .
It also depends how much the club try to reduce their budgets on the playing side
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
Didn’t Sunderland and Wolves have one of the largest budgets in the Championship when they went down from the Prem to L1 in consecutive seasons?
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Possibly, but they didn't have the largest
ovduk78
Well-Known Member
When Wolves were in L1 with us they still had players on PL wages. I know that Sam Ricketts was still on £30K per week!!
Ccfcisparks
Well-Known Member
Well according to Grendels sampling, teams just relegated from the premier league are excluded. Therefore they aren’t valid examples.
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
For me what is wrong is that people take an estimate or best guess of the "budget" then apply it to an absolute of league position. That enables comments of over achievement or excuses of what did you expect.
The reality is the budget though a big part of it is still only part. Player development, management decisions, injuries, leadership etc etc all have a definite input irrespective of budget.
CCFC has a low player budget in comparison to most championship clubs. We will never know what is actually spent on player wages, even transfers are not necessarily clear cut in terms of value.
What that does for ccfc is provide a range of positions that the club should end up. I would suggest somewhere in the bottom third. Then there is a whole clutch of clubs that are much of a muchness financially but also in other elements. Leaving the top third that with the odd exception have the biggest financial commitment to budget.
League position is also a factor of how well or effectively opposition spend their money and utilise their players and set up. Obvious point I know but a big budget doesnt mean it is spent or used well. There can also be historic dead wood that push budget up but add nothing to the player or team performance
Should ccfc be in the relegation zone because it has the worst or second worst budget. No. It is not a given. Should they be in the bottom third or so yes that's a reasonable assumption. Being at the top of that third (don't get hung up on absolute position ) is not really over achieving in my mind. It is matching what should be possible with the set up and employees we have.
Focusing on an estimated budget that never actually then gets disclosed is proving only a generalisation. It doesn't prove position and to my mind creates a negative mindset.
Budget is important but the smaller factors can also make a significant difference
The reality is the budget though a big part of it is still only part. Player development, management decisions, injuries, leadership etc etc all have a definite input irrespective of budget.
CCFC has a low player budget in comparison to most championship clubs. We will never know what is actually spent on player wages, even transfers are not necessarily clear cut in terms of value.
What that does for ccfc is provide a range of positions that the club should end up. I would suggest somewhere in the bottom third. Then there is a whole clutch of clubs that are much of a muchness financially but also in other elements. Leaving the top third that with the odd exception have the biggest financial commitment to budget.
League position is also a factor of how well or effectively opposition spend their money and utilise their players and set up. Obvious point I know but a big budget doesnt mean it is spent or used well. There can also be historic dead wood that push budget up but add nothing to the player or team performance
Should ccfc be in the relegation zone because it has the worst or second worst budget. No. It is not a given. Should they be in the bottom third or so yes that's a reasonable assumption. Being at the top of that third (don't get hung up on absolute position ) is not really over achieving in my mind. It is matching what should be possible with the set up and employees we have.
Focusing on an estimated budget that never actually then gets disclosed is proving only a generalisation. It doesn't prove position and to my mind creates a negative mindset.
Budget is important but the smaller factors can also make a significant difference
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Legia Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Portsmouth definitely flirted with relegation to the Conference in 2013-14. They were lying in 22nd place with only 7 games left, so I imagine a lot of their fans feared the worst at that precise moment in time.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
they finished 3 points off 8th
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
They did secure 17 points from 21 if they were 22nd with 7 left
Relegation was 50 points they got 59 ..
So were on 42 with 7 games left
Ccfcisparks
Well-Known Member
Yeah but that’s not considered flirting with relegation if it doesn’t fit Grendels agenda
Legia Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Irrelevant - that's just hindsight. After 39 games they were only 2 points above the drop zone and closer to relegation than we were at the same point this season. Even so there were many on here that were convinced we were in real danger of going down this season, so I'm pretty sure a large element of Portsmouth's fans would have thought the same at that time.
Ccfcisparks
Well-Known Member
It means that we haven’t been flirting with relegation all year because we are likely to finish 9 points above the drop zone!
Barnsley
Well-Known Member
We’ve got a wage bill that’s in the bottom 6 in this league. Which is to be expected when we’re running on only the money the club generates.
Brentford have a wage bill that’s 180% of their annual income, and they owe their owner £102M but through player sales they’re chipping away at it.
Brentford have a wage bill that’s 180% of their annual income, and they owe their owner £102M but through player sales they’re chipping away at it.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
You are an anomaly though really, and it's not the normal
Barnsley
Well-Known Member
It will be at some point, well run clubs going about it the right way, will see off the big spending shit or bust type. Get your house in order like us, Luton, Millwall, yourselves and you’ll end up a top 10 side whilst the cheating catches up with the rest.
ovduk78
Well-Known Member
There's little evidence of cheating catching up with the rest. A couple of teams fined and Sheff Wednesday deducted 6 points yet the overspending goes on.
Barnsley
Well-Known Member
Sunderland, Wigan, Ipswich, Hull, all getting their punishment Pompey have been getting theirs 10 years, Wednesday getting theirs this season, Derby’s and Birmingham’s won’t be long in coming, all lot will come back with far smaller bills than they went down with. They’ll be more to come too in my opinion.
ovduk78
Well-Known Member
Well they have punished themselves by being so badly managed that they were relegated and have suffered in L1 and some in L2 but how many have broken FFP and been penalised for it?
Barnsley
Well-Known Member
The cheating as caught up with them, it’s unsustainable to keep throwing piles of money at established names, paying way over the odds trying to get to the greed league, the governing bodies are spineless bottle jobs, with absolutely no grip on the cheating bastards, but fortunately the mercenaries having a final payday are punishment enough.
ovduk78
Well-Known Member
Be nice for governing bodies to govern though. Hopefully Agent Rooney will successfully complete his task & Derby will also be punished in 3 games time
Hullinho87
Well-Known Member
Where is the proof of that?
Frostie
Well-Known Member
He's deliberately twisting it by comparing our entire club's wage bill to just the playing staff of others.
Our wage bill for the entire club in the L2 season was £3,988,263 from the club's accounts.
HuckerbyDublinWhelan
Well-Known Member
How much of that is likely to be non playing staff though, just asking
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Other than the manager and the back room staff very little
mark82
Super Moderator
I wouldn't say well run in business terms. Losing less money than most, but not necessarily "well run".
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Where do you get these figures from? The accounts are sure the accounts for 17 18 are they?
D
Deleted member 11652
Guest
Yes but you were able to spend £20m on a striker in January