Do you want to discuss boring politics? (234 Viewers)

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Scotland have had referendums to leave oddly before brexit and Sturgeon will do it again if she can and lose again

It’s always been within irelands remit to vote for union with the south since the signing of the Treaty - I think the appetite will not be great in the south and was always at one point going to the be the majority in the north

Can you not see how the last 5 years have made these things much more likely when Brexit was deeply unpopular in both countries?

 

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[Ian1779]

Ed Balls saying that photo was taken from the balcony of number 11. Rishi sneaking about with his Polaroid.

It’s so obvious he’s behind all of it.

 

[Grendel]

Can you not see how the last 5 years have made these things much more likely when Brexit was deeply unpopular in both countries?

I think you over estimate the desire for Scottish independence

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I think you over estimate the desire for Scottish independence

I think they have been at 50/50 for ages which is hardly a healthy position given that it’s mostly older people who are opposed to it

 

[David O'Day]

It’s so obvious he’s behind all of it.

Lights touch paper and then fucks off to California

 

[PVA]

Nobody’s gloating. What I find very odd is how blasé the Brexiteers and Tories here and elsewhere are towards the country breaking apart as a consequence of things and people they voted for.

‘British sovereignty’ means little if the British state doesn’t last barely 10 years after the vote.

Haven't you heard? It's all Labour/The EU's/remainers' fault.

You can't possibly expect a Brexiteer to take some responsibility for what they voted for.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Haven't you heard? It's all Labour/The EU's/remainers' fault.

You can't possibly expect a Brexiteer to take some responsibility for what they voted for.

‘It was gonna happen anyway’ is the new line. Not like giving Sinn Fein and the SNP their best arguments for their respective causes has made any difference at all

 

[Grendel]

‘It was gonna happen anyway’ is the new line. Not like giving Sinn Fein and the SNP their best arguments for their respective causes has made any difference at all

The situation for creating it was laid down by the Blair government and the expanding catholic population of course will lead to more calls for it

 

[CCFCSteve]

[

I think they have been at 50/50 for ages which is hardly a healthy position given that it’s mostly older people who are opposed to it

Agreed, they were before brexit and are after ?! I don’t think anyone’s blasé but we live in a democracy. They’re 50/50 and I might be wrong but hasn’t there always been a view that Ireland might reunify when demographic gradually changed over time ?!

As you know I voted for Brexit (after a lot of thought/research/soul searching). Would I still vote for it again. I don’t know. It’s been far messier than I expected but then again the EUs conduct since has re-enforced some of my prior assumptions and beliefs

I didn’t/don’t want the break up of the union and there are deals that still could be done which can make this less likely, but as I say above, we live in a democracy

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The situation for creating it was laid down by the Blair government and the expanding catholic population of course will lead to more calls for it

What is actually happening is a growing appetite for Alliance and less polarised parties

 

[Grendel]

[

Agreed, they were before brexit and are after ?! I don’t think anyone’s blasé but we live in a democracy. They’re 50/50 and I might be wrong but hasn’t there always been a view that Ireland might reunify when demographic gradually changed over time ?!

As you know I voted for Brexit (after a lot of thought/research/soul searching). Would I still vote for it again. I don’t know. It’s been far messier than I expected but then again the EUs conduct since has re-enforced some of my prior assumptions and beliefs

I didn’t/don’t want the break up of the union and there are deals that still could be done which can make this less likely, but as I say above, we live in a democracy

When the treaty was signed the gap was huge and even in 2011 was 14% pts apart - it’s likely to switch in 2022 - if you are going to grant powers for the electorateto be independent the government allowing that had to foresee the possibility

The issue really anyway will be that the Irish republic will avoid the economic basket case for as long as it can

Which is funny

 

[Grendel]

What is actually happening is a growing appetite for Alliance and less polarised parties

Sinn Fein isn’t polarised? Ok

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

[

Agreed, they were before brexit and are after ?! I don’t think anyone’s blasé but we live in a democracy. They’re 50/50 and I might be wrong but hasn’t there always been a view that Ireland might reunify when demographic gradually changed over time ?!

As you know I voted for Brexit (after a lot of thought/research/soul searching). Would I still vote for it again. I don’t know. It’s been far messier than I expected but then again the EUs conduct since has re-enforced some of my prior assumptions and beliefs

I didn’t/don’t want the break up of the union and there are deals that still could be done which can make this less likely, but as I say above, we live in a democracy

I think you’ve completely missed the point to be honest. It isn’t about ‘it shouldn’t be allowed’, it’s about recent events having made them much more likely. 2 parts of the UK having a strong anti Brexit vote should have been cause for a rethink.

 

[Grendel]

I think you’ve completely missed the point to be honest. It isn’t about ‘it shouldn’t be allowed’, it’s about recent events having made them much more likely. 2 parts of the UK having a strong anti Brexit vote should have been cause for a rethink.

so the change of religious demographic isnt the decider and you think Scotland will actually sign up to nationalism and their own form of Brexit but at the same time want a progressive alliance

ok

 

[CCFCSteve]

I think you’ve completely missed the point to be honest. It isn’t about ‘it shouldn’t be allowed’, it’s about recent events having made them much more likely. 2 parts of the UK having a strong anti Brexit vote should have been cause for a rethink.

I haven’t missed the point at all. I was saying Scotland was 50/50 before brexit and still is and Ireland was potentially heading that way anyway.

So I’m saying, brexit or not and whether I like it or not, the break up of the union was probably on its way to happening anyway at some point. Same as I believe us leaving EU was always going to happen, just a matter of when and how.

Should the four UK nations views have led to a different type of brexit, yes, possibly. Has brexit accelerated what might well have happens, again, possibly yes but so have various other dynamics

 

[David O'Day]

What is actually happening is a growing appetite for Alliance and less polarised parties

Also it's utter bollocks that a growing catholic population has much to do with anything. As you said the Alliance party is taking votes away from the DUP and the UUP as their brand of conservatism is at odds with the younger generation of voters.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Also it's utter bollocks that a growing catholic population has much to do with anything. As you said the Alliance party is taking votes away from the DUP and the UUP as their brand of conservatism is at odds with the younger generation of voters.

In past polls on this a large chunk of Catholics have shown support for staying, it’s really the Protestants who tended to be a closed shop

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

so the change of religious demographic isnt the decider and you think Scotland will actually sign up to nationalism and their own form of Brexit but at the same time want a progressive alliance

ok

A growing % of people in NI don’t actually identify as Irish or British anymore and as above past polls have shown being Catholic is not necessarily a guaranteed UI vote

 

[Deleted member 9744]

The problem with claiming these are all work meetings is either people don't believe you or if they do believe you its the most unprofessional workplace in the country with seemingly daily breaks for cheese and wine.

Raab seemed unclear whether it was a work meeting or an after work drink. Of course one would have been against the regulations at the time.

Either way it doesn't really chime with the line that was constantly trotted out that they were 'working round the clock' to deal with the emergency. If this was how it was it is easy to understand why the Government 's response was always too slow and ill informed resulting in tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths.

 

[JAM See]

Raab seemed unclear whether it was a work meeting or an after work drink. Of course one would have been against the regulations at the time.

Either way it doesn't really chime with the line that was constantly trotted out that they were 'working round the clock' to deal with the emergency. If this was how it was it is easy to understand why the Government 's response was always too slow and ill informed resulting in tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths.

These are the people who created a 'VIP Lane' for awarding of PPE contracts because "There wasn't time to do due diligence".

Sat around eating cheese and drinking wine.

It would be laughable if wasn't so important.

 

[skybluetony176]

so the change of religious demographic isnt the decider and you think Scotland will actually sign up to nationalism and their own form of Brexit but at the same time want a progressive alliance

ok

Religion is irrelevant. Sinn Fein and the SDLP are polling well even in some predominantly Protestant areas. Many can just see where their bread is buttered and it isn’t by Boris.

 

[PVA]

Oh Dom. Keep digging.

 

[David O'Day]

Someone take the shovel off Raab

 

[rob9872]

These are the people who created a 'VIP Lane' for awarding of PPE contracts because "There wasn't time to do due diligence".

Sat around eating cheese and drinking wine.

It would be laughable if wasn't so important.

Imagine people eating and drinking, that should stop immediately.

We had a number of meetings throughout the pandemic and if I recall May was particularly warm. Those people you've been working all day with you're now still with but in an outside environment, I wish we had one and I may have popped out for a quick beer to unwind at the end of the day.

Tbh it doesn't surprise me a bit that it went on and the new faux outrage at each new photo is only more surprising than the fact that someone has sat on them for 18 months waiting to pull the trigger. The mistake imo is not what went on but the denials. It would have gone away by now if they'd come and said yeah of course we had gatherings. there were many and often and I think people would have been less offended.

 

[David O'Day]

Religion is irrelevant. Sinn Fein and the SDLP are polling well even in some predominantly Protestant areas. Many can just see where their bread is buttered and it isn’t by Boris.

The UUP at the last Stormont elections advised their voters to give the SDLP their 2nd preference votes

 

[PVA]

LBC is awash with people calling up heartbroken at not being able to say goodbye to loved ones while the government were having cheese and wine parties.

Do you still think the parties don't matter and no one cares about them Grendel?

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I really don't care if some people who've had some meetings together relax afterwards with a small amount of cheese and wine. It's outside, they're at separate tables, and you could argue it's good for morale after a tough day to give a small pick-me-up. It's also a bit like my next door neighbour - he goes off to work sharing a car with a colleague, so he may as well have a pint afterwards with him mightn't he, as any 'damage' has been done. It's the same with this cheese and wine - if you've been in an office with somebody all day, then being in the garden for an hour or two after is not going to make things worse! I can buy that that's an extension of a meeting, in a liberal sense of the word - hell, I've brought biscuits and cake into meetings in the past, even if I'm clearly not posh enough for the finest wines known to humanity.

Now that doesn't mean that the Christmas gatherings don't leave a sour taste however, but this particular one is distracting from more important breaches, and also policy decisions going forward.

 

[fernandopartridge]

LBC is awash with people calling up heartbroken at not being able to say goodbye to loved ones while the government were having cheese and wine parties.

Do you still think the parties don't matter and no one cares about them Grendel?

The next place the argument is probably going to go is whether or not restrictions on meeting people in the open air were reasonable

 

[rob9872]

I really don't care if some people who've had some meetings together relax afterwards with a small amount of cheese and wine. It's outside, they're at separate tables, and you could argue it's good for morale after a tough day to give a small pick-me-up. It's also a bit like my next door neighbour - he goes off to work sharing a car with a colleague, so he may as well have a pint afterwards with him mightn't he, as any 'damage' has been done. It's the same with this cheese and wine - if you've been in an office with somebody all day, then being in the garden for an hour or two after is not going to make things worse! I can buy that that's an extension of a meeting, in a liberal sense of the word - hell, I've brought biscuits and cake into meetings in the past, even if I'm clearly not posh enough for the finest wines known to humanity.

Now that doesn't mean that the Christmas gatherings don't leave a sour taste however, but this particular one is distracting from more important breaches, and also policy decisions going forward.

I agree pretty much as I've said above, but I still think it was a huge mistake denying it. Unless the advisors are in on the plan they must have known there would be photos about to surface as it was gathering pace.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I agree pretty much as I've said above, but I still think it was a huge mistake denying it. Unless the advisors are in on the plan they must have known there would be photos about to surface as it was gathering pace.

I think most commentators even accept that this particular one didn't breach guidelines, so it's a particular non-story! If I were Boris Johnson, I'd be delighted for this one to have come out, as it suggests they're running out of the stuff that could actually be damaging.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

This, however, is far worse. Not even cheese and wine can encourage him to turn up!

Boris skips Cobra meeting as decision over Christmas restrictions goes unmade

Scotland’s First Minister Nicola Sturgeon has slammed Boris Johnson and Chancellor Rishi Sunak for their Cobra meeting no-show - despite more cash being pledged to combat the Omicron 'tsunami'

www.mirror.co.uk

 

[David O'Day]

The next place the argument is probably going to go is whether or not restrictions on meeting people in the open air were reasonable

Couldn't you get arrested in May 2020 for sitting on a park bench

 

[Ian1779]

Imagine people eating and drinking, that should stop immediately.

We had a number of meetings throughout the pandemic and if I recall May was particularly warm. Those people you've been working all day with you're now still with but in an outside environment, I wish we had one and I may have popped out for a quick beer to unwind at the end of the day.

Tbh it doesn't surprise me a bit that it went on and the new faux outrage at each new photo is only more surprising than the fact that someone has sat on them for 18 months waiting to pull the trigger. The mistake imo is not what went on but the denials. It would have gone away by now if they'd come and said yeah of course we had gatherings. there were many and often and I think people would have been less offended.

I’m not particularly bothered about this instance to be fair as a single thing. But then I can also appreciate that if I was someone who had a family member die alone at this time I’d be fucking apoplectic.

It still smacks of them being above their own rules too.

 

[Ian1779]

Couldn't you get arrested in May 2020 for sitting on a park bench

And that’s what adds to the absurdity of it all. Imagine trying to justify things like this when you were banning people from comforting dying relatives.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Couldn't you get arrested in May 2020 for sitting on a park bench

Yeah, well most of them were taped off round our way.