Potential New Managers - An Overview (3 Viewers)

[kingharvest]

I was bored last night so tried to bio the managers at the top of the bookies list and look at some stats and a bit of a summary of their highs and lows in management.

Dennis Wise

Club Games Won Drawn Lost Win %
Millwall 89 36 24 29 40.45
Swindon 17 9 5 3 52.94
Leeds 99 47 19 33 47.47
TOTAL 205 92 48 65 44.87

• Successful start to Swindon Managerial career
• Poached by Leeds in October 06 – relegated that year
• Left in Jan 08 with Leeds 3rd in league 1
• Bad spell at Newcastle, image damaged by signings (you tube videos, favours)

Kevin Blackwell

Club Games Won Drawn Lost Win %
Leeds 114 44 37 33 38.6
Luton 47 16 10 21 34.04
Sheffield Utd 125 53 36 36 42.40
TOTAL 286 113 83 90 39.51

• Took leeds to play off final
• Sacked for negative comments in press, Leeds lying in 23rd at time with 7 points from first 8 games
• Spent time at Madrid and Inter to learn new training methods
• Took Shef Utd to 9th in first season (joined in Feb 08)
• Took them to play-off final a year later
• Left job by mutual consent on 14th August (early!) 2010

Paul Ince

Club Games Won Drawn Lost Win %
Macc Town 35 14 8 13 40.00
MK Dons 55 33 12 10 60.00
Blackburn 21 6 4 11 28.57
MK Dons 56 23 9 24 41.07
Notts County 29 10 6 13 34.48
TOTAL 196 85 39 72 43.37

• Won League 2 with MK Dons – April 2008
• Won 3 in 17 at Blackburn
• Less Successful second spell at MK Dons
• Lost 9 in a row at Notts County – April 2011

Sean Dyche

Club Games Won Drawn Lost Win %
Watford 49 17 17 15 34.69

• 1 Season in charge at Watford
• Promoted from Malkay Mackays Assistant
• Highest Watford finish since 2008
• Better record at Watford than Mackay
• Dismissed after change in ownership – Italians bought in Zola

Some stand out things for me in there are firstly that i didn't realise how decent a record Kevin Blackwell has, nor did i realise how impressive Dyche's first season at watford was.

 

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[kingharvest]

Soz - can't format the tables to make them look tidy. hopefully they make sense

 

[tanchahal]

Still wise for me

 

[Greggs]

nice work, the stats say Wise

 

[SkyblueBazza]

Well sadly, after sparking my interest initially you lost all credibility by saying Dennis Wise had a bad spell at Newcastle & then choosing to ignore that spell in your analysis. You may be willing & able to ignore that bad spell but if I am going to be swayed with stats I want all of them.
On a gut feel, which may serve us as well as any stats, I think Wise would be a wise choice (pun intended)

 

[stupot07]

I would put not managed a football club since January 2008 as a bullet point under wise.

Also steering Macclesfield from relegation, having took over with them rooted bottom and seven points behind the next team is probably Ince's biggest achievement.

 

[skyblueman]

Still Wise for me

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

My order of who I want out of these:

Wise - Seem the best choice, won't take no shit etc.
Dyche - Might have been a fluke, Mackay turned out good
Ince - not sure, he's could be either v good or bad
Blackwell - Just no!

Any of these will be a punt! imo, all have used hoofball*, which I'm not a fan of, but only 1 stat counts...

*NOT SURE if Ince did, could someone confirm his tactics etc.

 

[smileycov]

Well sadly, after sparking my interest initially you lost all credibility by saying Dennis Wise had a bad spell at Newcastle & then choosing to ignore that spell in your analysis. You may be willing & able to ignore that bad spell but if I am going to be swayed with stats I want all of them.
On a gut feel, which may serve us as well as any stats, I think Wise would be a wise choice (pun intended)

He wasn't manager at Newcastle......So now you have all the facts! :wave:

 

[We'll_live_and_die]

I don't want Wise, He was one of the Crazy Gang with Thorn. We need to get away from that squad. Next up Vinny Jones will be on the shortlist.

 

[skyblueman]

Vinny Jones !!!! BRILLIANT

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I don't want Wise, He was one of the Crazy Gang with Thorn. We need to get away from that squad. Next up Vinny Jones will be on the shortlist.

Wise is also in the Chelsea class of the 90s with Poyet and RDM, they've turned out well, tbf, RDM was very lucky!

 

[kingharvest]

Well sadly, after sparking my interest initially you lost all credibility by saying Dennis Wise had a bad spell at Newcastle & then choosing to ignore that spell in your analysis. You may be willing & able to ignore that bad spell but if I am going to be swayed with stats I want all of them.
On a gut feel, which may serve us as well as any stats, I think Wise would be a wise choice (pun intended)

Yeah sorry mate, but as wise wasn't manager there are no stats. Ultimately it was only his credibility and image damaged by the newcastle role he had, but there is an interesting quote from bobby Robson who really lays into Wise.

 

[SkyBluegilby]

March 2011 - Roberto Di Matteo installed as favourite to take the reigns at Coventry City FC.

He must be gutted he didnt take the job!

 

[SkyBluegilby]

Wise was part of the supposed "cockney mafia" and if i remember right he was involved in the transfers for the club? Was a really bizarre setup to be honest. Not really sure what Wise was being paid for there.

 

[mark82]

March 2011 - Roberto Di Matteo installed as favourite to take the reigns at Coventry City FC.

He must be gutted he didnt take the job!

I spotted that the other day. Things could have turned out very differently for all involved!!!

 

[Paxman II]

I don't think the stas have much weight in the argument frankly. I'm more concerned that Blackwell has been out too long and not been in with a shout anywhere else since. I think his best may be behind him.
Wise is hungry but I fear the disruptive elements you risk with him and was he any good after splitting with Poyet?
Dyche is hungry and out of those probably the better choice on paper.

The thing is I wouldn't want any of them.

I think you need to look at the gut instinct as much as past records and the personality. Good back room staff help tremendously too.

Still surprised none's talking about Curbishley....fits right in for me on every level.

 

[SydneySkyBlue]

I don't think the stas have much weight in the argument frankly. I'm more concerned that Blackwell has been out too long and not been in with a shout anywhere else since. I think his best may be behind him.
Wise is hungry but I fear the disruptive elements you risk with him and was he any good after splitting with Poyet?
Dyche is hungry and out of those probably the better choice on paper.

The thing is I wouldn't want any of them.

I think you need to look at the gut instinct as much as past records and the personality. Good back room staff help tremendously too.

Still surprised none's talking about Curbishley....fits right in for me on every level.

I get the impression Curbishley would be asking for a lot of money to return to management. He's had a fair few offers.

 

[kingharvest]

But Curbishley has been out of the game longer than any of them! I like Curbishley, but i think maybe his best is behind him as well.

 

[blueflint]

give it to shaw lets try to attack teams more

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Curbishley would walk into any job at a top championship side and most of the bottom end prem teams so can we stop mentioning him. He has probably had numerous job offers from premiership clubs in the last 3/4 years and hasn't taken them. Left West Ham because their owners sold the players under his nose without his say so, yea he would love it here :facepalm:
While I am on a rant can we also stop mentioning Billy Davies, Gary Neville and Mick Mcarthy as well

 

[Gint11]

I was bored last night so tried to bio the managers at the top of the bookies list and look at some stats and a bit of a summary of their highs and lows in management.

Dennis Wise

Club Games Won Drawn Lost Win %
Millwall 89 36 24 29 40.45
Swindon 17 9 5 3 52.94
Leeds 99 47 19 33 47.47

TOTAL 205 92 48 65 44.87

• Successful start to Swindon Managerial career
• Poached by Leeds in October 06 – relegated that year
• Left in Jan 08 with Leeds 3rd in league 1
• Bad spell at Newcastle, image damaged by signings (you tube videos, favours)

Kevin Blackwell

Club Games Won Drawn Lost Win %
Leeds 114 44 37 33 38.6
Luton 47 16 10 21 34.04
Sheffield Utd 125 53 36 36 42.40
TOTAL 286 113 83 90 39.51

• Took leeds to play off final
• Sacked for negative comments in press, Leeds lying in 23rd at time with 7 points from first 8 games
• Spent time at Madrid and Inter to learn new training methods
• Took Shef Utd to 9th in first season (joined in Feb 08)
• Took them to play-off final a year later
• Left job by mutual consent on 14th August (early!) 2010

Paul Ince

Club Games Won Drawn Lost Win %
Macc Town 35 14 8 13 40.00
MK Dons 55 33 12 10 60.00
Blackburn 21 6 4 11 28.57
MK Dons 56 23 9 24 41.07
Notts County 29 10 6 13 34.48
TOTAL 196 85 39 72 43.37

• Won League 2 with MK Dons – April 2008
• Won 3 in 17 at Blackburn
• Less Successful second spell at MK Dons
• Lost 9 in a row at Notts County – April 2011

Sean Dyche

Club Games Won Drawn Lost Win %
Watford 49 17 17 15 34.69

• 1 Season in charge at Watford
• Promoted from Malkay Mackays Assistant
• Highest Watford finish since 2008
• Better record at Watford than Mackay
• Dismissed after change in ownership – Italians bought in Zola

Some stand out things for me in there are firstly that i didn't realise how decent a record Kevin Blackwell has, nor did i realise how impressive Dyche's first season at watford was.

Bloody hell mate you must have been bored. Wouldnt pick any of them 4. If I had to, I'd pick Wise only because I loved him while he was here. Ince was a class player, rubbish manager, Cant stand Blackwell (remember him slagging us off before when we played his teams) and Dyche I think is still unproven.

 

[Paxman II]

Well if Curbishley was asking a lot to return then it's because he feels he is a strong candidate...but i doubt anyone knows the inside track on that one tbh.
Had not realised he had been out quite so long but he still posseses much more experience and stature than any of the others by a long way.
Don't think his days are behind him at all.

As for pay? I've expressed b4 on here that there's a reason football managers are out of work - clubs can't pay those amounts demanded but the very thought of managing someone like us means the likes of Curbishley and many others will have their sights lowered for sure. Interestingly when talking contracts and wages for a manager everyone assumes huge paydays! Not so. I would bet my life savings for example that say Curbishley would come here for 200k a year so long as rewards were there for promotion etc that made it all worth while. We are a big club not some small fry without potential. Of course the likes of him would come here. 40 + applicants tells us already this job is rated by many as a cream position regardless of the underlying trends at the club in recent years. Any football manger worth his salt would want a job here. The chance to fire this club back is a great challenge. Yeah we won't entice Harry but we can get some decent applicants of repute.
Question is will SISU risk the untested Shaw for too long regardless of results or bite the bullet and get their man in asap? It will be a brave decision to appoint Shaw and I'm not sure SISU can take that risk. Look at it this way: If you appointed Warnock at Leeds you did so because you know hook or by crook the guy will produce a team that will be fighting around the playoffs minimum. That's what we now need to do. Leeds didn't get Bates favourite son Wise in did they? No too risky, Bates needs promotion and appointed a man that will get it. Did he appoint from within? No Did he sack a good manager? Yes but has shown by his actions he means business and woh be tide anyone who does not match that ambition. SISU for me anyway...need to think this way.
I like what I see in Shaw and it could happen for us but do you risk it? We could be out of business if we don't get promoted!

 

[wingy]

Clive mentioned a name on tuesday night that I was suggesting in pre-season to come in on a Coaching role with the strikers ,to form the Attack elelment in our play.Now i don't know if he meant as a stand alone manager,or to increase the coaching element back up to three ,should RS and LC step up.David Kelly who worked alongside Billy Davis @ Preston and Derby I believe,Don't know if he based it on inside club information but lives fairly local also.:thinking about:

 

[Paxman II]

Curbishley would walk into any job at a top championship side and most of the bottom end prem teams so can we stop mentioning him. He has probably had numerous job offers from premiership clubs in the last 3/4 years and hasn't taken them. Left West Ham because their owners sold the players under his nose without his say so, yea he would love it here :facepalm:
While I am on a rant can we also stop mentioning Billy Davies, Gary Neville and Mick Mcarthy as well

Can't possibly think why Curbishley would walk into any championship club or bottom half of the prem!? You need to keep up with reality this last few years. Sorry. However from what you say I deduce you rate him highly then?
Billy Davies is a good shout and backed by many supporters when you talk to them. As for the other two...I agree with you.

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Well if Curbishley was asking a lot to return then it's because he feels he is a strong candidate...but i doubt anyone knows the inside track on that one tbh.
Had not realised he had been out quite so long but he still posseses much more experience and stature than any of the others by a long way.
Don't think his days are behind him at all.

As for pay? I've expressed b4 on here that there's a reason football managers are out of work - clubs can't pay those amounts demanded but the very thought of managing someone like us means the likes of Curbishley and many others will have their sights lowered for sure. Interestingly when talking contracts and wages for a manager everyone assumes huge paydays! Not so. I would bet my life savings for example that say Curbishley would come here for 200k a year so long as rewards were there for promotion etc that made it all worth while. We are a big club not some small fry without potential. Of course the likes of him would come here. 40 + applicants tells us already this job is rated by many as a cream position regardless of the underlying trends at the club in recent years. Any football manger worth his salt would want a job here. The chance to fire this club back is a great challenge. Yeah we won't entice Harry but we can get some decent applicants of repute.
Question is will SISU risk the untested Shaw for too long regardless of results or bite the bullet and get their man in asap? It will be a brave decision to appoint Shaw and I'm not sure SISU can take that risk. Look at it this way: If you appointed Warnock at Leeds you did so because you know hook or by crook the guy will produce a team that will be fighting around the playoffs minimum. That's what we now need to do. Leeds didn't get Bates favourite son Wise in did they? No too risky, Bates needs promotion and appointed a man that will get it. Did he appoint from within? No Did he sack a good manager? Yes but has shown by his actions he means business and woh be tide anyone who does not match that ambition. SISU for me anyway...need to think this way.
I like what I see in Shaw and it could happen for us but do you risk it? We could be out of business if we don't get promoted!

Curbishley is not coming here, he left West Ham because the owners sold players on him and is linked to nearly every premier/championship club when there is a job available

End of discussion in my eyes

Nothing wrong with hoping but it is not a realistic option imo

Yes I rate Curbs but don't think he will come here, I get the impression he is enjoying being out of work anyway and isn't exactly bashing down doors to get back into management

 

[CW6]

Well if Curbishley was asking a lot to return then it's because he feels he is a strong candidate...but i doubt anyone knows the inside track on that one tbh.
Had not realised he had been out quite so long but he still posseses much more experience and stature than any of the others by a long way.
Don't think his days are behind him at all.

As for pay? I've expressed b4 on here that there's a reason football managers are out of work - clubs can't pay those amounts demanded but the very thought of managing someone like us means the likes of Curbishley and many others will have their sights lowered for sure. Interestingly when talking contracts and wages for a manager everyone assumes huge paydays! Not so. I would bet my life savings for example that say Curbishley would come here for 200k a year so long as rewards were there for promotion etc that made it all worth while. We are a big club not some small fry without potential. Of course the likes of him would come here. 40 + applicants tells us already this job is rated by many as a cream position regardless of the underlying trends at the club in recent years. Any football manger worth his salt would want a job here. The chance to fire this club back is a great challenge. Yeah we won't entice Harry but we can get some decent applicants of repute.
Question is will SISU risk the untested Shaw for too long regardless of results or bite the bullet and get their man in asap? It will be a brave decision to appoint Shaw and I'm not sure SISU can take that risk. Look at it this way: If you appointed Warnock at Leeds you did so because you know hook or by crook the guy will produce a team that will be fighting around the playoffs minimum. That's what we now need to do. Leeds didn't get Bates favourite son Wise in did they? No too risky, Bates needs promotion and appointed a man that will get it. Did he appoint from within? No Did he sack a good manager? Yes but has shown by his actions he means business and woh be tide anyone who does not match that ambition. SISU for me anyway...need to think this way.
I like what I see in Shaw and it could happen for us but do you risk it? We could be out of business if we don't get promoted!

Good post and good points. Curbs is probably the best we could get out there realistically. If SISU want to show they mean business and want to win some fans over his appointment would do so in my eyes.

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17112269

Wolves weren't good enough 6 months ago when they were a premiership side?

 

[Colonel Mustard]

The interview with Fisher made it quite clear that the next man to come in will have to cede any ideas of a traditional manager's role.

They have modernised the setup with a director of football (even if they don't use that term). They want a coach, somebody to get the best out of the first team, primarily focused on performance rather than executive management. It is difficult - even moreso than it was before - to believe that a man like Curbishley would take on such a role.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

He wasn't manager at Newcastle......So now you have all the facts! :wave:

Quite...He did not have a bad spell at Newcastle as manager so there are no stats...so why suggest the bad spell at all? He could've signed Lionel Messi & the manager might have made that look a bad signing too!
Maybe I'm being pedantic?
Either way good on you for doing the grafting to work it out.

 

[BackRoomRummermill]

Who ever it is has a great oppurtunity to make a name for themselves , good or bad !

 

[cloughie]

sorry paxman but usually agree with lots of your posts but curbs, a big big no, he has not got the appettite and desire anymore otherwise he would have taken a better offer before

as for KingsH's stats, (cheers)

average them out and wise is a no brainer

PUSB

 

[jassie78]

I would go with Blackwell based on the success he's had at Sheffield united taking them to play offs, his win ratio not bad and he's gone out of his way to Italy to learning new ideas

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

I would go with Blackwell based on the success he's had at Sheffield united taking them to play offs, his win ratio not bad and he's gone out of his way to Italy to learning new ideas

Yea there was a very bad reaction when his name was mentioned and was surprised to see he has a half decent record

He has had limited success at two clubs in Leeds and Sheff Utd with play off fianls which is more than what most of the 1 season wonders (Boothroyd, Dowie, Brown) have achieved

 

[Grendel]

I would go with Blackwell based on the success he's had at Sheffield united taking them to play offs, his win ratio not bad and he's gone out of his way to Italy to learning new ideas

Probably a good time of night to slip that one in.....