Hamer and Sheaf (6 Viewers)

[hill83]

I did. I’m not sure I’d agree Sheafs role is to progress the ball more than Allen’s. It’s entirely data based categorisation. Allen doesn’t progress the ball and when he does he’s not very good at it. Hardly what you want from an AM.

Have a day off for fuck sake

Did Allen shag your mum?

 

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[Evo1883]

My biggest criticism of Allen is he doesn't get us on the front foot enough where receiving the ball but he is starting to do it more tegularly and he did iit Sturday in te build up to the 2nd goal.

Allen has 4 goal contributions in his last 7 matches .. I believe personally Robins picks him because he is disciplined , follows instructions well and works hard

We all know sheaf and hamer are more naturally gifted footballers , but the manager always seems to fit jamie bloody Allen in the starting 11

 

[Esoterica]

It's a bit of a perfect storm for Allen currently, in that the players around him very much compliment his style of play. He has 3 main strengths:

1. His pressing out of possession
2. Pulling the opposition out of shape by getting into half spaces
3. Making runs beyond the striker and into the box

Gyokeres suits 3. because he pulls wide a lot and commits the fullback 1 on 1 which leaves the space for Allen to run into.
Our playing style see a lot of either a) countering quickly, which is good for his runs again or b) we ball carry from deep through Hamer and O'Hare which again suits his off the ball movement.

What we don't do is play a huge amount of slow build up possession football through midfield which I think would challenge his technique and physicality.

So in summary, now we've gone back to a variant of the box midfield, together with the other players we have in the side, it is maximising his strengths and minimising his weaknesses.

 

[Grendel]

Have a day off for fuck sake

Did Allen shag your mum?

I think it’s more he wants to shag Palmer

 

[hill83]

I think it’s more he wants to shag Palmer

Ok, now I don’t know what to do. Palmer is class. I’ll leave you both to it.

 

[clint van damme]

Allen has 4 goal contributions in his last 7 matches .. I believe personally Robins picks him because he is disciplined , follows instructions well and works hard

We all know sheaf and hamer are more naturally gifted footballers , but the manager always seems to fit jamie bloody Allen in the starting 11

I'm fairy sure ou don't have too many instances of not following instructions and stay in Robins team
If Robins keeps picking people it's because they're doing what he asks. I'm not sure why somepwople can't grasp this.

 

[Evo1883]

It's a bit of a perfect storm for Allen currently, in that the players around him very much compliment his style of play. He has 3 main strengths:

1. His pressing out of possession
2. Pulling the opposition out of shape by getting into half spaces
3. Making runs beyond the striker and into the box

Gyokeres suits 3. because he pulls wide a lot and commits the fullback 1 on 1 which leaves the space for Allen to run into.
Our playing style see a lot of either a) countering quickly, which is good for his runs again or b) we ball carry from deep through Hamer and O'Hare which again suits his off the ball movement.

What we don't do is play a huge amount of slow build up possession football through midfield which I think would challenge his technique and physicality.

So in summary, now we've gone back to a variant of the box midfield, together with the other players we have in the side, it is maximising his strengths and minimising his weaknesses.

I guess that goes back to the QPR fan suggesting we have a Manic PlayStyle

 

[shmmeee]

Have a day off for fuck sake

Did Allen shag your mum?

Fucks sake I was just commenting on the graph. I’m still not convinced it’s even him

 

[hill83]

Fucks I don’t like Allen sake I was not liking Allen. just commenting hate Allen on the graph. I’m still not liking Allen convinced it’s even don’t like Allen him

 

[steve cooper]

I'm fairy sure ou don't have too many instances of not following instructions and stay in Robins team
If Robins keeps picking people it's because they're doing what he asks. I'm not sure why somepwople can't grasp this.

Who the hell's somepwople?

 

[covcity4life]

Ok, now I don’t know what to do. Palmer is class. I’ll leave you both to it.

He has an issue with palmer because other people like him. It's so obvious he's lining him up as a target now hyam has gone

 

[clint van damme]

Who the hell's somepwople?

You honestly don't know?!

 

[Grendel]

Ok, now I don’t know what to do. Palmer is class. I’ll leave you both to it.

most people who don’t want Allen want Palmer as he’s a flair player. Allen to say the least exceeds expectation and works ideally with Sheaf o hare and Hamer

Palmer hasn’t the capability to cover the range of ground Allen has. Of course he’s more skilful but needs the ball to feet

ive feuded Allen last season but this season he’s fitted ideally into our formation.

 

[Grendel]

He has an issue with palmer because other people like him. It's so obvious he's lining him up as a target now hyam has gone

Oh dear

 

[hill83]

He has an issue with palmer because other people like him. It's so obvious he's lining him up as a target now hyam has gone

I called exactly this months ago from Grendel. But he’s calmed down a bit lately.

 

[stupot07]

It's a bit of a perfect storm for Allen currently, in that the players around him very much compliment his style of play. He has 3 main strengths:

1. His pressing out of possession
2. Pulling the opposition out of shape by getting into half spaces
3. Making runs beyond the striker and into the box

Gyokeres suits 3. because he pulls wide a lot and commits the fullback 1 on 1 which leaves the space for Allen to run into.
Our playing style see a lot of either a) countering quickly, which is good for his runs again or b) we ball carry from deep through Hamer and O'Hare which again suits his off the ball movement.

What we don't do is play a huge amount of slow build up possession football through midfield which I think would challenge his technique and physicality.

So in summary, now we've gone back to a variant of the box midfield, together with the other players we have in the side, it is maximising his strengths and minimising his weaknesses.

This is why despite his limitations he is a much better partner for O'Hare in the box than Palmer, which is a real shame as Palmer has that xfactor. Its almost either O'Hare or Palmer with the other 3. Unless its a team we are going to have lots of ball.

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[hill83]

Oh dear

But true though. He was your next target for a while before any of us had seen enough to make a judgement. It’s all there.

 

[Evo1883]

Fucks sake I was just commenting on the graph. I’m still not convinced it’s even him

I didn't mean for it to get like this mate , il just never get your dislike of Allen , youre still a good guy

 

[olderskyblue]

I'm fairy sure ou don't have too many instances of not following instructions and stay in Robins team
If Robins keeps picking people it's because they're doing what he asks. I'm not sure why somepwople can't grasp this.

Have you been in allo allo ?

 

[hill83]

I didn't mean for it to get like this mate , il just never get your dislike of Allen , youre still a good guy

Never in doubt he’s a good guy. He’s just jealous of Jamie Allens height

 

[covcity4life]

I called exactly this months ago from Grendel. But he’s calmed down a bit lately.

Not really. We win a game and he posts about hyam.

Anyone brings up Palmer played well or racial bias he says oh Dear or a laughing emoji etc

Sad bastard

 

[hill83]

Not getting into racial bias talk. Count me out.

 

[Esoterica]

Jamie Allen has been very vocal in his criticism of the council recently. He was arrested last week for hiding in a shoe box outside the council house and throwing quail eggs at anyone leaving. I think that explains a lot.

 

[Esoterica]

Have you been in allo allo ?

Clint is famous for pissing by ze bonk.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

It is , did you read the boxes with the explanations ? I would before the gloating

But those explanations are just assumptions of what type of player those in each area of the graph would be. I.e. Someone how doesn't make many progressive passes and doesn't complete many of the ones they do is therefore a player not expected to do so. Whereas someone how makes a lot of attempted progressive passes but doesn't complete many is meant to play them but is just a bit shit (which is the area Sheaf falls into)

Would you say Sheaf's not very good as that graph hints at? Would you say it's his job to make progressive passes? Or that he's a more defensive midfielder in the team to be doing a lot of tidying up? Would you say that it's Sheaf's job to be more progressive than Allen when they're both playing? Seeing as how Allen has more goals and makes runs into the box I'd say not. If we're playing the box would you expect Sheaf or Allen to be playing further up the field? It might just mean Allen plays very safe passes.

Of course you'd argue if that was the case surely he'd have been dropped, but then by that graph Sheaf should be dropped for not doing what he's on the pitch to do. We've had a very threadbare squad at times leaving few other options.

This isn't having a go at Allen. I think he's doing a decent job and deserves his place in the team. I just don't think that graph can be taking as meaning what you think it does.

 

[Evo1883]

But those explanations are just assumptions of what type of player those in each area of the graph would be. I.e. Someone how doesn't make many progressive passes and doesn't complete many of the ones they do is therefore a player not expected to do so. Whereas someone how makes a lot of attempted progressive passes but doesn't complete many is meant to play them but is just a bit shit (which is the area Sheaf falls into)

Would you say Sheaf's not very good as that graph hints at? Would you say it's his job to make progressive passes? Or that he's a more defensive midfielder in the team to be doing a lot of tidying up? Would you say that it's Sheaf's job to be more progressive than Allen when they're both playing? Seeing as how Allen has more goals and makes runs into the box I'd say not. If we're playing the box would you expect Sheaf or Allen to be playing further up the field? It might just mean Allen plays very safe passes.

Of course you'd argue if that was the case surely he'd have been dropped, but then by that graph Sheaf should be dropped for not doing what he's on the pitch to do. We've had a very threadbare squad at times leaving few other options.

This isn't having a go at Allen. I think he's doing a decent job and deserves his place in the team. I just don't think that graph can be taking as meaning what you think it does.

Ok

 

[clint van damme]

This is why despite his limitations he is a much better partner for O'Hare in the box than Palmer, which is a real shame as Palmer has that xfactor. Its almost either O'Hare or Palmer with the other 3. Unless its a team we are going to have lots of ball.

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Let's not be too quick to write off the COH/Palmer partnership.
Early days yet and they combined to score a good goal against Blackpool.

Nice to have these options.

 

[stupot07]

Let's not be too quick to write off the COH/Palmer partnership.
Early days yet and they combined to score a good goal against Blackpool.

Nice to have these options.

Not writing it off, they did combine well for that goal, but in that game Vik wasn't playing and Palmer was up front almost as a false 9 with Allen and O'Hare in the box behind him.

He's a great option to have, hes almost better as an impact sub when the game is stretched in the second half. Although only one game against a team parking thr bus, it just felt they both wanted the ball in similar areas, and we became very narrow and lacked space in midfield. Allen's movement creates so much space for O'Hare and Palmer to drive into.

Now they are both fit, Robins can work on a system which can fit both in, even if its plan b.

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[clint van damme]

Not writing it off, they did combine well for that goal, but in that game Vik wasn't playing and Palmer was up front almost as a false 9 with Allen and O'Hare in the box behind him.

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Good point re the goal
I'm hopeful they'll click, might need a bit of tweaking.

 

[Esoterica]

But those explanations are just assumptions of what type of player those in each area of the graph would be. I.e. Someone how doesn't make many progressive passes and doesn't complete many of the ones they do is therefore a player not expected to do so. Whereas someone how makes a lot of attempted progressive passes but doesn't complete many is meant to play them but is just a bit shit (which is the area Sheaf falls into)

Would you say Sheaf's not very good as that graph hints at? Would you say it's his job to make progressive passes? Or that he's a more defensive midfielder in the team to be doing a lot of tidying up? Would you say that it's Sheaf's job to be more progressive than Allen when they're both playing? Seeing as how Allen has more goals and makes runs into the box I'd say not. If we're playing the box would you expect Sheaf or Allen to be playing further up the field? It might just mean Allen plays very safe passes.

Of course you'd argue if that was the case surely he'd have been dropped, but then by that graph Sheaf should be dropped for not doing what he's on the pitch to do. We've had a very threadbare squad at times leaving few other options.

This isn't having a go at Allen. I think he's doing a decent job and deserves his place in the team. I just don't think that graph can be taking as meaning what you think it does.

A progressive pass is also different depending on what part of the pitch you are in, so is therefore also influenced by role in the team and the team's style of play:

A pass is considered progressive if the distance between the starting point and the next touch is:

• at least 30 meters closer to the opponent’s goal if the starting and finishing points are within a team’s own half
• at least 15 meters closer to the opponent’s goal if the starting and finishing points are in different halves
• at least 10 meters closer to the opponent’s goal if the starting and finishing points are in the opponent’s half

I always find these charts look impressive and they're fan pleasers when one of their players rank highly in them but I think their use is limited when comparing between players. I'd find it much more interesting if you broke down the 3 progressive pass types and then compared players. I think it would paint a very different picture.

 

[Grendel]

But true though. He was your next target for a while before any of us had seen enough to make a judgement. It’s all there.

he’s not a target he’s an expensive player who isn’t an automatic choice - that’s a risk - and at the moment Jamie Allen is the preference

 

[wingy]

I'd question that graph and the assumptive expectation of the players.
I mean. Sheaf is barely the wrong side of the centre line and about 3-4 players behind Hamer. Meanwhile Fleck is in the category not expected to make progressive passes.

 

[Otis]

Gyok-24
Ohare -24
Sheaf-24
Hamer-25
Palmer 26
Allen 27

Is this age the sweet spot for recruitment when replacing?

Just goes to prove that Allen is too old and needs to be put out to pasture.

 

[Robinshio]

this is season to date - we were bottom after 10 games

 

[shmmeee]

I think it’s more he wants to shag Palmer

Sexy Klingon looking motherfucker that he is.

At this point I just just find it funny how no one can defend Allen without bringing up running about. He has his uses.