Gathering for Tommy / Discontent (62 Viewers)

[torchomatic]

There’s a lot of false equivalency being drawn between JSO and these protests.

The JSO activists convicted were both planning and carrying out the actions and basically showed no remorse. That plays a part in sentencing.

OK I get that, saying, "sorry I didn't mean to chant vile racist abuse, set a police car on fire and punch a policeman in the face", should give them a lesser sentence? should be taken with a pinch of salt, as it's bullshit.

 

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[Sky_Blue_Daz]

Just been told the shops at the ricoh have been told to close early, obviously could be a load of nonsense

 

[skybluetony176]

I had no sympathy with Just Stop Oil (although I agree with their broad message) for the way they caused chaos. To think they got basically double the sentences of these fucking morons beggars belief.

Must be that 2 tier policing that the snowflakes are crying about at the moment.

 

[pusbccfc]

Just been told the shops at the ricoh have been told to close early

Country is on lockdown. There's pictures of towns fully boarded up. Completely bowed down.

 

[Nick]

if it is about any of these things then why are they attacking people and communities that had nothing to do this this?

your argument is weak

I think the huge majority of people with constructive issues aren't out rioting. I have issues with parts of immigration but Tommy Robinson and these cunts don't speak or act for me.

The people out smashing up Greggs are cunts looking for an excuse to be cunts. The people smashing up takeaways are cunts.

The people saying it's for the 3 poor kids are cunts, setting a fire isn't doing anything to help them or show respect. If it's about that then help build a memorial garden and then go kick off at people making the decisions at the top. The people setting the policies etc etc.

 

[David O'Day]

There’s a lot of false equivalency being drawn between JSO and these protests.

The JSO activists convicted were both planning and carrying out the actions and basically showed no remorse. That plays a part in sentencing.

So they get 5 years while you can attack emergency workers and get 3?

Bollocks

 

[David O'Day]

Country is on lockdown. There's pictures of towns fully boarded up. Completely bowed down.

Bowed down? it's just a sensible precaution

Why risk having your businesses windows put through

 

[skybluecam]

OK I get that, saying, "sorry I didn't mean to chant vile racist abuse, set a police car on fire and punch a policeman in the face", should give them a lesser sentence? should be taken with a pinch of salt, as it's bullshit.

I mean that’s how criminal justice always works. Premeditation and remorse always play a part.

 

[rob9872]

Just been told the shops at the ricoh have been told to close early, obviously could be a load of nonsense

FFS I BLAME DOUG!

 

[Nick]

I still think there should be a purge like the films. Anybody out to cause trouble later with no valid reason to be out then sort it.

I think (and hope) so much of this is precaution from shit being stirred up online and the people writing these lists are probably gimpy incel types in their mum's back room. Hopefully they get found and punished properly.

 

[pusbccfc]

Bowed down? it's just a sensible precaution

Why risk having your businesses windows put through

There's places locking up that are out of town or in places where riots aren't on the long list of 100 towns.

 

[David O'Day]

I mean that’s how criminal justice always works. Premeditation and remorse always play a part.

Still shouldn't mean they get twice as long as someone who attacks an emergency worker

 

[Nick]

There's places locking up that are out of town or in places where riots aren't on the long list of 100 towns.

Yeah it's weird.

If you put the news on it's as if there's a hurricane coming or something. Its really being whipped up.

 

[David O'Day]

There's places locking up that are out of town or in places where riots aren't on the long list of 100 towns.

no point in taking a risk is you are not white or live in an area the racists will see as not white

 

[skybluecam]

Still shouldn't mean they get twice as long as someone who attacks an emergency worker

The guy who got 5 years had a previous conviction for similar.

Sentencing is far more than just the objective harm your actions caused.

 

[Nick]

no point in taking a risk is you are not white or live in an area the racists will see as not white

Are people really expecting an army style invasion tonight? How much is it being whipped up and scare mongering in the media and online?

Get the snipers out to be honest, anybody starts running towards a hotel, mosque or immigration centre acting violently / aggressive then just sort it.

 

[pusbccfc]

no point in taking a risk is you are not white or live in an area the racists will see as not white

If shops are being locked down on a Wednesday night, then surely we are unlikely to see football on a Saturday?

 

[pusbccfc]

Yeah it's weird.

If you put the news on it's as if there's a hurricane coming or something. Its really being whipped up.

Out of town retail parks being shut early and estate agents are being boarded up.

Maybe there is genuine evidence to suggest major rioting?

 

[David O'Day]

If shops are being locked down on a Wednesday night, then surely we are unlikely to see football this on a Saturday?

Nonsense

 

[SBAndy]

This is the thing though Andy, it's been allowed to pass people by. With this, the Manchester pair being out and about, the Leeds riot being dealt with differently (along with the arrest of Nicola Wilcox and other factors) - it begs a lot of reasonable questions.

There might be good reasons for each one of those things being handled differently, I am not saying there isn't, but it is a lot of things all at once and all it is doing at the moment is pouring petrol on a very volitle fire. The media, government, and police could calm this all down pretty quickly if they were a bit more proactive, but all they're doing at the moment is making it worse.

Not quite sure what your central point regarding stuff being dealt with differently is getting at. Each are rather different criminal scenarios. Like I say, I don’t know anything about the Gillingham thing (assuming this was the one where the soldier was stabbed?) but the other 2 you’ve got the Manchester pair on bail as investigations continue, then the Leeds riot again not aware of the aftermath but would assume something is happening with it all. It’s an unfortunate fact that the news agenda is moving on so quickly this last few weeks you may not hear about every case from open to close.

As an aside, I just had a look at when the Just Stop Oil protest happened which saw those sentenced recently. November 2022. We have quite frankly a ridiculous court backlog which means, even if people are arrested and charged, you won’t hear about the outcome for a good while. Now I have a feeling that you’ll say “why are we able to turn round the charging and conviction so quickly on the ‘far right protestors’?” And that’s because it’s still live, they are trying to use this as the deterrent for other activity going on.

Do I think the Manchester couple, in particular, should have been processed double-quick to possibly nip all this in the bud? Yes. But equally the police, CPS and Government weren’t to know what was round the corner.

A final point on patience: no one has any any more. There needs to be trust that due process will be followed. I kind of get why there isn’t due to previous miscarriages of justice, but we are where we are and people want instant gratification.

 

[David O'Day]

Are people really expecting an army style invasion tonight? How much is it being whipped up and scare mongering in the media and online?

Get the snipers out to be honest, anybody starts running towards a hotel, mosque or immigration centre acting violently / aggressive then just sort it.

Yeah, it's the media who who keep talking about x amount of protests. As has been said there are no actual planned protests but you wouldn't want to risk your business anyway just in case some people do turn up.

 

[pusbccfc]

Nonsense

That's what I thought until I turned on the news and saw towns being boarded up and staff at out of town retail parks being sent home at 3pm.

 

[Nick]

Out of town retail parks being shut early and estate agents are being boarded up.

Maybe there is genuine evidence to suggest major rioting?

I'm not trying to play it down but it seems like madness.

Some of the media are behaving like it's a zombie apocalypse.

I'm not doubting there will be a lot of cunts out, I just think zero tolerance after telling people to stay at home.

 

[Nick]

That's what I thought until I turned on the news and saw towns being boarded up and staff at out of town retail parks being sent home at 3pm.

That's the thing though, it just seems weird when you turn on the news or look online.

What have they heard to make it seem like it's going to be a full blown war?

 

[pusbccfc]

I'm not trying to play it down but it seems like madness.

Some of the media are behaving like it's a zombie apocalypse.

I'm not doubting there will be a lot of cunts out, I just think zero tolerance after telling people to stay at home.

I agree but ultimately like has been said, misinformation is being spread like wildfire and the media are ramping it up.

100 protests being planned? How many do they expect to be at each one? Hundreds have already been arrested. Some of which will have travelled from distance to attend.

 

[Nick]

I agree but ultimately like has been said, misinformation is being spread like wildfire and the media are ramping it up.

100 protests being planned? How many do they expect to be at each one? Hundreds have already been arrested. Some of which will have travelled from distance to attend.

Exactly. The media storm just seems to be way, way over the top.

I get why immigration centres are taking precautions but why is b and m miles from anywhere closing early? What are they expecting?

Look at how many people assembled in Birmingham. What were they told and who by?

If you watch the news, there's a bomb going off tonight at 8.

 

[David O'Day]

That's what I thought until I turned on the news and saw towns being boarded up and staff at out of town retail parks being sent home at 3pm.

It really is nonsense, there's no real protests planned for Saturday and there's not a "list" of 30 difference places for Saturday. It's going to piss it down and there are not going to but the start of the season in danger as they a) will lose loads of the support they do have and a sizeable number will want to go to the games anyway.

Also people getting 20 to 30 month jail time will put a lot of people off as well.

 

[SBAndy]

Exactly. The media storm just seems to be way, way over the top.

I get why immigration centres are taking precautions but why is b and m miles from anywhere closing early? What are they expecting?

Self-fulfilling prophecy ain’t it. You’ve had people on here saying “hope it doesn’t happen in Cov”. And nothing mentioned anywhere suggests it will. But police have put out warnings that there could be trouble (they probably have a bit of a duty of care), people/businesses take precautions, it results in more people expecting trouble.

Hopefully it all blows over without more than a handful of people swearing.

 

[pusbccfc]

It really is nonsense, there's no real protests planned for Saturday and there's not a "list" of 30 difference places for Saturday. It's going to piss it down and there are not going to but the start of the season in danger as they a) will lose loads of the support they do have and a sizeable number will want to go to the games anyway.

Also people getting 20 to 30 month jail time will put a lot of people off as well.

Exactly and yet places are still being boarded up today.

What if these hidden/fake/Russian accounts start making up fake protests on Saturday?

 

[David O'Day]

Exactly and yet places are still being boarded up today.

What if these hidden/fake/Russian accounts start making up fake protests on Saturday?

What if something that hasn't happened yet and may never happen at all happens?

 

[Grendel]

Have you come to a view yet whether racism is unacceptable in all its forms and should not be tolerated?

I am surprised it would take anyone 5 seconds to say either yes or no to this question let alone two days.

I have answered it several times

 

[Nick]

Exactly and yet places are still being boarded up today.

What if these hidden/fake/Russian accounts start making up fake protests on Saturday?

I don't get why the police and intelligence services aren't saying much to calm it?

There are police giving interviews like they are gearing up for a war.

What have they heard?

 

[Grendel]

... and those looting, throwing objects, setting fires, launching fireworks, possessing drugs, punching police/other protestors, kicking, shouting abuse at people, chanting religious hatred, make gesticulations etc.
Anyone convicted of rioting should get a 5 year football banning order too - to help stop the problems we've had in recent years from growing further.
As with anyone in jail these guys must get the mental health support, addiction support, and re-education on tolerance/diversity to help them turn their lives around and given apprenticeships and jobs to help them move on.
Obvious to say a lot of the current problems result from primarily those being disenfranchised poor education, low aspiration, reliance on benefits leading to jealousy and envy and them easily being groomed and radicalised. Applies to far right, ethnic groups and even those on far left that also have a few loons. The government need to see this as an opportunity to make things better for the country and develop a stronger economy and to make the UK safer. It can be turned around.

The people I would target most severely are the likes of MPs Boris, Farage, Patel, Anderson, Redwood, Braverman, Tebbitt, Rees-Mogg, Raab, Bob Stewart, Scully, Swayne, Gullis, Anne Marie Morris and others such as... Yaxley-Lennon, Tate, Musk, Fox, Hopkins, Hester, Hankinson, Doolan, etc.

Not George Galloway or Hamsa then. Thats revealing.

 

[Deleted member 9744]

I have answered it several times

Must have missed it. So what was it? Yes or no?

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Not quite sure what your central point regarding stuff being dealt with differently is getting at. Each are rather different criminal scenarios. Like I say, I don’t know anything about the Gillingham thing (assuming this was the one where the soldier was stabbed?) but the other 2 you’ve got the Manchester pair on bail as investigations continue, then the Leeds riot again not aware of the aftermath but would assume something is happening with it all. It’s an unfortunate fact that the news agenda is moving on so quickly this last few weeks you may not hear about every case from open to close.

As an aside, I just had a look at when the Just Stop Oil protest happened which saw those sentenced recently. November 2022. We have quite frankly a ridiculous court backlog which means, even if people are arrested and charged, you won’t hear about the outcome for a good while. Now I have a feeling that you’ll say “why are we able to turn round the charging and conviction so quickly on the ‘far right protestors’?” And that’s because it’s still live, they are trying to use this as the deterrent for other activity going on.

Do I think the Manchester couple, in particular, should have been processed double-quick to possibly nip all this in the bud? Yes. But equally the police, CPS and Government weren’t to know what was round the corner.

A final point on patience: no one has any any more. There needs to be trust that due process will be followed. I kind of get why there isn’t due to previous miscarriages of justice, but we are where we are and people want instant gratification.

I agree with most of that. My central point is pretty much what you have said at the bottom regarding patience. There has been a lot of shit that has happened in the last few weeks, and whilst there might be good reason for a proper investigation to take time on these events, telling an angry mob that they'll be sentenced and sent down in hours, when the things they're directly pissed off with
(where they perceive other people getting off lightly) is rather counter-productive to an extent I would say.

I understand the government want this rioting to stop immediately, so I don't fault the tactic, but them along with the police and media need to read the room better or I suspect things are going to get a whole lot worse before they get better. If they can speed up the rioters then they need to find a way to speed up the Manchester pair as well.

Gillingham was the solider stabbing, Nicola Wilcox was the woman in the Leeds riots who was one of what is seemingly a very small number of people arrested, and she was allegedly there trying to give ice lollies to the police.