Are we being “hyped”? (6 Viewers)

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

You've not read my other comments in this thread, have you ?

Look at the bigger picture. It's pressure from within. Our own fanbase is being smashed with positivity from those podcasts, journalists and other fans. That's going to rub off on us and will increase OUR expectations. We then expect our players to perform to those higher levels constantly. One potentially poor result and watch those boos start rolling round the CBS. We've always had a fickle minority of fans.

And it's got zero to do with "small club". As I have previously said, I was following Cov in the 80s and 90s. We were an also-ran in the top flight all that time, apart from one outstanding year. You get fed an "Oh well, another season of doing nothing" attitude consistently , it sticks. We were where Crystal Palace are now.

I don’t need the podcasts - I expect them to be there or there abouts. The expectation should be there, the fans are backing the club - we’ve got record season tickets, we’re edging to being a big club at this level. I expect the players to be at that level - it’s what Doug expects, and what Robins expects.

The players are aware of those expectations. Anything other than anything lower than 6th is a failed season. Doug will have made them aware of this.

I followed them in the 90s aswell. It’s that level of apathy that ultimately led to acceptance of the crap that proceeded.

 

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[Marty]

Anything other than top 6 is an abject failure, we have a well built squad with plenty of talent on the bench, couple of players we should probably look to upgrade (Allen, Palmer) but they'll do a job. Not many teams will be spending the sort of money we have.

I've been going regularly since the mid 90s, I've never known a squad with so much talent and depth as we've got now.

I think we'll have firmly cemented our spot in the top 6 by the end of September and we may even push for the autos. Absolutely no excuses this season.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

What if our attack is 1st-2nd in the league ?

Personally, I can’t see us having the best attack. Either way, last season was a massive deviation from the rule. Most previous seasons, the 3 promoted teams will have defensive records in the top 4. The year we missed out on promotion, we had the 4th best defence in the league, being Luton, Sheff U and Burnley. Even nullified the 2nd best attack in the playoffs (Middlesborough) over 2 matches.

Going back as far as 2017/18, the only seasons that deviated from this trend was 2023/24 and 2018/19. It’s fair to say that defence wins you championships. Yes, it is also correlated with GD but looking at our squad, we’re short defensively still and no quality has actually been added. With MVE being a nailed on starter and one of the best in the league, a top end CB (preferably with experience) would be the next logical step imo.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I don’t need the podcasts - I expect them to be there or there abouts. The expectation should be there, the fans are backing the club - we’ve got record season tickets, we’re edging to being a big club at this level. I expect the players to be at that level - it’s what Doug expects, and what Robins expects.

The players are aware of those expectations. Anything other than anything lower than 6th is a failed season. Doug will have made them aware of this.

I followed them in the 90s aswell. It’s that level of apathy that ultimately led to acceptance of the crap that proceeded.

Agreed, we have spent a lot of money. The relegated teams from the Prem will have squads where they’ve spent 90-100+ million on their starting 11s. A sobering comparison was in our first season in the championship when we lost to Bournemouth at home, their squad was worth 90-100m and ours was freebies with Godden and Hamer making up 2-3m in value.

Top 4 is a realistic aim, I wouldn’t reasonably expect us to finish in the automatics although I think we could - with some caveats.

 

[Perennial Lurker]

Personally, I can’t see us having the best attack. Either way, last season was a massive deviation from the rule. Most previous seasons, the 3 promoted teams will have defensive records in the top 4. The year we missed out on promotion, we had the 4th best defence in the league, being Luton, Sheff U and Burnley. Even nullified the 2nd best attack in the playoffs (Middlesborough) over 2 matches.

Going back as far as 2017/18, the only seasons that deviated from this trend was 2023/24 and 2018/19. It’s fair to say that defence wins you championships. Yes, it is also correlated with GD but looking at our squad, we’re short defensively still and no quality has actually been added. With MVE being a nailed on starter and one of the best in the league, a top end CB (preferably with experience) would be the next logical step imo.

We've signed a very good prospect in Dovin and yes I would like another CB or RB , depending where Lati is seen as cover. However I think this season's suggested flatter 3 won't leave us as exposed as last season playing with a CAM/10 did.
Heart says top 2
Head says top 4-6

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

Agreed, we have spent a lot of money. The relegated teams from the Prem will have squads where they’ve spent 90-100+ million on their starting 11s. A sobering comparison was in our first season in the championship when we lost to Bournemouth at home, their squad was worth 90-100m and ours was freebies with Godden and Hamer making up 2-3m in value.

Top 4 is a realistic aim, I wouldn’t reasonably expect us to finish in the automatics although I think we could - with some caveats.

I’m not demanding promotion - we all know that the relegated sides have far more value in them.

but we need to be there or there abouts. Like you said Top 4 is a realistic aim. I’m optimistic we’ll be top 2. I think we’re more settled than Burnley and Sheff Utd in some respects but top 4 is achievable, top 6 is what we should demand

 

[Travs]

The three who came down...

Throw in Leeds. And us..... plus Middlesborough who seem as hotly tipped as us. Thats six already.

Who knows what the rest of the division is going to throw up, but Norwich and Preston are always around. Add in a couple of others who are bound to overperform. Sunderland ma well come good (although i suspect they won't)

I'm not saying we aren't genuine challengers for top six, but to call missing out an "abject failure" sounds pretty harsh to me. I would expect the division to be as competitive as usual, and us to be towards the sharp end.

 

[The Great Eastern]

You've not read my other comments in this thread, have you ?

Look at the bigger picture. It's pressure from within. Our own fanbase is being smashed with positivity from those podcasts, journalists and other fans. That's going to rub off on us and will increase OUR expectations. We then expect our players to perform to those higher levels constantly. One potentially poor result and watch those boos start rolling round the CBS. We've always had a fickle minority of fans.

And it's got zero to do with "small club". As I have previously said, I was following Cov in the 80s and 90s. We were an also-ran in the top flight all that time, apart from one outstanding year. You get fed an "Oh well, another season of doing nothing" attitude consistently , it sticks. We were where Crystal Palace are now.

We're going to have a small number of SBT members who will get suicidal if we're not 10 points clear of 2nd place after 3 games....

 

[thekidfromstrettoncamp]

We're going to have a small number of SBT members who will get suicidal if we're not 10 points clear of 2nd place after 3 games....

Knowing what our fans are like it would be more than a small number.

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

The three who came down...

Throw in Leeds. And us..... plus Middlesborough who seem as hotly tipped as us. Thats six already.

Who knows what the rest of the division is going to throw up, but Norwich and Preston are always around. Add in a couple of others who are bound to overperform. Sunderland ma well come good (although i suspect they won't)

I'm not saying we aren't genuine challengers for top six, but to call missing out an "abject failure" sounds pretty harsh to me. I would expect the division to be as competitive as usual, and us to be towards the sharp end.

We’ve spent close to 40m - in the last two seasons, we’ve been 2 kick from the premier league.

we’ve replaced 1 20 goal striker with 2 20 and a play off team’s top goal goalscorer, we’ve got a multi million £ defence.
Throw in a 10m midfield - we should be aiming to finish above most teams bar Leeds, Burnley, Luton and Sheff Utd - and arguably I think we’re more stable than Sheff Utd.

 

[wingy]

Personally, I can’t see us having the best attack. Either way, last season was a massive deviation from the rule. Most previous seasons, the 3 promoted teams will have defensive records in the top 4. The year we missed out on promotion, we had the 4th best defence in the league, being Luton, Sheff U and Burnley. Even nullified the 2nd best attack in the playoffs (Middlesborough) over 2 matches.

Going back as far as 2017/18, the only seasons that deviated from this trend was 2023/24 and 2018/19. It’s fair to say that defence wins you championships. Yes, it is also correlated with GD but looking at our squad, we’re short defensively still and no quality has actually been added. With MVE being a nailed on starter and one of the best in the league, a top end CB (preferably with experience) would be the next logical step imo.

Agree as long as Bidwell is Indeed recognised as a solid, experienced performer,and Josh Eccles too for the fact he fact he represents continuation?
Something intangible that isn't represented by Stats necessarily!

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

We’ve spent close to 40m - in the last two seasons, we’ve been 2 kick from the premier league.

we’ve replaced 1 20 goal striker with 2 20 and a play off team’s top goal goalscorer, we’ve got a multi million £ defence.
Throw in a 10m midfield - we should be aiming to finish above most teams bar Leeds, Burnley, Luton and Sheff Utd - and arguably I think we’re more stable than Sheff Utd.

I’m happy with out attacking options, there are lingering doubts about the midfield and defence depth and quality. Midfield in particular because it’s a demanding position and two of our players have struggled to play a high volume of games - Palmer is not a CM.

 

[Travs]

We’ve spent close to 40m - in the last two seasons, we’ve been 2 kick from the premier league.

we’ve replaced 1 20 goal striker with 2 20 and a play off team’s top goal goalscorer, we’ve got a multi million £ defence.
Throw in a 10m midfield - we should be aiming to finish above most teams bar Leeds, Burnley, Luton and Sheff Utd - and arguably I think we’re more stable than Sheff Utd.

That's fair enough..... but "finish above most teams bar......." leaves you with little room for error.... you've basically got to finish top two out of the rest of the league (the "most competitive in the world" as the saying goes)

ps: i think we'll finish above at least one of those four teams mentioned.

 

[hamil99]

I personally don’t think the Hamer situation has been rectified, we’ve yet to sign a marauding or penetrating midfielder, I think the closest thing we’ve got is Torp maybe? As much as it’s a cliche at this point we do lack the qualities that Hamer brought to the table.

You're basically describing Rudoni there. See him as the Hamer replacement and not O'Hare's. And we don't need a like for like O'Hare replacement as we won't be playing with an AM this year. Add a CDM like Madsen and the position is covered. Even though I feel torp can take up that mantle this year.

 

[Sbarcher]

Interesting Top 6 thread on the Sunderland board ( yes I know but I was born up there). Most have us in their top 6 with some tipping us for autos.
They are good lads who obviously know their stuff!

 

[BlueSkiesForever]

You're basically describing Rudoni there. See him as the Hamer replacement and not O'Hare's. And we don't need a like for like O'Hare replacement as we won't be playing with an AM this year. Add a CDM like Madsen and the position is covered. Even though I feel torp can take up that mantle this year.

Fair enough, I’m not sure why but I feel like Rudoni is more of an O’Hare than a Hamer, just my initial impressions rather than anything factual. Although how can you be sure we’re not playing with an AM at all this season?

I prefer us as a 4-3-3, and I’m happy for us not to play an AM tbh, but doesn’t mean we know what Robins is planning, and maybe some games we will need that type of AM player/position?

 

[SkyblueTexan]

Sheff Utd, who are not tipped for autos and seem to be behind Cov in many polls, seem to be signing everyone or rumored to be in the running for several players and strengthening all areas. I really hope Hamer leaves before the deadline. Just can’t stand Wilder.

 

[hamil99]

Fair enough, I’m not sure why but I feel like Rudoni is more of an O’Hare than a Hamer, just my initial impressions rather than anything factual. Although how can you be sure we’re not playing with an AM at all this season?

I prefer us as a 4-3-3, and I’m happy for us not to play an AM tbh, but doesn’t mean we know what Robins is planning, and maybe some games we will need that type of AM player/position?

When Hamer had his best season with us he played as a box to box midfielder, that's literally what Rudoni is being described as. As for playing with an AM we have EMC, Saka, BTA and Rudoni who could play there, so we have options already in the squad to cover that position if Robins feels like playing that way. What we don't have is an out and out CDM.

 

[Perennial Lurker]

Fair enough, I’m not sure why but I feel like Rudoni is more of an O’Hare than a Hamer, just my initial impressions rather than anything factual. Although how can you be sure we’re not playing with an AM at all this season?

I prefer us as a 4-3-3, and I’m happy for us not to play an AM tbh, but doesn’t mean we know what Robins is planning, and maybe some games we will need that type of AM player/position?

It has been reported all preseason that we are playing a flatter midfield three. And in none of the friendlies have we played a 10/CAM

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Sheff Utd, who are not tipped for autos and seem to be behind Cov in many polls, seem to be signing everyone or rumored to be in the running for several players and strengthening all areas. I really hope Hamer leaves before the deadline. Just can’t stand Wilder.

Would be pretty frustrating if Hamer stayed in the Championship with them but jumped at the chance to join one of the worst PL sides of all time.

 

[Perennial Lurker]

Would be pretty frustrating if Hamer stayed in the Championship with them but jumped at the chance to join one of the worst PL sides of all time.

Just can't see him staying . Gambled on joining a bad side to put himself in the shop window which he did only to stay in the Championship?
Doesn't make any sense , still think he ends up abroad

 

[ccfcricoh]

Sheff Utd on paper making lots of signings, but look at how that turned out for us last season...

i imagine after one of the worst seasons in footballing history, dropping back to the championship and trying to bed in a whole new squad of players, they'll be slow starters, especially if they lose Hamer... hopefully they're just chasing the pack for the whole season, if they start strong i think they'll stay up there

 

[BlueSkiesForever]

It has been reported all preseason that we are playing a flatter midfield three. And in none of the friendlies have we played a 10/CAM

Okay fair, I’m not saying we should use a CAM but I just don’t think we should rule it out if a particular game needs a player who can operate in that central pocket of space between defenders/midfielders. I hope we adapt each game to what the opposition is shit at rather than resolutely sticking to what formation we like every game. Clearly I’m no tactical genius I just like to see us keep oppositions on their toes rather than being predictable.

 

[BlueSkiesForever]

@Ccfcisparks is your like button stuck on “” that’s all I ever seem to get from you, I don’t see what’s funny about my last comment Is being adaptive and changing formations not a good thing in your eyes?

 

[Perennial Lurker]

@Ccfcisparks is your like button stuck on “” that’s all I ever seem to get from you, I don’t see what’s funny about my last comment Is being adaptive and changing formations not a good thing in your eyes?

I don't see many times we will go to using a CAM this season , I can see us using a front two at times however

 

[Ccfcisparks]

I don't see many times we will go to using a CAM this season , I can see us using a front two at times however

We won't use a CAM if we haven't got one.

 

[Perennial Lurker]

We won't use a CAM if we haven't got one.

Exactly! Rudoni has always been more of an attacking 8

 

[BlueSkiesForever]

We won't use a CAM if we haven't got one.

Isn’t Rudoni sort of one though? Just because he wasn’t stamped “CAM” on his birth certificate doesn’t mean he can’t play there? He’s got the ability to do that role, the little flicks and turns and runs into the box, I think he’d be great there. (Just for reference I prefer us as a 4-3-3, I’m basically just arguing the toss tbh )

 

[Perennial Lurker]

Isn’t Rudoni sort of one though? Just because he wasn’t stamped “CAM” on his birth certificate doesn’t mean he can’t play there? He’s got the ability to do that role, the little flicks and turns and runs into the box, I think he’d be great there. (Just for reference I prefer us as a 4-3-3, I’m basically just arguing the toss tbh )

I think Huddersfield persisted with trying to turn him into one but just seeing him in preseason you can see that negates his physical attributes. He covers a lot of ground easily , is strong in the 50/50 challenges and likes to drop deep to find pockets of space and he seems to like a late burst into the box . Playing him too high up negates all of that

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

That's fair enough..... but "finish above most teams bar......." leaves you with little room for error.... you've basically got to finish top two out of the rest of the league (the "most competitive in the world" as the saying goes)

ps: i think we'll finish above at least one of those four teams mentioned.

We’re getting to that stage where there’s little room for error. Doug wants premier league, we the fans want premier league - we’ve got 4 seasons of his plan and he wants 3 cracks at the play offs in that time.

robins has been given the tools, the fans have backed the club. With no excuses now - I think Robins is under natural pressure. Get off to the start we’ve had the last 2 seasons and I think Doug will be having conversations with Robins

 

[napolimp]

Not everyone hugely hyping us up, this is from the the Guardian's football correspondent - a footnote at the bottom of the play-off hopefuls pile: -

 

[Winny the Bish]

Not everyone hugely hyping us up, this is from the the Guardian's football correspondent - a footnote at the bottom of the play-off hopefuls pile: -

View attachment 37572

Potentially the worst season preview I’ve ever seen. Essentially boils down to “the relegated teams and Leeds could get autos, everyone who was around the playoffs last year could get playoffs, the promoted teams and Plymouth could get relegated.”

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Potentially the worst season preview I’ve ever seen. Essentially boils down to “the relegated teams and Leeds could get autos, everyone who was around the playoffs last year could get playoffs, the promoted teams and Plymouth could get relegated.”

Beyond Oxford, the relegation slots aren’t straightforward to predict. Rooney is terrible but having kept Morgan Whittaker Plymouth ought to be ok.

 

[napolimp]

Potentially the worst season preview I’ve ever seen. Essentially boils down to “the relegated teams and Leeds could get autos, everyone who was around the playoffs last year could get playoffs, the promoted teams and Plymouth could get relegated.”

Yeah, and they've only thrown Plymouth in because of the Rooney effect. Terrible journalism.

I am disappointed we won't be playing Plymouth pre-Rooney sacking.

 

[SwanLane]

Potentially the worst season preview I’ve ever seen. Essentially boils down to “the relegated teams and Leeds could get autos, everyone who was around the playoffs last year could get playoffs, the promoted teams and Plymouth could get relegated.”

Yeah that’s pretty embarrassing. Lack of awareness about the current state of Hull and WBA. Also at the bottom end where Blackburn, just one example, have got more to worry about than Portsmouth.

Typical of some big newspapers and the state of their coverage and knowledge of the EFL these days though.