dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
No it is one of the possibilities either move out themselves or are made insolvent
Boxing Day deadline (1 Viewer)
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No it is one of the possibilities either move out themselves or are made insolvent
ashbyjan
Well-Known Member
Unlikely to happen as politically it would be suicide for the council to be doing that even if legally (and possibly morally) they are entitled to do so and just as unlikely is the club upping sticks in favour of Irthlingborough or Hinckley. Most likely scenario (if we now all agree - even Grendel - that this is not a rent row but a fight for the Ricoh complex itself) is as OSB and others have speculated that in new year ACL issue winding up petition - this will take 6 or so weeks to be heard. Then there could be fight over control of Yorkshire loan, CCFC opt for prepack admin, 10 point deductions, etc.
On pitch things would carry on probably minus 10 points and several players but off the pitch things will get very ugly and nasty.
On pitch things would carry on probably minus 10 points and several players but off the pitch things will get very ugly and nasty.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
And my swapping places with Tranmere in the last couple of weeks down the Swanny
I am inserting a get out clause now. That prediction is based purely on the football squad as it is now and not matters taken out of our hands by are diabolical owners!
This squad as it stands is more than capable of the 2 point average and sixth spot!
covcity4life
Well-Known Member
Or we might pay rent?
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
Yes that is one of the possibilities.
I was just considering what ACL options are if an agreement is not reached.
Some say it isn't going to make money as anything but a football venue
Gynnsthetonic
Well-Known Member
Wasps move to Coventry merge with Cov rugby football club they`ll get 20,000 + every game in the guiness premiership and Heineken cup.
The Butts becomes vacant hey presto CCFC move in
The Butts becomes vacant hey presto CCFC move in
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
Leyton sell their found for 10 million to property developers.
They buy out ACL we end up with Coventry Orient.
They buy out ACL we end up with Coventry Orient.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
Also in my delusion world. Remember this is only if CcFc disappear Coventry Orient could invest the profits from the Ricoh directly into the academy and produce academy players for the squad. Then sell them on and reinvest the money back into the academy and the squad.
Now I really am delusional
Now I really am delusional
skybluegod
Well-Known Member
Also the fact that you get £90 million if you get promoted to the premiership.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Fantastic. The best Christmas present any of us could wish for.
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Grendel
Well-Known Member
Can't see administration. In the short term it's likely a compromise will be reached to see us through to the end of the season
The rent is an issue and always will be unless it drastically alters. It puts the club at a huge disadvantage.
If this is resolved whatever the underlying motivation it will be for long term benefit.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Where we are at the moment, if it were me, I would be looking to strengthen in the Jan window. Don't need to splash money. Just retain the best we've got and bring in a player of two from selling fringe players. Unfortunately though, they are not me. A push now could make all the difference. And promotion would obviously bring in millions.
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Bill Glazier
Active Member
Prepack admin fits with something I heard from another source recently. Highly likely I think.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
You are right the club are at a huge disadvantage we have SISU making in the main bad decisions
Paxman II
Well-Known Member
This will all blow over. There is a perfectly decent rent and share of income streams on offer. Its probably more to do with the back rent than anything. No doubt SISU want the new rate to relfect from back then. Also they want ACL to drop it just a tad more I suspect. Joy has been in talks privately with all parties so I would expect some resolution to this mess to be announced any time soon.
The long term scenario is very clear for all to see. Time all sides to put their differences to one side and find the solution that works. Stop the arguing and constant disagreements, stop the public confusion, stop the acusations and take responsibility for your actions (both of you) and get it sorted. Jeez its like tatrums of a bunch of babies listening to either side! The public are fed up with both of you.
They say managers get fired when they 'lose' the dressing room? Well the people on both sides of this dispute are losing the public trust. That in the longer term will be more damaging than anything else will be.
The long term scenario is very clear for all to see. Time all sides to put their differences to one side and find the solution that works. Stop the arguing and constant disagreements, stop the public confusion, stop the acusations and take responsibility for your actions (both of you) and get it sorted. Jeez its like tatrums of a bunch of babies listening to either side! The public are fed up with both of you.
They say managers get fired when they 'lose' the dressing room? Well the people on both sides of this dispute are losing the public trust. That in the longer term will be more damaging than anything else will be.
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MichaelCCFC
New Member
Interesting point by samccov1987. I always thought the Ricoh was a goldmine in terms of concerts, conferences etc. One of the things I couldn't quite believe when it came to light earlier this year, was that ACL have never made a profit net of CCFC rent (although happy to be corrected if I'm wrong on this). I'm not supporting SISU (OSB and others make a really good case about SISU's real motives) and nor am I looking for an argument but I would be genuinely interested if one of the ACL advocates (Waldorf?) could respond to samccov1987's point about why ACL has not been doing all these things to boost profitability, previously.
coundonskyblue
New Member
Nothing will happen. ACL have offered a good deal, which the Club will take. The only delay now is typical Sisu tactics in trying to make the opposition sweat. Its the same tactics that led us to going within 30 mins of admin & the fact it takes us forever to sign a player.
cloughie
Well-Known Member
Sisu lost the publics trust long long ago and will take several years of success to change that
Don't think that they will ever change it. Too much water under the bridge for that!
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
I think there are a number of factors Michael, these are some from more of an ACL perspective
- first off the stakeholders didnt set out to be long term owners, the original plan was to get the club on board and/or developers that could take the whole site further. That creates a short term attitude in planning and it doesnt help drive a business
- the stakeholders themselves are not your usual entrepeneurs , they have had to learn new tricks and that takes time. But at the back of their minds is they dont really want to be running the business it just wasnt the long term intention. I think that is changing because there is currently no alternative and disposal to the club current owners is no longer desirable - trust is gone
- I think the short term view and the wanting to include the club has held the ACL business back, there was an intention to go a particular way that was a little inflexible, and at times slow to react.
- I think that ACL and its partner have suffered to some degree because of the clubs failure for 7 years. The plan was to have had more income from the stadium and it has gone the other way.
- The club i suspect has been given the right to first use of the stadium so any alternative income sources would have to be planned round that. Alternatives would have to slot in and take time. Concerts would have to be in the summer months only and each concert would take 2 or 3 days to set up and same to take down ...... the football season could finish in May and restart early August doesnt leave much time does it and these things have to be arranged year in advance .... so there is a bit of logistics involved that is always worked round CCFC. The new lease that will be necessary should CCFC stay will change that
- It takes time to build a conference and exhibition business and continuous investment. It would not be unexpected for such a business to make losses for several years from the outset.
I think however people under estimate what has been done. Has it been perfect, has it been full on commercially - no probably not but you dont get an international reputation or be 7th best in the UK by not doing something very well. When you compare their operation to its football tenant it would not be hard to argue in terms of running a viable business they are light years ahead.
As to the future. Yes ACL will look for new income sources, certainly sensible rather than take any further risk from CCFC. They will probably restructure, look at all their overheads, see what is duplicated by other operations for instance. They will have to look at how the debt is financed I would guess. They will take an awful long time to trust their football tenant again, it may never happen if SISU remain. They will take measures to ensure that the football club can never put them at risk again. Other sources of income will be sought, alternatives probably not football related, more usage of the pitch, other codes of sport - I suspect assuming CCFC remain that the football club will have to fit round ACL not the other way round.
One thing this whole saga has done for ACL is to sharpen their thoughts and processes ...... good news for them, going to create problems for CCFC though if they dont change attitude and dont try to be a partner rather than an adversary
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oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
One thing i would add is that assuming SISU are not successful then they have done a lot more damage to the club and its future than people realise. The club will have lost the trust and sympathy of its landlord but also the council. It will not be seen as being a keystone to the plan that at least for some time will find it hard to get the favourable treatment it has had in the past. There are going to be a lot of hardened attitudes standing their path
If they win this battle it wont matter, the stadium will become a commodity they can cash in on and ACL will be gone in its current form. Any control of the redevelopment will go with it. SISU will go and become someone elses problem/"saviour"
CCFC I fear will continue to bump along and I doubt it will ever own the stadium.
If they win this battle it wont matter, the stadium will become a commodity they can cash in on and ACL will be gone in its current form. Any control of the redevelopment will go with it. SISU will go and become someone elses problem/"saviour"
CCFC I fear will continue to bump along and I doubt it will ever own the stadium.
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Grendel
Well-Known Member
Hope you win more than £40 million. You'll have spent all of it in 5 years and people will still think your a tosser for not spending another £40 million
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
He may spend it wisely though.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Then he won't be wasting it on a football club.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
Fair comment, he will just buy the ricoh
Warwickhunt
Well-Known Member
£400k you are joking! its a Rugby cloub you are talking about, the most they will pay it £200k a year if that. Sisu are playing the long game and forcing ACL into oblivion, they will pick the RICOH up for corn and flog it on as this is the only way they can get their shareholders cash back. City will move to Hinkley for the rest of the season
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
I wonder how happy you'd be paying £1.28m a year in rent when it's your money? :thinking about:
skyblueinBaku
Well-Known Member
What's a prepack admin? Something you get from Ikea?
MichaelCCFC
New Member
Thanks for this, OSB. All really interesting stuff. I'm not a SISU fan but I'm also not entirely convinced by the argument that some people are making along the lines that 'ACL doesn't need CCFC, but CCFC needs the Ricoh' because your post shows how the current situation is far from straight-forward. It just makes me think that supporter representation/involvement has to be the way forward. It goes beyond my expertise but someone mentioned to me the new Localism Act which provides for community ownership of community assets. As I understand it, the Act is aimed at smallscale things like village halls but if we are trying to think of creative ways forward (and perhaps try to invoke the example of Jimmy Hill who my dad always used to refer to as 'a man who saw rules as being there to be broken, and if he was told he couldn't do something took it as a challenge to make sure what he wanted happened') is this the kind of thing to start looking at?
SkyBlueBlood
Member
3 days to the Boxing Day deadline to pay our rent or receive a winding up order... any insights, whiffs of rumour, grains of truth, concrete evidence; please post here...
I don't believe it will come to eviction, liquidation or administration but am very concerned that with only 48hrs of working days to go, SISU appear to be playing 'Mexican standoff' with our landlords
Perhaps their plan was to believe that the Mayans prediction was true and the end of the world would get them out of their predicament.
Boxing Day will come and go and all it means is that ACL are entitled to invoke a winding up order. However, the Stat Demand cost them nothing but they start incurring fees at winding up order level and why would they do that if they are still talking.................