Turn the lights off (15 Viewers)

[Macca]

Are we still chewing over this

 

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[Astute]

I would think so until we at least know we have somewhere to play and the rent/lease is sorted.

 

[Godiva]

@don...

I don't buy into the conspiracy theory where sisu deliberately got us relegated. Staying in the championship would make it much easier to obtain their financial goals.
They initiated the rent discussions way before relegation was certain. They stopped paying rent before relegation was certain. They could have carried out their non-paying tactics even in the championship.

Relegation was the result of many factors - the players, the manager, poor decisions by referee's, the off-field issues (SOC) ... all factors that in combination lead to relegation. Selling Juke and replacing him with two loanees helped the clubs cashflow problems, but even with Juke staying there you can't be sure we wouldn't have been relegated anyway.

I think what most anti-sisu people are objecting is the fact that they won't put in millions more on top of what they have already invested. So they want them out and hope we can find another sugardaddy who is willing to risk more millions, because as many say: 'You need to invest to be able to harvest a profit.'
Well, different owners have tried that route and failed. Even when we were in the promissed land it didn't work.

 

[Macca]

I would think so until we at least know we have somewhere to play and the rent/lease is sorted.

Each days arguments stay the same. I think I ll duck out until we have some facts

 

[Astute]

Why do you have to be pro or anti SISU?

I am happy with the squad that got put together....pro SISU

Unhappy with the way they are dealing with the rent/lease of the Ricoh...anti SISU

Cardiff and Forest know that throwing money at a club don't always work. Just the same as costcutting too far like last season can get you relegated.

 

[Godiva]

Why do you have to be pro or anti SISU?

I am happy with the squad that got put together....pro SISU

Unhappy with the way they are dealing with the rent/lease of the Ricoh...anti SISU

Cardiff and Forest know that throwing money at a club don't always work. Just the same as costcutting too far like last season can get you relegated.

Many want them out, that is anti-sisu to me.
I am quite tired of all the post's that include the sentence 'I am not pro-sisu ...' as the posters seem to belive that is the political correct statement.

 

[valiant15]

I hate sisu. Did i ever tell you guys this?

 

[wingy]

I hate sisu. Did i ever tell you guys this?[/QUOTE
Me too thats two of us ,again no surprise ,its natural enough given my morals and politics.

 

[Macca]

The tone yesterday was that if you didn't support SISU you secretly wanted the club to go out of existence. School yard stuff

 

[torchomatic]

Not true. However some people like CJP want them to go out of business but make no secret about it.

The tone yesterday was that if you didn't support SISU you secretly wanted the club to go out of existence. School yard stuff

 

[Astute]

The tone yesterday was that if you didn't support SISU you secretly wanted the club to go out of existence. School yard stuff

Only yesterday?

And how quickly things change with Cov fans and SISU. A couple of months ago if you made a comment that could be seen as sticking up for SISU you were not a proper Cov fan....and that is a polite way of putting it. Now if you don't agree with them not paying any rent and think it is wrong they get the ground for a pittance then you are not a proper Cov fan :facepalm:

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

I think the problem people have Godiva, myself included, is what did SISU expect, heading into the fated relegation season? The season before, we'd finished 18th - hence just above relegation, yet we lost Westwood, Turner, Gunnarsson, King and Jutkiewitz heading into the new season; with a manager with less than 2 months managerial experience. Surely relegation was inevitable?

They have to accept a level of culpability for where we are - the lowest league position in a generation or two.

They also had the chance to review and potentially renegotiate the rental agreement when they completed due diligence. Again, as such a level of culpability needs to prevail if they either failed to do so; or simply didn't bother.

Yet all we're doing is comparing our rentals to other clubs in this division. Lets start off with SISU accepting responsibility for us being in this damn division; thereafter, candid discussions with regards how we all climb out together can ensue

 

[Godiva]

I think the problem people have Godiva, myself included, is what did SISU expect, heading into the fated relegation season? The season before, we'd finished 18th - hence just above relegation, yet we lost Westwood, Turner, Gunnarsson, King and Jutkiewitz heading into the new season; with a manager with less than 2 months managerial experience. Surely relegation was inevitable?

Westwood and King chose to walk - Turner and Gunnar would have made no or little difference. I think the club only received money from Turner - and selling players was needed then and is needed still to keep up with the cashflow.

They have to accept a level of culpability for where we are - the lowest league position in a generation or two.
They have to accept their share of the responsibility - as do the players, the manager and the SOC campaigners. They are not solely responsible.

They also had the chance to review and potentially renegotiate the rental agreement when they completed due diligence. Again, as such a level of culpability needs to prevail if they either failed to do so; or simply didn't bother.
Sure they did, and failing to do so was a huge mistake. But as the club at takeover had a completely different economy the rent would not then have counted for as large a percentage of the overall costs as it does today.
Still - it would have been an even bigger mistake not to initiate rent-talks when they prepared this seasons budget. Better late than never.

Yet all we're doing is comparing our rentals to other clubs in this division. Lets start off with SISU accepting responsibility for us being in this damn division; thereafter, candid discussions with regards how we all climb out together can ensue
What other clubs pay, what other stadiums offer in regards to facilities is actually not important. Our club cannot afford the rent we (should) pay and that problem needs to be rectified.
You say sisu should accept responsibility and I assume you mean they should inject more millions. But I think you should consider the possibility that there simply is no more money going into this club. It has to live on it's own. Nobody - not even sisu - will be able to paint an investment prospect colorfull enough to attract new investors, so it's a dead end.

And now back to the crucial point: It doesn't seem that ACL can stay profitable if the club only pays what it can afford.
If that is true, then one of the two will fade away.
Who should it be?

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

And now back to the crucial point: It doesn't seem that ACL can stay profitable if the club only pays what it can afford.
If that is true, then one of the two will fade away.
Who should it be?

I don't agree with much of your brush-offs above. SISU's administration of the club is almost exclusively responsible for us being where we are.

And what can the club afford anyway? Even if they'd have existed rent free and shared match-day income, according to Fisher's own figures they'd still have lost in excess of £30m in five years.

So, even if they break ACL, they can't afford anything anyway. So, what's the bigger picture?

 

[wingy]

And now back to the crucial point: It doesn't seem that ACL can stay profitable if the club only pays what it can afford.
If that is true, then one of the two will fade away.
Who should it be?

That of course is if we all believe what the club can afford
.

 

[Godiva]

I don't agree with much of your brush-offs above. SISU's administration of the club is almost exclusively responsible for us being where we are.

And what can the club afford anyway? Even if they'd have existed rent free and shared match-day income, according to Fisher's own figures they'd still have lost in excess of £30m in five years.

You are looking backwards. And you're right - the club would still have lost a lot of money even if the rent had been £0 from day one.
But look forward - will the club be able to exist on its own paying say £400k plus matchday expenses and a five year installment plan for the £1m outstanding rent?
Maybe it can, but it would surely hurt any ambition of getting back to the championship.

So, even if they break ACL, they can't afford anything anyway. So, what's the bigger picture?

If they get ACL they will have their £500k/yr profit. That will help the club.
If they can utilize the potential ACL says the stadium still has (but have failed to do themself) it will only help the club even more.

 

[Jack Griffin]

The rent is being withheld to force meaningful talks.
The clubs needs a better offer than ACL's temporary reduction offer that isn't going to get us anywhere long term.

It is being witheld to push ACL from a profiable to a loss making company and pressure them into giving away the goose that lays the golden egg.

They have got to avoid that scenario, what is needed is an alternative strategy from ACL that forces SISU onto the defensive, force SISU into having to find a new stadium & let ACL use the RICOH for whatever events can be staged to keep their heads above water.

People who say things like this often get accused of disloyalty to the club, but I think SISU's hold is like an illness, a cancer & the treatment has to be suitably aggressive to cure the club of it.

 

[italiahorse]

It is being witheld to push ACL from a profiable to a loss making company and pressure them into giving away the goose that lays the golden egg.

They have got to avoid that scenario, what is needed is an alternative strategy from ACL that forces SISU onto the defensive, force SISU into having to find a new stadium & let ACL use the RICOH for whatever events can be staged to keep their heads above water.

People who say things like this often get accused of disloyalty to the club, but I think SISU's hold is like an illness, a cancer & the treatment has to be suitably aggressive to cure the club of it.

Are you a Leicester fan?
It's called cutting your nose off to spite your face.............
This negativity is starting to get on my nerves. All criticism and negativity but yet no alternative plan YAWNNNNNNNNN

 

[valiant15]

You're the leicester fan you troll.

 

[italiahorse]

You're the leicester fan you troll.

Great Contribution. Try and put a sensible sentence together that makes an input into the conversation.

 

[torchomatic]

These kind of comments make me laugh. Without CCFC ACL would be nothing. The odd sellout concert during the summer won't make up the shortfall and neither will wedding fares and Jehovah conventions.

and let ACL use the RICOH for whatever events can be staged to keep their heads above water.it.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

You are looking backwards. And you're right - the club would still have lost a lot of money even if the rent had been £0 from day one.
But look forward - will the club be able to exist on its own paying say £400k plus matchday expenses and a five year installment plan for the £1m outstanding rent?
Maybe it can, but it would surely hurt any ambition of getting back to the championship.



If they get ACL they will have their £500k/yr profit. That will help the club.
If they can utilize the potential ACL says the stadium still has (but have failed to do themself) it will only help the club even more.

But why, dear chap, why?

SISU already had shares for free, giving the promise of a debt-free tomorrow of honey and milk.

Now they want to break ACL, get their hands on the Ricoh and its revenues and still without a plan to curb their losses. What will be next? Demanding the right to develop the brown fields site toward the M6?

All they've proven to me is that they can't run a football club, can't complete due diligence, and that their latest plan doesn't work even if they break ACL and get what they want.

So; why?

 

[WillieStanley]

Just thought I'd remind us all that not so long ago there was an element of the fan base who actually wanted a move away from The Ricoh. Not so pretty now it could become a reality, eh?