Fisher pays tribute to fans (3 Viewers)

[dongonzalos]

Look no company on earth would agree to an arrangement that dictates strategy and policy via a third party that ultimately has no liability if such strategies go wrong.

It's unworkable and unjust.

The strategy is their own publically stated goals.
All that is added is a guarantee that they have an option to obtain a percentage of the stadium at cost price as they achieve those goals. It is a bonus they don't have at the moment

It is a complete win win for SISU.

Please expand how is giving them this option unjust.

 

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[Godiva]

Yes it is what I suggested, tweaked to include financial stability over a longer period.
Correct me if I am wrong but the other day were you not suggesting an alternative in which SISU effectively run ACL out of business. I think people see The charity and ACL as synonyms.
Yes take the point it is complicated however I think the complications of the mess and the different aspects of Rent, shares, stadium ownership, food, football club, charity, council, SISU, ACL

Mean we are going to have long drawn at battles like this at every stage of every different negotiation. Considering this in itself is just the rent.

Such drawn out battles may suit one group in particular (not the fans)

So it would be very cost (lawyers) and time efficient to get one all encompassing agreement that covers everything over s long period.

Yes - I have done this many times. But I have not been defended Higgs position in ACL at any time. In fact I have asked what the f... a charity is doing in a property investment case? Especially as when they constructed ACL money was in excess everywhere and finding a specialized property investment partner wouldn't have been difficult.
Now Higgs - as so many others - are facing a loss of their investment as property values have decreased as a direct outcome of the financial crisis.

In my previous post I merely pointed out that others are defending the charitys investment and that your proposal will actually lead to Higgs losing some of their money.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

This just shows SISU that there is a huge dormant following just waiting for success ! That, SISU, is the way forward -- I can well remember regular gates of 35,000 at Highfield Road. So, SISU, produce the goods and you'll increase your revenue ! (Why the ferk they didn't realize this from day one baffles me!)

 

[Godiva]

The strategy is their own publically stated goals.
All that is added is a guarantee that they have an option to obtain a percentage of the stadium at cost price as they achieve those goals. It is a bonus they don't have at the moment

It is a complete win win for SISU.

Please expand how is giving them this option unjust.

Ah ... cost price ... but that is now way above actual value. Nobody is prepared to pay more than it's actually worth.
(And just to be clear: The value is equal to the price a buyer and a seller can agree)

 

[Godiva]

This just shows SISU that there is a huge dormant following just waiting for success ! That, SISU, is the way forward -- I can well remember regular gates of 35,000 at Highfield Road. So, SISU, produce the goods and you'll increase your revenue ! (Why the ferk they didn't realize this from day one baffles me!)

It's capacity was approx 23.000 when it became allseater 25 years ago. Much has changed since.

 

[Grendel]

The strategy is their own publically stated goals.
All that is added is a guarantee that they have an option to obtain a percentage of the stadium at cost price as they achieve those goals. It is a bonus they don't have at the moment

It is a complete win win for SISU.

Please expand how is giving them this option unjust.

As I have just said no private company would ever allow a third party (especially a council) dictate objectives and measurement.

Interesting you say financial stability. That I assume means that the club has to effective be self sufficient as a stand alone entity. Given that the club constantly reports trading losses the only way this can be achieved is to sell players or are you saying the council can dictate how much a private company should loan to fund losses?

 

[dongonzalos]

Ah ... cost price ... but that is now way above actual value. Nobody is prepared to pay more than it's actually worth.
(And just to be clear: The value is equalt to the price a buyer and a seller can agree)

Yes that is fair comment if cost price is more than an independent market value you would have to agree on an independent value.

I would be very surprised if that is less than cost price though.

There could be an option for SISU to sell on their share and the agreement at any point in the future as well

 

[wingy]

This just shows SISU that there is a huge dormant following just waiting for success ! That, SISU, is the way forward -- I can well remember regular gates of 35,000 at Highfield Road. So, SISU, produce the goods and you'll increase your revenue ! (Why the ferk they didn't realize this from day one baffles me!)

Nice try VOR ,the topic won't go away.

 

[Godiva]

Yes that is fair comment if cost price isotherms than an independent market value you would have to agree on an independent value.

I would be very surprised if that is less than cost price though.

There could be an option for SISU to sell on their share and the agreement at any point in the future as well

I am afraid your suggestion couldn't work and I suspect none of the involved would be interested.

But it is very nice to see that you actually come up with alternative ideas. Very constructive.

 

[Grendel]

Can I get some clarity from Sisu's buddies on here

What's a sisu buddy?

Don't think that you will find any of them just fans of the football club who want to see a fair deal after a decade of obvious unfairness which includes not paying back rental monies at the previous rental amount.

 

[dongonzalos]

Yes - I have done this many times. But I have not been defended Higgs position in ACL at any time. In fact I have asked what the f... a charity is doing in a property investment case? Especially as when they constructed ACL money was in excess everywhere and finding a specialized property investment partner wouldn't have been difficult.
Now Higgs - as so many others - are facing a loss of their investment as property values have decreased as a direct outcome of the financial crisis.

In my previous post I merely pointed out that others are defending the charitys investment and that your proposal will actually lead to Higgs losing some of their money.

Ok well hopefully if a version of this suggestion could be used then maybe the charity can get money back at a fair price agreed by an independent valuer.

 

[dongonzalos]

I am afraid your suggestion couldn't work and I suspect none of the involved would be interested.

But it is very nice to see that you actually come up with alternative ideas. Very constructive.

That's the bit that worries me,
But in theory everyone gets what they want

Council and regeneration, community projects successful club, direct responsibility for the club handed over, bragging rights.
Higgs fair price and relinquish ownership.

SISU an end game complete ownership of the Ricoh.
A clear path of how to get their, also an option to sell this project on at anytime to a suitable purchaser.

Godiva I appreciate your point about parties not been interested, however I would be very intrigued as to who would say no and what their intentions are when they say no.
As in theory this is what they are all publicly saying they want.

 

[dongonzalos]

What's a sisu buddy?

Don't think that you will find any of them just fans of the football club who want to see a fair deal after a decade of obvious unfairness which includes not paying back rental monies at the previous rental amount.

I think it's fair to say fans just want some sort of agreement and no off field matters causing any disruptions on field unfortunately I think this maybe the first of many long drawn out battles over various issues.

 

[covcity4life]

thank you tim, get that rent sorted please

 

[kdrinkell]

It was better to read what the players thought about the MK game
Elliott confirmed the fans’ part in the courageous display by saying: “They were like an extra man for us out there. All the lads were talking about them afterwards and we are delighted to send them home happy.”

 

[cloughie]

Yeah £400K. + operational costs £230k. + rates £170K. mysteriously introduced in the Queens christmas speech,What business is not responsible for its own operational costs and business rates .What utopia is this world where Sisu exist??:thinking about:

this should read '.What utopia is this world where Sisu and grendel exist?'

 

[dongonzalos]

Is Grendel the SISU company account on here,
It changes its name with each new CEO.
Did the name change from KD to Grendel coincide with a change in staff at SISU

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

It's capacity was approx 23.000 when it became allseater 25 years ago. Much has changed since.

The point I am trying to make is that the Ricoh has a capicity of 32,000 which could be filled each week with a successful team. There are so many dormant fans -- (remember 32,000 v Chelsea in the FA cup 3 seasons ago ?) just waiting. Had SISU realized from the start that success = increased income instead of cost cutting to the bare bones we might well have been back in the Premiership instead of Div 1 (with 16,000 "lost"). Cheers -- Happy New Year all :wave:

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

I can see Fisher and SISU's mouths dribbling from here! They're thinking what would it be like having all that money in our coffers instead of the oppositions'
Well, simple answer is, pay the rent(And what's due in back rent, and the Escrow account) Start thinking about how much money you can rake in with promotion(£5m) and that's just for starters! For the first time in your tenure of ownership of CCFC. Think of the people who put money in YOUR pockets, "The Fans" Invest in the football side of things, and maybe..just maybe, We "Away supporters only" might come back to the Ricoh. Happy New Year to all at SBT:wave::wave:

 

[Godiva]

The point I am trying to make is that the Ricoh has a capicity of 32,000 which could be filled each week with a successful team. There are so many dormant fans -- (remember 32,000 v Chelsea in the FA cup 3 seasons ago ?) just waiting. Had SISU realized from the start that success = increased income instead of cost cutting to the bare bones we might well have been back in the Premiership instead of Div 1 (with 16,000 "lost"). Cheers -- Happy New Year all :wave:

I think their plan initially was to get us back into the PL, and I think they have poured millions into the project. Unfortunately there were 23 other teams who had the same idea, and now we are where we are.

Playing the blame game, pointing fingers, telling them they failed ... how will that change anything?

 

[Sky Blues]

What's a sisu buddy?

Don't think that you will find any of them just fans of the football club who want to see a fair deal after a decade of obvious unfairness which includes not paying back rental monies at the previous rental amount.

As I have acknowledged in reply to Godiva, I think everyone wants the best for CCFC but there are different ideas about what the best is. I was simply asking those who seem to back the SISU approach on the rent to state whether they believe ACL's last offer is for £400,000 or £800,000 as you (plural) seem to use whichever figure most suits the argument you are making at that particular moment. I notice you (Grenduffy) chose not to answer that, but get nit picky about my choice of words. What do you believe ACL's last offer to be?