Midlands Today Last Night (16 Viewers)

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Concourse Stella pumps attended by topless beauties?

The last word hopefully preventing any Thorn-japery...

By beauties I assume we mean the finalists from last year's 'Mr UK'?

 

---

[torchomatic]

Unfortunately not. As the Council have given £14M to ACL, they've had to close a few Care Homes down. The topless beauties will be former residents, though the Council have confirmed that none will be over 85. Phew.

By beauties I assume we mean the finalists from last year's 'Mr UK'?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Unfortunately not. As the Council have given £14M to ACL, they've had to close a few Care Homes down. The topless beauties will be former residents, though the Council have confirmed that none will be over 85. Phew.

Then count me out-the club could always do a naked calendar 'for charity' as a plan B.

 

[torchomatic]

Or an SBT one. I have a stamp to cover my modesty.

Then count me out-the club could always do a naked calendar 'for charity' as a plan B.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Unfortunately not. As the Council have given £14M to ACL, they've had to close a few Care Homes down. The topless beauties will be former residents, though the Council have confirmed that none will be over 85. Phew.

Never mind. With regards the over-85's, okay, on one hand they can tuck their nipples in their socks, but on the other hand they might have memory sufficient to reminisce SISU's last rent payment....

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Or an SBT one. I have a stamp to cover my modesty.

Taylor hasn't even left school yet Torch-control yourself.

 

[ilikesisuhatethecouncil]

my god! ccfc could do without the Ricoh. I dont care where they play. the ricoh is absolutely shiiite, jinxed, boring and pathetically built on the posh side of the ground. I want to see us in a 20,000 seater stadium shared if we have to, whatever.. just dont give that nasty council / acl anything let the greedy sods rot in their muck

 

[torchomatic]

The bit I'm looking forward to is paying for my coffee. "No honestly love, I gave you a twenty".

Never mind. With regards the over-85's, okay, on one hand they can tuck their nipples in their socks, but on the other hand they might have memory sufficient to reminisce SISU's last rent payment....

 

[torchomatic]

I really want to like your posts, but I can't do it. My credibility is in tatters as it is.

my god! ccfc could do without the Ricoh. I dont care where they play. the ricoh is absolutely shiiite, jinxed, boring and pathetically built on the posh side of the ground. I want to see us in a 20,000 seater stadium shared if we have to, whatever.. just dont give that nasty council / acl anything let the greedy sods rot in their muck

 

[MichaelCCFC]

Oh, I see. The crime of having a different view. Guilty.

Been a fan myself for 40. Always looked on the bright side. As for figures, it's not for me to say, is it? It's up to City and ACL.

Understanding ACL/council position is pretty easy but it's sisu's next move I'm not sure of at all. As you challenge the anti-sisu people (and warm Tim's slippers! - plus lots of city fans seem to entrenched in their view and interpret information to fit their opinion) I thought you might have more of a view about what sisu might do and what would be reasonable rent e.g is the current acl offer of £400k fair? As for optimism, spent the journey up to carlisle talking about how many goals we'd get and who'd be the scorers, and look where that ended up!

 

[Astute]

I work at Pizza Hut and I can tell you, the store looks forward to match days in terms of bringing revenue, AND, the store has lost revenue because the club only gets 10k fans as when we were getting 20k+ the store was 'rammed'. Local areas beefit massively from CCFC and other events at the RICOH.

But this is not the fault of the Council.

 

[Astute]

Agree, MMM. I'm not saying they couldn't survive without City, but I think they'd certainly miss us.

Miss us like a fookin hole in the head you mean?

Have you ever rented out any properties? I have. Having someone not paying rent is nothing but hassle and costs you money. Get rid of them and you lose less money.

 

[shmmeee]

Miss us like a fookin hole in the head you mean?

Have you ever rented out any properties? I have. Having someone not paying rent is nothing but hassle and costs you money. Get rid of them and you lose less money.

How many potential tenants did you have? Cos if its more than one the situation isn't comparable.

This is basic economics, the ground is worth what people will pay. If noone offers more than CCFC they can pay what they like.

 

[Astute]

my god! ccfc could do without the Ricoh. I dont care where they play. the ricoh is absolutely shiiite, jinxed, boring and pathetically built on the posh side of the ground. I want to see us in a 20,000 seater stadium shared if we have to, whatever.. just dont give that nasty council / acl anything let the greedy sods rot in their muck

Hi Joy.

Welcome to SBT. You must be Joy as you chat as much shit as a woman :claping hands:

 

[Astute]

How many potential tenants did you have? Cos if its more than one the situation isn't comparable.

This is basic economics, the ground is worth what people will pay. If noone offers more than CCFC they can pay what they like.

So the ground is worth fook all as SISU pay that much? :facepalm: I'll give them a tenner a year as that is a tenner more than they get off SISU. But they will have to do any events around when I want the pitch to play footy with the lads.

 

[BackRoomRummermill]

There is so much 'crap' spouted on the internet and 'guess work'

Without a doubt there is no way ACL can survive without CCFC, they are struggling now which is why they are getting 14 M from the council. ( this not crap as this happened this week)

It takes some balls and stupid buissness sense for the woman from ACL to say that they can survive without CCFC. WTF , she dont give a shite she will be offski if it all goes wrong and have a semi decent CV.

Unreal totally that some people need to understand that its all about people here and now . loyalty has left ethics in the 90's.

Where does your loyalty lie ? Yes you !

 

[thegameaintstraight]

[QUOTE=oldskyblue58
balls in SISU's court as far as I am concerned right now.

Are we about to find out if they really are of steel?
(sorry couldnt resist)

 

[BackRoomRummermill]

FFS, when will some people realise that the 14m was a loan to pay off the bank which was charging much higher interest rates than the council will, therebye incurring significantly less expense in the form of interest than previously, which makes them much more profitable. It also protects ACL from any takeover machinations that other parties may have envisaged as being to their benefit by defaulting on rent payments and therebye buggering up ACL's cash flow position. This danger is now eliminated.
Please note for those that STILL think that the council are giving taxpayer's money away by doing this, the exact opposite is happening. The council will make a cash profit on this deal as the interest they earn from ACL exceeds the interest they must pay on the loan. The taxpayer WINS. FFS, will you not see the truth of this! No-one is being deprived or losing their job becuase of this.
Anyone who thinks that ACL cannot survive without CCFC just does not understand business, eventing, hospitality etc. Why can you not understand that having such a large area covered in grass and open to the sky is a HINDERENCE to ACL making far more money than they ever will from CCFC. And you keep conveniently forgetting other things like the planned area development, the possibility of the rail link etc. The potential for investors is huge - why on Earth do you think SISU are even here in the first place?

I love my football club as much as any of you and I hate what is happenning to them and would hate to see them evicted, but get your blinkers off and see reality for what it is. Loving your club does not negate the economic realities.

Is this 'guesswork' or 'spin' or fact ?

If its the latter then offer some evidance, like you know the future order contract book.

 

[Astute]

It was said to be the reason when the news was released.

Do we believe them or SISU?

 

[BackRoomRummermill]

It was said to be the reason when the news was released.

Do we believe them or SISU?

Check out there massive order book on the website for the next 6 months

http://www.ricoharena.com/entertainment/entertainment-events/

That including sprinstien wont even cover overheads hmmmmmmmmmmmmm . Fair enough every week with a Take that or Bruce or Bryan Adams but I see they have mystic meg filling in , maybe this will help

Again I am dealing with facts here , so over to the forum ACL reps ...............

Sorry forgot the midland carp fishing spectacular , not to be missed apparently

 

[lordsummerisle]

Miss us like a fookin hole in the head you mean?

Have you ever rented out any properties? I have. Having someone not paying rent is nothing but hassle and costs you money. Get rid of them and you lose less money.

Astute on holiday:

[video=youtube;U8Kum8OUTuk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8Kum8OUTuk[/video]

 

[ohitsaidwalker king power]

ACL previously stated I'm sure that only 20% of their revenue stream is from CCFC-so the remaining 80% are from "alternates"?
Assuming this to be factual and not sabre rattling- How do ACL calculate financial benefits from say the Casino revenue stream when people casually visit after/before the match- in my view they aren't mutually exclusive and probably not calculable?

 

[BackRoomRummermill]

SBS , I have to agree to disagree with you I am afraid

If like I said the RICOH hosted big events each week then I would conclude they will solvent...maybe

However based on my corperate experience in the cash rich oil and gas industry

The AECC Aberdeen (smaller venue) holds major concerts and also all the MAIN EURO oil and GAS exhibitions .

I know people at the venue and they struggle to get by. Make no mistake these are major world wide events with poeple from mid east, brasil, africa and europe attending.

The Carp show with mystic meg and the occasional big name enticed at knock down rates will not keep it all above water I am afraid at the RICOH

The only viable REGULAR income comes from CCFC events and the extras, Rent apart they make a good amount from , Parking, Burgers (non horse) and hospitality .FACT

 

[deanocity3]

Don't forget the jerhovah's witness convention !!!!

 

[lordsummerisle]

Don't forget the jerhovah's witness convention !!!!

Not that successful though, when they knocked, everybody pretended not to be in til they went away.

 

[Astute]

Astute on holiday:

[video=youtube;U8Kum8OUTuk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8Kum8OUTuk[/video]

So what are you trying to say?

 

[BackRoomRummermill]

Oh, and by the way, from my own personal experience, the single biggest barrier to putting on an event is finding a suitable venue. It's not usually the money, it's finding the right venue.
Let me assure you, ACL would not lack for customers if they had the freedom of not having a football club.

Why is the RICOH suitable? What is the Unique selling point of the RICOH?

The NEC is far better connected and what local buissness niques does Cov have ? to draw in a worldwide audiance?

I am looking for answers here ........... that confirm that ACL can live er sorry exist without CCFC

 

[Astute]

SBS , I have to agree to disagree with you I am afraid

If like I said the RICOH hosted big events each week then I would conclude they will solvent...maybe

However based on my corperate experience in the cash rich oil and gas industry

The AECC Aberdeen (smaller venue) holds major concerts and also all the MAIN EURO oil and GAS exhibitions .

I know people at the venue and they struggle to get by. Make no mistake these are major world wide events with poeple from mid east, brasil, africa and europe attending.

The Carp show with mystic meg and the occasional big name enticed at knock down rates will not keep it all above water I am afraid at the RICOH

The only viable REGULAR income comes from CCFC events and the extras, Rent apart they make a good amount from , Parking, Burgers (non horse) and hospitality .FACT

And it is much better to have a football club taking over the stadium for most of the year making it difficult to have anything else take place when they don't pay any rent? FACT

 

[Astute]

Backroom,

Let me say that I do not know the UK market as it has been many, many years since I have worked in the UK, so I will bow to your local knowledge.
Here on the continent it would appear to be very different. In my spare time, I am part of an organisation that puts on quite large events over a two week period where we hope to get a minimum of 3,000+ paying bums on seats, run bars and cafees etc. We have to book potential venues up to three years in advance or we will not have anywhere to put on our events. Over here, any large property that can even be expensively converted to put in temporary light and sound infrastructure, staging and seating is a very valuable piece of property that is almost guaranteed to be sold out for the entire year, except January and September which for some reason nobodfy wants venues for and nobody comes to events (strange that!).
I therefore find it difficullt to believe that a place like the Ricoh, especially if the pitch was done away with, partly roofed over (leaving the possibility for open air events), light and sound infrastucture put in place and variable seating arranged for, would not be an absolute killer place for events and would not be almost continuously sold out.
Even amdram events make a killer profit for venues over here! Pantomimes at the Ricoh, what more could anyone want!

Some people only see what they want to see though.

 

[BackRoomRummermill]

And it is much better to have a football club taking over the stadium for most of the year making it difficult to have anything else take place when they don't pay any rent? FACT

Astute maybe you can tell me where the other buissness is then apart from the Carp Show without CCFC in the UK current market is , i am all ears !

 

[Grendel]

Astute maybe you can tell me where the other buissness is then apart from the Carp Show without CCFC in the UK current market is , i am all ears !

Open air concert tonight would be good. Perhaps we could put a roof on. Only cost about £15 million.

 

[BackRoomRummermill]

Backroom,

Let me say that I do not know the UK market as it has been many, many years since I have worked in the UK, so I will bow to your local knowledge.
Here on the continent it would appear to be very different. In my spare time, I am part of an organisation that puts on quite large events over a two week period where we hope to get a minimum of 3,000+ paying bums on seats, run bars and cafees etc. We have to book potential venues up to three years in advance or we will not have anywhere to put on our events. Over here, any large property that can even be expensively converted to put in temporary light and sound infrastructure, staging and seating is a very valuable piece of property that is almost guaranteed to be sold out for the entire year, except January and September which for some reason nobodfy wants venues for and nobody comes to events (strange that!).
I therefore find it difficullt to believe that a place like the Ricoh, especially if the pitch was done away with, partly roofed over (leaving the possibility for open air events), light and sound infrastucture put in place and variable seating arranged for, would not be an absolute killer place for events and would not be almost continuously sold out.
Even amdram events make a killer profit for venues over here! Pantomimes at the Ricoh, what more could anyone want!

The place you are talking about already exists all over europe and UK.

I will throw in the AHOY Rotterdam, great shows for buissness ( with relervance) and also saw Micheal Bubble there in a state of the art roof over arena.

The fact remains that the RICOH is caught out in that it can hold say 20K for a concert but they will all get wet if it rains , or they put a roof on which they cannot afford given the number of within an hour or two already have it.

I cannot see a future for ACL without CCFC I am afraid.

 

[blueflint]

Check out there massive order book on the website for the next 6 months

http://www.ricoharena.com/entertainment/entertainment-events/

That including sprinstien wont even cover overheads hmmmmmmmmmmmmm . Fair enough every week with a Take that or Bruce or Bryan Adams but I see they have mystic meg filling in , maybe this will help

Again I am dealing with facts here , so over to the forum ACL reps ...............

Sorry forgot the midland carp fishing spectacular , not to be missed apparently

cant you see without being tied to a football club they could have more of events like springsteen etc then they will become very viable

 

[Astute]

How many concerts do they have to hold to make the same as they are collecting from SISU? How many concerts would they have to hold to make the same as SISU might be happy to pay?

Could that be made over the duration of a football season? What do you say Mr SISU?

 

[oldskyblue58]

ACL 2011 accounts

Turnover 6,663,974
overhead costs including depreciation 5,147,739 (depreciation 1,545,158)
interest paid 1,048,346
Profit 471,389 (if you ignore depreciation then that becomes 2,016,547 profit)

Take out 1.3m for ccfc rent and an estimate of the share of the profits from the joint venture with Compass that does all the catering, bars, hospitality etc say ACL share £1.0m. ACL does not do the hospitality etc itself. Have ignored the additional costs that are there because CCFC are there eg power costs included in overheads etc that could be reduced with no club there.

that would leave a new situation of

Turnover 4,363,974
overheads excl depreciation 3,602,581
interest (14m over 40 years at 5% perhaps) say 725,000. (the deal was announced as long term and lower interest rate the 5% is probably higher than they are now paying)

I make that a profit of 36,393 before depreciation that is without an attributed £2.3m income from CCFC. Then look at whether they could save on staffing or other overheads, whether they can get new events in ...........

Depreciation I have excluded because it doesnt involve any money changing hands

I believe it was asserted that there is no doubt that ACL can not survive without CCFC, couldnt pay the bills .......... that is not a fact it is an opinion.

In my opinion the facts and assertions/assumptions above means that there is a possibility that ACL can cover the costs with income from other sources and could survive without CCFC............. the fact is they do not want to do that, and CCFC certainly do not want to be in a position where that happens