cloughie
Well-Known Member
no they would want it by bank transfer..........................................hang on a minute , accounts frozen
Lack of news? (13 Viewers)
- Thread starter cyril
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no they would want it by bank transfer..........................................hang on a minute , accounts frozen
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
I agree with Gren and BSB. I can't fathom why Black's name comes up as a fans favourite every time we need a manager. Someone who was here ten years ago and hasn't managed in his own right for ten years.
It's pure nostalgia like hiding behind the sofa while watching Dr Who or summer holidays when you were a kid.
It's pure nostalgia like hiding behind the sofa while watching Dr Who or summer holidays when you were a kid.
deanocity3
New Member
yes white horses and robinson crusoe
Colonel Mustard
New Member
For god's sake, nobody is assuming he would succeed. Anybody who thinks any manager is a dead cert to succeed at any club just doesn't pay attention to football. It is a crapshoot.
All that is being said is that Eric Black has excellent credentials to be manager of CCFC. That should be beyond dispute. What his history at CCFC shows us is that he prefers attacking football, makes the most out of what's available to him, and knows the value of goals scored - something we should all embrace.
To add: any comparison with Thorn is nonsensical. They have nothing in common.
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Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Hmmm, sure. What part of 'It was all 9 years ago' doesn't make sense to you? Perhaps in 2022 we will all be screaming for the board to hire Robins again because he won us a few games in League One. Your sole basis for thinking he would be a good appointment is because of what he did in 2004-thank God the people making this decision don't use such absurd logic.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I hear Jimmy Hill's still available, why haven't we interviewed him?
hill83
Well-Known Member
Ha. hopefully mentioning 2022 will force your point home!
Grendel
Well-Known Member
There are actually some people on here who would want Bobby Gould back and I am sure some who would even cheer if Thorn returned.
Baffling.
Colonel Mustard
New Member
My sole basis? I can only assume you haven't read my other posts in this thread.
Black is an intelligent, thoughtful man (evident in his press conferences and the recent TalkSport interview). He is bilingual, which could help both current players and future recruits. He likely has a wide network of contacts after his work in the Championship and Premiership. I also find his footballing philosophy appealing. What's more, he was available and a realistic candidate.
How do nine years affect any of that?
We are not talking about the sentimental return of a 36 year old player whose legs have gone. Nor the return of a manager who has spent 10 years in the armchair like George Graham or Kenny Dalglish had. Not even a man who is pushing close to retirement.
You can make a case for plenty of other managers. But if we are talking about logic, I fail to see any in the reluctance to hire Black.
EDIT: As for Robins, no, I wouldn't be enamoured. I feel he did what any decent manager should have done with this squad. What's more, I wouldn't vouch for his character after his walk-out.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
How on Earth do we know what his style would be when he hasn't managed in 9 years? Nostalgic appointments have long been a resounding failure in football (Dalglish and Keegan excellent examples), with one or two big exceptions (Howe at Bournemouth, Walter Smith at Rangers), and it's always because people have memories stuck in the past. Football has changed a hell of a lot since then-if we tried Black's tactics from 2004 now, chances are they'd have us fall flat on our face.
Colonel Mustard
New Member
That is a desperate comparison.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
There are plenty of other coaches meeting the same criteria-except I doubt you could name many; it is only because Black was manager in 2004 that he even entered the equation. I ask-will you be still wanting Robins hired in 2022?
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
You are the one clamouring for someone off the back of a honeymoon period.
Colonel Mustard
New Member
Half a season qualifies as a honeymoon period? Where do you draw the line? I would assume it's fewer than ten games.
Colonel Mustard
New Member
I answered that. No, I wouldn't be clamouring for Robins. As I say, I felt he did what any half-decent manager should have done with the squad he had available, and that he was helped no end by the torrid form of McGoldrick. Plus his walkout did not reflect well on his character.
I am willing to assess the merits of the man, not a period of time.
SkyBlue_Bear83
Well-Known Member
Ok I think you have made your point but it's not as if Black has been out of football since 2004 is it?
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
You'd think that we won every game 5-0. Just because he guided us to some good results then is not a guarantee he would deliver the same results now-his record at Motherwell was especially poor, but that was 11 years ago. Anything more than 9 doesn't count.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
He has been out of management which is an entirely different ball game to coaching.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Manager in 'joining a better team for more money and closer to home' shock.
Colonel Mustard
New Member
I'm not sure how this relates at all to what I said.
Colonel Mustard
New Member
Which is fine. But a prime reason why I wouldn't hire him again - in case he jumped ship at a pivotal point to take more money and move closer to home. The same reason I would never want Paul Lambert as a manager.
And as for the other points?
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
No team in world football is immune to having its manager or best players taken off their hands against their will, I hate to break it to you. People would point to results like the 4-1 at Donny, 5-1 at home to Walsall, breaking the club record for consecutive away wins, the JPT run etc. The difference is that Robins will likely be in management for the next 9 years, whereas for the previous 9, Black hasn't aside from the odd brief bit of caretaking. It is no basis on which to hire him.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I have provided you with a time he held a managerial post at roughly the same time and was distinctly average at it.
Colonel Mustard
New Member
We are deviating from the discussion. What rankled me was Robins' kiss-the-badge stuff only to bail. Purely subjective on my part, but I wouldn't vouch for such a character.
If people point to Robins' success, I will gladly contextualise it - L1, one of the best squads there, freakish form by McGoldrick etc. I don't think there was anything remarkable about Robins. None of my posts in the past six months will show any kind of enthusiasm for him. And obviously I wouldn't hire Black solely on the back of a few results - as I have repeatedly said and qualified.
Colonel Mustard
New Member
I asked how long a honeymoon period was, which you didn't answer. As for his stint at Motherwell, we know nothing about the context of it. I've said many times on this forum that I don't judge by win percentage or any other stats without knowing the context - which is why I feel comfortable judging Thorn, but not Pressley.
usskyblue
Well-Known Member
Pressley would be my choice over Black. No sentiment involved, no dislike of Black.
Pressley is more experienced as a manager and has a decent win ratio. He has been succesful at working with younger players and bringing them through. He also checks the boxes relating to style of play and being well spoken and seemingly intelligent (despite considering managing us).
Pressley is more experienced as a manager and has a decent win ratio. He has been succesful at working with younger players and bringing them through. He also checks the boxes relating to style of play and being well spoken and seemingly intelligent (despite considering managing us).
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
He still had to turn around a rank poor mentality and poor quality left to him by the buffoon he succeeded. A little psgm1-esque to suggest all he had to do was turn up and tell them to score goals.
SkyBlue_Bear83
Well-Known Member
The idea that his tactics and philosophies would be outdated because he hasn't been managing imo is wrong. He has been working day in, day out with premiership players for the last 9 years working closely with managers. Likely developing new training methods and tactics as football has developed.
Most lower league managers are effectively head coaches, very hands on and take every training session. The biggest challenge for coaches stepping up is whether they can handle the added responsibility, pressure and leadership required and how good there man management skills are i.e. getting them motivated, 1v1 issues with players etc. an how comfortable they are at dealing with the media
Colonel Mustard
New Member
I didn't come close to suggesting that. I think Robins is a capable manager.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
There's no set definition. I'm sure you would accept though, that a lot of caretakers achieve an upturn in form because of the change in approach they might bring, because the old manager was either unpopular, incompetent, or both, and so on. If Black hadn't been in charge all that time ago you wouldn't be clamouring for his appointment-indeed I doubt you'd have heard of him.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
There are quite literally hundreds of coaches who all have experience coaching and developing top quality players. If Black had any appetite for management he would have applied and been appointed for a position between now and then. If he hadn't managed here 9 years ago would you still be wanting him? Bear in mind I'd be surprised if you can name half a dozen other coaches who weren't employed by us at some point.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
That being the case, surely we should hire him in 2022.