A Deal Is Simple Really (12 Viewers)

[jesus-wept]

Simply, you, sisu, can play your team at the Ricoh for 3 years and as Gary Hoffman has offered, your rent will be paid, compensation, if any will be given to Northampton Town and we will throw in F&B too. You then have 3 years to build your new stadium. Good luck.What is there to negotiate ?

 

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[covcity4life]

why would they want to force them into building new stadium, leaves council in same position in 3 years

what they wanna do is secure ccfc at ricoh forever, so be nice if they gave up 25-50% of ricoh.

 

[Jack Griffin]

It would be nice if SISU invested in the stadium complex like Compass did, then they can have a better deal.

 

[italiahorse]

SISU don't plan to build a stadium. If they do what you say above they will be seen to be lying as they will do nothing in that period.
Their master plan of stressing the Ricoh will be seen for what it is. Whilst going through with the pretence of ground share, planning application refusals etc, their plan for getting the Ricoh is still a goer.
Everybody knows this and as soon as they realise we all know they will settle with ACL. ACL please be sensible.

 

[oldskyblue58]

or just negotiate 125 year lease at a low rent say £100k. They dont have to agree to giving up any ownership.

Would that give access to other incomes ? - probably not. But perhaps access could be purchased to some of them

Also what do people mean by giving up....... for free or sold?

 

[GaryPendrysEyes]

Sisu are a bunch of unethical business failures (halved our revenue, increased our debt, didnt file accounts etc. etc) they really cant be allowed to get any ownership of the Ricoh, the utter chaos will just continue for years.
CCC have to do the right thing and that isnt letting poisonous business failures run a key Coventry asset.

 

[covcity4life]

yeh as long as council get better deal than ccfc hey oldskyblue?

no idea why people thought you worked for them!

 

[RoboCCFC90]

Sisu are a bunch of unethical business failures (halved our revenue, increased our debt, didnt file accounts etc. etc) they really cant be allowed to get any ownership of the Ricoh, the utter chaos will just continue for years.
CCC have to do the right thing and that isnt letting poisonous business failures run a key Coventry asset.

Blinded by SISU Hate. To allow SISU purchase ownership of the Ricoh would mean the club will benefit greatly.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

why would they want to force them into building new stadium, leaves council in same position in 3 years

what they wanna do is secure ccfc at ricoh forever, so be nice if they gave up 25-50% of ricoh.

Force SISU into building a new stadium. Did you really type that? Did folk really mean to 'like' it?

 

[covcity4life]

Force SISU into building a new stadium. Did you really type that? Did folk really mean to 'like' it?

yes i did and yes they did.

i forgive you for having the wrong opinion though. im nice like that

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

yes i did and yes they did.

i forgive you for having the wrong opinion though. im nice like that

I'm trying to reciprocate by forgiving you for interpreting SISU doing anything other than play at the Ricoh, means they've been forced to build anew. But I'm struggling. Maybe it's the heat? Maybe I need coffee? I'll try very hard and see what I can muster

 

[Paxman II]

Hoffman's offer was not an actual offer of money or payment though was it? The money was going to come from the football clubs earnings and so was basically just a loan. I don't think Hoffman has been paying attention. It's not about that kind of money it's the ownership or part ownership of a stadium the football club wants and needs to be able to continue playing there.

The sooner everyone gets that and stops whining about trusting SISU and find a way to do that for the football club the better. I have said before on these forums there is more than one way to skin a cat. This whole trust and good faith issue has been played out long enough. There are many companies out there that make deals which dislike and distrust each other all the time. Business is business and a legally binding arrangement can and should be made that ensures ACL/council get the football club to stay and create some ownership of the stadium for the football club.
SISU will be long departed one day but such a deal would still remain for the football club.

Why is it so difficult to ask? Why are both these sides so difficult and intransient in their negotiating and lack of willingness to participate in their moral obligations to the City of Coventry and the supporters of the football club?
They play this out like a bunch of children arguing over who gets the best toy: "you can't have it, it's mine" How about "Ok I'll share it with you a bit but you can't keep it" ?

I accept the pouring out of emotion and campaigning against SISU but it won't be long now before the knife is also turned on ACL/Council for the same intransience. Poor old Higgs, all they want is to sell the darn shares they have and get out of dodge but these other two factions are ruining everyone's lives.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Blinded by SISU Hate. To allow SISU purchase ownership of the Ricoh would mean the club will benefit greatly.

Come on. Just no. It would benefit SISU greatly. They'll be flogging it within micro-seconds of the ink being dry on the contract. The 'benefit' will be felt in the Cayman islands, not in the 'CV' postcode, dear chap

 

[James Smith]

Blinded by SISU Hate. To allow SISU purchase ownership of the Ricoh would mean the club will benefit greatly.

I think and most people agree that the club needs to own ACL and their long lease which could be renegotiated to be extended at the purchase for another 50 years etc. AS I've discovered renting my flat if you sign up for a long lease you generally get a better deal so the lease could drop to say £100k-150k depending on length. This would then give the club the ability to set their own rent as a stadium user (so could be nothing if enough generated elsewhere in business) and get access to revenue streams from the year round Ricoh business and mean we might get out of this league by going up (not down). However I don't agree with SISU being part of this in any way size shape or form.

:blue:

 

[GaryPendrysEyes]

Blinded by SISU Hate. To allow SISU purchase ownership of the Ricoh would mean the club will benefit greatly.

Engage your brain and answer me why you think Sisu's business record here warrants them being trusted running a key Coventry asset???
Sisu's business record in 5 years here:
Halved gates and lost sponsorship - revenue pretty much halved- the business has shrunk dramatically
Debt increased to 70m - (despite virtually all playing assets have been sold off)
Appalling stakeholder/fan relationships
Accounts repeatedly not filed which is a criminal offence.

So cut out the mindless abuse and let's hear why you think Sisu are a competent business to be trusted with the Ricoh????
All ears...

 

[oldskyblue58]

Just giving an alternative that might work cc4l nothing more. Gives tenant and landlord long term security, lease adds to asset value on club and arena, allows time to rebuild a partnership with the club, keeps the possibility of more available to the club, ties the club to the arena, can be done relatively quickly and easily, gives a rent at low value (100k is just an example), could be negotiated to include other incomes (although at the moment i dont think it will just my opinion) wouldnt cost a lot for the club to acquire (probably nothing) ......... yes i can see why you would think it is all for the council :facepalm:

Oh and in the present circumstances is probably more achievable. Yes the Club and stadium should be one - right now I do not see CCFC owned by SISU getting an ownership share. So forgive me for taking a more pragmatic and practical approach

 

[RoboCCFC90]

I think and most people agree that the club needs to own ACL and their long lease which could be renegotiated to be extended at the purchase for another 50 years etc. This would then give the club the ability to set their own rent and get access to revenue streams from the year round Ricoh business and mean we might get out of this league by going up (not down). However I don't agree with SISU being part of this in any way size shape or form.

:blue:

Well there our owners James so unless you want the club to continue failing at which point you'll blame SISU anyway you need to put your anamosity aside.

 

[RoboCCFC90]

Come on. Just no. It would benefit SISU greatly. They'll be flogging it within micro-seconds of the ink being dry on the contract. The 'benefit' will be felt in the Cayman islands, not in the 'CV' postcode, dear chap

That's what you believe, a speculated opinion based on hatred or a conception of the owners. No hard facts or anywhere near relative truth Dear Chap.

 

[James Smith]

Well there our owners James so unless you want the club to continue failing at which point you'll blame SISU anyway you need to put your anamosity aside.

If we have to starve them out then so be it, they must leave.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

That's what you believe, a speculated opinion based on hatred or a conception of the owners. No hard facts or anywhere near relative truth Dear Chap.

No. An educated observation based on a historical trend.

On what do you base your false hope?

 

[fernandopartridge]

It would be nice if SISU invested in the stadium complex like Compass did, then they can have a better deal.

You really could put a glass eye to sleep. Was the massive rent now investment in kind? How could ACL invest in the stadium without SISU's rent from 2007 to 2012?

 

[GaryPendrysEyes]

So can someone/anyone tell me why, based on their business record here, Sisu are a competent business to run the Ricoh?

 

[RoboCCFC90]

Engage your brain and answer me why you think Sisu's business record here warrants them being trusted running a key Coventry asset???
Sisu's business record in 5 years here:
Halved gates and lost sponsorship - revenue pretty much halved- the business has shrunk dramatically
Debt increased to 70m - (despite virtually all playing assets have been sold off)
Appalling stakeholder/fan relationships
Accounts repeatedly not filed which is a criminal offence.

So cut out the mindless abuse and let's hear why you think Sisu are a competent business to be trusted with the Ricoh????
All ears...

Engage my brain? That's not nice.. Skipping over that.

I am not talking about SISU's business records, but would it benefit a CCFC owned by SISU to own the Arena, Simply put yes.

Mindless abuse? I haven't abused based on anyone's opinon, however I do believe people are slating this idea to purchase the Arena which frankly purchasing our own ground and being 100% joined at the hip is a fantastic idea, is based on hatred and disapproval of the company that owns CCFC.

But should you have any beteter ideas then this that would keep us in Coventry, maximise our revenue, pull the crowds in to a stadium and have the feeling of a place called "Home" feel free to enlighten me...

 

[RoboCCFC90]

If we have to starve them out then so be it, they must leave.

Good luck with that if they move back into the Ricoh.

 

[covcity4life]

Just giving an alternative that might work cc4l nothing more. Gives tenant and landlord long term security, lease adds to asset value on club and arena, allows time to rebuild a partnership with the club, keeps the possibility of more available to the club, ties the club to the arena, can be done relatively quickly and easily, gives a rent at low value (100k is just an example), could be negotiated to include other incomes (although at the moment i dont think it will just my opinion) wouldnt cost a lot for the club to acquire (probably nothing) ......... yes i can see why you would think it is all for the council :facepalm:

Oh and in the present circumstances is probably more achievable. Yes the Club and stadium should be one - right now I do not see CCFC owned by SISU gaetting an ownership share. So forgive me for taking a more pragmatic and practical approach

125 year lease means any successors to SISU will be the councils puppets aswell? if there are claused that can be triggered to buy the ground outright i would agree with your deal.

the football club should own its own stadium.

 

[grego_gee]

or just negotiate 125 year lease at a low rent say £100k. They dont have to agree to giving up any ownership.

Would that give access to other incomes ? - probably not. But perhaps access could be purchased to some of them

Also what do people mean by giving up....... for free or sold?

interesting proposal OB,
that is a big change down from the 400k where it was left.
on the face of it, we couldn't expect the council/acl side to go that low. Could we?

imp:

 

[RoboCCFC90]

No. An educated observation based on a historical trend.

On what do you base your false hope?

Oh it's an observation, well an observation can be many things, I can observate that if one woman cheats on a bloke in marriage than she will cheat again.... Or not that is an opinion based on prior historical information, not proven to be reliable in the future.

I base my opinion on what is best for the club, for exmaple if we move to Northampton this is bad, SISU have not said no to new negotiations and these look to take place meaning there not absolutely incohearent to what the fans want, you may say there turn of leaf for negotiations is for the financial gain and I could quite happily agree with that, but every action has a reaction, like moving back to the Ricoh would do.

 

[GaryPendrysEyes]

Engage my brain? That's not nice.. Skipping over that.

I am not talking about SISU's business records, but would it benefit a CCFC owned by SISU to own the Arena, Simply put yes.

Mindless abuse? I haven't abused based on anyone's opinon, however I do believe people are slating this idea to purchase the Arena which frankly purchasing our own ground and being 100% joined at the hip is a fantastic idea, is based on hatred and disapproval of the company that owns CCFC.

But should you have any beteter ideas then this that would keep us in Coventry, maximise our revenue, pull the crowds in to a stadium and have the feeling of a place called "Home" feel free to enlighten me...

I havent got a problem with a competent business running the Ricoh but I (and I hope CCC) have a serious problem with letting an evidently incompetent business own and run it. Seriously how can you call for Sisu ownership with no reference to their record as a business, that is just plain daft.

 

[James Smith]

Good luck with that if they move back into the Ricoh.

I find it interesting that they are so keen for ACL to agree to the CVA, could it be that if they don't sign it that there would be unwanted consequences for SISU. I mean next season is probably a write off given Tim has stated that we're not going back to the Ricoh and it's Sixfields here we come. The damage that has been done to the next generation of junior Sky Blues by SISU is possibly un-reversable which is tragic.

 

[Sky Blue Harry H]

Well there our owners James so unless you want the club to continue failing at which point you'll blame SISU anyway you need to put your anamosity aside.

Hitler 'owned' part of Europe - reckon you'd have just told Winston to let 'em just keep France and Poland and stop moaning about it:slap:

 

[RoboCCFC90]

I find it interesting that they are so keen for ACL to agree to the CVA, could it be that if they don't sign it that there would be unwanted consequences for SISU. I mean next season is probably a write off given Tim has stated that we're not going back to the Ricoh and it's Sixfields here we come. The damage that has been done to the next generation of junior Sky Blues by SISU is possibly un-reversable which is tragic.

I agree with that and being one of the many reasons we return to the Ricoh.

 

[wes_cov]

what about a:
49% ACL
49% SISU
2% Higgs/Trust/and agreeable fan based allocation

 

[oldskyblue58]

having a lease (and to .... one that is viewed as good as freehold) has never stopped a tenant from bidding to buy the freehold, nor would it stop a tenant taking an interest in the management company. But a lease agreeable to both sides would secure CCFC in Coventry quickly - the main problem at the moment isnt it?.

A long lease gives the owners something more tangible to sell and if it is at a low rent it (the club) is more marketable (the biggest problem is and always will be the amount owed to the owners)

What the low rent would be I have no idea - might still be offered at £400k for all I know

 

[RoboCCFC90]

Hitler 'owned' part of Europe - reckon you'd have just told Winston to let 'em just keep France and Poland and stop moaning about it:slap:

Invading a country and slaughtering millions of people is slightly different to putting anamosity aside for a company that is in essence trying to stabalise it's business.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Oh it's an observation, well an observation can be many things, I can observate that if one woman cheats on a bloke in marriage than she will cheat again.... Or not that is an opinion based on prior historical information, not proven to be reliable in the future.

I base my opinion on what is best for the club, for exmaple if we move to Northampton this is bad, SISU have not said no to new negotiations and these look to take place meaning there not absolutely incohearent to what the fans want, you may say there turn of leaf for negotiations is for the financial gain and I could quite happily agree with that, but every action has a reaction, like moving back to the Ricoh would do.

When it's SISU and honestly or clarity of ambition, my prediction of future events based on past behaviour is more akin to predicting that the sun will rise in the morning as I've seen it do nothing else for 40-odd years on this planet.

And I'm sorry, you can't base your opinion on what's best for the club. What's going so damn well now then?

Not knowing where we'll be playing in a fortnight? Not having new kits until October? Starting another season in embargo in the third tier?

What's the reason to be so damn trusting of, and cheery about our owners, eh?