italiahorse
Well-Known Member
That's SISU killing off the Speedway and the Greyhound racing.
What next .... Rugby, Ice Hockey ?
What next .... Rugby, Ice Hockey ?
Telegraph says we have bought the Brandon speedway site. (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter ccfctommy
- Start date
jesus-wept
New Member
Like me aren't you glad the Minister of Sport has a handle on this
J
Jack Griffin
Guest
There is also another site that has been mooted on this forum as a possible target.
Currently occupied by Broad St Rugby Club it lies to NE of junction of A428 & A46 and is just outside the City boundary.
http://www.broadstreet-rugby.co.uk/directions-to-broadstreet-rugby-club-rugby-road-ground.html
I think the trust should get in touch with the club & see if any approach has been made for their land (which I believe they acquired in a deal for a site they previously occupied), in fact they might not own the land & only have a lease..
Currently occupied by Broad St Rugby Club it lies to NE of junction of A428 & A46 and is just outside the City boundary.
http://www.broadstreet-rugby.co.uk/directions-to-broadstreet-rugby-club-rugby-road-ground.html
I think the trust should get in touch with the club & see if any approach has been made for their land (which I believe they acquired in a deal for a site they previously occupied), in fact they might not own the land & only have a lease..
jesus-wept
New Member
That's the other end of Binley Woods if I said getting planning permission for the Speedway site is less chance than me becoming Pope, I will add or President or the USA to that statement
we havent brought it.. we have agreed a deal.. thats a long way from actually being purchased , especially with SISU being the purchasing party!!
also a great coincidence that this news breaks on the day that the club are to sit down with ACL .. certainly puts some pressure on ACL doesn't it ?
but yeah in short, they have offered an amount.. the owner has accepted it, now its onto contract negotiations.. and then finally the signing of contracts.. which even then, might have a cooling off period. so where we are right now is pretty much the same as you advertising your car for sale for 5k, me ringing you and saying it sounds a nice car, will you take 4.5k to which you agree.. and i say, cool i'll be round in an hour... how many times does that person never even show up
Or, like Sisu, sign a contract, then still default on the rent!
This is no proof of purchase, especially with Sisu involved!
Yes, a more unviable site is hard to imagine.
If the FL fall for this they need to be relieved of all responsibilities.
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Building a stadium on the site of a stadium is plausible it is the associated items that will be a problem
remember TF said that the stadium would be part of a much bigger development where the other parts help finance the stadium build
so
(a) access is a problem, and like it or not impacts on the Coventry Council area who will have a say in it. We are not just talking match days, because for the site to be viable there has to be considerable footfall 365 days of the year. The stadium itself will require good footfall 365 days of the year
(b) If the other elements are basically a retail park then that is going to impact on the site already in the Binley area. Certainly those businesses there are not going to be happy about their trade being diluted and could well put in planning objections
(c) The Binley residents in the past have not been happy about the speedway and that rarely attracts crowds of 10k so their reaction to this is hardly likely to be positive
(d) Creating new roads is costly running in to 10's of 1000's of pounds per yard. Who picks up that cost. For example the link suggested above how far is that 2 miles? at even £1000 a yard (an impossible price) would be 3.5m its going to be much higher than that. To widen existing road would require purchasing frontages - expensive and time consuming.
(e) Do we actually know that this plan has the support of any council? Has any outline planning permission been given? Planning for the speedway stadium was agreed many years ago - planning has changed, yes some relaxation on some things, but the regulastions regarding access etc have been beefed up.
It is not as simple as it sounds, but no real surprise the news surfaced today. I would guess it makes SISU feel better about their position. Makes a point to fans I suppose but if this was so nailed on why talk to ACL at all? (dont say they are doing it for the fans ) Not sure how much pressure it actually puts on ACL - it is a lot if you believe that they have sat there doing nothing about their business whilst all this is going on, but have they?
Just a few of the things to consider
remember TF said that the stadium would be part of a much bigger development where the other parts help finance the stadium build
so
(a) access is a problem, and like it or not impacts on the Coventry Council area who will have a say in it. We are not just talking match days, because for the site to be viable there has to be considerable footfall 365 days of the year. The stadium itself will require good footfall 365 days of the year
(b) If the other elements are basically a retail park then that is going to impact on the site already in the Binley area. Certainly those businesses there are not going to be happy about their trade being diluted and could well put in planning objections
(c) The Binley residents in the past have not been happy about the speedway and that rarely attracts crowds of 10k so their reaction to this is hardly likely to be positive
(d) Creating new roads is costly running in to 10's of 1000's of pounds per yard. Who picks up that cost. For example the link suggested above how far is that 2 miles? at even £1000 a yard (an impossible price) would be 3.5m its going to be much higher than that. To widen existing road would require purchasing frontages - expensive and time consuming.
(e) Do we actually know that this plan has the support of any council? Has any outline planning permission been given? Planning for the speedway stadium was agreed many years ago - planning has changed, yes some relaxation on some things, but the regulastions regarding access etc have been beefed up.
It is not as simple as it sounds, but no real surprise the news surfaced today. I would guess it makes SISU feel better about their position. Makes a point to fans I suppose but if this was so nailed on why talk to ACL at all? (dont say they are doing it for the fans ) Not sure how much pressure it actually puts on ACL - it is a lot if you believe that they have sat there doing nothing about their business whilst all this is going on, but have they?
Just a few of the things to consider
Mary_Mungo_Midge
Well-Known Member
Bonkers. I used to live in Wolston, and went to Brandon every week on the days of Boocock, Olsen, et al.
There's one road in, and one road out. It would be gridlocked, even for the smallest gate.
Moreover, the tail backed traffic in and out, would congest the roads used by the ambulances to get into the hospital.
It's so crazy it's beyond words. Unless you've the landlord of the Roseycoombe....
Or, looked at another way, it's another investment cost that will be more than recovered when (if) SISU eventually decide to sell, having put the club in its own stadium, showing a positive return for their financial investors who seem quite happy to keep backing SISU with the aim of a longer-term gain.
stick a massive carpark on the A46 and make Rugby Road restricted access on match days and make the majority walk the mile or so up Rugby Road to the ground.
are there any other combined football/speedway stadia? sounds even less practical than an athletics/football stadium. just googled and the only slight reference I can find is they want to put it on at the Odsal in Bradford which is rugby league
I wonder what rental arangement SISU will agree with the Bees and what will happen if the Bees decide to stop paying it in a few years time...
still, it keeps the forums buzzing with interest even though it'll never happen. perhaps.
are there any other combined football/speedway stadia? sounds even less practical than an athletics/football stadium. just googled and the only slight reference I can find is they want to put it on at the Odsal in Bradford which is rugby league
I wonder what rental arangement SISU will agree with the Bees and what will happen if the Bees decide to stop paying it in a few years time...
still, it keeps the forums buzzing with interest even though it'll never happen. perhaps.
Manchester_sky_blue
Well-Known Member
The old pug factory site at Ryton would be no better. A large chunk of it has been built on now and another big section is being used for storage. There would still be space for a stadium and a small car park on the existing land but the access is little better than Brandon, although there would I suspect be less opposition as there are few houses around that area.
Lord_Nampil
Well-Known Member
Here's a thought, 2 sites have been identified 1 site has been made public, the skyblues, in theory require 2 sites, 1 for the training complex and academy and 2 would be for the new stadium...... Brandon to me looks like a potential area which would cater comfortably with a new training and academy set up, with a potential second site identified as well i get the feeling this will be the new site of the training ground rather than the new home..... The problem i have is what its replacing, where would the Bees go......
ericagradus
Member
It is not clear from the Cov Tel article what the position the real position is. Has SISU agreed a 'gentlemans' agreement to purchase the site. If so, very unusual to announce a deal before it has been exchanged. Although we know that the timing of the announcement ties in perfectly with the ACL meeting, or does SISU have a call option. This would be a contract to purchase the land and is legally binding. It could potentially be conditional on planning.
If it was the latter, would be easier for us fans to get a stear of just how strong SISU's intentions to develop the site are.
If it was the latter, would be easier for us fans to get a stear of just how strong SISU's intentions to develop the site are.
GaryPendrysEyes
Well-Known Member
Sisu's only aim is to bury their skeletons (via the CVA) quickly and to get the Ricoh on the cheap.
Coventry fans, Northampton FC, Brandon property bods and residents just collateral damage to be messed about in that game.
Sisu dont have the money for this, would never get permission (given the Ricoh is there), it's just a game.
Sisu are a failed, unethical business and not fit a proper business to run a football club or to own any share in a key Coventry asset.
Coventry fans, Northampton FC, Brandon property bods and residents just collateral damage to be messed about in that game.
Sisu dont have the money for this, would never get permission (given the Ricoh is there), it's just a game.
Sisu are a failed, unethical business and not fit a proper business to run a football club or to own any share in a key Coventry asset.
grego_gee
New Member
Les Reid has tweeted
"@skybluestalk No. Telegraph hasn't reported Brandon a done deal. Pls post my article on SBT so people can read what it says"
so here it is
Sky Blues agree deal to buy Brandon speedway site - but keep options open
25 Jul 2013 06:45Club strikes provisional deal for Brandon while becoming preferred buyer for mystery site just outside Coventry
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Brandon speedway site
Coventry City FC have secured a provisional deal to buy the Brandon speedway site to build a new stadium.
The site has been sold to the Sky Blues subject to contract.
The club has also become the preferred buyer for a second mystery site just outside the Coventry boundary – which could become their chosen stadium site.
A formal announcement confirming the Sky Blues have entered exclusive negotiations on the unnamed site is expected tomorrow from Birmingham-based property consultants CBRE.
More news is also anticipated next week of the controversial sale of the 26-acre Brandon Stadium site – home of the Coventry Bees and a venue for greyhound racing.
Bees owner Mick Horton has stated he recently signed a four-year deal to use Brandon for speedway .
Others claim there would be major problems with road infrastructure to support a football stadium around the site in Rugby Road, Brandon.
Any potential sale of Brandon stadium by owner Avtar Sandhu might also be affected by a legal wrangle with HM Revenue and Customs.
Andrew Moss, of Birmingham-based GVA property agents, refused to confirm the provisional sale agreed was with Coventry City.
But he told the Telegraph: “A sale has now been agreed subject to legals with a single party.
“The vendor has accepted a bid subject to contract, and the site is under offer to a party.”
He said a heads of terms agreement was being finalised, and the sale could be completed by the end of September.
The club has also entered exclusive “due diligence” talks with the owner of the second site – as it wants to keep its options open.
Packed Brandon crowd
Many fans, and anti-Sisu Coventry MP Bob Ainsworth, have questioned whether the club have any genuine intention of building a new stadium , accusing them of playing hard-ball to obtain control of the part-council-owned Ricoh Arena.
Those allegations are denied by the club.
It comes a day after we revealed the club’s owners Sisu/Otium had agreed to last-ditch talks with Arena Coventry Limited over staying at the Ricoh Arena , rather than playing ‘home’ matches at Northampton Town until the new stadium is built.
While any potential agreement for a return to the Ricoh a long way off, CBRE is expected to release further details confirming movement of the unnamed site, and the appointment of a team of architects, highway consultants and planning consultants.
However, any sale of the Brandon site could also face problems.
HMRC said in November that the Brandon Stadium was a frozen asset and could not be sold following the conviction for money laundering by gambler Jatinder Singh Batth – also known as Micky Singh – who it claims owns half of the £1million venue.
However, Avtar Sandhu insists he is the legal and rightful owner.
Brandon’s sellers expect the HMRC issues to be resolved during a two-month “due diligence” period.
The club would hope to secure planning permission from the relevant district council in Warwickshire for the eventual site it would pick. The government could also have the final say if secretary of state Eric Pickles calls in the application, or calls a public inquiry.
The second site remains a mystery, although many fans have speculated over the former Peugeot factory site at the A45 Ryton, which is close to the Sky Blues training ground.
But Chris Hall, director of Trenport Investments, said yesterday there had been no approach by the club.
Neither has there been any club approach for Ansty Park, said Steve Holland, of the Homes and Communities Agency – the former Advantage West Midlands site which has long been earmarked for up to 10,000 advanced manufacturing jobs.
imp:
"@skybluestalk No. Telegraph hasn't reported Brandon a done deal. Pls post my article on SBT so people can read what it says"
so here it is
Sky Blues agree deal to buy Brandon speedway site - but keep options open
25 Jul 2013 06:45Club strikes provisional deal for Brandon while becoming preferred buyer for mystery site just outside Coventry
Share on printShare on email
Coventry City FC have secured a provisional deal to buy the Brandon speedway site to build a new stadium.
The site has been sold to the Sky Blues subject to contract.
The club has also become the preferred buyer for a second mystery site just outside the Coventry boundary – which could become their chosen stadium site.
A formal announcement confirming the Sky Blues have entered exclusive negotiations on the unnamed site is expected tomorrow from Birmingham-based property consultants CBRE.
More news is also anticipated next week of the controversial sale of the 26-acre Brandon Stadium site – home of the Coventry Bees and a venue for greyhound racing.
Bees owner Mick Horton has stated he recently signed a four-year deal to use Brandon for speedway .
Others claim there would be major problems with road infrastructure to support a football stadium around the site in Rugby Road, Brandon.
Any potential sale of Brandon stadium by owner Avtar Sandhu might also be affected by a legal wrangle with HM Revenue and Customs.
Andrew Moss, of Birmingham-based GVA property agents, refused to confirm the provisional sale agreed was with Coventry City.
But he told the Telegraph: “A sale has now been agreed subject to legals with a single party.
“The vendor has accepted a bid subject to contract, and the site is under offer to a party.”
He said a heads of terms agreement was being finalised, and the sale could be completed by the end of September.
The club has also entered exclusive “due diligence” talks with the owner of the second site – as it wants to keep its options open.
Jeff Davies
The Telegraph understands Sky Blues directors and owners Sisu/Otium intend to give fans a say in a consultation exercise about the new stadium.Many fans, and anti-Sisu Coventry MP Bob Ainsworth, have questioned whether the club have any genuine intention of building a new stadium , accusing them of playing hard-ball to obtain control of the part-council-owned Ricoh Arena.
Those allegations are denied by the club.
It comes a day after we revealed the club’s owners Sisu/Otium had agreed to last-ditch talks with Arena Coventry Limited over staying at the Ricoh Arena , rather than playing ‘home’ matches at Northampton Town until the new stadium is built.
While any potential agreement for a return to the Ricoh a long way off, CBRE is expected to release further details confirming movement of the unnamed site, and the appointment of a team of architects, highway consultants and planning consultants.
However, any sale of the Brandon site could also face problems.
HMRC said in November that the Brandon Stadium was a frozen asset and could not be sold following the conviction for money laundering by gambler Jatinder Singh Batth – also known as Micky Singh – who it claims owns half of the £1million venue.
However, Avtar Sandhu insists he is the legal and rightful owner.
Brandon’s sellers expect the HMRC issues to be resolved during a two-month “due diligence” period.
The club would hope to secure planning permission from the relevant district council in Warwickshire for the eventual site it would pick. The government could also have the final say if secretary of state Eric Pickles calls in the application, or calls a public inquiry.
The second site remains a mystery, although many fans have speculated over the former Peugeot factory site at the A45 Ryton, which is close to the Sky Blues training ground.
But Chris Hall, director of Trenport Investments, said yesterday there had been no approach by the club.
Neither has there been any club approach for Ansty Park, said Steve Holland, of the Homes and Communities Agency – the former Advantage West Midlands site which has long been earmarked for up to 10,000 advanced manufacturing jobs.
imp:ericagradus
Member
Having re read the article in full. This announcement is a joke. So SISU have agreed terms with Brandon. That means nothing. This is purely publicity for today's meeting. For all we know it could be a highly inflated bit, that SISU have no intention of progressing. As nothing is legally binding until contracts are exchange.
It looks like on the other site, that they are looking to agree an exclusivity agreement. These are when heads are agreed and confirm that pending exchange of contracts, that the seller will not enter into any negotiations with any other parties, but again, if SISU do not progress to exchange of contracts, it expires and we are where we started.
This, this and this.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
As in agree a heads of terms then walk away? ...............
All true.
But supposing no deal can be agreed to keep the club at RA for the long term, and suppose sisu actually goes on to buy this (or any other) site.
Then at some point in the future there will be a new 'reality' where other agenda's will gain priority. Just think for a second about the potential job creation. It will require thousands of labor years and I think a few politicians would welcome that.
And a lot of money is involved - I would expect a lot of people and businesses would be attracted by the potential to make a nice profit. Their influence cannot be underestimated.
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Just out of interest what is the legal status of "CCFC" or the "Club" or "Coventry City FC" ?
The entities that could/would secure anything contract wise are CCFC H, Otium, SBS&L, Sconset Capital or SISU or a new company
The entities that could/would secure anything contract wise are CCFC H, Otium, SBS&L, Sconset Capital or SISU or a new company
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jaytskyblue
New Member
More nonsense from Sisu. They really are one of the most unprofessional and unethical businesses you could come across.
How could anyone trust them with the Ricoh.
How could anyone trust them with the Ricoh.
J
Jack Griffin
Guest
Its not like they've done that before? Hold on wait a minute :thinking about:
grego_gee
New Member
Although I agree that this might be highly tactical, the article does say
"The site has been sold to the Sky Blues subject to contract."
Which suggests more than just bluster!
I believe CCFC will seriously look at any last minute deal for the Ricoh that is offered but they want to "OWN" their own stadium, be it the Ricoh or an alternative.
So far CCC/ACL have not been prepared to seriously offer any ownership of the Ricoh.
If CCC/ACL don't believe that CCFC will leave they think they can impose whatever terms they like (some might call that bullying).
CCFC need CCC/ACL to believe that they will leave so that a realistic and mutually acceptable deal can be discussed.
imp:
covcity4life
Well-Known Member
yeh the ricoh should be the clubs not the councils.
ericagradus
Member
Although I agree that this might be highly tactical, the article does say
"The site has been sold to the Sky Blues subject to contract."
Which suggests more than just bluster!
I believe CCFC will seriously look at any last minute deal for the Ricoh that is offered but they want to "OWN" their own stadium, be it the Ricoh or an alternative.
So far CCC/ACL have not been prepared to seriously offer any ownership of the Ricoh.
If CCC/ACL don't believe that CCFC will leave they think they can impose whatever terms they like (some might call that bullying).
CCFC need CCC/ACL to believe that they will leave so that a realistic and mutually acceptable deal can be discussed.
Site has been sold subject to contract, is the same as...
I have made an offer on your house, you have accepted. So it is sold subject to us exchanging contracts. In English property law, this means nothing, as nothing is legally binding until exchange and any party can walk away
I would have thought SISU will struggle to get this through planning. After all nowaday's you have to have a Green plan around things like Transport to and from the site. All the Government will say is 'it's got to be at least as good as the Ricoh's' to get approval. Essentially it's already dead.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
As I say buying this lands means nothing it will hold its value or increase in value.
Without finding 30 million to build a new stadium.
It is part of the plan to get the Ricoh as is the Northampton move.
There are options to stay at the Ricoh but it really does not suit SISU to do it.
Unless they get the Higgs charity's share and or the councils for next to nothing.
Without finding 30 million to build a new stadium.
It is part of the plan to get the Ricoh as is the Northampton move.
There are options to stay at the Ricoh but it really does not suit SISU to do it.
Unless they get the Higgs charity's share and or the councils for next to nothing.
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dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
Yeh the club should buy it you are right
All valid and excellent points.
It certainly doesn't fit in with Fisher's "self-financing Brentford model master-plan" as the site isn't big enough. Smacks of bullshit and desperation to me.
Regarding the road costs, there is also the cost of acquiring the land and access to the A46. It would involve a ransom strip and this would also add many more millions to the cost, even if the Highways Agency were mad enough to allow it.
The project will struggle to get financial backing, never mind planning consent. All it will do is blight the houses in Binley Woods for the next few years.
True Sky Blue, so you would happily watch football from behind a speedway track then?
The speedway stadium is officially in Brandon and not Binley Woods. I can tell anyone, the local opposition would be 100%.
As a few have said, another tactical move from Sisu.
And of course, what happens to the Bees? Years of speedway history on that site, Boocock & co. Not going to happen.
The speedway stadium is officially in Brandon and not Binley Woods. I can tell anyone, the local opposition would be 100%.
As a few have said, another tactical move from Sisu.
And of course, what happens to the Bees? Years of speedway history on that site, Boocock & co. Not going to happen.