simple_simon
New Member
OSB58
What do you think will happen now?
What do you think will happen now?
ACL Statement (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter SlowerThanPlatt
- Start date
CarpyCov84
New Member
Great post oldskyblue
deanocity3
New Member
As I said earlier Sisu knew exactly what they were doing when they moved every thing from LTD to holdings and never told FL
CarpyCov84
New Member
Surely this is fraud ??? Creditors will have lost out on a lot of money and the football league couldn't of known about this as their administrator hasn't done his job property as this would of came up ??? Old sky blue do you think the football league will now have to take action of this it's gonna end up a mess on their hands also now ???
GaryPendrysEyes
Well-Known Member
Thanks very interesting.
The question is how to get a response from any of these parties.
Who would be taken to court?
Why can't The Telegraph put these questions to Appleton. Alun Thorne, Les Reid are you out here?
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Think there will be more legal cases on both sides...... I wouldn't want to be the auditors signing off accounts on that basis..... The Football League could be under intense scrutiny of their governance...... if accounts not filed for the SBS&L group of companies then embargo stays (can the auditors sign off if share ownership disputed ? )
The team will struggle ...... they are good young lads but they need depth in the squad and some experience..... CCFC will play at Sixfields it is not certain they will come back to the Ricoh despite what some say
The lawyers will make thousands ....... the media will continue to put out mistake ridden articles..... folk here will continue to bicker and spin (some with ridiculous claims of knowing).....
The fans continue to suffer..
( I hate writing all that but I do not see much that is positive in all this
)CarpyCov84
New Member
I would say les Reid etc would be onto this come Mondays papers
cloughie
Well-Known Member
Thick beyond belief
lordsummerisle
Well-Known Member
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
cant and wont make such allegations because i have no evidence, but you could look at it that way. Only a court can judge however. The Football League could end up with bigger problems than CCFC
skybluehugh
New Member
Kid, don't bite. No matter what statement was put out the fans of our owners would slag it off. they do not want true debate because when their arguments are challenged they just do not stand up and so they resort to name calling just to stifle any threads that show they are wrong rather than try and win the debate with proof of why their views are right.
CarpyCov84
New Member
I think had administrator Paul Appleton done his job properly this would of came up sooner and we would of had a different outcome it's obvious what's gone on and who's done what...the football league employs Paul Appleton...
I think his days are numbered !!!
I think his days are numbered !!!
Snozz_is_god
New Member
Great write up osb58, about sums it all up.
I believe when ACL applied to the High Court to put CCFC Ltd into administration in March, 2013, they did so fully believing the players a registrations, golden share and lease were all in CCFCLtd.
The shifting of the players assets for me is the key piece of information we have never been told about, the football league don't want to answer this question, neither do the football club or the administrator. What are they hiding?
I think this it's the key bringing SISU down and I think the football leagues silence suggest to me negligence.
I believe when ACL applied to the High Court to put CCFC Ltd into administration in March, 2013, they did so fully believing the players a registrations, golden share and lease were all in CCFCLtd.
The shifting of the players assets for me is the key piece of information we have never been told about, the football league don't want to answer this question, neither do the football club or the administrator. What are they hiding?
I think this it's the key bringing SISU down and I think the football leagues silence suggest to me negligence.
skybluehugh
New Member
Could you please expand on this because that is not how I read it. And no I'm not reading it through ACL tinted glasses
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Could be the companies in the SBS&L group, its directors or shadow directors, the owners, the football league to name a few that could end up in court facing ACL
This whole thing is not going away ..... hopefully the football season will distract us fans
skybluehugh
New Member
Revaluation, this was NOT aimed at you but at all the other people who try to sniffle people's views on our owners that do not agree with them. And I think SBK would accept that he can have a tendency to allow them to get o him. As I do no certain days.
TrakiaPlovdiv
New Member
Hang on a minute........Why is Joy there at the meeting.........She is neither a Director of CCFC Ltd or CCFC (Holdings Ltd) so should have no right to make any type of threat or contribution at any meeting!
I must be missing something because I thought it was a breach of Football League Rules for any 'Third Party Ownership'.
???????????????????????????????????????
I must be missing something because I thought it was a breach of Football League Rules for any 'Third Party Ownership'.
???????????????????????????????????????
Snozz_is_god
New Member
[h=1]http://www.sfo.gov.uk/fraud/what-is-fraud/corporate-fraud/asset-stripping.aspx
Asset stripping[/h] What is asset stripping?
Asset stripping is taking company funds or assets of value while leaving behind the debts.
Company directors transfer only the assets of one company to another and not the liabilities. The result is a dormant company with large liabilities that cannot be met and it has to be put into liquidation
Stripping of company assets is normally done for two main reasons:
Asset stripping[/h] What is asset stripping?
Asset stripping is taking company funds or assets of value while leaving behind the debts.
Company directors transfer only the assets of one company to another and not the liabilities. The result is a dormant company with large liabilities that cannot be met and it has to be put into liquidation
Stripping of company assets is normally done for two main reasons:
- The fraudsters deliberately target a company or companies to take ownership, move the assets and then put the stripped entity into liquidation
- "Phoenixing" - directors move assets from one limited company to another to 'secure' the benefits of their business and avoid the liabilities. Most or all the directors will usually be the same in both companies. This usually arises as a way of 'rescuing' the assets of a failing business rather than targeting a company
Johnnythespider
Well-Known Member
Do you remember back in march when acl filed for admin and sisu got in first, pwkh said at the time that this would have serious ramifications, well i think it's just started. IMO this is going to be much bigger than just ccfc, this is going to affect all football in this country and to be honest it is long overdue. I think we can expect to see parliament getting involved in this, how nice would it be to see the F.L chairman squirming in front of a parliamentary committee.
Snozz_is_god
New Member
If if if if SISU moved the players from CCFCLtd to CCFCHolding, deliberately to put CCFCLtd into administration, to get rid of debts & the Ricoh lease, then it's asset stripping and fraud
skybluehugh
New Member
I agree especially with the 2nd para. When ACL caught SISU out by going for administration, they had to move much faster than they planned and rushed us into admin themselves, so they had control over the Administrator selection. Because they new about the split of players and GS. And they have been caught out by ACL not signing the CVA, after weeks of threats of, and finally having to do it to after all their bluster, moving us to Northampton. If ACL had signed the CVA then none of this would have been revealed, which is what sisu was after in the first place so it has blown up in their faces.
Snozz_is_god
New Member
If this is what happening and I use the word if, it's asset stripping and is fraudulent (notice the word if, it's only my thoughts, I'm not accusing anyone)
But how can we make the authorities, sit up, take notice and investigate this.
But how can we make the authorities, sit up, take notice and investigate this.
Say for example - The football league,in the last say 12 months or so had failed to spot a slight oversight in which company was going to be running the team competing in their leaugue.
Would they be willing to admit their mistake? or would they be inclined to go with "they've got us this time but we'll keep a close eye on them" type attitude?
Would they be willing to admit their mistake? or would they be inclined to go with "they've got us this time but we'll keep a close eye on them" type attitude?
skybluehugh
New Member
That is a well spotted flaw in all this. Why was she there but more important is why did ACL allow her to be? And why is it only coming out now? First time I have questioned any of ACL's dicision.
duffer
Well-Known Member
I don't think it's third-party ownership - but it's even more evidence that she's a 'shadow director'. HMRC definition, below.
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/insmanual/ins44133.htm
"It should be remembered that acting as a shadow director is not an offence in itself (unless the person is an undischarged bankrupt or disqualified from being a director INS44147). But the existence of a shadow director is a risk indicator. It raises the suspicion that the shadow director is attempting to conceal something by managing the company but not being listed as one of its directors."
The real significance of this (imho) is her possible personal liabilty for anything that might have been done whilst she's been in this role. Like, for example, below value transfer of assets.
Snozz_is_god
New Member
EXACTLY and probably why Richard Keys was on about ACL having out maneuvered SISU. oh god I hope so, please be true
Bennets Afro
Well-Known Member
Maybe ACL have some backers who will fund the legal costs if it gets rid of SISU
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Was a great post clarifying a few things (again) somewhat. One additional question it raises for me is since GH & JE were present - why have they not done or said anything about all this? Another is who exactly will take legal action about this???
If it is shown there was any wrongdoing...would it be a case of: GH & JE are possibly implicated by association & I guess would want no part in it; The FL could be implicated by negligent practices; Auditors for at some point (I'm guessing) signing off incorrect accounts; Owners of CCFC Ltd &/or Holdings for some sort of fraud maybe; PA for trying to hide it &/or cheating so to speak in his administration duties...thus leaving everyone (except the fans) involved taking a sharp intake of breath, stop their slanging matches, shutting-up...& finally sweeping the whole sorry mess under the carpet?
This might be a case of ACL yet playing a few trump cards & saving the day (& themselves) - they appear to be the only ones left with nothing to lose.
skybluehugh
New Member
Agreed, ACL have already had to lay a small fortune on fighting them. Wonder if that is why they said about City fans asking more questions on certain points. Hope not.
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Or maybe PH4 mtgs there were discussions about him supporting them if they can convince his legal team that the case is pretty water-tight?
SydneySkyBlue
Member
Only just seen this statement. VERY interesting:
"It is interesting to note Mr Fisher’s failure to mention Ms Seppala’s verbal statement during this meeting, made in the presence of her own lawyers that the only circumstance in which the Club would return to the Ricoh would be upon SISU assuming full ownership of the venue without any negotiation on purchase price.
"Ms Seppala also stated at this meeting her intention to continue to threaten ACL and its shareholders with expensive litigation at every possible opportunity. Perhaps the fact that Mr Fisher was not himself present at this meeting has distorted his view of what was really discussed."
As if we needed further proof of this evil bitch's crazy plans.
"It is interesting to note Mr Fisher’s failure to mention Ms Seppala’s verbal statement during this meeting, made in the presence of her own lawyers that the only circumstance in which the Club would return to the Ricoh would be upon SISU assuming full ownership of the venue without any negotiation on purchase price.
"Ms Seppala also stated at this meeting her intention to continue to threaten ACL and its shareholders with expensive litigation at every possible opportunity. Perhaps the fact that Mr Fisher was not himself present at this meeting has distorted his view of what was really discussed."
As if we needed further proof of this evil bitch's crazy plans.
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
In fairness - PWKH statements cannot be taken as proof. They are statements to be either believed or not, disputed or not, proven or not.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
That bit was specifically denied by Labovich too.
Doesn't make Labovich right either of course, but once again it's one group's word against another's.
SydneySkyBlue
Member
No smoke without fire - it's very likely she said something close to that.
Past court documents suggesting she is a liar and, frankly, heading up an asset stripping venture capitalist itself, makes it all seem very plausible.
Let's face it. You'd have to be a cold hearted bitch to disregard the feelings of tens of thousands for your own benefit and to spite others.
It's a no brainier.
Past court documents suggesting she is a liar and, frankly, heading up an asset stripping venture capitalist itself, makes it all seem very plausible.
Let's face it. You'd have to be a cold hearted bitch to disregard the feelings of tens of thousands for your own benefit and to spite others.
It's a no brainier.