Coventry City boss admits 'errors' after leak of confidential players' documents (1 Viewer)

[Deleted member 5849]

It's probably all part of a scientific experiment to see how far credibility can be stretched before it finally breaks........

tbf, none of us knew/cared about Ltd. or (Holdings) until recently. I'd suspect as long as other clubs got their money and had a contract, they weren't overwhelmingly bothered about the intricacies of the company setup either.

 

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[ajsccfc]

How can so many parties involved in this come forward and just say 'oops' with seemingly no fallout? What the fuck are any of these people playing at?

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

But is it a smoking gun?
Or is the headline of the article a little mis-leading.
The statement from Fisher is almost word-for-word the same he used at the fans forums - at least as I recall it.

Are you honestly telling me the words in the programme notes are not inaccurate within the context of these documents?

 

[Godiva]

Are you honestly telling me the words in the programme notes are not inaccurate within the context of these documents?

I don't have the program at hand. Can you post a link please?

 

[kmj5000]

Oh dear Tim, you've been found out again and, I suspect, there are more revelations to come?

I raised this very point in respect of the accounts you signed, with all the player registrations in CCFC Ltd, at the fan's forum, and you passed the question over to your sidekick who, in turn, blamed the auditors.

It seems that the truth is finally coming out and, having made such categoric statements that have turned out to be untrue ( and not fot the first, or even, the second time), you must be a worried man.

I think you will be having a few sleepless nights eh Tim?

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

I don't have the program at hand. Can you post a link please?

I'll help you with the specific quote I'm interested in your thought on:

"The Football League, finally confirmed last week that they have been registering players in 'Holdings' rather than 'Ltd' and as we have maintained for months, this has been going on since way before SISU took over."

What's that then? Bearing in mind the recent nature of its scribe?

 

[longjohnskyblue]

tbf, none of us knew/cared about Ltd. or (Holdings) until recently. I'd suspect as long as other clubs got their money and had a contract, they weren't overwhelmingly bothered about the intricacies of the company setup either.

If the club bought the player from the wrong person (ie not the club) they would have done exactly what west ham did with Tevez! You honestly think any club would risk such penalties simply because they didn't check? My god talk about clutching at straws!

Sisu have been caught out. If the case for the league rubber stamping sisu was thin before it is wafer thin / transparent now! The administration process MUST start again, this time don't let sisu squirm off the hook

 

[shmmeee]

tbf, none of us knew/cared about Ltd. or (Holdings) until recently. I'd suspect as long as other clubs got their money and had a contract, they weren't overwhelmingly bothered about the intricacies of the company setup either.

To be fairer. The maker of the claim is Fisher and the burden of proof is on him. So far we've seen nothing to corroborate his story, but plenty in defence.

If this was a scientific battle, it'd be ID vs evolution.

 

[Astute]

OK dock us more points, thanks ACL

And this proves that whatever SISU do.......even when there is 100% proof....... some people will blame ACL whatever. Then some people wonder why posters accuse others of being Fishy Fisher, Joy or something to do with SISU.

 

[Godiva]

I'll help you with the specific quote I'm interested in your thought on:

"The Football League, finally confirmed last week that they have been registering players in 'Holdings' rather than 'Ltd' and as we have maintained for months, this has been going on since way before SISU took over."

What's that then? Bearing in mind the recent nature of its scribe?

I am confused now ... that is exactly what Fisher has said all along. FL admitting this is their error actually suppoted sisu's case in the administration proces. That error is why nobody but sisu would buy Limited. Without the players Limited was worthless.

Or what have I missed????

 

[Deleted member 5849]

To be fairer. The maker of the claim is Fisher and the burden of proof is on him. So far we've seen nothing to corroborate his story, but plenty in defence.

If this was a scientific battle, it'd be ID vs evolution.

To be fairer still, I was responding to the point "that well respected clubs didnt have a clue which company they were dealing with", which doesn't seem beyond the realms of possibility to me.

I could have added a percentage breakdon of the other probabilities (with correlating fairness) but then it'd get a little over-wordy, a little less than succinct, and probably end up with me having a rant about Ranson.

 

[blueflint]

I am confused now ... that is exactly what Fisher has said all along. FL admitting this is their error actually suppoted sisu's case in the administration proces. That error is why nobody but sisu would buy Limited. Without the players Limited was worthless.

Or what have I missed????

players registered with ltd m8 read the article

 

[DazzleTommyDazzle]

tbf, none of us knew/cared about Ltd. or (Holdings) until recently. I'd suspect as long as other clubs got their money and had a contract, they weren't overwhelmingly bothered about the intricacies of the company setup either.

True but it became very relevant when TF announced that Ltd was not, as everyone - in particular ACL - has believed, a trading company but was in fact a non-trading property owning subsidiary.

This despite the fact that he himself had signed Ltd's accounts only 9 (?) months previously showing that it was very much a trading company and not noting any change to this fact in the Directors' Report.

I have to say that if a creditor of mine had done the same, my first call would have been to the most aggressive lawyers I could find, with instructions to take action against the company and the Directors.

I have wondered if the reason that ACL rejected the CVA might be to keep the option of such action open. I guess that time will tell.

 

[Godiva]

I could have added a percentage breakdon of the other probabilities (with correlating fairness) but then it'd get a little over-wordy, a little less than succinct, and probably end up with me having a rant about Ranson.

Yes, minister ....

 

[shmmeee]

To be fairer still, I was responding to the point "that well respected clubs didnt have a clue which company they were dealing with", which doesn't seem beyond the realms of possibility to me.

I could have added a percentage breakdon of the other probabilities (with correlating fairness) but then it'd get a little over-wordy, a little less than succinct, and probably end up with me having a rant about Ranson.

My point being (badly made) that there is only "confusion" by any party because Fisher says there is.

I'm yet to see any evidence other than proving what ACL state.

 

[Godiva]

players registered with ltd m8 read the article

Yes - Fisher have said that FL had the players registered in Holdings and the club had till he started clearing the mess the players registered in Limited.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

True but it became very relevant when TF announced that Ltd was not, as everyone - in particular ACL - has believed, a trading company but was in fact a non-trading property owning subsidiary.

Indeed, not denying that.

I would however be very surprised if, having effectively started/gone along with this process themselves (the option was there for them to bail after all, or even wind the club up straight away) they hadn't checked and re-checked that they were on solid legal ground.

No doubt we shall find out...

 

[DazzleTommyDazzle]

Indeed, not denying that.

I would however be very surprised if, having effectively started/gone along with this process themselves (the option was there for them to bail after all, or even wind the club up straight away) they hadn't checked and re-checked that they were on solid legal ground.

No doubt we shall find out...

I'd been expecting some movement on this issue and there has been none - so perhaps there will be none.

Time will tell.

 

[Astute]

Yes - Fisher have said that FL had the players registered in Holdings and the club had till he started clearing the mess the players registered in Limited.

But the problem is that players were removed from LTD.....then LTD was put into admin, leaving nothing but debts and a legal contract they wanted out of. It doesn't matter which side of the fence you sit on. You have to admit that it looks suspicious.

 

[Godiva]

But the problem is that players were removed from LTD.....then LTD was put into admin, leaving nothing but debts and a legal contract they wanted out of. It doesn't matter which side of the fence you sit on. You have to admit that it looks suspicious.

Oh, I have already said a few times that isolating the lease can easily have been the main priority - and that if I was in charge, I would have done the same. The club need to own all income streams from the stadium. Be it owning ACL or a brand new stadium - the club MUST own all income streams.

 

[Astute]

Oh, I have already said a few times that isolating the lease can easily have been the main priority - and that if I was in charge, I would have done the same. The club need to own all income streams from the stadium. Be it owning ACL or a brand new stadium - the club MUST own all income streams.

Nobody should disagree with this. The major problem is the way they have gone about it. I try my best to stay within the law. I pay my taxes. I pay my debts. I can't back someone who don't pay their taxes or their debts.

 

[RPHunt]

But the problem is that players were removed from LTD.....then LTD was put into admin, leaving nothing but debts and a legal contract they wanted out of. It doesn't matter which side of the fence you sit on. You have to admit that it looks suspicious.

Suspicious and illegal.

 

[RegTheDonk]

I thought Appleton had done a thorough investigation...this clown couldn't find a document if it was couriered to him with a bunny girl and a marching band.

Has he been paid yet? His fee should be withheld.

 

[DazzleTommyDazzle]

I thought Appleton had done a thorough investigation...this clown couldn't find a document if it was couriered to him with a bunny girl and a marching band.
.

Just in case you ever have to send me a document, you needn't worry about the marching band

 

[chiefdave]

So at the forums it was all about the accounts being in a mess, now all the admin is in a mess as well. Even if this was all pre-Fisher this all happened under SISU. I find it hard to believe that everyone else is wrong and Fisher is right. What we need to know from the FL is when players changed from being registered with Ltd and started being registered in Holdings. My guess would be that will be in the last couple of years and would indicate that it is Fisher who has made the mess, at best you would say incompetence at worst you would say some type of fraud, moving the players without any real consent or anyone elses knowledge to suit their aims.

As has been said Fisher talks a lot about documents he has that prove he is right but we never get to see them.

Wonder where the leak is coming from, if it's someone no longer connected with the club why did they feel the need to keep a copy of all these documents if they didn't suspect something dodgy was going on?

 

[longjohnskyblue]

Oh, I have already said a few times that isolating the lease can easily have been the main priority - and that if I was in charge, I would have done the same. The club need to own all income streams from the stadium. Be it owning ACL or a brand new stadium - the club MUST own all income streams.

But can't you understand - they cannot be allowed to achieve it by fraud! How are you not getting this?

SISU's Actions could be considered fraudulent in a court of law! How can you possibly defend these people?

 

[Samo]

I thought Appleton had done a thorough investigation...this clown couldn't find a document if it was couriered to him with a bunny girl and a marching band.

Has he been paid yet? His fee should be withheld.

He can find them alright... but is he looking?

 

[chiefdave]

Another thought, if everything was in such a mess why did Fisher keep claiming everything was in Holdings with such conviction? If we believe his statement about the state of the accounts and administration then surely any statement regarding player registrations would need to have a caveat that it may not be correct due to the mess everything is in.

 

[italiahorse]

OK dock us more points, thanks ACL

NO. Redo the whole process with players in Ltd and Sisu will be gone

 

[Godiva]

So at the forums it was all about the accounts being in a mess, now all the admin is in a mess as well. Even if this was all pre-Fisher this all happened under SISU. I find it hard to believe that everyone else is wrong and Fisher is right. What we need to know from the FL is when players changed from being registered with Ltd and started being registered in Holdings. My guess would be that will be in the last couple of years and would indicate that it is Fisher who has made the mess, at best you would say incompetence at worst you would say some type of fraud, moving the players without any real consent or anyone elses knowledge to suit their aims.

As has been said Fisher talks a lot about documents he has that prove he is right but we never get to see them.

Wonder where the leak is coming from, if it's someone no longer connected with the club why did they feel the need to keep a copy of all these documents if they didn't suspect something dodgy was going on?

But that's just it - the players were since 1995 or thereabout registered to Holdings according to FL archives, but until 2012 registered in Limited according to clubs accounts. So the indication is that Fisher is cleaning up the administrative mess (while at the same time isolating the lease and get in a position to break it).

The leak is most likely a former director ... Elliott? Hoffman? Clarke? Who knows - and I wish he will keep them coming!

 

[Grendel]

This is a disgrace. I suggest someone organises a picnic outside the football league.

Ill bring the hamper.

 

[duffer]

Another thought, if everything was in such a mess why did Fisher keep claiming everything was in Holdings with such conviction? If we believe his statement about the state of the accounts and administration then surely any statement regarding player registrations would need to have a caveat that it may not be correct due to the mess everything is in.

Excellent point. Everything is in a terrible mess apart from the bits that suit SISU which are all in perfect order! How convenient.

 

[Godiva]

NO. Redo the whole process with players in Ltd and Sisu will be gone

I can't see any grounds for starting the process over.
Nothing that have come to public knowledge show any illegal actions.
But it will be interesting to hear Appeltons final statement.

 

[italiahorse]

Fancy, not posting responses instantly.

Hang him now!

Wait ................ the Maginot line is out.
SISU defences in place.

We all must agree this needs checking out.

 

[italiahorse]

This is a disgrace. I suggest someone organises a picnic outside the football league.

Ill bring the hamper.

...... and I bet thats for one !!!