ACL independently strong (3 Viewers)

[blueflint]

If ACL now has a business case strong enough to run the venue without ccfc - and in a way that ccfc may still return - then the offer should be 'come back, no rent to be paid, have ACL's share of F/B and only pay the pure matchday costs and pitch maintenance'.
CCC should join in and offer the freehold for the actual costs CCC have had on the Ricoh.

dont be stupid

 

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[Godiva]

dont be stupid

Why? That's my trademark.

 

[blueflint]

That is pretty much it isn't it? With a few beloved's in there.

come on nick its nothing like that SISU took us away not anybody else

 

[blueflint]

Why? That's my trademark.

can't argue with that why should they get it rent free a fair rent for the league were in getting more with each promotion then see what happens

 

[shmmeee]

I have absolute no idea, but the figure they gave us in the q and a suggest around 11-12% profit.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse and spelling or grammar errors

Oh I know, was just expressing incredulity.

 

[stupot07]

Oh I know, was just expressing incredulity.

I can only assume compass are getting paid a hefty management fee.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse and spelling or grammar errors

 

[dongonzalos]

As I just said on another thread, CCC say the Ricoh is fine without the club and according the you the "majority" of fans do not want SISU owning the Ricoh, so both should cut their losses. CCC/ACL get on with doing whatever they want at the Ricoh and CCC should grant permission for the Club to build a new stadium within the City, if possible.

To build a stadium is a massive project that has massive impact on the local community. Some positive some negative. They would need to be happy that the negative impacts it has are justifiable and outweighed by the positive ones.

Could the football club use the stadium already there.... Yes
Can they justify the negative impact of building a massive infrastructure, questionable.

Can they trust the business acronym of the company proposing to build the stadium that it will happen and will be a continuing long term success that will justify the negative impacts, questionable.

I think if the council wanted an excuse to say no they have plenty.

Never mind the obvious thought that they don't trust SISU and another stadium reduces the chance of the Ricoh and Coventry City FC getting reunited. Which apart from financial implications is what the council would want

 

[skybluefred]

If ACL now has a business case strong enough to run the venue without ccfc - and in a way that ccfc may still return - then the offer should be 'come back, no rent to be paid, have ACL's share of F/B and only pay the pure matchday costs and pitch maintenance'.
CCC should join in and offer the freehold for the actual costs CCC have had on the Ricoh.

What part of (the FREEHOLD IS NOT FOR SALE) do you not understand ?

 

[CCFCSteve]

Surely the Council can't use personal feelings when it comes to granting permission can they? They can't say no because they don't like them.

Like you say, if ACL is going stronger than with the club then they will be fine without the club and if Lucas' beloved club can come back to Coventry she won't have an issue. Also have to think of the local economy..

Hang on a second Nick, you're talking about people who reneged on a previous agreement with the council (which potentially could have bust acl and cost the council millions...probably the hope). The Ricoh was built for ccfc, the council and higgs bailed out the club when they couldn't afford to finish it but hey, it doesn't suit the current owners so fuck it(excuse the language) lets just allow another one to be built in the area.

They knew what they were letting themselves in for when they bought the club, they could've addressed the issue then if they are such excellent business people.

It only appears to have become an issue when there was a change in strategy at the top. Since then, whatever the actual figures are, significantly improved deals have been put on the table, all rejected. Sisu could come to the table with a sensible rent agreement that would suit the club, they haven't and refuse to. As has been proved numerous times if FFP was the real issue then five years in Northampton is not the answer. We'll be financially crippled by then.

The fact is the city doesn't need another stadium so why agree planning.

Rant over !

 

[TurkeyTrot]

Hang on a second Nick, you're talking about people who reneged on a previous agreement with the council (which potentially could have bust acl and cost the council millions...probably the hope). The Ricoh was built for ccfc, the council and higgs bailed out the club when they couldn't afford to finish it but hey, it doesn't suit the current owners so fuck it(excuse the language) lets just allow another one to be built in the area.

They knew what they were letting themselves in for when they bought the club, they could've addressed the issue then if they are such excellent business people.

It only appears to have become an issue when there was a change in strategy at the top. Since then, whatever the actual figures are, significantly improved deals have been put on the table, all rejected. Sisu could come to the table with a sensible rent agreement that would suit the club, they haven't and refuse to. As has been proved numerous times if FFP was the real issue then five years in Northampton is not the answer. We'll be financially crippled by then.

The fact is the city doesn't need another stadium so why agree planning.

Rant over !

Absolutely spot on Steve, but if SISU/ Otium applied for planning permission to build a new stadium within Coventrys boundaries and they met all the legal requirements then the council couldn't reject planning permission.

 

[dongonzalos]

Absolutely spot on Steve, but if SISU/ Otium applied for planning permission to build a new stadium within Coventrys boundaries and they met all the legal requirements then the council couldn't reject planning permission.

Legal requirements?

Would that include justification for the need for their development over the complaints against it, of which their will be many.

 

[bigfatronssba]

Absolutely spot on Steve, but if SISU/ Otium applied for planning permission to build a new stadium within Coventrys boundaries and they met all the legal requirements then the council couldn't reject planning permission.

All they would have to do is say there is evidence of bats on the site and building work couldn't proceed.

 

[dongonzalos]

All they would have to do is say there is evidence of bats on the site and building work couldn't proceed.

No plans yet, I am sure the telegraph will get round to asking about this soon

 

[No future with SISU]

I think it really depends on the following.

• If the new stadium exists
• Location of it
• Finance agreement (IF we do rent from a sisu company, how much is it and how does it benefit the club?)

In terms of capacity, I think if it was 17000 - 20000 BUT easily expandable if we got promoted it wouldn't be that much of an issue.

I think it really depends on how it benefits the club.

A capacity of 12,000 will cost £20m so a capacity of 20,000 would be around £30m and that is with out the price of the land. If you look at otium accounts they have given the club a loan of £2m and charged £220,000 interest which is about 10%. 10% interest on £20m is £2m and on £30m is £3m, how can city pay that sort of money as they can not pay £1.2 rent.

 

[TurkeyTrot]

All they would have to do is say there is evidence of bats on the site and building work couldn't proceed.

Look how some of the big supermarkets operate. Apply, it gets rejected, appeal, gets rejected, appeal again and again and at some point the local council realise that it's going to cost them millions in court fees so they just grant the application. Councils have an obligation to their council tax payers and don't have a bottomless pit. Lawyers would be all over the council to ensure they don't step out of line and anyone from the council or someone it employs would make sure that were whiter than white. Sorry if it's something folk don't want to hear but that's the way it is. Ask any councillor or ex councillor and they'll tell you. Especially if the applicant has deep pockets.

 

[dongonzalos]

Look how some of the big supermarkets operate. Apply, it gets rejected, appeal, gets rejected, appeal again and again and at some point the local council realise that it's going to cost them millions in court fees so they just grant the application. Councils have an obligation to their council tax payers and don't have a bottomless pit. Lawyers would be all over the council to ensure they don't step out of line and anyone from the council or someone it employs would make sure that were whiter than white. Sorry if it's something folk don't want to hear but that's the way it is. Ask any councillor or ex councillor and they'll tell you. Especially if the applicant has deep pockets.

So why are the proposed sites not in Coventry City Council territory?

 

[TurkeyTrot]

So why are the proposed sites not in Coventry City Council territory?

Guess you'd have to ask SISU that. Maybe nothing suitable. If I was SISU and serious about a new ground I'd be looking at an area with development opportunities, retail outlets etc etc not just a football stadium. Most areas are suitably covered in the City boundaries. Or maybe they don't really have a plan to build a new stadium.

 

[shmmeee]

So why are the proposed sites not in Coventry City Council territory?

To tug on your emotional heart strings, suggest a new ground in a better location that the Ricoh and people might actually back it and not support your bid for the Ricoh. /tinfoilhat

 

[dongonzalos]

Guess you'd have to ask SISU that. Maybe nothing suitable. If I was SISU and serious about a new ground I'd be looking at an area with development opportunities, retail outlets etc etc not just a football stadium. Most areas are suitably covered in the City boundaries. Or maybe they don't really have a plan to build a new stadium.

Yep could be either.
Brandon and Ryton don't seem like ripe pickings to me for such a development

 

[bigfatronssba]

Look how some of the big supermarkets operate. Apply, it gets rejected, appeal, gets rejected, appeal again and again and at some point the local council realise that it's going to cost them millions in court fees so they just grant the application. Councils have an obligation to their council tax payers and don't have a bottomless pit. Lawyers would be all over the council to ensure they don't step out of line and anyone from the council or someone it employs would make sure that were whiter than white. Sorry if it's something folk don't want to hear but that's the way it is. Ask any councillor or ex councillor and they'll tell you. Especially if the applicant has deep pockets.

Big supermarkets are a good example.

The council recently took on Tesco over their new Holyhead Rd store.

Although the store eventually got built, it cost Tesco thousands as planning permission kept being refused. Im not sure where you get this idea from that it costs the council millions?

Anyway, reasons for refusing the site were the building not fitting in with its local surroundings, rare water voles living in the River Sherbourne next to the site, another supermarket having a detrimental affect on existing traders, and extra traffic caused by deliveries.

This meant Tesco had to throw out their old plans and start again. Basically their original application had just been a waste of money.

Im not saying the council could stop it, just that they can make it costly and very difficult if they want to.

 

[Houdi]

If today's revelations are correct.
It seems it maybe true that ACL can survive without CCFC.

Seems like we as fans now have a choice
Do we analyse the maths of our owners decisions and put pressure on them to accept a sliding scale rent at the Ricoh in line with attendances and like for like rents. Including 80% of F&B.

Do we put pressure on ACL to ensure such an unequivocal offer is made directly to Ms Sepalla.

Or do we support our owners decision to have their own stadium in 3-5 years time.

Personally I think financially it is better for CCFC and our owners if they agree a long term rent deal. With the aim of getting the club into the championship play off positions then try to sell the combined package for 60 million.

Hoping someone will pay 60 million for the premiership dream.

Will be interesting to hear S.Linnell's take on this. Whilst I think he has generally been reasonably even handed in this long running saga, he has always seem to take a very sceptical view on ACL's ability to survive without the football club. If PWKH's assertions are true, it will leave SISU's attempt to distress ACL now totally dependent on the JR hearing next month, lose that as seems likely, and ACL will have finally called SISU's bluff.
So if ACL are now running a profitable and growing business, and SISU are running a debt ridden and increasingly loss making business, maybe people should be looking at ACL taking over SISU's business, rather than the other way round.

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Carefull I like your take on this but you may upset a few

 

[Jack Griffin]

So why are the proposed sites not in Coventry City Council territory?

Who knows what is going on, I mean SISU said they were relocating to a ground in the Wast Midlands, then they pitched up in the East Midlands.. I wouldn't read too much into what they say, its what they want that they're acting on & they're keeping their tactics & strategy under wraps.