Was it or wasn't it? (14 Viewers)

[fernandopartridge]

However you dress it up or however you try to deconsruct it an "offer" was made. In any negotiation or dispute the making of any kind of proposal represents an indication of willingness to compromise

Whether such a proposal could be incorporated into the CVA (which it clearly couldnt) or whether Labovitch was "hearing" the offer as a director of Holdings, Otium, Arvo, SISU, SBS&L or anyone else is irrelevant because as Fisher, Seppala and all their acolytes have made abundantly clear, they have no intention or desire to rent and neither do they have any intention or desire to discuss rental terms

ACL can ONLY offer rental / leasehold terms, they do not have it in their gift to do anything else

SISU / Otium / Arvo then as now had / have no intention of reaching compromise otherwise they would have recognised that the "offer" - whatever it's legal status - represented an opening and an opportunity to enter discussions for a resolution.

To question (even rhetorically) whether ACL should continually repeat the "offer" on a regular basis (weekly? monthly? daily?) is absurd

Our owners want the freehold AND the stadium management (ie ACL) business. Neither is much use to them and their investors without the other and it seems very unlikely that SISU / Otium will ever have the funds and / or a willingness to pay what would have to be a proper market valuation, as is required by law, for the Ricoh

Think you're right, I don't buy that "I can't hear the offer cos I haven't got my Otium hat on".....

Then again, I also don't buy that a board member of ACL who also is employed by Coventry City Council can't use any counter offer as a starting point discuss the sale of the freehold, or at least move that process on.

 

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[torchomatic]

Have we ever had a full explanation of the rejection of the cva?

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[Grendel]

Have we ever had a full explanation of the rejection of the cva?

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I'm sure it will be liked whatever it is,

The point overlooked of course is that this action made future relationships almost impossible. Having stitched the club with a ten point reduction sisu were hardly going to be knocking on the door the next day for a rent reduction - it was an action that effectively declared war and the has never been vindicated.

 

[sky blue john]

I'm sure it will be liked whatever it is,

The point overlooked of course is that this action made future relationships almost impossible. Having stitched the club with a ten point reduction sisu were hardly going to be knocking on the door the next day for a rent reduction - it was an action that effectively declared war and the has never been vindicated.

I would have thought going back on hand shake deals, non payment of rent, non payment for academy facilities, JR, liquidation to break lease !!!!
What were all these actions friendly fire ??????
You really are a prize dickhead !!!!!

 

[torchomatic]

I would have thought going back on hand shake deals, non payment of rent, non payment for academy facilities, JR, liquidation to break lease !!!!
What were all these actions friendly fire ??????
You really are a prize dickhead !!!!!

But apart from that?

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[njdlawyer]

Have we ever had a full explanation of the rejection of the cva?

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I guess that after it became apparent that the owners were not interested in discussing rent deals it was the only bargaining tool left in the ACL cupboard, the only way they could force the club / club owners to the negotiating table. As a tactic it failed and rather like the warring parents who use their children as pawns it does no-one any great credit although you can see why, at the time, they did it

 

[njdlawyer]

I'm sure it will be liked whatever it is,

The point overlooked of course is that this action made future relationships almost impossible. Having stitched the club with a ten point reduction sisu were hardly going to be knocking on the door the next day for a rent reduction - it was an action that effectively declared war and the has never been vindicated.

War had been declared by SISU well before that point. To suggest otherwise is to ignore the facts

 

[James Smith]

At least one side are keeping us informed of what is going on, unlike our owners who are still looking at the sites for the new stadium. I really hope that Mr Waggot and the Higgs can sort out the Academy being at the Higgs Centre and as quickly as possible. I guess the best news is there are still talks ongoing about that.

 

[dongonzalos]

I guess that after it became apparent that the owners were not interested in discussing rent deals it was the only bargaining tool left in the ACL cupboard, the only way they could force the club / club owners to the negotiating table. As a tactic it failed and rather like the warring parents who use their children as pawns it does no-one any great credit although you can see why, at the time, they did it

And what did withholding rent and moving the club out of the city, prior to this do.

Generate the slightly warm feeling of a hot scone with afternoon tea on a cold winters day?

 

[torchomatic]

I guess that after it became apparent that the owners were not interested in discussing rent deals it was the only bargaining tool left in the ACL cupboard, the only way they could force the club / club owners to the negotiating table. As a tactic it failed and rather like the warring parents who use their children as pawns it does no-one any great credit although you can see why, at the time, they did it

No I can't see why they did it at the time as there was nothing to gain.

I think even PWKH said he wanted to accept.

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[fernandopartridge]

I would have thought going back on hand shake deals, non payment of rent, non payment for academy facilities, JR, liquidation to break lease !!!!
What were all these actions friendly fire ??????
You really are a prize dickhead !!!!!

The Council went back on a deal to let SISU buy out the ACL mortgage. This is a non disputed fact.

 

[James Smith]

The Council went back on a deal to let SISU buy out the ACL mortgage. This is a non disputed fact.

And also unconfirmed of course by the council.

 

[fernandopartridge]

And also unconfirmed of course by the council.

Not denied and mitigated by their own actions as in the £14m loan (not a bail out).

 

[Astute]

But apart from that?

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Other than being a prize dickhead? Suppose he might be a nice person.

 

[dongonzalos]

Not denied and mitigated by their own actions as in the £14m loan (not a bail out).

Not quite a fact then really ....

 

[fernandopartridge]

Not quite a fact then really ....

Not strictly speaking but on the balance of probabilities yes. Or was the whole story made up?

 

[James Smith]

Not strictly speaking but on the balance of probabilities yes. Or was the whole story made up?

That's the £14m question, I guess we won't know the truth until either the council come out and say it's true or Tim produces the signed deals he claims to have. I'm prepared to give SISU the benefit of the doubt but I really will need to see some evidence before I believe that it's 100% true.

 

[Grendel]

Not quite a fact then really ....

Well no but then again when a certain person posts on here you take it at face value every time don't you? So it fisher posted on here it was a fact would you immediately like his post and accept it as gospel?

 

[Norman Binns]

Well no but then again when a certain person posts on here you take it at face value every time don't you? So it fisher posted on here it was a fact would you immediately like his post and accept it as gospel?

Given SISU’s proclivity to litigate at every opportunity, do you think it would be sensible to propagate lies on a public forum?

 

[skybluetony176]

Have we ever had a full explanation of the rejection of the cva?

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Really? i thought they had been pretty clear on that. i don't remember the exact statement but it was along the lines of the admin process was rushed so the CVA was flawed meaning no one (except scrotium) understood what they were bidding for and therefore the best deal for creditors was not on the table.ACL wanted the admin process re-run because of this so rejected the CVA so it could be, accepting it would have meant no chance of it being re-run.

 

[Grendel]

I would have thought going back on hand shake deals, non payment of rent, non payment for academy facilities, JR, liquidation to break lease !!!!
What were all these actions friendly fire ??????
You really are a prize dickhead !!!!!

It's interesting how most if the main protagonists in this debate were also slavish thorn worshippers.

Ah well you really did get that wrong didn't you.

The fact is I have remained consistent on this forum since i joined over two matters;

Thorn should have been sacked in September 2011. Few will argue against that now.

If the rental agreement remained in place the club would go bust. Oh right on that as well.

Sisu were a huge disappointment. They should have done this when they started. Coventry city are a far greater community assett than a lump of ugly concrete in Holbrooks. Yet the council just treated them as a tenant they could charge a fortune to to allow the management company to stay afloat.

Whenever PWKH is challenged on the arrangement he says he deals in fact and hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Well here is a fact. The titanic was declared an unsinkable vessel. In hindsight captain smith shouldn't have hit an iceberg I assume.

Personally I think if captain smith had used some foresight the titanic would not be an historical reference. Do you agree?

 

[Grendel]

Really? i thought they had been pretty clear on that. i don't remember the exact statement but it was along the lines of the admin process was rushed so the CVA was flawed meaning no one (except scrotium) understood what they were bidding for and therefore the best deal for creditors was not on the table.ACL wanted the admin process re-run because of this so rejected the CVA so it could be, accepting it would have meant no chance of it being re-run.

I think PWKH has answered this and his answer is different. Have you missed se posts from your hero? Two conditions were refused apparently.

 

[blueflint]

It's interesting how most if the main protagonists in this debate were also slavish thorn worshippers.

Ah well you really did get that wrong didn't you.

The fact is I have remained consistent on this forum since i joined over two matters;

Thorn should have been sacked in September 2011. Few will argue against that now.

If the rental agreement remained in place the club would go bust. Oh right on that as well.

Sisu were a huge disappointment. They should have done this when they started. Coventry city are a far greater community assett than a lump of ugly concrete in Holbrooks. Yet the council just treated them as a tenant they could charge a fortune to to allow the management company to stay afloat.

Whenever PWKH is challenged on the arrangement he says he deals in fact and hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Well here is a fact. The titanic was declared an unsinkable vessel. In hindsight captain smith shouldn't have hit an iceberg I assume.

Personally I think if captain smith had used some foresight the titanic would not be an historical reference. Do you agree?

i can't believe you still support SISU after all the shite they have put us through PWKH posts and you pillory him your hero tim is never going to tell the truth and you follow blindly god help us all

 

[blueflint]

I'm sure it will be liked whatever it is,

The point overlooked of course is that this action made future relationships almost impossible. Having stitched the club with a ten point reduction sisu were hardly going to be knocking on the door the next day for a rent reduction - it was an action that effectively declared war and the has never been vindicated.

just read your reply here the problem started with relegation then the non payment of rent SISU did that nobody else

 

[Grendel]

just read your reply here the problem started with relegation then the non payment of rent SISU did that nobody else

I'm surprised you can read - you certainly never read I word I actually say.

 

[skybluetony176]

I think PWKH has answered this and his answer is different. Have you missed se posts from your hero? Two conditions were refused apparently.

i was going by what was said at the time of it being rejected not from your arch nemesis's post.

 

[dongonzalos]

Have to say It must be tough.

When you spend weeks sometimes months repeating the same mantra in here. Eventually you feel your propaganda has started to be accepted as fact, as a handful of others start to repeat the same mantra.

Then boom.
One post by someone genuine. Who is actually well respected and in the know and your 300 posts have just been vaporised from people's thoughts.

I can't help but feel that this is why some (very very small minority) are trying to discredit or diminish what PWKH says

 

[ohitsaidwalker king power]

I'm surprised you can read - you certainly never read I word I actually say.

:thinking about:

 

[Grendel]

Have to say It must be tough.

When you spend weeks sometimes months repeating the same mantra in here. Eventually you feel your propaganda has started to be accepted as fact, as a handful of others start to repeat the same mantra.

Then boom.
One post by someone genuine. Who is actually well respected and in the know and your 300 posts have just been vaporised from people's thoughts.

I can't help but feel that this is why some (very very small minority) are trying to discredit or diminish what PWKH says

So you at least you admit you admit that CCFC are a distant second in your priorities and ACL are first - as PWKH's are quite rightly. Of course he has to - you also clearly value their interests above the club

Brave admission - you have my respect.

 

[cloughie]

Not strictly speaking but on the balance of probabilities yes. Or was the whole story made up?

And on the balance of probabilities that as this came from fisher The conclusion would be NO.

was the whole story made up?[ well that fits Fishers profile

 

[Astute]

Well no but then again when a certain person posts on here you take it at face value every time don't you? So it fisher posted on here it was a fact would you immediately like his post and accept it as gospel?

Considering that even Joy admitted that Timothy had bullshitted to us......

 

[dongonzalos]

Well no but then again when a certain person posts on here you take it at face value every time don't you? So it fisher posted on here it was a fact would you immediately like his post and accept it as gospel?

Yet you surprise me.
As you only deal in facts in here.
You always ask for them when someone expresses an opinion.

I give PWKH's statements on here a little bit more respect, because generally he was there. Whilst others can inly hypothesise.
Would be a tad silly not to really.

 

[ohitsaidwalker king power]

So you at least you admit you admit that CCFC are a distant second in your priorities and ACL are first - as PWKH's are quite rightly. Of course he has to - you also clearly value their interests above the club

Brave admission - you have my respect.

Where in that post does he admit that CCFC are a distant second to ACL?

 

[Astute]

Would be a tad silly not to really.

Hence Grendulls posts. ...

 

[dongonzalos]

Also I am very much of the belief that you should trust someone until they give you cause not to.
I appreciate you comment that we should not take PWKH's word as gospel.
Yet I am yet to have found a case on here where he has intentionally not told us the truth?
Have you?