Coventry City Council have Failed CCFC (20 Viewers)

[SkyBlueCharlie]

Here we go again, just another wind-up thread....for heavens sake get a life.

 

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[dongonzalos]

Ridiculous, the only people to have come out of this with any credit are the manager and the players.

The fans be it
Those who travel rain or shine to stand on a hill
Those who are prepared to sacrifice their football to make stand
Or even depending how you look at it those who travel all that way still to support Cov.

 

[blueflint]

Please note: This is NOT a pro SISU thread. I fully acknowledge SISU's many catastrophic mistakes and deplore them. I also acknowledge that one of those mistakes was in not renegotiating the rental deal following due diligence. Having said that, when it became clear that the club would not survive under the existing agreement, CCC should have been instructing ACL (I'm sure the Higgs Charity would have agreed to this) to restructure its business model in favour of the club thus allowing it to maintain it's tenancy and avoiding the eventual situation of the club (rightly or wrongly) withholding rent. I realize that I am inviting accusations of naivety (its just business - would you expect your landlord to knock your door offering a rent reduction, etc etc) but this was not a normal tenant/landlord relationship. The club is not just a business, it is a huge part of our community and loved by thousands. CCC is not just a landlord it is a democratically elected body with a responsibility to its community and its electorate. CCC should have been doing all it could to enable the club to move forward as was its duty. In neglecting to do so it has failed its community, the people of Coventry and the club, costing the city many millions of pounds in the process. At best they stood by, did nothing and watched the club implode, at worst they refused/ignored requests from the club for help.
In my opinion this amounts to dereliction of duty.​

your talking absolute rubbish and you know it

 

[Samo]

never really understood this "ACL extorting CCFC with rent" argument.

If a landlord sets a rent per month/year and there is a tenant willing to pay that amount, how is the landlord being extortionate?

If ACL kept raising the rent etc then fair enough, but if someone is willing to pay you a certain amount of money then you don't question it surely?

But CCC is NOT a normal landlord. Please read OP

 

[Samo]

Here we go again, just another wind-up thread....for heavens sake get a life.

Not a wind up at all. I think its time we all acknowledged that this is not only the fault of our dreadful owners

 

[ccfc92]

But CCC is NOT a normal landlord. Please read OP

Fully agree with the OP, but did CCFC actually ask CCC/ACL for a reduction? Or did they just start withholding the rent?

My point is, how are ACL meant to know what CCFC's books are like?

 

[blueflint]

I have seen documents that back this up yes

don't believe you or they would be public knowledge by now

 

[stupot07]

Fully agree with the OP, but did CCFC actually ask CCC/ACL for a reduction? Or did they just start withholding the rent?

My point is, how are ACL meant to know what CCFC's books are like?

They've been quite accessible from companies house (albeit usually late)..


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[blueflint]

Because that was the level we were paying, given that the generally argument people give for us having to pay such high rent is that ACL needed it to ensure they could pay the mortgage, I can only assume that the championship rent would have remained the same, if not why didn't they charge us lower rent in the championship regardless?


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because the football club didn't negotiate a cheaper rent they thought they could afford it not ACL's fault they got the best they could football club didn't.football club to blame nobody else

 

[ccfc92]

They've been quite accessible from companies house (albeit usually late)..


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But did CCFC/SISU express distress to ACL and ask for a rent reduction? Or just decided one month to withhold the rent?

 

[Samo]

Fully agree with the OP, but did CCFC actually ask CCC/ACL for a reduction? Or did they just start withholding the rent?

My point is, how are ACL meant to know what CCFC's books are like?

That's a fair point. But whether or not they asked, is it realistic to suppose that ACL did not know the club were in trouble? Everybody else did!

 

[Nick]

The football club rejected a sliding scale rent in the first place
Then rejected a approx 650k rent
Then rejected a 400k one
Then rejected a 150k one

Proud of the council, the charity, the fans, the manager and players

Disgusted by our owners

Are you just copying and pasting as much as you can?

 

[DaleM]

I agree with the OP. ACL had already bankrupted the club once and refused to reduce the rent when asked before Sisu even took over. They then tried to put the club into administration over a rent strike that was agreed between both CCFC and ACL to stress the mortgage to pay it off at a reduced rate.

All will be revealed in court and I can't wait for it all to come out

I have seen documents that back this up yes

If that is true about agreeing a rent strike I think people from both sides will be getting a visit from the Serious Fraud Squad.

 

[dongonzalos]

Are you just copying and pasting as much as you can?

Yes

The football club rejected a sliding scale rent in the first place
Then rejected a approx 650k rent
Then rejected a 400k one
Then rejected a 150k one

Proud of the council, the charity, the fans, the manager and players

Disgusted by our owners

 

[ccfc92]

That's a fair point. But whether or not they asked, is it realistic to suppose that ACL did not know the club were in trouble? Everybody else did!

agreed, morally you would think they'd say "can you afford the current deal?"

but if ACL are receiving the agreed money every month, it's highly unlikely they will offer a reduction unless asked.

 

[stupot07]

because the football club didn't negotiate a cheaper rent they thought they could afford it not ACL's fault they got the best they could football club didn't.football club to blame nobody else

But what if ACL wouldn't budge back then, it was this price or go?


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[SkyBlue_Bear83]

never really understood this "ACL extorting CCFC with rent" argument.

If a landlord sets a rent per month/year and there is a tenant willing to pay that amount, how is the landlord being extortionate?

If ACL kept raising the rent etc then fair enough, but if someone is willing to pay you a certain amount of money then you don't question it surely?

I agree, if we were stupid enough to agree to it then you can't really blame ACL for taking it as it makes business sense for them.

But then ACL and our fans can't claim that they act in the clubs best interests as this is a lie.

 

[stupot07]

agreed, morally you would think they'd say "can you afford the current deal?"

but if ACL are receiving the agreed money every month, it's highly unlikely they will offer a reduction unless asked.

Pretty sure ACL said the club had one or 2 light touch discussions about the rent. A bit ambiguous.


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[dongonzalos]

Not a wind up at all. I think its time we all acknowledged that this is not only the fault of our dreadful owners

Most say SISU are the major cause of the problem and the council/ACL to a much lesser extent

 

[ccfc92]

I agree, if we were stupid enough to agree to it then you can't really blame ACL for taking it as it makes business sense for them.

But then ACL and our fans can't claim that they act in the clubs best interests as this is a lie.

exactly my point. as a business person/company you don't reduce income/revenue.

(let's just leave that last sentence there shall we )

 

[jan87]

I have seen documents that back this up yes

Why are you entitled to see them?

 

[Samo]

agreed, morally you would think they'd say "can you afford the current deal?"

but if ACL are receiving the agreed money every month, it's highly unlikely they will offer a reduction unless asked.

Also agreed. But don't the council have a duty to help the club (as part of the community) and it's fans (as part of the electorate) as much as is possible. It is in everyone's interests that the club is healthy and viable.

 

[stupot07]

exactly my point. as a business person/company you don't reduce income/revenue.

(let's just leave that last sentence there shall we )

You also don't want to lose your flag ship/anchor tenant especially so publicly.


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[ccfc92]

Most say SUSU are the major cause of the problem and the council/ACL to a much lesser extent

I'd say order of blame:

1. SISU
2. Previous Owners
3. CCC/ACL - remember they stepped in to rescue the Ricoh project after HR was already sold and there was no going back to HR

 

[ccfc92]

Also agreed. But don't the council have a duty to help the club (as part of the community) and it's fans (as part of the electorate) as much as is possible. It is in everyone's interests that the club is healthy and viable.

and I completely agree with that too

i suppose a key question is how much are ACL influenced by CCC?

 

[Samo]

Most say SUSU are the major cause of the problem and the council/ACL to a much lesser extent

and the Sun outsells the Guardian. Do you always run with the pack?

 

[ccfc92]

You also don't want to lose your flag ship/anchor tenant especially so publicly.


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agreed. but did they not publicly offer reduced/free rent when SISU threatened moving out of Cov?

 

[RFC]

Ridiculous, the only people to have come out of this with any credit are the manager and the players.

Totally agree, ONLY the Manager (& his staff) & the Players can come out of this with any credit! PUSB

 

[ccfc92]

Totally agree, ONLY the Manager (& his staff) & the Players can come out of this with any credit! PUSB

can we make this post a sticky? probably the only sensible post from RFC

 

[wingy]

Brave OP Samo ,Just remind me what Fisher was on about when It all started saying It's not Can't pay but won't pay?

 

[Huckerby]

lets be honset they've all ballsed it up haven't they

 

[ccfc92]

lets be honset they've all ballsed it up haven't they

the whole club/situation is a total balls up

 

[Samo]

Brave OP Samo ,Just remind me what Fisher was on about when It all started saying It's not Can't pay but won't pay?

Or foolhardy! I hesitate to defend that loathsome twat but I think he was trying to suggest that SISU had the money but objected to paying an inflated rate.

 

[Chipfat]

Sisu have got us all barking up the wrong tree,, this is what they do misdirection...RENT is and was never the issue they signed from day 1 the contract and didn't see a problem then, even though they say it was an issue for previous owners... If so why as business savy people didn't they address then, instead of brushing under the carpet.. Tell you why never was they in it for long term ,,, short term investment promotion and sell for large profit or buy the Ricoh then sell for even higher..No plan B, no idea of running a football club and no idea of the importance of the fans...

Please stop banging on about rent altogether never mind sliding rent, done deals, shaking hands, and reductions...Sisu are holding the keys to the safe, the office and the decision making, they have fell into deep and cant get out..The rent wasn't paid and still the books were shit, so why are we still going on about it. The CCC although i agree not blameless do not control what Sisu are doing now or the day they stopped paying rent or the day they agreed the initial rent contract..If we want to talk anything it should be about the way the club is still being run without outside influence just our beloved Sisu. Even her own have tried to make her sell, she won't why should be the question not rent deals, as they are neither here or there in the larger scale of things...

They misdirect more than dynamo and we all fall for it TF must look at tjis site and roll around his living the fat twat, i cant believe some still eat out of his hand anything he spill.

 

[SonOfSnoz]

The finances of Coventry city fc are not the responsibility of the council.

End of.

& the redevelopment of Coventry is not the duty of it's football club! Council should stick to running the city of Coventry not interfering in holding a football club hostage!