CCLSC minutes 29th May - Fisher Speaks (2 Viewers)

[shmmeee]

Evidence does seem to lean towards him telling the truth.

What do you feel is underhand?

I've seen evidence that they thought about PR responses, like every organisation ever, and that they possibly didn't send an email they said they would.

Not sure it's on the same level as "Give me the Ricoh or the club gets it" to be honest.

As I said in the original thread, it's hardly a smoking gun and that is from Sisu's statement. God knows how benign it would look if presented by an unbiased body.

 

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[lordsummerisle]

What do you feel is underhand?

I've seen evidence that they thought about PR responses, like every organisation ever, and that they possibly didn't send an email they said they would.

Not sure it's on the same level as "Give me the Ricoh or the club gets it" to be honest.

As I said in the original thread, it's hardly a smoking gun and that is from Sisu's statement. God knows how benign it would look if presented by an unbiased body.

We would want this arrangement to be kept entirely private between

ourselves to allow us to conclude a rent deal with SISU... Our
concern is that they will walk away from the table if they think that
we have reached an arrangement with YB.

That whilst still negotiating with Sisu was pretty shabby i'd have thought, if the other way round would be pretty much condemned by all on here, quite correctly.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Tf I am sure would say standard business practice

 

[shmmeee]

That whilst still negotiating with Sisu was pretty shabby i'd have thought, if the other way round would be pretty much condemned by all on here, quite correctly.

I think we'll have to accept different personal standards then, because I honestly don't see anything wrong with that. By your logic Sisu not telling the council where they are planning to build a new ground, or not even telling them they were planning that, is just as bad.

All seems like normal cut and thrust of negotiations TBH and I'm still not sure it shows anything that suggests they are out to hurt the club, which is the accusation that several on here are claiming this proves.

 

[Astute]

Evidence does seem to lean towards him telling the truth.

This certainly is the case. But we need to remember where this evidence came from and how truthful they have been in the past. And also how they have tried to twist the truth as well. I will be much happier with it once CCC have had a chance to give their side.

One sides evidence don't mean proof. It don't even make it the truth. It just gives you an idea.

 

[Astute]

That whilst still negotiating with Sisu was pretty shabby i'd have thought, if the other way round would be pretty much condemned by all on here, quite correctly.

But the judge came to his decision because both sides were not seriously looking at completing the deal in August. So was anyone still negotiating?

 

[Monners]

Any Council, or other public body, would have done a similar thing. It would be naive not to, and TF ought to (and I dare say does) know that. Public bodies are bound by a plethora of rules and levels of scrutiny that simply don't apply to the private sector, and getting the best deal, and protecting public assets are part of that - hence the state aid issues; which is very comlpex to those of us who have had to consider it (form either side of the public/non- public sector side of the fence).

 

[lordsummerisle]

I think we'll have to accept different personal standards then, because I honestly don't see anything wrong with that. By your logic Sisu not telling the council where they are planning to build a new ground, or not even telling them they were planning that, is just as bad.

All seems like normal cut and thrust of negotiations TBH and I'm still not sure it shows anything that suggests they are out to hurt the club, which is the accusation that several on here are claiming this proves.

Sisu did tell the council, well ACL, that they were planning to build a new ground, after CCC took over the loan, and wanted to arrange a run-off period of three years rental(which would have been indefinite in reality), but it was rejected out of hand.

 

[bigfatronssba]

Sisu did tell the council, well ACL, that they were planning to build a new ground, after CCC took over the loan, and wanted to arrange a run-off period of three years rental(which would have been indefinite in reality), but it was rejected out of hand.

According to Fisher he had been looking at a new ground before CCC lent Acl the money. Therefore he was negotiating with the council whilst also considering a new ground.

Was he being underhand?

 

[lordsummerisle]

According to Fisher he had been looking at a new ground before CCC lent Acl the money. Therefore he was negotiating with the council whilst also considering a new ground.

Was he being underhand?

When did he say he was looking at a new ground?

 

[bigfatronssba]

When did he say he was looking at a new ground?

December 2012

 

[Astute]

They started looking at a ground share in 2012. They had their first talks with the FL in January 2013. Not sure when the bluster of the new ground started but it was certainly before we heard of moving to Northampton.

 

[bigfatronssba]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20681423

 

[lordsummerisle]

December 2012

Are you sure?

 

[lordsummerisle]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20681423

No mention of building a new ground there, just moving to another ground, due to being handed a winding-up petition.

 

[Astute]

Are you sure?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22581748

Article dated 18th May 2013.

We retained stadium specialists some months ago to advise us on suitable sites for a permanent club stadium in the Coventry area”
​

Tim FisherCoventry City chief executive

"We will ensure that all the fans are kept fully informed as the situation develops and the upcoming fan meetings will provide a further opportunity for discussion." :thinking about:

 

[shmmeee]

Are you sure?

Here's the more relevant question:

If you are concerned that should Sisu not completed the YB deal that Joy will liquidate the club (as threatened) would you tell her you're thinking of gazumping her?

The only issue for me hinges on why CCC pulled out of the deal. If it was "we hate Sisu and we want new owners" then you have something. If it was "This deal is bad for us/bad for Coventry as a city" then what's the issue?

 

[lordsummerisle]

Here's the more relevant question:

If you are concerned that should Sisu not completed the YB deal that Joy will liquidate the club (as threatened) would you tell her you're thinking of gazumping her?

The only issue for me hinges on why CCC pulled out of the deal. If it was "we hate Sisu and we want new owners" then you have something. If it was "This deal is bad for us/bad for Coventry as a city" then what's the issue?

I think the former, purely because of the undue weight that Hoffman and Elliott seem to pull locally.

Planting ideas of rich American Property developers who will take all their problems away amd redevelop the whole area for them.

Had to be tempting to try and "force" the issue.

 

[shmmeee]

I think the former, purely because of the undue weight that Hoffman and Elliott seem to pull locally.

Planting ideas of rich American Property developers who will take all their problems away amd redevelop the whole area for them.

Had to be tempting to try and "force" the issue.

And I think latter, problem is neither of us have any evidence and are unlikely to until we hear the Council's defence in the JR.

 

[Monners]

And I think latter, problem is neither of us have any evidence and are unlikely to until we hear the Council's defence in the JR.

Agreed. If the CCC officers have followed procedure and done their job properly then the latter. If they have been malicious and this can be proved, then they leave themselves open to prosection (potentially). Pretty serious allegation to make at this stage without any evideince to hand I would have thought.

 

[Astute]

Agreed. If the CCC officers have followed procedure and done their job properly then the latter. If they have been malicious and this can be proved, then they leave themselves open to prosection (potentially). Pretty serious allegation to make at this stage without any evideince to hand I would have thought.

And I am still getting accused by a few of being on one side when I am trying to keep my mind open on the matter

 

[sky blue john]

New owners required for CCFC.
It is impossible for Sisu to achieve a return to the Ricoh. For a Ricoh return we need new owners.
Sisu haven't even got a plan to get us playing in Cov ever !!!

 

[Deleted member 5849]

And I am still getting accused by a few of being on one side when I am trying to keep my mind open on the matter

Oi!

'accused by one'*

 

[Astute]

And with a mind as small as mine you would think it would be an easy thing to do :thinking about:

 

[shmmeee]

And I am still getting accused by a few of being on one side when I am trying to keep my mind open on the matter

Frankly if you and me are part of Weber Shandwick then ACL should ask for their money back!

 

[lordsummerisle]

Frankly if you and me are part of Weber Shandwick then ACL should ask for their money back!

Over the years you've been doing very well to get paid by both!

 

[shmmeee]

Over the years you've been doing very well to get paid by both!

You're onto me I'm a double agent employed by Nick just to keep traffic up.

On a serious point: this is why I find the vitriol spat at me so hilarious. I used to have quite serious arguments with people during the rent strike about how Sisu are just trying to get the best deal for the club, I slagged off Lucas over King with the best of them, yet apparently I'm biased and can never change my mind.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

So we can conclude you're just a fan of arguing?

 

[shmmeee]

So we can conclude you're just a fan of arguing?

Guilty as charged.

As the saying goes: Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling with a pig in the mud: after a while you realise the pig likes it.

 

[Astute]

So we can conclude you're just a fan of arguing?

Get your hard hat on. Grendel will want his meaning in life back.

 

[Astute]

Guilty as charged.

As the saying goes: Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling with a pig in the mud: after a while you realise the pig likes it.

Are you an engineer as well?

 

[shmmeee]

Are you an engineer as well?

Now I'm "just" a teacher. But in a previous life both software engineer and telecommunications engineer yes.

 

[Astute]

I wanted to be either a maths teacher or solicitor. But I ended up leaving home at 15. Made it slightly difficult. Did my training in my 20's to become a mechanical engineer. Bit late now to do anything about it as would have loved to go into teaching. Just had lots of kids instead

 

[shmmeee]

I wanted to be either a maths teacher or solicitor. But I ended up leaving home at 15. Made it slightly difficult. Did my training in my 20's to become a mechanical engineer. Bit late now to do anything about it as would have loved to go into teaching. Just had lots of kids instead

Frankly I wouldn't go in now. Everyone I know is looking at their escape route since Gove came in and undid all the progress of the last 20 years. Maths is the most frustrating subject to teach as well. I had a look at Law as a second (well fourth) career but to be honest it doesn't seem that good once you get there either, I think I've been watching too many courtroom dramas.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Frankly I wouldn't go in now. Everyone I know is looking at their escape route since Gove came in and undid all the progress of the last 20 years. Maths is the most frustrating subject to teach as well. I had a look at Law as a second (well fourth) career but to be honest it doesn't seem that good once you get there either, I think I've been watching too many courtroom dramas.

Having changed career about as often as City change managers, I can safely say the grass isn't always greener, anyway!