Kris Boyd (7 Viewers)

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The Gentleman

Well-Known Member
That's not being realistic though Astute. Its being negative.

You bring up the Arsenal game and rightly say we can't survive hoping for that game to occur every season. But you can't then ignore the fact that it did happen and will be included in our FFP calculations next season along with that one off sponsorship. We are likely to have made upwards of 500k on that match and using your simple FFP calcs above that boosts our wage potential considerably.

If Boyd wants to come to England, in League 1, then we have a good a chance as anyone to sign him.

Really? Do you think that we have as good a chance at signing him as some of the bigger teams teams in League 1? A player in the final part of his career would move for money more than anything else in the lower leagues and you think that we can compete? I wish I had your optimism, I would like him to come but cannot see it.
 

Skyblueweeman

Well-Known Member
The problem I have is that some of our supporters get their hopes up when they see a thread like this. They don't understand the ramifications of FFP.

Edgy has a go at me and then shows he doesn't understand it himself.

And some fans (all of us) don't know exactly what our finances are going to be for next season. In your defence, I though it was actually a fair question you asked. However, your 'back of a fag packet' calculations mean as much as me pulling a figure of say, £2m, out of the air.

I've replied to you before on another thread saying OSB had calculated something like £650k as a reasonable amount for wages next season...can't be arsed to hunt for it.

As I stated on that thread, the truth of the matter is that neither you, nor I, nor even OSB has an accurate clue of our finances for next season. The one thing I'd be totally pee'd off at is with all the cost cutting that's gone on, if we don't meet FFP, SISU will have totally shot themselves in the foot. All the talk of cutting our cloth accordingly and still not meeting FFP would be demolish any small ounce of credibility in living by our means.

WM
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
The problem I have is that some of our supporters get their hopes up when they see a thread like this. They don't understand the ramifications of FFP.

Edgy has a go at me and then shows he doesn't understand it himself.
If sisu wanted to they could put enough equity in to have the biggest wage bill in the league.

Edgy understands it well enough. You seem to think its purely based on turnover.
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
And some fans (all of us) don't know exactly what our finances are going to be for next season. In your defence, I though it was actually a fair question you asked. However, your 'back of a fag packet' calculations mean as much as me pulling a figure of say, £2m, out of the air.

I've replied to you before on another thread saying OSB had calculated something like £650k as a reasonable amount for wages next season...can't be arsed to hunt for it.

As I stated on that thread, the truth of the matter is that neither you, nor I, nor even OSB has an accurate clue of our finances for next season. The one thing I'd be totally pee'd off at is with all the cost cutting that's gone on, if we don't meet FFP, SISU will have totally shot themselves in the foot. All the talk of cutting our cloth accordingly and still not meeting FFP would be demolish any small ounce of credibility in living by our means.

WM

Good points WM .

Hope the Injection comes though ,otherwise ,In the managers own words " We have a budget similar to Nuneaton town".
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
If sisu wanted to they could put enough equity in to have the biggest wage bill in the league.

Edgy understands it well enough. You seem to think its purely based on turnover.

How much have we shaved from the last Books where the club cost £13.5M to run .

Being generous £5-6M .

Income last season £2-£2.5M ,looking like a potential Injection of £5M required ,£1.5M equity the rest loans and a club still losing near to £500K per month
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
If sisu wanted to they could put enough equity in to have the biggest wage bill in the league.

Edgy understands it well enough. You seem to think its purely based on turnover.

If SISU don't gift our club money what will it be based on then?

If Edgy understands it well enough why did he go by last seasons income?

At least if we don't reach the FFP target we would only get an embargo IIRC. We are good at them ;)
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
SISU are busy persuing a JR and a who did what forum. I can't see them putting equity in.

Hopefully us boring fuckers will be wrong. Maybe if we always have a go at CCC and dream about what could happen we won't be boring fuckers anymore :thinking about:
 

hill83

Well-Known Member
Hopefully us boring fuckers will be wrong. Maybe if we always have a go at CCC and dream about what could happen we won't be boring fuckers anymore :thinking about:

The whole lot of you are boring fuckers whatever side of the imaginary fence you want to put up.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
The whole lot of you are boring fuckers whatever side of the imaginary fence you want to put up.

I am glad the side of the fence you stand at is exciting.
 

The Gentleman

Well-Known Member
I seriously hope we sign him if only to shut a few boring fuckers up.

As said by the life and soul of the party. I hope we do sign him because we are certainly going to need him but just can't see it. Thanks for your input though but i'm off now to spot some more trains.
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
As said by the life and soul of the party. I hope we do sign him because we are certainly going to need him but just can't see it. Thanks for your input though but i'm off now to spot some more trains.

While yo're there see If you can get Waterman to bail us out.:)
 

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
why on earth does every thread now just turn into people being abusive ?

Nick, cant you sort this out ?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
why on earth does every thread now just turn into people being abusive ?

Nick, cant you sort this out ?

Two reasons it seems.

1, It changes the subject. It normally starts when the truth comes out and it looks bad for SISU.

2, It puts some people off talking about the truth and they know it.

Look at all the comments towards anyone that comes out with how it is and not how we would want it to be. But these same posters keep on going about blaming CCC/ACL whenever they can. But they are running out of reasons that could be seen as the truth by anyone with an unbiased view. But if you don't try and make excuses for the way SISU have done things there are a few on here that will insult you. Wonderful isn't it.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
it was more that it will put people off posting.

This is pretty much how GMK went.

Look at how many on here are doing so and are on GMK. Maybe they are trying to send it the same way.
 

covmark

Well-Known Member
I think more people will be put off by repetitive threads arguing the same old crap. Also I read a comment yesterday that I couldn't believe. 'A council win in the JR would be the best moment for our club since 87'. Comments like this, you'd be forgiven for not believing this is a football forum. It's enough to put anyone off coming on here.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Two reasons it seems.

1, It changes the subject. It normally starts when the truth comes out and it looks bad for SISU.

2, It puts some people off talking about the truth and they know it.

Look at all the comments towards anyone that comes out with how it is and not how we would want it to be. But these same posters keep on going about blaming CCC/ACL whenever they can. But they are running out of reasons that could be seen as the truth by anyone with an unbiased view. But if you don't try and make excuses for the way SISU have done things there are a few on here that will insult you. Wonderful isn't it.

What do you think is the most offensive post made on here?
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
I know too.........

Why don't Sisu get their arses in gear then and try to buy it? Or will we get another reply re-directing all your anger towards ACL/CCC?

Am i going to upset your precious council?

Maybe if BOTH parties stopped this ridiculous stand-off we may get somewhere.
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
Two reasons it seems.

1, It changes the subject. It normally starts when the truth comes out and it looks bad for SISU.

2, It puts some people off talking about the truth and they know it.

Look at all the comments towards anyone that comes out with how it is and not how we would want it to be. But these same posters keep on going about blaming CCC/ACL whenever they can. But they are running out of reasons that could be seen as the truth by anyone with an unbiased view. But if you don't try and make excuses for the way SISU have done things there are a few on here that will insult you. Wonderful isn't it.

Really??

Without turning this into another argument, there is plenty of 'abuse' coming from the anti-SISU camp. In fact the very thing you are complaining about is the thing you do most frequently.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Really??

Without turning this into another argument, there is plenty of 'abuse' coming from the anti-SISU camp. In fact the very thing you are complaining about is the thing you do most frequently.

I think "I hope some going to Sixfields die in a car crash" was pretty offensive - oddly wasnt deemed so on here
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
Really??

Without turning this into another argument, there is plenty of 'abuse' coming from the anti-SISU camp. In fact the very thing you are complaining about is the thing you do most frequently.

Is that right?

I have lost count of stupid comments and insults to myself today and have hardly posted. Got called into work. And each time I got to look there was more. So if others throw insults about that who are seen to have a similar view to me does that mean I become a target?

The only time I ever give anyone an insult is when someone constantly does it to me. If you don't want one back don't do one to start with if you are going to cry about it. And if you come out with rubbish I will point it out. If you fantasise about where our club is going I will give my view. That is the idea of a forum.

If you don't like a thread or can't handle the truth don't bother reading it or commenting if the truth hurts. I am not going to praise any side that I see as at fault. And these days it seems to be nearly always SISU. How can anyone say anything differently unless they are defending them?
 

Chez78

New Member
Can't see this one happening, I was in Glasgow last month with guys who used to live next door to Andy Webster (nice bloke apparently) and the word on the street up there is he's been offered a contract by Rangers. Good signing if we could get him just can't see him choosing to move down here on the kind of wages I presume we could offer playing in front of 1600 instead of Ibrox.

I could see Will Hoskins though, had a couple of injuries so may be cheap wage wise, good target man and scored goals at our level and above all else he's been released so he's free and that's our kind of price.
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
Is that right?

I have lost count of stupid comments and insults to myself today and have hardly posted. Got called into work. And each time I got to look there was more. So if others throw insults about that who are seen to have a similar view to me does that mean I become a target?

The only time I ever give anyone an insult is when someone constantly does it to me. If you don't want one back don't do one to start with if you are going to cry about it. And if you come out with rubbish I will point it out. If you fantasise about where our club is going I will give my view. That is the idea of a forum.

If you don't like a thread or can't handle the truth don't bother reading it or commenting if the truth hurts. I am not going to praise any side that I see as at fault. And these days it seems to be nearly always SISU. How can anyone say anything differently unless they are defending them?

I don't disagree with any of your points, and I wasn't saying that you personally was giving out abuse, and certainly not to me.

You are right - the forum is a place to give out views, and clearly our views don't match up. But some other people need to realise that if someone has a view they don't agree with, discuss/argue as much as you like - not just hurl abuse, and much like this whole dispute, it is coming from people that fall on either side of the opinion.

I will continue to argue for what I think is right, and I'm sure you will do the same.
 

The Gentleman

Well-Known Member
I don't disagree with any of your points, and I wasn't saying that you personally was giving out abuse, and certainly not to me.

You are right - the forum is a place to give out views, and clearly our views don't match up. But some other people need to realise that if someone has a view they don't agree with, discuss/argue as much as you like - not just hurl abuse, and much like this whole dispute, it is coming from people that fall on either side of the opinion.

I will continue to argue for what I think is right, and I'm sure you will do the same.

I like the sentiment and you are right but some of the abuse is banter based and nothing more than what goes on between mates in the pub at the weekend. However, you have said before that you hold all parties accountable (as do many on here, just the % differs) but only ever seem to direct your energies against one party. You cannot hide behind the very occasional well of course Sisu/Otium have been terrible but then continue on your posts against ACL/CCC. It just shows that you are not as balanced as you make out. At least with people like Grendel I have a grudging respect because even though I totally disagree with his view, his view never changes and he never paints himself as something he is not. Sadly, there are a few on here who like to say they are balanced but never show that in their posts/arguments.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
I don't disagree with any of your points, and I wasn't saying that you personally was giving out abuse, and certainly not to me.

You are right - the forum is a place to give out views, and clearly our views don't match up. But some other people need to realise that if someone has a view they don't agree with, discuss/argue as much as you like - not just hurl abuse, and much like this whole dispute, it is coming from people that fall on either side of the opinion.

I will continue to argue for what I think is right, and I'm sure you will do the same.

I fully agree with you here, although in the previous post you said I do it most frequently :p. Then agreed with by Grendel and Torch :facepalm:
 

The Gentleman

Well-Known Member
Am i going to upset your precious council?

Maybe if BOTH parties stopped this ridiculous stand-off we may get somewhere.

'Precious Council', see what I mean. I make a perfectly valid comment about Sisu buying the Ricoh because it is only them who can buy it and you come back with a stupid comment that I have never said. I have said before that I appreciate and like what the Council try to do for the people of Coventry and I will not hide that.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
I see myself as having unbiased views. My problem is that I am still waiting for this 'smoking gun' we have been expecting. So far the main fault from CCC was having the rent set too high. Yet we know why it was set so high at the time. Yes it was too much for our club, but why should CCC use taxpayers money to help our club that wouldn't be repaid in some way. The loan taken out was when interest rates were much higher. Since then the rent strike got them to refinance. The loan has come down from 21m to 14.4m. And it seems that the arena is now making a profit. So now a lower rent can be offered. Maybe could have been done earlier. But that don't make them as bad as what SISU have done the last couple of years in my eyes.

We know that we don't have to be in Northampton. We know our club would be at least 2m a year better off at the Ricoh. So why are we not back yet? We need both sides to negotiate. How can this properly happen when we have constant litigation? Why did SISU spend much more on legal fees than the 29k that Higgs felt that they were due after having an agreement? I could go on. This is why my unbiased outlook has taken my views to the latest history in this shitfest being against what SISU are doing to my club and us fans.

Only one side can bring us home. It could happen today if they wanted. But all we get is bluster and twisting of words. Yet some think both sides are to blame equally.
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
'Precious Council', see what I mean. I make a perfectly valid comment about Sisu buying the Ricoh because it is only them who can buy it and you come back with a stupid comment that I have never said. I have said before that I appreciate and like what the Council try to do for the people of Coventry and I will not hide that.


OK fair enough... on that comment. You say I only seem to target ACL/CCC in my posts, and you are probably correct. There are more than enough people here on this forum that hold SISU exclusively for blame. I don't - they are both culpable. So I feel that my comments are needed to add some balance to the discussion. That doesn't mean I relinquish SISU of responsibility - far from it.

I see their errors being in two key areas. Firstly the way they didn't do the correct due diligence in the beginning, and then got some rank amateurs in to run the business up until the point it was too late. The second is moving the club out of Coventry. These have made them alienate the fanbase and no wonder people despise them.

But within all that I also see the need to be self sustainable. In all the years I have supported the club, Fisher is the first person to put forward any kind of plan to achieve this. Yes he is despised, and some of the things he has said are ridiculous, but putting a plan in place where we don't have to rely on people like SISU is more important than anything else IMO. So for me I am prepared to tolerate SISU if this goal is achieved. Football is living beyond its means now - and when the arse falls out of it (and it will) I would want our club to be in a position of strength. If they don't deliver on this I am happy to move my position and join the call for them to go.

My vitriol towards the council is because I generally have a dim view of government and politics (being a teacher is a big reason for this). They don't like SISU, but that's not a reason to deal with them. The idea that a council holds themselves up as a moral beacon irates me, given some of the things that have happened to people in Coventry over the last few years as a result of their negligence. The council have done pretty well out of the Ricoh over the years, and I think they should be prepared to do a deal that will benefit the club, and it will benefit the city as a whole over time. I also agree that this has to be a fair price. This standoff over who should make an offer/put up for sale is pathetic. Both should agree to an independent valuation and shake hands on the price.

Does it matter if SISU have the Ricoh and the surrounding land? As long as the club's position is protected and agreements in place that the club won't be separated from the stadium again I couldn't care less what they do with the rest of it. If they want to make their fortune building stuff around the complex good luck to them - as long as CCFC are safe from the rubbish that has gone on for the last 20 years.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
My vitriol towards the council is because I generally have a dim view of government and politics (being a teacher is a big reason for this). They don't like SISU, but that's not a reason to deal with them. The idea that a council holds themselves up as a moral beacon irates me, given some of the things that have happened to people in Coventry over the last few years as a result of their negligence. The council have done pretty well out of the Ricoh over the years, and I think they should be prepared to do a deal that will benefit the club, and it will benefit the city as a whole over time. I also agree that this has to be a fair price. This standoff over who should make an offer/put up for sale is pathetic. Both should agree to an independent valuation and shake hands on the price.

Does it matter if SISU have the Ricoh and the surrounding land? As long as the club's position is protected and agreements in place that the club won't be separated from the stadium again I couldn't care less what they do with the rest of it. If they want to make their fortune building stuff around the complex good luck to them - as long as CCFC are safe from the rubbish that has gone on for the last 20 years.

CCC have done well out of the Ricoh? Would you like to explain? They have never taken a penny out and have had nothing but trouble for helping our club.

Fair price? Certainly. But they are doing whatever they have to not to pay a fair price. This includes taking our football club to Northampton to play to try and devalue the arena by not having a football club playing there.

Would you think that SISU would use litigation against anything where there was a document saying that the arena must stay with the club? Or how about trying the liquidation route? Our club owes SISU a lot of money because of the way they have financed this mess. If they liquidated our club they would become owners outright to the arena. There is not a legal document that could stop this from happening. I can't think of any other reason for them to dump so much debt on our club. Not saying it would happen, but it must be considered.
 
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