99 year lease, fair rent, revenues (3 Viewers)

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K

KersleyDigs

Well-Known Member
Is this a potential solution?

The trouble is a the moment both sides are saying what they wouldn't find acceptable. It is time for them to say what they would be prepared to accept. SISU don't want to pay the going rate and the council won't sell the freehold, we know this.

Both sides need to say WHAT THEY WOULD FIND ACCEPTABLE!!!

Could the fans take the initiative and try and broker a deal through the media by asking both sides: What would it take? For example:

- Would a long lease be acceptable?
- Would a rent in keeping with the league average be acceptable (with provisions for promotion etc)?
- Is there a way for the Club to gain matchday revenues? If so, would this be acceptable?
 
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Samo

Samo

Well-Known Member
KersleyDigs said:
Is this a potential solution?

The trouble is a the moment both sides are saying what they wouldn't find acceptable. It is time for them to say what they would be prepared to accept. SISU don't want to pay the going rate and the council won't sell the freehold, we know this.

Both sides need to say WHAT THEY WOULD FIND ACCEPTABLE!!!

Could the fans take the initiative and try and broker a deal through the media by asking both sides: What would it take? For example:

- Would a long lease be acceptable?
- Would a rent in keeping with the league average be acceptable (with provisions for promotion etc)?
- Is there a way for the Club to gain matchday revenues? If so, would this be acceptable?
Click to expand...

That is the most likely outcome and probably wat sisu actually wants.
 
C

Cheshire Sky Blue

New Member
I think both sides have made it clear already. The crux of the issue is that what is acceptable to ACL / CCC is a million miles away from what SISU see as an acceptable position. That is because SISU do not see the success of the Football Club as their primary goal. I believe they see the rewards from full ownership of the Arena as the goal and CCFC are in irritable pawn in the game. Until that changes or ACL / CCC accept they have lost all, nothing will change.

Its hard to accept, but CCFC are only the lever to SISU's desire, not their desire.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
Cheshire Sky Blue said:
I think both sides have made it clear already. The crux of the issue is that what is acceptable to ACL / CCC is a million miles away from what SISU see as an acceptable position. That is because SISU do not see the success of the Football Club as their primary goal.
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Hard to imagine ACL see the success of the club as primary goal also. To take an extreme position, if they did a rent of zero and access to all revenues across the site would be the deal agreed if they did...
 
C

Cheshire Sky Blue

New Member
Deleted member 5849 said:
Hard to imagine ACL see the success of the club as primary goal also. To take an extreme position, if they did a rent of zero and access to all revenues across the site would be the deal agreed if they did...
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The question is "Is the granting of ALL revenues within ACL's gift". I do not think it is. The third parties purchased the rights to those revenue streams and hard as it is to accept, they have a value. SISU could offer to buy these rights. But something tells me they won't.
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Cheshire Sky Blue said:
I think both sides have made it clear already. The crux of the issue is that what is acceptable to ACL / CCC is a million miles away from what SISU see as an acceptable position. That is because SISU do not see the success of the Football Club as their primary goal. I believe they see the rewards from full ownership of the Arena as the goal and CCFC are in irritable pawn in the game. Until that changes or ACL / CCC accept they have lost all, nothing will change.

Its hard to accept, but CCFC are only the lever to SISU's desire, not their desire.
Click to expand...

So do you think ACL give a fuck about CCFC? If any other sports franchise was interested in doing business with the tawdry little outfit they would be over them like a rash. The only reason this is still up for discussion is no one else would touch them with a barge pole.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
So do you think ACL give a fuck about CCFC? If any other sports franchise was interested in doing business with the tawdry little outfit they would be over them like a rash. The only reason this is still up for discussion is no one else would touch them with a barge pole.
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I'd say they give more of a fuck about the long term success than Sisu to be perfectly honest, what with having an actual link to the city. Not everyone who lives here shares your view of Coventry ;)

To address OP: You're making the same error the SBT have. If we could agree a deal for that, then the club wouldn't be in Northampton. Whether ACL can or will offer what CCFC say they need is a question only they can answer after serious negotiation. In the mean time we need a solution to get us home. Insisting on waiting until talks are complete for the most complex part of negotiations is no solution at all. It's just "wait and see". We did that last season, it didn't work.
 
S

SkyBlueScottie

Well-Known Member
Let's say another sporting team moves to the Ricoh. Who benefits the sales of beverages, corporate sponsorship, car parking etc, is it the sports team or is it the company owned by ACL and Compass?
 
C

Cheshire Sky Blue

New Member
Grendel said:
So do you think ACL give a fuck about CCFC? If any other sports franchise was interested in doing business with the tawdry little outfit they would be over them like a rash. The only reason this is still up for discussion is no one else would touch them with a barge pole.
Click to expand...

I actually do think that ACL care more for CCFC than SISU do. ACL are a Coventry based organisation, with the needs and desires of the folk of our City firmly embedded in their thoughts and deeds. Where as i am of the opinion your thoughts and deeds are based in a bigoted and juvenile hatred of CCC and the DECENT folk in Coventry.
 
Como

Como

Well-Known Member
That would depend on the deal that they made, pay enough and all things are possible.
 
Astute

Astute

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
So do you think ACL give a fuck about CCFC? If any other sports franchise was interested in doing business with the tawdry little outfit they would be over them like a rash. The only reason this is still up for discussion is no one else would touch them with a barge pole.
Click to expand...

And now would you like to mention all the good things that SISU have done for our club and us supporters?

I will start. They saved us from administration......
 
bigfatronssba

bigfatronssba

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
So do you think ACL give a fuck about CCFC? If any other sports franchise was interested in doing business with the tawdry little outfit they would be over them like a rash. The only reason this is still up for discussion is no one else would touch them with a barge pole.
Click to expand...

I spell out the difference for you Grendel.

Primary concern of acl board members is the wellbeing of acl.

Primary concern of ccfc board members is the wellbeing of sisu.

Absolutely nothing wrong with a company looking out for its own interests. Unfortunately in ccfc we have a board that is more interested in its parent companys interests.
 
C

CCFC PimpRail

New Member
Grendel said:
So do you think ACL give a fuck about CCFC? If any other sports franchise was interested in doing business with the tawdry little outfit they would be over them like a rash. The only reason this is still up for discussion is no one else would touch them with a barge pole.
Click to expand...

My friend, we need to have a chat about who exactly the "tawdry little outfit" is...
 
K

KersleyDigs

Well-Known Member
SISU need to go to compass who at the minute have no match day revenues and say something like:

"We want to come back to the ricoh, but we want all CCFC match day revenues. If we can agree a rent deal to return, we will pay you £X for the rights to the match day revenues, that way you get some money. If there is no deal to be done, then we will not return and you will still have no matchday revenues, no lump sum and a relatively useless rights to revenues at a football stadium with no football team!!"
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
KersleyDigs said:
SISU need to go to compass who at the minute have no match day revenues and say something like:

"We want to come back to the ricoh, but we want all CCFC match day revenues. If we can agree a rent deal to return, we will pay you £X for the rights to the match day revenues, that way you get some money. If there is no deal to be done, then we will not return and you will still have no matchday revenues, no lump sum and a relatively useless rights to revenues at a football stadium with no football team!!"
Click to expand...

Easy to say we will come back with our fans if you give us x% of income taken in the "bowl" on match days. The z total on all tills is the proof of turnover. Profit is irrelevant as it is turnover based. Maybe one can use the turnover for FFP purposes.
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
KersleyDigs said:
SISU need to go to compass who at the minute have no match day revenues and say something like:

"We want to come back to the ricoh, but we want all CCFC match day revenues. If we can agree a rent deal to return, we will pay you £X for the rights to the match day revenues, that way you get some money. If there is no deal to be done, then we will not return and you will still have no matchday revenues, no lump sum and a relatively useless rights to revenues at a football stadium with no football team!!"
Click to expand...

I thought Compass only get 23% of revenues now?
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Rob S

Rob S

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
Are they?
Click to expand...

I lose track of the various ins & outs so it might take a perusal of ACL accounts from someone with more time but IIRC, the key points are Compass loaning £4m upfront – which was used to redevelop the DeVere? – and getting sole rights to the F&B for an annual £1.4m (index-linked?) payment. This was one of the things that might have been an issue in the due dil for buying out the Higgs share?

Lots of question marks in there so take it with a pinch of salt.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Link to OSBs analysis of the ACL accounts. No mention of a £1.4m payment that I can see, but I always go cross eyed on finance threads.

It does mention the £4m Compass paid for shares in IECE. Again, no mention of a loan other than the council one.

Whoops forgot link: http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/42975-ACL-group-accounts-2013
 
Rob S

Rob S

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
Link to OSBs analysis of the ACL accounts. No mention of a £1.4m payment that I can see, but I always go cross eyed on finance threads.

It does mention the £4m Compass paid for shares in IECE. Again, no mention of a loan other than the council one.

Whoops forgot link: http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/42975-ACL-group-accounts-2013
Click to expand...

I guess it depends on any share agreement re: IECE shares and would income from Compass be listed as an individual item?
 
J

Jack Griffin

Guest
Rob S said:
I lose track of the various ins & outs so it might take a perusal of ACL accounts from someone with more time but IIRC, the key points are Compass loaning £4m upfront – which was used to redevelop the DeVere? – and getting sole rights to the F&B for an annual £1.4m (index-linked?) payment. This was one of the things that might have been an issue in the due dil for buying out the Higgs share?

Lots of question marks in there so take it with a pinch of salt.
Click to expand...

Where did you get this information from? Unless you can quote a publically available source either you've made it up or you have been told by someone in the know, if you were given the information by someone else then who was it that told you?

Has OSB any comment, he seemed to be aware of some IEC details, that were in ACL accounts.
 
Rob S

Rob S

Well-Known Member
TBH, I've had conversations with a fair few people about Compass-related stuff and there's been enough on here too so I don't think it comes from one place, hence all of the question marks. I'm expecting someone who knows a bit more or has a better memory to chip in and shed some more light.
 
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