SimonGilbert
Telegraph Tea Boy
It was set up at the request of the FL is my understanding. I would imagine the club's owners would still have to authorise any payment from it though.
New statement (20 Viewers)
- Thread starter Pusb1
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It was set up at the request of the FL is my understanding. I would imagine the club's owners would still have to authorise any payment from it though.
James Smith
Well-Known Member
I'm 99% sure that someone on here met her with others at Ryton at least a year ago and posted to say that they had done so afterwards. Can't remember who it was though, will try a search when I get to work.
letsallsingtogether
Well-Known Member
Of course not never Sisu fault in your eyes is it.
Personally I don't give a damn if it is human error or not.
For a million dollar company they seem to make a lot of these mistakes? this particular mistake has happened before as the judge said at the JR you shook hands on a deal only to back track when Joy found out and wouldn't approve it, is that what has happened here?
So does she agree with decisions that are made on her behalf by her employees? if not she should save her money get rid of them and do it herself.
Personally I don't give a damn if it is human error or not.
For a million dollar company they seem to make a lot of these mistakes? this particular mistake has happened before as the judge said at the JR you shook hands on a deal only to back track when Joy found out and wouldn't approve it, is that what has happened here?
So does she agree with decisions that are made on her behalf by her employees? if not she should save her money get rid of them and do it herself.
D
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Kingharvest
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
True. However, both sides have stated that they want to return and so BOTH sides need to make concessions - drop the appeal, drop the "we need the money now" bit and just talk. Sort these things out around the table out of the public eye.
I (amazingly) agree with Tony. Contact the FL and inform them how vital the next few weeks are. We can't really afford to wait for all the old blokes to gather round a table and a bottle of malt on the 7th August.
I (amazingly) agree with Tony. Contact the FL and inform them how vital the next few weeks are. We can't really afford to wait for all the old blokes to gather round a table and a bottle of malt on the 7th August.
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
Wrong SISU are to blame and I've said that a zillion times. However, I also blame ACL, so to black and whiters like yourself the second cancels out the first.
7th August is too late, is there any rules to stop a club moving grounds mid season? the revenues if we moved back in time for sheffield united (H) would be huge as they would bring a much bigger following too compared to what they can take to shitfields, the gate could be upwards of 20k.
( embarrassing to say the least if after all this bickering / petitions/ begging to go back we did not reach 20k)
( embarrassing to say the least if after all this bickering / petitions/ begging to go back we did not reach 20k)
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Had to happen sooner or later.
Plus it proves that if you throw enough shit some of it will stick
letsallsingtogether
Well-Known Member
So if everyone dropped everything and they started talking/arguing does anyone believe there is enough time to get the contracts sorted checked double checked signed in time to get us back to the Ricoh for the start of the season?
Tim said it could be done in a week I don't see it with the distrust between them.
Tim said it could be done in a week I don't see it with the distrust between them.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't worry too much about the FL's rule book. They've shown more than once during this whole sorry affair that there rules are just like the pirates code, they're more like guide lines than rules
letsallsingtogether
Well-Known Member
20k is pushing it they have lost a lot of fans be hard to get them to come back now, We had a hard core of about 8,000 before could see that being about 6,000 now.
And yes I would go back tomorrow money waiting for season ticket even thou I have been made redundant, just don't tell the missus.
And yes I would go back tomorrow money waiting for season ticket even thou I have been made redundant, just don't tell the missus.
20k is pushing it they have lost a lot of fans be hard to get them to come back now, We had a hard core of about 8,000 before could see that being about 6,000 now.
And yes I would go back tomorrow money waiting for season ticket even thou I have been made redundant, just don't tell the missus.
Lost alot of fans at the moment... but a winning side and back at the Ricoh.. people would soon forget, not to mention we are playing the best football since we even moved to the stadium under Pressley. .. high press with wingers in the side.. if only we saw that before their.. but no we had dross long ball or the Andy Thorn famous diamond which opened us up every time.
Midfield General
New Member
Steady now, you are veering towards comments of a 'football' nature there. I won't have it.
James Smith
Well-Known Member
It was kingharvest on 25-09-13 www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/37376/-Joy-Seppala-meeting-at-Ryton-Report
No future with SISU
New Member
Only if SISU drop the appeal
Rob S
Well-Known Member
A few things:
JS going missing from the web page: My guess is that the previous statement was used as a template and TF didn't delete the previous sign-off from both of them until after it went live.
JS meeting with fans: Do people remember the first time she met with fans (at Ryton?) back in September? Joey Crone talked about meeting her on his Nii Lamptey Show podcast. Cossy & I have met her a couple of times, there was dongonzalos' mini-forum not so long ago, the statement mentions meeting with the SBT board and I know of representatives from other supporters' groups having met with her too. Meeting with smaller groups of fans is something I've always advocated because it's harder for JS/TF/ML to get off the hook and people get to focus on getting deeper answers to particular questions they have. At larger forms, the depth tends to get lost in attempts to 'give everyone a chance to say something' or just lots of yelling.
The statement: It's a definite change in tone and attitude. As with the previous one, it pays to be wary and anyone getting too excited must've been on a Himalayan retreat for the past 20 years.
The legals: One of the popular theories pre-JR was that Sisu should offer to drop the JR as part of a deal to return. Personally I see any legal dropping as a point of negotiation rather than a barrier to it but then I'm a big believer in just sitting down and thrashing things out. But enough of my completely ridiculous ideas. </sarcasm>
That the talk pre-JR was 'it's really straightforward to go back & rent short-term' has now morphed into 'it's really straightforward to pay what ACL demand, drop all legal action then go back & rent short-term'. Is it me or did it just get more complicated for some people?
Overall: Do ACL actually want Sisu-owned CCFC back? Do Sisu-owned CCFC actually want to come back? The advantage of returning to the F&B debate now that CCFC & ACL have no contracts and are starting from scratch means that there's a clean slate and we could:
It's interesting to see reactions now that ACL are putting conditions down and Sisu have seemingly done an about-face. (BTW, I'm not making a judgement on who is right or wrong here, just noting that it looks like roles have been reversed somewhat.)
It's also interesting that the council / Ann Lucas were making the comments (e.g. open doors etc.) with ACL being silent whereas now ACL are saying more than I ever remember them saying and making the comments. (Again, no particular judgment, just that things seem to be a bit different.)
JS going missing from the web page: My guess is that the previous statement was used as a template and TF didn't delete the previous sign-off from both of them until after it went live.
JS meeting with fans: Do people remember the first time she met with fans (at Ryton?) back in September? Joey Crone talked about meeting her on his Nii Lamptey Show podcast. Cossy & I have met her a couple of times, there was dongonzalos' mini-forum not so long ago, the statement mentions meeting with the SBT board and I know of representatives from other supporters' groups having met with her too. Meeting with smaller groups of fans is something I've always advocated because it's harder for JS/TF/ML to get off the hook and people get to focus on getting deeper answers to particular questions they have. At larger forms, the depth tends to get lost in attempts to 'give everyone a chance to say something' or just lots of yelling.
The statement: It's a definite change in tone and attitude. As with the previous one, it pays to be wary and anyone getting too excited must've been on a Himalayan retreat for the past 20 years.
The legals: One of the popular theories pre-JR was that Sisu should offer to drop the JR as part of a deal to return. Personally I see any legal dropping as a point of negotiation rather than a barrier to it but then I'm a big believer in just sitting down and thrashing things out. But enough of my completely ridiculous ideas. </sarcasm>
That the talk pre-JR was 'it's really straightforward to go back & rent short-term' has now morphed into 'it's really straightforward to pay what ACL demand, drop all legal action then go back & rent short-term'. Is it me or did it just get more complicated for some people?
Overall: Do ACL actually want Sisu-owned CCFC back? Do Sisu-owned CCFC actually want to come back? The advantage of returning to the F&B debate now that CCFC & ACL have no contracts and are starting from scratch means that there's a clean slate and we could:
- actually ignore the machinations of the past and
- sort out a deal that reflects something reasonable within the context of modern stadium football business.
It's interesting to see reactions now that ACL are putting conditions down and Sisu have seemingly done an about-face. (BTW, I'm not making a judgement on who is right or wrong here, just noting that it looks like roles have been reversed somewhat.)
It's also interesting that the council / Ann Lucas were making the comments (e.g. open doors etc.) with ACL being silent whereas now ACL are saying more than I ever remember them saying and making the comments. (Again, no particular judgment, just that things seem to be a bit different.)
James Smith
Well-Known Member
Thanks, I didn't see your post until I had found the thread he posted.
No future with SISU
New Member
The FL would just open the drawer with all the rules in and fish out a rule allowing a club to move when it suited the FL.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
It wasn't just the sign-off. Some of the wording changed as did the headline. Besides, it really needed Joys name on it. She pulls the strings as we seen with the infamous hand shake gate.
The proposal (whatever that may be) only carries weight if Joys name is on it.
No future with SISU
New Member
Fisher is bullshitting, he said they will have to wait untill the 7th of August for the FL to make a statement about the amount owed to ACL. We all knew that and what ever the FL say SISU will have to comply. If they are serious about moveing back, pay up now and drop the Appeal.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
The FL instructed them to pay the funds into an ESCROW account. They have complied to the FL instruction.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Rob: Nothing has changed. The legal threat has always been an issue with sorting revenues.
What's happened is that Sisu are stating the same terms for a short term return as they were asking before for a long one.
Isn't the whole point of a short term deal to stop the damage while these finer details are sorted or a ground is built?
If Sisu were offering a return while negotiations were on going Id be all over it. But they're not. They're just restating the terms that lead to the fall out in the first place.
I wish all sides would realise this and refocus on a demand for a short term return immediately with no conditions from either side, rather than fall for this quite simple bait and switch.
What's happened is that Sisu are stating the same terms for a short term return as they were asking before for a long one.
Isn't the whole point of a short term deal to stop the damage while these finer details are sorted or a ground is built?
If Sisu were offering a return while negotiations were on going Id be all over it. But they're not. They're just restating the terms that lead to the fall out in the first place.
I wish all sides would realise this and refocus on a demand for a short term return immediately with no conditions from either side, rather than fall for this quite simple bait and switch.
No future with SISU
New Member
and then told the FL not to release the funds to ACL. Release the £590,000 and drop the JR appeal, a deal could then be done for a return to the RICOH. Grendel what chance do you think SISU have on winning an appeal?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
FL are meeting on the 7th to make the decision. ACL should talk knowing these funds will be paid. The JR appeal again can still be part of the negotiation process.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
I dont buy the ACL cant do a deal with the threat of legal action hanging over them line. They offered a deal in the middle of last season through the FL when the threat of legal action carried a lot more weight than it does now, given the battering sisu recieved in the JR and the likelyhood of any appeal being succesful again given the strength of the battering sisu recieved from the JR.
If anything the JR has put ACL in a stronger position for negotaition, surely?
If anything the JR has put ACL in a stronger position for negotaition, surely?
stupot07
Well-Known Member
Completely agree with you Shmmeee. There should be no pre conditions to talks, get us back short term deal ASAP then they can get on with the other crap.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
I get this it - agreed. As far as the JR appeal being part of the negotiation process though; this is a stand alone issue I would hae thought (think someone on here is is more legal beagle than me alluded to this on the thread somewhere). The leave to appeal is yet to be granted anyway.
No future with SISU
New Member
Come on let us know do you think SISU will win the appeal?
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
The irony is that they can do that as acl aren't actually party to the agreement
Even if they don't get leave to appeal they may still complain to the EU commission.
sky blue john
Well-Known Member
I know we will get the usual brigade blaming Acl for no talks. But I know I if someone was taking me to court at the same time wanting to deal with me, they would be told where to go.
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
So you would probably end up losing out then. Fair enough.
I can understand ACL wanting to tell SISU where to go, but at the end of the day they say they want the Club back at the Ricoh and there is a real chance here they could help make it happen. To just say "no" - which they have just done as it happens, makes a deal and thus a return unlikely. And yeah, SISU should drop the appeal, so the same applies to them.
Understandable? Yes. Sensible? No, not for me. Still they are apparently "very profitable" without us, so maybe they don't want us anyway.
I can understand ACL wanting to tell SISU where to go, but at the end of the day they say they want the Club back at the Ricoh and there is a real chance here they could help make it happen. To just say "no" - which they have just done as it happens, makes a deal and thus a return unlikely. And yeah, SISU should drop the appeal, so the same applies to them.
Understandable? Yes. Sensible? No, not for me. Still they are apparently "very profitable" without us, so maybe they don't want us anyway.
So if Sisu are serious about wishing to negotiate on a short term deal to return, it would make sense to drop the legal process. It will cost them nothing to do this
, and immediately remove one barrier. Are they serious in regard to returning now though?