Mowbray or Waggott (17 Viewers)
- Thread starter rupert_bear
- Start date
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
Not too bothered about SW to be honest. I think TM is a stronger person and manager and I don't think SW will be so hands on. If anyone needs to go, it's Fisher.
chinamans view
Well-Known Member
TF & SW & TM can all stay but the back room has to change, for TM to stay, imo.
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
Yeah, agree with that too. Clean sweep. Get rid of them all, even - shock, horror - Oggy.
SkyBlueJix
Member
Isn't that how Mcgoldrick came in though?
I don't get why some would think TM would demand the removal of either SW or TF. TF is chairman and not involved in the day-to-day operation. SW is CEO and not involved in the playing side - only negotiating the contracts, and TM isn't even interested in that part. There is nothing in the article to suggest TM wants TF or SW replaced - he is blaming previous managers.
Expecting TF and/or SW to go as a condition for TM to stay is just wishful thinking.
Expecting TF and/or SW to go as a condition for TM to stay is just wishful thinking.
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sp...news/tony-mowbray-coventry-city-owner-9177508
I think Mowbray has made very clear that it is his way or no way. Clearly he has a good idea about football finance as well as team management
Raises a few questions .....
- what is it about the infrastructure Mowbray sees as being wrong?
- where do SISU want to take the club both on and off the pitch?
- is Mowbray implying that previous managers were not picking the players signed? That it was SW?
- restructuring means what exactly? usually means a cost is involved?
- where will funds be diverted from if no new funds to come in? does that mean a reduced expenditure on the academy for instance?
- this is an interesting paragraph “I think Steve is applying the actions that he has to do – Tim Fisher and, obviously, Joy is the main person that has to ultimately say ‘yes we can do this.’ Because if the answer is ‘no we can’t do it,’ then let someone else have a go with this group of players because, as I said, I like processes and organisation" So is he saying he has a good working relationship with SW but things were/are blocked by TF?
- as is this paragraph "if the owners are sick of promises or false promises or hollow promises and nothing has ever come from it from managers who come and go, and the club just keeps declining, then she’s not going to invest any more money." So it is not about money but there is some expectation of investment? is it promises from previous managers or is he including SW and/or TF in that?
I hope he stays because it means he has got what he wants and is being backed financially or otherwise. Not confident that will happen and I do not think Mowbray is someone who will dither about making a decision.
The owners backing has to be solid and tangible though. I would hate to think that they say they will then when it comes to it they don't (as seems to have been the case previously). I would hate to think they get him in now, people buy their ST's and then come July & August when most players are signed (and we will need probably 9 or 10) they do not follow through on promises.
I think Mowbray has made very clear that it is his way or no way. Clearly he has a good idea about football finance as well as team management
Raises a few questions .....
- what is it about the infrastructure Mowbray sees as being wrong?
- where do SISU want to take the club both on and off the pitch?
- is Mowbray implying that previous managers were not picking the players signed? That it was SW?
- restructuring means what exactly? usually means a cost is involved?
- where will funds be diverted from if no new funds to come in? does that mean a reduced expenditure on the academy for instance?
- this is an interesting paragraph “I think Steve is applying the actions that he has to do – Tim Fisher and, obviously, Joy is the main person that has to ultimately say ‘yes we can do this.’ Because if the answer is ‘no we can’t do it,’ then let someone else have a go with this group of players because, as I said, I like processes and organisation" So is he saying he has a good working relationship with SW but things were/are blocked by TF?
- as is this paragraph "if the owners are sick of promises or false promises or hollow promises and nothing has ever come from it from managers who come and go, and the club just keeps declining, then she’s not going to invest any more money." So it is not about money but there is some expectation of investment? is it promises from previous managers or is he including SW and/or TF in that?
I hope he stays because it means he has got what he wants and is being backed financially or otherwise. Not confident that will happen and I do not think Mowbray is someone who will dither about making a decision.
The owners backing has to be solid and tangible though. I would hate to think that they say they will then when it comes to it they don't (as seems to have been the case previously). I would hate to think they get him in now, people buy their ST's and then come July & August when most players are signed (and we will need probably 9 or 10) they do not follow through on promises.
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Hugh Jarse
Well-Known Member
It's a bit like the tail wagging (no pun intended) the dog!
Is TM so arrogant that he thinks he can dictate who goes and who stays at the club? I don't think so.
Is TM so arrogant that he thinks he can dictate who goes and who stays at the club? I don't think so.
As I have said previously in posts ( and been shot down) it has been Waggott having full control of the signings incomings / outgoings, full control of the budget and would not allow several first second even third choice targets to sign last summer as they was deemed too expensive, now finally Mowbray has came out and told like it has been !!!
Wagott needs to keep his fooking nose out of the playing side / recruitment process.
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The Lurker
Well-Known Member
You reading a different article to me? It clearly states that players have/were chosen by waggott and not just Pressley. Clearly TM believes off the field were ran poorly and changes need to be made.
I think he demands a scouting system. The only off-field matter he has talked about ever since he came here has always been about scouting. The missing database that SP apparently assumed was his personal property for example.
When he speaks about structure and processes then I believe it's all about scouting (structure) and selecting players (process). He is quoted to say:
“I think Steve is applying the actions that he has to do" indicating that without a structure and process SW has continued his previous role of football director.
TM want that to change:
“I need to pick and choose them because the buck stops here with me" which is sensible and will almost certainly be acceptable to both SW and JS - as long as signings stay within the budget (which is SW's responsibility btw).
SkyBlueSid
Well-Known Member
I have no doubt that both SP and SW were responsible for the signing of players jointly. What we shall probably never know is who was having the final say. Did SW find players for SP's approval, or the other way round? Either way, it was inevitable that when it all fails it is the manager who pays with his job and the director who gets away with it.
I am impressed that TM wants the final say on players and how the budget is used. He is the one who stands or falls by those decisions and it is excellent to see he is willing to stand up against those fools. Will he be allowed to do it? I hope so but I'm not so sure they will be able to agree. TF, SW and JS are unlikely to hand over what he requires.
I am impressed that TM wants the final say on players and how the budget is used. He is the one who stands or falls by those decisions and it is excellent to see he is willing to stand up against those fools. Will he be allowed to do it? I hope so but I'm not so sure they will be able to agree. TF, SW and JS are unlikely to hand over what he requires.
I am not trying to pull TM down from the pedestal but he is actually only saying what any job applicant for a leader position would/should say:
'I know what I can do. I know what I can change. I assume full responsibility. I will work within the budgets. I am raring to go.'
If the chemistry is good between him and SW and JS he will get a two year deal.
SkyBlue_Bear83
Well-Known Member
That's the same for a lot of clubs, Liverpool for example have a 6 man transfer committee to which the manager is part of.
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And its been a massive problem the transfer strategy for Liverpool over the last 12 months, if these people actually knew anything about football it wouldn't be as bad but you've got business man and accountants picking what players should play for the club, its bonkers.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
No, Not giving it as a good example just pointing out its not just us that have done it that way.
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stupot07
Well-Known Member
Agree, but just pointing out it isn't just us, there seems to be a move towards doing it that way, look at United signing Shaw and others before van gaal even joined. Presley said it was him, McFarlane and waggot ok the committee so no businessmen or accountants picking the players.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
The Lurker
Well-Known Member
Agree, but just pointing out it isn't just us, there seems to be a move towards doing it that way, look at United signing Shaw and others before van gaal even joined. Presley said it was him, McFarlane and waggot ok the committee so no businessmen or accountants picking the players.
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Superb so your matching us up with man utd? They have millions and millions to spend on players and a massive scouting system. We have nothing. In your last 2 posts you've mentioned Liverpool and united. I find that strange. Look at bristol city, Bournemouth and burton. All teams who managers who it would be fair to say had 100% control of team fear polices and who were trying to emulate
stupot07
Well-Known Member
yes, I am matching us up with Man United...........that is exactly what I am doing ccfc=man Utd
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Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
In a nutshell isn't he saying the current regime is run by amateurs and he is a professional.
SkyBlue_Bear83
Well-Known Member
Agree, but just pointing out it isn't just us, there seems to be a move towards doing it that way, look at United signing Shaw and others before van gaal even joined. Presley said it was him, McFarlane and waggot ok the committee so no businessmen or accountants picking the players.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
The bit about businessman was more just a generalisation about the way its heading in football
Of course he is. I have done the same a few times in my career. Haven't you?
MusicDating
Euro 2016 Prediction League Champion!!
Hm - more like we all are going by this thread.
F antastic
E xpectations
A mazing
R evelations
rupert_bear
Well-Known Member
My information as asked earlier came in conversation with somebody about happenings at City and he mentioned a few things regards Waggott. So i rang someone else totally unconnected to the first person i was talking to and he confirmed to me what was said by the first chap and believes Mowbray wants full control of all things football related from top to bottom this guy. also added TM had already met and spoken to JS and others (who could these others be ?)alone a few weeks ago, so this meeting today will not be news to JS ears, so why have it. Tony Mowbray will not have spent the last few weeks sitting idly by until this meeting, a lot will have been done and costed. Look what he said recently "there's a lot of good things in place here but also a lot of unbelievable things happening, or words to that affect. I don't think for a minute Tony Mowbray would be waisting his time travelling to London without prior knowledge of certain things.
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Boro fan in peace here.
Glad to hear that Mowbray is doing well for you and that you're looking forward to keeping him on board. I rated him as a manager but his man management skills are a bit lacking, he'll frustrate you by shying away from confrontation and freezing out people he has an issue with.
He did a brilliant job for us on a non-existant budget. Managed to shift a bunch of players on £25k a week or more and brought in a better and far cheaper group of players. He'll want a scouting system to help in finding cheap, bargain players. There's still a few players in our first team who I'd value at at least £1m who we got for pennies thanks to the recruitment he put in place. George Friend is probably the best example, we snagged him for just over 100k from Doncaster and now I doubt there's anyone at the club who'd value him below 2-3 mill. Carayol was another decent deal, Grant Leadbitter was identified and snagged from Ipswich on a free transfer, Our goalie Dimitrios Konstantopoulos was a free agent also. He's very good at making the best of what he has at his disposal as well. Going forwards expect a slow paced, attractive brand of football. If he has you playing anything remotely like he had us playing then you'll be dominating possession and creating a lot of pressure. Defensively usually solid but very prone to fast, direct, counter attacking football.
Unfortunately if you're working on a strict budget then despite several very shrewd bargain signings, expect a lot of dross. Each year under Mowbray we took a gamble on a few might be players who were inevitably released after a year or 2 and made very little contribution to our seasons under him. You'll do well under Mowbray if you have a good striker. He built us a team on a very limited budget that was able to pass the ball nicely, work the ball up the pitch and create a lot of chances but not put them away. The downfall of this team was with pressure and players committed up the pitch we got shredded on the counter in just about every game. You'll also note a lack of a plan B, he can be quite stubborn and won't make changes unless they're absolutely necessary. Don't ever expect a substitute before the 70th minute!
One thing for certain is that Mowbray's biggest strength is working to a stringent budget and if nothing else then he'll leave you in a financial situation better than when he took over. Our good season this year is based on a lot of the dirty work that Mowbray did by restricting wages and transfer fees. It'll be why he's so desperate to have a decent scouting infrastructure set up as that's what made him good in the transfer market for us was identifying relatively unknown, cheap, or lower league players and spotting attributes they had that could make them a good fit for the team he's trying to build.
Glad to hear that Mowbray is doing well for you and that you're looking forward to keeping him on board. I rated him as a manager but his man management skills are a bit lacking, he'll frustrate you by shying away from confrontation and freezing out people he has an issue with.
He did a brilliant job for us on a non-existant budget. Managed to shift a bunch of players on £25k a week or more and brought in a better and far cheaper group of players. He'll want a scouting system to help in finding cheap, bargain players. There's still a few players in our first team who I'd value at at least £1m who we got for pennies thanks to the recruitment he put in place. George Friend is probably the best example, we snagged him for just over 100k from Doncaster and now I doubt there's anyone at the club who'd value him below 2-3 mill. Carayol was another decent deal, Grant Leadbitter was identified and snagged from Ipswich on a free transfer, Our goalie Dimitrios Konstantopoulos was a free agent also. He's very good at making the best of what he has at his disposal as well. Going forwards expect a slow paced, attractive brand of football. If he has you playing anything remotely like he had us playing then you'll be dominating possession and creating a lot of pressure. Defensively usually solid but very prone to fast, direct, counter attacking football.
Unfortunately if you're working on a strict budget then despite several very shrewd bargain signings, expect a lot of dross. Each year under Mowbray we took a gamble on a few might be players who were inevitably released after a year or 2 and made very little contribution to our seasons under him. You'll do well under Mowbray if you have a good striker. He built us a team on a very limited budget that was able to pass the ball nicely, work the ball up the pitch and create a lot of chances but not put them away. The downfall of this team was with pressure and players committed up the pitch we got shredded on the counter in just about every game. You'll also note a lack of a plan B, he can be quite stubborn and won't make changes unless they're absolutely necessary. Don't ever expect a substitute before the 70th minute!
One thing for certain is that Mowbray's biggest strength is working to a stringent budget and if nothing else then he'll leave you in a financial situation better than when he took over. Our good season this year is based on a lot of the dirty work that Mowbray did by restricting wages and transfer fees. It'll be why he's so desperate to have a decent scouting infrastructure set up as that's what made him good in the transfer market for us was identifying relatively unknown, cheap, or lower league players and spotting attributes they had that could make them a good fit for the team he's trying to build.
simonregis
New Member
Very impressive. You seem to be the man in the know even before the person himself knows. I will discard the CET and just tune into your threads.
SkyBlue_Bear83
Well-Known Member
It does sound from Mowbrays comments that Mowbray is basically saying he can do Waggots job as well as manager, if he does sign I'd expect Waggot to take a back seat role if not leave.
Thats cost cutting I can get behind, then replace Fisher with literately any other animal including ones who primary pastime is licking their own testicles and again great cost savings and a better quality of job done.
Hobo
Well-Known Member
Mowbray has shown what is wrong with the club, the infrastructure which Waggott was in charge of. All those people saying SP bought bad players now should be thinking it was Waggott. TM has said he want complete control on who comes in suggesting SP didn't have that,.
Waggott said SP had the final decision, but now we know it was who do you want out of these four waste of space players!
Get TM in fast!
Waggott said SP had the final decision, but now we know it was who do you want out of these four waste of space players!
Get TM in fast!
rupert_bear
Well-Known Member
Good lad, invest the 60p you are saving wisely
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Well-Known Member
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Well-Known Member
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