robbiethemole
Well-Known Member
for Port Vale!! at least they have their own stadium.
£1.25 m bid for Port Vale (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter robbiethemole
- Start date
Nope - they rent
robbiethemole
Well-Known Member
oh ok, same boat as us then, so Hoff isn't far off the mark.
MatthewWallis
Well-Known Member
Amazing what happens when you officially put the club up for a sale, a bid within a few days
How much CD?
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
£3.7M according to this article WATCH: Burslem-based IT firm makes £1.25m bid to buy Port Vale
Two hedge funds interested too apparently.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Well let's hope it is Si and Su and Port Vale just don't notice.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
It's a prop co/op co arrangement isn't it?
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Why do you always worry about how much owners are going to get I don't give a fuck. Same as ours you put a bid in and tell the fuckers to take their debt with them.
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
I'm not worried about it in the slightest but surely you can see offering to pay £1.25m and the debt is written off or paying £1.25m and inheriting £3.7m of debt to be serviced are very different things?
It makes headline figures, like the £1 or the Hoffman offer, hugely misleading which isn't in anybodies interest.
Monkeyface
Well-Known Member
Que 15 pages of "your mum's a slag" "yeah well at least my dad doesn't snog his brother" "I know you are because you said you are"
mark82
Super Moderator
Because..... And this is key.... The fuckers have to accept it. I know we all live in dreamland where they accept a couple of quid and go off into the sunset writing off everything they have put into the club (whatever figure that may be it's fairly substantial) but that isn't going to happen. It doesn't matter what anyone but Sisu think the club is worth and it's no good comparing us to any other club. It is their right as owners to value the club at whatever the fuck they like whether we like it or not. We just have to stop living in this dreamland where they are going to allow anyone to have the club for a relatively small amount debt free.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Yes and the person offering the money also values it. I bought a house last year didn't give then the money and also paid Off their mortgage. The debt is their debt if they don't like the offer they don't have to accept it.and I don't live in a dreamland our owners do if they think they are going to get anywhere near what they think they are
mark82
Super Moderator
Exactly, so they are not. It's not like buying a house though, it's buying a business where it is commonplace to inherit the debt of a company along with the assets. What Hoffman is trying to do is purchase the assets, with whatever is left of the company to be liquidated by the current owners. This means he'll need to pay at least full market value for the assets, if not more.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
it's exactly the same they will probably get the value of the assets that are left rand that will be it. People think they can hold out I think you'll find that's not true
mark82
Super Moderator
I hope you're right, I just don't have faith it will be that easy.
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
What about businesses that buy houses? Let's face it, you're out of your depth when it comes to acquisitions.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Exactly that's the business I'm in, I buy at the price I'm comfortable with I'm not concerned with other people's debts that's their business. Nobody cared when I was in debt and nearly lost everything that was my business. Sisu are no different
mark82
Super Moderator
Yes, you're right. I'm not pretending to be an expert. Sorry Mr Big Shot in your multi million dollar San Marino house (fancy buying a football club? I hear it's not worth much).
The point I'm trying to make which is being completely missed is that the seller, in this case Sisu, controls the market. I assume you think it is realistic that they will walk away with their tail between their legs and swallow everything they have put in? I really hope you are right.
mark82
Super Moderator
Could you explain why they would walk away without reclaiming what they've put in? I don't get how it is like buying a house - I genuinely want to be enlightened.
mark82
Super Moderator
Look, we want the same thing. We want Sisu gone. I just want to understand how you think they will be available for a couple of million? It might be what we think the club is worth but that is irrelevant - assume we agree on that?
I just find it pointless saying Port Vale have had an £x million bid, this shows Mr Hoffman's bid is great.
Mr Hoffman's bid is not great because it hasn't been accepted by the only people that matter... The current owners.
I respect Mr Hoffman a lot. I think people on here underestimate greatly just how successful he is and the kind of contacts he is likely to have. I don't know if you think I'm having a go at him, if so you are well wide of the mark.
The problem is Sisu will likely want an unrealistic amount. Mr Hoffman is not stupid and must know this. At the end of the day, he knows the powers within Sisu better than most as he was employed by them. Until he is able to offer something close to what Sisu want you have to consider the possibility it is for publicity. Maybe he is trying to highlight the club club? Maybe he is trying to show up the current owners? Maybe he is just playing the long game? Until Sisu accept the offer we don't know what they want. Speculating based on a club that are publicly for sale and losing money is not going to give us an answer.
Brylowes
Well-Known Member
At some point they will have to give up and walk away,
At no point will they ever get back what they've (supposedly) put in.
I'm not sure if this is a satisfactory explanation.:emoji_smirk:
mark82
Super Moderator
We hope that is the case but whilst they are breaking even or making a profit they have no real need. They will just keep cutting costs. Not sure I'd walk away whilst I could still make some of my money back unless I received the right offer.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I think it's probably better if he walks away, perhaps it's for publicity who knows. What I do know is that the price the club will go for is a lot closer to his valuation than it is to Sisus
mark82
Super Moderator
I don't mean for his own publicity. Why are you so confident that they will sell?
I hope he doesn't give up, I'd like someone like Mr Hoffman to be involved who is well respected in the business world but also has the club in his heart.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
Is this bid just for Port Vale FC or does it include the stadium?
IT has to be for both. Every element of Port Vale has to be consolidated. You have to know as a fan that if you are buying a matchday ticket, a shirt, a drink on the concourse or having your party at the club, that all the revenue is going into Port Vale FC. Only by having everything together can we achieve that.
Is it true you bid considerably more for the club a year ago? If so, why do you expect the current owner to now accept a much lower bid?
IT was more then, yes, but we are in a worse position now than we were 18 months ago. There is a lot of work we would have to do to get that goodwill back into the club. To be candid, it isn't worth what it was.
IT has to be for both. Every element of Port Vale has to be consolidated. You have to know as a fan that if you are buying a matchday ticket, a shirt, a drink on the concourse or having your party at the club, that all the revenue is going into Port Vale FC. Only by having everything together can we achieve that.
Is it true you bid considerably more for the club a year ago? If so, why do you expect the current owner to now accept a much lower bid?
IT was more then, yes, but we are in a worse position now than we were 18 months ago. There is a lot of work we would have to do to get that goodwill back into the club. To be candid, it isn't worth what it was.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
What do SISU hope to achieve in the short term, medium term and long term. If no bid of 20-30 million is coming?
What if the only bids they ever get are like this?
What if the only bids they ever get are like this?
mark82
Super Moderator
Assume they'll sell what they can (Ryton) then take what they can for the little that is left. OSB broke it down previously on another thread. Maybe there is some compromise around the £10m mark (not saying it's actually worth that). Who knows, we have no choice but to see how it plays out. Depressing.
Brylowes
Well-Known Member
Who knows, he's been known to voice his opinion of our situation in the past, from
Coventry as well isn't he.
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
I've PM'ed you.
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
The club is worth less and less every year that it is owned by SISU for the simple reason that SISU have no idea how to run a football club. Therefore, it's in their interests to sell as quickly as they can. Indeed I am sure that SISU would have got a lot more if they had sold the club before they lost the option to purchase half of ACL. Every decision they make is value destroying so if they were acting in their own best interests they would sell now.
Unfortunately, as we know from past history, Joy is totally irrational. IIRC even Fisher once said that Joy is nuts. Therefore, commonsense logic just doesn't apply to their behavior.
That said, I agree with the sentiment that GH has not offered enough. I reckon an offer of around 5m-8m should do it (with SISU having to write off all their liabilities).
Unfortunately, as we know from past history, Joy is totally irrational. IIRC even Fisher once said that Joy is nuts. Therefore, commonsense logic just doesn't apply to their behavior.
That said, I agree with the sentiment that GH has not offered enough. I reckon an offer of around 5m-8m should do it (with SISU having to write off all their liabilities).
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
Because it becomes more trouble to keep than let go.
Unless SISU can take an annual profit why would they keep it along with all the associated negative publicity.
Surely they'd be better to flip it for what they can get and move on.