Albany Meeting ? (20 Viewers)

usskyblue · Feb 14, 2019

Fuck me sideways.

No one is going to sort this out except the protagonists. Not the Trust and not the people having a pop at the Trust.

Is it ‘better to be doing something’ ? Only if it makes the individual feel better, or in some kind of control. The reality is; Absolutely fuck all will happen unless SISU/Wasps/Council figure it out.

Carry on indulging yourselves in this pointless fucking argument... I’m sure you all will.

mark82 · Feb 14, 2019

Irish Sky Blue said:
Instead of wasting your time endlessly pointing out how useless the Trust are and how they keep ignoring all of the ideas generated on here, why don’t you for once, stop carping and actually start to organise and do these things yourself. You have a platform here. You have people who listen and agree with you. If others saw the value in what you are doing, they could see it would benefit the club, they would join in. I would myself.
I await the usual “bingo” response.

Part of the problem we've had is too many different groups pushing different agendas. Time for everything to be done through the trust, not an even more haphazard approach. The trust have had communication issues, both with involved parties and fans. I personally trust @CJ_covblaze to do what is needed, and hopefully he can make sure the rest of the SBT board are pulling in the same direction.

mark82 · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
Was it constructive conversation with Haskell and ACL?

My point is nobody knows what they are doing to pressure wasps as it's top secret. The fact somebody let slip a new club might be able to play there shows they can't be pressuring too hard

Need to stop harking back to the past. Most the board members now are different. There is no evidence they are trying anything untoward so have to be given the benefit of the doubt. If it turns out they are trying to orchestrate something in the background I'll be the first to criticise, but I just don't see it.

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

mark82 said:
Need the stop harking back to the past. Most the board members now are different. There is no evidence they are trying anything untoward so have to be given the benefit of the doubt. If it turns out they are trying to orchestrate something in the background I'll be the first to criticise, but I just don't see it.

It's not really harking back to the past is it? It's pointing out something that went on then and not being blind to things because they shout about sisu.. it's also pointing out the similarities to it.

I may well be wide of the mark, decent communication (aside from CJ who tries) would have that sorted straight array.

The fact people are predicting the outcome of meetings before they happen is also based on history, as it's the same as every other time.

We need to use history and learn from it.

Deleted member 5849 · Feb 14, 2019

mark82 said:
Need the stop harking back to the past.

I think this is important, and something we all need to take on board really. Plenty I'd have done differently and, philosophically, I'd want Wasps gone, obliterated, and CCFC not to have to deal with them.

Now it comes to the crunch however, it's as much 'how can we ensure our club survives?' and that means supping at the devil's table, even if briefly.

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

Deleted member 5849 said:
I think this is important, and something we all need to take on board really. Plenty I'd have done differently and, philosophically, I'd want Wasps gone, obliterated, and CCFC not to have to deal with them.

Now it comes to the crunch however, it's as much 'how can we ensure our club survives?' and that means supping at the devil's table, even if briefly.

It also needs to be learned from and not just accepting everything as benefit of the doubt with everybody.

That's not saying walk into wasps and smash the place up, far from it. Just not accept everything they and the council say just because they aren't sisu.

Be cynical with all of them.

mark82 · Feb 14, 2019

usskyblue said:
Fuck me sideways.

No one is going to sort this out except the protagonists. Not the Trust and not the people having a pop at the Trust.

Is it ‘better to be doing something’ ? Only if it makes the individual feel better, or in some kind of control. The reality is; Absolutely fuck all will happen unless SISU/Wasps/Council figure it out.

Carry on indulging yourselves in this pointless fucking argument... I’m sure you all will.

Agree to an extent, but the Trust do have a role in trying to bring people to talks. Ultimately, as you say, only really 2 parties who can resolve it, CCFC & Wasps (and both of them).

olderskyblue · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
You know when the "why don't you do it" line comes out you have nothing else. The same as "what are you doing".

That's complete bollocks. You're using the standard line someone comes out with when they haven't got an answer. Seen it before on here.

You say you have been constructive, have lots of ideas, while also spending lots of time berating the trust and what they do, so why not put yourself up to go on their board. I'd vote for you.

mark82 · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
It also needs to be learned from and not just accepting everything as benefit of the doubt with everybody.

That's not saying walk into wasps and smash the place up, far from it. Just not accept everything they and the council say just because they aren't sisu.

Be cynical with all of them.

Agree, need to always act with some cynicism/scepticism. You need to be on the lookout for things that are wrong, but not be jumping to conclusions.

Deleted member 5849 · Feb 14, 2019

mark82 said:
Agree, need to always act with some cynicism/scepticism. You need to be on the lookout for things that are wrong, but not be jumping to conclusions.

Yup. Constructive distrust.

Ultimately, what's in it for them? has to be the approach.

Irish Sky Blue · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
Because I'm not the fans group claiming to represent fans with links to journalists am I? I can't get media coverage, I've tried before when i was pushing the tifosy thing

You know when the "why don't you do it" line comes out you have nothing else. The same as "what are you doing".

Why is it unrealistic to think a fans group would listen and maybe do something?

Read liquid gold s explanation of why he is frustrated by it.

Since I have been on this forum I have read comments from you and a few others endlessly criticising the Trust. Why when the results are so obviously frustrating for you do you continue to do so? It is obviously not getting the result that you desire, so why waste more time and energy on doing the same thing over and over.

Perhaps time to grasp the nettle. Form your own group now. As stated you have the platform and I am pretty sure that all local media outlets would be interested from hearing from any group, publicising events, meetings and giving them air time. (If Dale can get air time and column inches then surely a genuine fans group should be able to do the same). The sole aim for this group would be to try and achieve the outcome of CCFC playing at the Ricoh next year. Over the next few weeks and months all events would aim to make this happen. It can be totally pro Sky Blue and doesn’t have to be anti anybody so long as each party is willing to engage, speak and listen. Such a group may even give Wasps the chance to gain the moral high ground and say that fan pressure has made them rethink their approach.
So, over to you. A chance to do something positive that could unite fans. Use your platform and your influence here to make it happen. I disagree with most of what you say and the way that you say it. However, I would be more than willing to join in if I see it is for the benefit, or even if it is not to the detriment, of CCFC. I am sure lots of other people on here and elsewhere would feel the same and would give it support

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

olderskyblue said:
That's complete bollocks. You're using the standard line someone comes out with when they haven't got an answer. Seen it before on here.

You say you have been constructive, have lots of ideas, while also spending lots of time berating the trust and what they do, so why not put yourself up to go on their board. I'd vote for you.

How is it bollocks? It's what is said when there's no answer to it.

It's like saying if you don't like sisu doing things then just start your own team isn't it?

I've offered plenty of constructive help and offers for help with particular things I can do and help with.

I'm not always a ranty twat about them, it gets to that point after years of offering help or a slightly different view point.

Again read what liquid gold said.

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

Irish Sky Blue said:
Since I have been on this forum I have read comments from you and a few others endlessly criticising the Trust. Why when the results are so obviously frustrating for you do you continue to do so? It is obviously not getting the result that you desire, so why waste more time and energy on doing the same thing over and over.

Perhaps time to grasp the nettle. Form your own group now. As stated you have the platform and I am pretty sure that all local media outlets would be interested from hearing from any group, publicising events, meetings and giving them air time. (If Dale can get air time and column inches then surely a genuine fans group should be able to do the same). The sole aim for this group would be to try and achieve the outcome of CCFC playing at the Ricoh next year. Over the next few weeks and months all events would aim to make this happen. It can be totally pro Sky Blue and doesn’t have to be anti anybody so long as each party is willing to engage, speak and listen. Such a group may even give Wasps the chance to gain the moral high ground and say that fan pressure has made them rethink their approach.
So, over to you. A chance to do something positive that could unite fans. Use your platform and your influence here to make it happen. I disagree with most of what you say and the way that you say it. However, I would be more than willing to join in if I see it is for the benefit, or even if it is not to the detriment, of CCFC. I am sure lots of other people on here and elsewhere would feel the same and would give it support

Why don't you start your own football team? Same thing isn't it?

Why does it need so many groups? Why not have one that works effectively and is balanced?

You really don't see the point people are making do you? They could be the most constructive, thought out points but it's completely pointless trying to discuss it with you.

"Make your own"

It's not really an answer is it?

Deleted member 5849 · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
I'm not always a ranty twat about them

Just sometimes?

Irish Sky Blue · Feb 14, 2019

So your answer is to continue to pointlessly rant at an organisation that you say isn’t fit for purpose. In the meanwhile the solutions that you say would help to secure the future of our football club will never be implemented.
Seems that perhaps you would sooner complain about all and sundry rather than to implement actions that you say would help.

usskyblue · Feb 14, 2019

Can no one else see this going nowhere ? Agree to disagree for the love of everything holy.

Either way; SISU, the Council and Wasps will do what the fuck they want.

NortonSkyBlue · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
So you want to be friendly and try and cuddle up to them and take everything they say at face value without being cynical and analysing it? In fairness, you were having a go at people for pointing out Dale Evans was a con artist and look how that ended up.

Unity won't happen unless either (ideally both):

Pressure is applied to every side to try and squeeze the outcome we want, I know that the outcome I want is for CCFC to exist next year.

Everything is made purely about being pro CCFC and supporting the team.

Unfortunately, while people are more interested in focusing solely on the legals being dropped than getting a deal and SISU it won't happen. People get frustrated because they can see the same thing happening over and over, time and time again.

You see Nick, you spend your time getting personal rather than looking st what's being said.
Yes I say Let things play out with Dale Evans and he did prove to be a charlatan and that is your stick to beat me with. Oh and you do!
Yes I want to give everyone a cuddle because I think it's better to do something rather than the nothing that happens through your channel. You have a go at contributors for having a go at the owners because in your words they should be having a go at everybody but as Irish Sky Blues says you have a platform and all you do is drill holes in your constituency.
I hope sincerely that we have a club to follow whilst you and your acoloytes point out who is to blame.
Whilst you do that I hope that someone sensible is trying to build a bridge with the one group that can assist us apart from the owners, who have shown in the history you are so keen on to be intransigent.
I think you are able to sit in your tower and dispense your wisdom without taking the responsibility that some you dig at like CJ actually do cross the line and do something, even if you don't agree with it and whilst I accept your right to pick holes in arguments and certainly to hold an opinion, I do get the impression that you would rather say I told you so that actively do anything that resembles a solution.

clint van damme · Feb 14, 2019

riyadhskyblue said:
You see Nick, you spend your time getting personal rather than looking st what's being said.
Yes I say Let things play out with Dale Evans and he did prove to be a charlatan and that is your stick to beat me with. Oh and you do!

to be fair mate, he was clearly a fantasist and you were just wasting our time and your own time by not joining the witch hunt from the start!

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

riyadhskyblue said:
You see Nick, you spend your time getting personal rather than looking st what's being said.
Yes I say Let things play out with Dale Evans and he did prove to be a charlatan and that is your stick to beat me with. Oh and you do!
Yes I want to give everyone a cuddle because I think it's better to do something rather than the nothing that happens through your channel. You have a go at contributors for having a go at the owners because in your words they should be having a go at everybody but as Irish Sky Blues says you have a platform and all you do is drill holes in your constituency.
I hope sincerely that we have a club to follow whilst you and your acoloytes point out who is to blame.
Whilst you do that I hope that someone sensible is trying to build a bridge with the one group that can assist us apart from the owners, who have shown in the history you are so keen on to be intransigent.
I think you are able to sit in your tower and dispense your wisdom without taking the responsibility that some you dig at like CJ actually do cross the line and do something, even if you don't agree with it and whilst I accept your right to pick holes in arguments and certainly to hold an opinion, I do get the impression that you would rather say I told you so that actively do anything that resembles a solution.

I point out all sides are to blame, that's the problem

NortonSkyBlue · Feb 14, 2019

clint van damme said:
to be fair mate, he was clearly a fantasist and you were just wasting our time and your own time by not joining the witch hunt from the start!

Oh my god, let me get you a stick too! I don't know Dale Evans anymore than I know you but I would listen to what you had to say. You never know it might of been of some value, it costs nothing to listen. Draw your own conclusion rather that following the rabid pack.
You were correct he was a fantasist who dragged in people who had access to information that you and I didn't. For me that's called having an open mind.
Well CVD that post of yours assisted in the saving of the club didn't it?
Is that the best you can come up with?

clint van damme · Feb 14, 2019

riyadhskyblue said:
Oh my god, let me get you a stick too! I don't know Dale Evans anymore than I know you but I would listen to what you had to say. You never know it might of been of some value, it costs nothing to listen. Draw your own conclusion rather that following the rabid pack.
You were correct he was a fantasist who dragged in people who had access to information that you and I didn't. For me that's called having an open mind.
Well CVD that post of yours assisted in the saving of the club didn't it?
Is that the best you can come up with?

it was a joke.

NortonSkyBlue · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
I point out all sides are to blame, that's the problem

Yes Nick and that brings what to the table?

clint van damme · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
I point out all sides are to blame, that's the problem

is that you Astute?!

edit - that was also a joke Nick, just in case you're thinking of having a mini meltdown as well!

NortonSkyBlue · Feb 14, 2019

clint van damme said:
it was a joke.

Then my apologies!

rob9872 · Feb 14, 2019

Irish Sky Blue said:
You have a monopoly on supporting the team? Funny, but for well over fifty years I have supported the team home and away. I will be at Luton and as always I will be shouting for our team to win. That doesn’t mean that if there is something organised by the Trust and I agree with it, I wouldn’t support that too. If I did join in it would be because I would hope it would hope it would help the future of our club. Is that wrong?

Absolutely no monopoly, but you asked what we were doing so I asked you too - or are you above that?

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

riyadhskyblue said:
Oh my god, let me get you a stick too! I don't know Dale Evans anymore than I know you but I would listen to what you had to say. You never know it might of been of some value, it costs nothing to listen. Draw your own conclusion rather that following the rabid pack.
You were correct he was a fantasist who dragged in people who had access to information that you and I didn't. For me that's called having an open mind.
Well CVD that post of yours assisted in the saving of the club didn't it?
Is that the best you can come up with?

My point was that it wasn't about giving him the benefit of the doubt as it was obvious he was blagging from the start.

It's the same with all the parties in this, nobody should be taken at face value. Analyse everything, look for contradictions.

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

clint van damme said:
is that you Astute?!

edit - that was also a joke Nick, just in case you're thinking of having a mini meltdown as well!

Is that a Brexit remainer joke?

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

riyadhskyblue said:
Yes Nick and that brings what to the table?

It brings nobody getting away with taking the piss just because they aren't called sisu.

Obviously it includes hammering the crap out of SISU too.

We don't want to go with the "we believe anybody as long as they aren't SISU" route do we?

Irish Sky Blue · Feb 14, 2019

rob9872 said:
Absolutely no monopoly, but you asked what we were doing so I asked you too - or are you above that?

Not above it at all. I think I politely explained what I would be doing.

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

Deleted member 5849 said:
Just sometimes?

In the bits when I'm not being constructive, Liquid Gold sums up the frustration though.

Irish Sky Blue · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
Why don't you start your own football team? Same thing isn't it?

Why does it need so many groups? Why not have one that works effectively and is balanced?

You really don't see the point people are making do you? They could be the most constructive, thought out points but it's completely pointless trying to discuss it with you.

"Make your own"

It's not really an answer is it?

I don’t see how me starting my own football team helps us stay at the Ricoh.

The suggestion for you to start a group is that, as far as you are concerned it would seem, none of the ones that exist at the moment, particularly the Trust, is doing anywhere near enough an acceptable job. We don’t just need another group, we need one that is going to succeed in moving the situation forward.

You have the solutions. You have pushed them on here. You have this platform and already a group of like minded people. You would have support I think from most reasonable and committed fans.

Take the leap, start the group that would be in the image of what you want. Work with all sides and try to secure our future.

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

Liquid Gold said:
I have to say too the only reason I'm constantly on about this is because I genuinely want the trust to succeed. I want a good fan representative trust that puts our interests first and doesn't let us get ran over like we have time and again over the last 30 years. I'm not in a position to be at the front line so all I can do is suggest action, write emails and letters etc. I get so critical when I see bad/useless information/action because I can see the same failing pattern repeating and it isn't going to give us what we need. The trust are in a position to actually make a difference and often we get fucking nowhere with them.

This sums it up.

I'm the same with Robins when it comes to something not working and he does the same over and over as well because I want to win matches as well.

I want the Trust to succeed, I nag the shit out of my daughter if she does the same over and over because I want her to succeed too (just less swearing).

Nick · Feb 14, 2019

Irish Sky Blue said:
I don’t see how me starting my own football team helps us stay at the Ricoh.

The suggestion for you to start a group is that, as far as you are concerned it would seem, none of the ones that exist at the moment, particularly the Trust, is doing anywhere near enough an acceptable job. We don’t just need another group, we need one that is going to succeed in moving the situation forward.

You have the solutions. You have pushed them on here. You have this platform and already a group of like minded people. You would have support I think from most reasonable and committed fans.

Take the leap, start the group that would be in the image of what you want. Work with all sides and try to secure our future.

Because it's the same principle, you aren't allowed to comment (no matter how constructive) as the standard reply is "start your own". So, there's your answer. Start your own football club.

I don't have the means do I? That's why I approach the Trust and then it's a share of resources, the same as the article the other day about myths. I will keep pushing that on here / social media etc. That's what happen when people can unite, it's what people are calling out for.

You need to figure out the difference when people are being constructive or just straight up abuse. If I was calling CJ a tosser or something I'd understand it, I'm not though. I am trying my best to be constructive.

Compare that to "I'll hold up a bit of paper if they ask me to" and just nodding and back patting and it gets nowhere as it is just repetitive over and over again. The same as if I was to congratulate my daughter if she kept doing the same thing over and over even if it wasn't working. She was just go on thinking it's great and nothing could be improved.

Irish Sky Blue · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
This sums it up.

I'm the same with Robins when it comes to something not working and he does the same over and over as well because I want to win matches as well.

I want the Trust to succeed, I nag the shit out of my daughter if she does the same over and over because I want her to succeed too (just less swearing).

But you do the same thing over and over with the Trust (and a lot of other things on here). Change, do something different.

Deleted member 5849 · Feb 14, 2019

Nick said:
CJ a tosser

Now now.:rage:

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