Boro want Juke on loan (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter mattylad
- Start date
think we need to move on from the fascination of labelling people anti or pro SISU. Some people, myself included just have observatoins and opinions
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
If you check the poll from last week I think you'll find that most people dislike SISU still. The majority see the letter as rubbing salt in the wounds and many, including myself, will be protesting against Derby with as much vigour as shown against Watford.
The bottom line is that it's too late. They've lird too many times,I'll never trust them again.
Astute
Well-Known Member
Read again. I said SISU out, not dislike SISU. Most people will dislike SISU, including myself. SISU out is not an option at the moment though. We need someone willing to take us over before they go. Nobody willing to take us over with the funds to do it at the moment = SISU stay or admin. If things turn around, a few good loans come in and we start getting results then SISU will start to make fans happier. As I have said several times before I can see where a few will want SISU out whatever happens.
kg82
Well-Known Member
I did that just to wind you up!!! It's bottom left corner of your post mate!
Of the two polls on here 1.do you despise sisu75% sample 70.2. do you trust sisu95% sample circa70,this equates to about 50% of the regulars here,we're all here in either camp doing what we feel best to protect our beloved club ,not on here to score points over anyone,just observing and expressing opinion.This is asmall bubble we're in, where we represent about 1% of current crowd level,but boy we do all feel it.
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
Agreed that the poll needed more options, but I'd have still gone for hate I reckon! I could go over the multitude of reasons why yet again, but it'd be preaching to the converted and the unconvertable. Ultimately, I still want them out. I think there would still be an alternative if Dulieu hadn't deliberately broken confidentiality agreements, and their mocking, scapegoating attitude since the Hoffman deal fell through has been disguisting.
Even if there is no visible alternative consortium at this precise moment, I still feel entirely entitled to shout SISU OUT at games. It's worth pointing out that an expression of anger and opinion in the form of a protest is a valid form of expression, one as a season ticket holder I am entitled to. If I can help to make it obvious to the outside world that they aren't welcome, it can only weaken their position and help make a sale more likely in the future. It may be via a different Hoffman led consortium, who knows-he did say he'd never give up. But whatever, I want to express my anger at the owners and board.
Bottom line, I think we'll be relegated due to the way they have ran the club and weakened the squad. If we survive and prosper, I'll accept that they knew what they were doing all along.
Even if there is no visible alternative consortium at this precise moment, I still feel entirely entitled to shout SISU OUT at games. It's worth pointing out that an expression of anger and opinion in the form of a protest is a valid form of expression, one as a season ticket holder I am entitled to. If I can help to make it obvious to the outside world that they aren't welcome, it can only weaken their position and help make a sale more likely in the future. It may be via a different Hoffman led consortium, who knows-he did say he'd never give up. But whatever, I want to express my anger at the owners and board.
Bottom line, I think we'll be relegated due to the way they have ran the club and weakened the squad. If we survive and prosper, I'll accept that they knew what they were doing all along.
Does that mean we're going to be subjected to this bollox all season?
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
There's nothing wrong with concern. However, I do have a problem with making up stuff just because it suits. That just makes the poster look stupid. For example, the comment I read somewhere that Juke was on his way up the motorway as I type and the deal will be done tonight. Why do people put that kind of rubbish on a public forum? I just don't understand what some posters get out of lying. It baffles me.
Again?
Still, people have the right to be concerned.
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
Was there any sign of the protesting fans at the Watford game not getting behind the players and manager as well? Most objective observers would have to admit that they also led the songs backing the players, of which we had far more than usual. The atmosphere created was one of the best for a while-and in front of a relatively paltry crowd at that.
Nevertheless, I suppose I have to get ready for other fans telling me to shut up and back the team on Saturday, even if I do just that when not singing "**** off SISU, SISU *** off"?
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
Bit late..I kinda expected AT to have a reasonable transfer budget over the summer to at least be competitive this season, which is part of my frustration. IF he'd had that, I think we'd be play-off challengers rather than relegation strugglers.
ICHAN
Well-Known Member
Every pre-season we get were going to buy players, X amount of funds are available for the manager for transfers etc etc and this always happens when the ST are just about to come out, then people buy them on this faith, then when this does not materialize people can't beleive that they have been duped into getting them again(this is not a go at any individual nonleague!).
This happens no matter who is/was in charge it's the way it is,always has been always will be.
This happens no matter who is/was in charge it's the way it is,always has been always will be.
skyblueinBaku
Well-Known Member
Well said, Otis. Because of the wording, I abstained.
ashbyjan
Well-Known Member
Why can some people not grasp the concept that fans can support the team but that doesn't mean they have to support our owners. Why would chants of SISU out cause our players to become demoralised and play badly then a few seconds later when they hear Play Up Sky Blues they will suddenly change up a gear and perform brilliantly? At the Watford game the atmosphere at a really dire game was actually enhanced by the anti-SISU chanting which was interspersed with a lot of pro-team support and the balance was about right. Obviously 90 minutes of SISU out would be tedious but a fair balance of the two would be good. A couple of pronouncements from up high by Onwe and an estate agent and the fact we have to be grateful that the entire squad wasn't decimated haven't exactly turned us pro-SISU and many reserve the right not to spend the 90 minutes tugging their forelocks and thanking the SISU masters for granting them some semblence of a team to support.
ICHAN
Well-Known Member
I don't think there is anything wrong with what some are doing as they have the right to say and do whatever they want (free country and all that) the whole game would be abit mind numbing I must admit, but I think if you want to do this then go into one area to make your voice's known (bit difficult if you have a season ticket for a differant area granted) however do you really think they give a shit?
If I owned the club and people were singing to get me out etc etc I wouldn't give a damn because at the end of the day your still giving me money by coming in and watching the team play, no board really gives a shit there all in it for the money, and whoever took us over would do the same weather that be hoffman or whoever, hoff is not putting his money in and would still have the same constraints, as the people with the money will want a return and will not just throw money at us willy nilly.
If I owned the club and people were singing to get me out etc etc I wouldn't give a damn because at the end of the day your still giving me money by coming in and watching the team play, no board really gives a shit there all in it for the money, and whoever took us over would do the same weather that be hoffman or whoever, hoff is not putting his money in and would still have the same constraints, as the people with the money will want a return and will not just throw money at us willy nilly.
ashbyjan
Well-Known Member
Personally I don't care who owns us, whether its SISU, Hoffman or Uncle Tom Cobley and I accept their right to make a profit as we will never attract a sugar daddy to be their play things. However what I do object to is the lack of a communicated plan, the half truths, the lack of answers to questions, the hiding behind non established proposals, the expectation that we should cow tow because they have issued a couple of statements that actually acknowledge the existence of us the supporters, statements that actually used a lot of words to say Jack All and the inference that we should just show blind faith in whatever secret plan SISU are following. Their track record so far has been lamentable as the current state of the team shows and their lack of communicating the "masterplan" for our salvation is still apparently too secret for us mere supporters to be privy to.
Astute
Well-Known Member
If you mean my opinion, I guess so yeah
So you are admitting to coming out with lots of bollox then?
ICHAN
Well-Known Member
Thing is ashbyjan.
If they did no-one would believe them, there were untruths when others were in charge to say whats going on when sisu have been in control not just iggy pop and the like.
People believed operatin prem etc and that was a load of clap trap as well.
They can all say things to make everyone feel better but the bottom line is there all full of shit no matter who it is.
In a way they can not win (rightly or wrongly) I think it just depends on what side of the fence you sit and weather your going to have a say or not about things.
Personally I am on the side of the fence that unfortunatly there is no alternative (admin would be a total disaster and hands on hearts I don't think many would see that as a solution) and while they are here weather thats to just keep us going as a club (not ideal I think the majority would agree, as we all want better for the club and team) then so be it at least we have a club and are not relegated or worse non existant.
If they did no-one would believe them, there were untruths when others were in charge to say whats going on when sisu have been in control not just iggy pop and the like.
People believed operatin prem etc and that was a load of clap trap as well.
They can all say things to make everyone feel better but the bottom line is there all full of shit no matter who it is.
In a way they can not win (rightly or wrongly) I think it just depends on what side of the fence you sit and weather your going to have a say or not about things.
Personally I am on the side of the fence that unfortunatly there is no alternative (admin would be a total disaster and hands on hearts I don't think many would see that as a solution) and while they are here weather thats to just keep us going as a club (not ideal I think the majority would agree, as we all want better for the club and team) then so be it at least we have a club and are not relegated or worse non existant.
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
No, I said IF you mean my opinion (meaning his opinion of my opinion), then yes. Obviously I didn't believe my opinion is "bollox", as that would make me insane. Please grow up and stop talking so much pro-SISU flange yourself, or this will just turn into a slanging match.
kg82
Well-Known Member
Otis
Well-Known Member
Depends on whether it was a Flounder or not.
Astute
Well-Known Member
It already is. You always seem to think that if anyone does not have the same views as yourself then they must love SISU. I frequently say I am not happy with SISU. I also frequently say what else have we got? OK let's get SISU out. Then what? Would you be happy going into admin? I guess someone with lots of millions will suddenly appear. I will be as happy as anyone when SISU finally go. Not before we have funding from somewhere though. You keep going on about how small our squad is. Are we making a profit yet? I don't think so. SISU do not have to or will not just walk away after putting all the cash in they have.
I have listened to what you have to say lots of times. You want SISU out. You are yet to say what you would be happy with if SISU pulled out today considering there are not investors queueing up at the gates. I am looking at things in reality, not constantly saying what I want the most.
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
Ok, so no need for the bollux stuff then!
The reason I voice my opinion is because if people only read/see things in favour of the owners-or at least passively accepting of the status quo-it would look as if everyone felt like that. And I for one don't.
I'm sorry if you don't like my opinion, but what can I do about that? Change it for someone elses sake? Just shut up because you don't agree? I'm not "slanging", I'm arguing what I believe. If you want to just say somethings bollux, surely you can see that you'll be met with something similar in kind?
And yes, my insult was to call you a SISU fan above in response to the bollux comment!
The reason I voice my opinion is because if people only read/see things in favour of the owners-or at least passively accepting of the status quo-it would look as if everyone felt like that. And I for one don't.
I'm sorry if you don't like my opinion, but what can I do about that? Change it for someone elses sake? Just shut up because you don't agree? I'm not "slanging", I'm arguing what I believe. If you want to just say somethings bollux, surely you can see that you'll be met with something similar in kind?
And yes, my insult was to call you a SISU fan above in response to the bollux comment!
Johnnythespider
Well-Known Member
Depends if it had tits macca:thinking about:
Astute
Well-Known Member
So just answer the question then. Most of us want SISU out but there is no alternative to them at the moment. So they go....what next when there is no investors ready to take over. Would you be happy with admin?
ICHAN
Well-Known Member
There is no solution, I have asked and pointed out the same question but nobody has yet come up with a viable answer because there is not one.
There is no one queing up to buy us but because some just unfortunatly accept and realise that there is no alternative to the situation we are labelled that we support sisu , however common sense will tell you there is no alternative, it does not mean that I/we are happy with it, protest fine but as I said early they will not give a monkeys arse what you do they are/will be here until they decide otherwise.
No-one is saying that everyone has to like it.
There is no one queing up to buy us but because some just unfortunatly accept and realise that there is no alternative to the situation we are labelled that we support sisu , however common sense will tell you there is no alternative, it does not mean that I/we are happy with it, protest fine but as I said early they will not give a monkeys arse what you do they are/will be here until they decide otherwise.
No-one is saying that everyone has to like it.
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
"So just answer the question then"-sorry, I didn't realise it works like that! All these posts and I've been doing it wrong all along, egg on face for me. Maybe you should just book me for an interview if you care about my opinions so much? Or even better, just add me to your "ignore" list.
You also seem to think that it really is that simple-I want SISU out, so I have to provide you with an alternative. Ignoring the aspect of my anger that is caused by SISU deliberately destroying a credible bid. If there is an alternative, Ken will just use his black arts ("industrial espionage" he's in, isn't it?) to ensure that it never gets off the ground. Anyone else will want confidentiality agreements too!
But seeing as you asked so nicely:
1) I don't think admin an option SISU will take unless they have no option whatsoever. They'd lose far too much money.
2) If they do (which I doubt they will) it will make it more likely that we'll attract a buyer. 30m for a bottom of Championship/soon to be L1 squad won't attract many people with sense, and we don't own the stadium so another outlay would be needed straight after the initial purchase. So according to that logic, I should want admin?
3) I don't, because it hurts lots of people who have done absolutely nothing wrong. Anyone with an unpaid bill will suffer, and I have nothing against them.
So no, I don't want admin-I want SISU to act in the interests of the club and the supporters and listen to any interested parties-not scare them away with dodgy practice and unprofessionalism. But the owners only care about their investors, and the best deal for them. If that means reducing all costs until we are a L2 side making a slight profit, then selling us, so be it. It's more important to them to try and make some money than it is to protect the interests of the club, i.e. the supporters. If a bid is great for the club but not what they want, we're screwed. Doesn't mean I have to just take it, though.
If you just lie down and accept something you don't like, you'll never change it. People mocked Brinner for going to the SISU offices until he kicked up a right stink. At least if they realise that the fans won't stand by and watch them destroy the club, they might think twice before shafting us and lying? The open letter suggests they have a long way to go, but its very release indicates that they know they have a case to answer-however badly they chose to defend their position. Many have said that it appears to be a response to protests and a bid to deter others against Derby. It's so plainly false that it's just irked me further.
I've got plenty to be angry about, and rather than being apathetic and saying "well what can I do?", I feel I have to at least wear my heart on my sleeve. I love my football club, and hate the way it is being mismanaged by a particular type of parasite produced by the modern capitalist system.
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
You're on your knees and someone has a gun to your head. Do you just accept it, there's nothing you can do, or do you fight anyway, regardless of the splatty consequences? It may make no difference to SISU, but I'll at least do all I can to make things tough for them.