Broken Britain (2 Viewers)

I can't approve of allowing thuggery in schools and encouraging bullying by bringing back corporal punishment, violence is not the way to educate children.

However, we have to accept that there are people who do not belong in society, and I'm in favour of bringing back a permanent solution.

I'd like to agree with some of the above.

I was just listening to a chap in my office who was telling someone how they should get a Kindle as they're brilliant and he has over 1000 books on his (not paid for). This is a well paid man with a respectable job and family who in one breath supports chastising thuigs and rioters but encourages piracy.
It got me thinking, aren't we all the same and in fact enery one in the country is corrupt?

- We are waiting on every word Cameron says as to what will happen to the victims/"criminals" - He is corrupt and lies as all our MP's do!

- The media is in a frenzy about this - The same organisations that condone tapping a grieving mothers phone

- We put up with a cut in lifestyle luxuries because bankers have not taken necessary precautions with our money, but they get away with it

- Police - only recently proven to be corrupt and now very high and mighty due to the "handling" of London

- Law abiding citizens (the fun bit)

Can you answer no to all of the following?:-

Illegally download music/films/ebooks?
Get into football or any event for student prices?
Lied about your childrens age to save a few quid on entrance fees?
Dodged a train fair because you didn't see the conductor?
Taken anything from a hotel?
Watched a live football stream on the internet which was not intended to be shown in the UK?
Copied a DVD or VHS that you didn't own?
Copied a CD that you didn't own?
Stolen anything from work?
Sold somebody something knowing that it was faulty?
Not paid somebody money back as they never mentioned it again?
Driven without Tax/Insurance or whilst over the drink drive limit?
Watched any films or clips on the internet that the copyright owner hadn't given permission for? (You know what sites I mean :jerkit
Broken or smashed any public/private property and not owned up?
Broken or entered any private property wthout the owners permission?
Done anything that you know is illegal in law or by your own moral compass and not confessed?

Personally I've done loads of these things but for some reason people see me as upstanding and intelligent. That's because I know how to get hold of films without having to smash a window.

That's what it comes down to for me. The people who are doing this are of a working class but it is no different to the time I stood in a queue of a cash machine that I knew was giving double bubble (it ran out as I got to it ). I wouldn't have regretted that if I got a £250 bonus, I would have loved it.
So, I'm guilty of a stream of "civilised" crimes but no-one is listening to my stories and frog marching me to the police station.

I think the problem is that we are all corrupt and because no-one has a clear concience. That is why we all jump on these "hoodies" to make an example because it makes us feel better. When the hoodies are gone we'll jump on the next level but still have a tinge of something in our heads. We'll do this again and again until the bankers and politicians are gone. Keep going until there is no-one left but you!
Now you have to deal with this tinge. The tinge is the fact that you are corrupt but you don't consider yourself corrupt because you know someone worse.
The way to solve this is to clean yourself out first and the byproduct is that reform will spread.

Just wondered your thoughts?



I know there wil be a few people who can read this and give a big grin because they have a clean and unchequered past.
To those peolple I throw a salute and hope to become more like you by the day!

I prefer the more intelligent crimes, running off with a poxy plasma is hardly the act of a clever person is it. Bums.

Doing those things doesn't involve smashing people's property though does it? Life is too short to worry about some of the petty things on that list - for example if I wanted to watch say an episode of the Peep Show which I didn't own on DVD (I do actually own this btw ) I'd happily watch it somewhere for free online, I wouldn't go without. You could argue some of the things are for the greater good as well eg going to a match with a student price when you are not a student - if the price difference is enough for it to decide if you can afford to go or not, I'm sure the club would accept less for what otherwise would be an empty seat and business lost. You are not making anyone's life miserable doing these things unlike the rioters, you are just getting the best deal for yourself, which is human nature,

I don't know if this has already been posted, but this is another of a series of incendiary columns by the Daily Telegraph's Peter Oborne:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/p...r-society-is-as-bad-at-the-top-as-the-bottom/

Links to what TheTruthMissPiggy is pointing out

SkyBluesAndy said:

Doing those things doesn't involve smashing people's property though does it? Life is too short to worry about some of the petty things on that list - for example if I wanted to watch say an episode of the Peep Show which I didn't own on DVD (I do actually own this btw ) I'd happily watch it somewhere for free online, I wouldn't go without. You could argue some of the things are for the greater good as well eg going to a match with a student price when you are not a student - if the price difference is enough for it to decide if you can afford to go or not, I'm sure the club would accept less for what otherwise would be an empty seat and business lost. You are not making anyone's life miserable doing these things unlike the rioters, you are just getting the best deal for yourself, which is human nature,

Click to expand...

You prove my point precicely. WE (the civiliced, middle classes) think that these acts are "petty" and as no one is physically hurt that it doesn't matter.
I'll use Barnsley as an example so this doesn't get turned into a ticket price discussion. Basically they are a business who get to dictate how much they charge for an entertainment product. They have no small print that says "if you can't afford it or feel that it is worth the money then please pay what you feel appropriate so we can fill the seat". Also to use your Peep Show example, I heard Richard Herring on the radio the other day saying how him and Stewart Lee have used their own money to produce a Fist of Fun DVD and they've invested alot in to it. He was urging people to buy it as it is likely they'll make a loss. If people who watch online pirate programming should sit down and write a letter to explain to the writer why it is ok what they have done. People hide behind the internet because they break the law annonomously. At least those chaps have the guts to do it on CCTV and on national News

We have convinced ourselves that all media (music, TV etc) creates well off people and that if it's been at the cinema or on TV then it now has no value and we have the right to see it.
Doesn't your "I wouldn't go without" attitude sum up the "me me me" culture we all live in now?
What do you think then about someone having £2000 of pirated books on their Kindle? Do you believe that all of the authors of those books are all financially sound and that they wouldn't appreciate the money from all of the copies that are freely distributed?

Back in the days when people had some moral fibre if you realised you were £5 short for a ticket you would have either earned some more money, borrowed some or gone without. You remember people who had free tickets for distributing the pools coupons? Well that was me, I did that because I couldn't afford to go.

You are not owed anything. Repeat after me "I am not owed anything". Sounds odd doesn't it?

So SISU and CCFC don't owe you right to watch a game without paying full price
The creators of Peep Show don't owe you their shows just because you want some instant gratification

Do me a favour, if you ever know of someone entering the Ricoh with the wrong ticket. Please make them tell the ticket chap "I'm sure the club would accept less for what otherwise would be an empty seat and business lost". There is merit in your statement if people were up front about this, but they are not. They are sneaky. They buy the tickets online and sneak in without drawing attention. I did it recently where I didn't pay for my boy as he was a few days over 2 but I lied and did it sneakily. I would never have stood up and said when buying a ticket that they should let him in for free because they would be better for the business of me paying.
No business would begrudge a true hardship case but actaully now days people just want to get everything cheaply so they can spend on other things.
In truth I am having a really tight month and if I hadn't got my son in for free I wouldn't have gone, but that only errodes my decency even further because I "got away" with it. I could have gone without a few premium brands on my weekly shop and saved this money but I didn't see the importance.

In essence these rioters are just a few levels on from me, they look at Dixons and see it's insured so it's a "victimless" crime. The same as your online viewing dilema that people face. Getting anything for free costs someone money. Obviously SISU directors and Channel 4 owners aren't going to starve for the actions of a 30 minute free viewing fix. But there is always a food chain and someone will get cut adrift. If it's the coach of a Saturday kids football coaching club or the window cleaner. They cost someone a job.

Apologies for the rant. I'm annoyed because everyone seems a bit of a corrupt shell of a human nowdays and that includes me. I don't notice how bad I am because the broadcast media organisations forces it down my throat that others are worse than me (including themselves).

In 2 weeks I am going to drive to the attraction that I went to the other day and pay the amount and discuss what I did. I'm also going to go and buy a full price copy of Elbows new album as someone gave me a copy of it and I accepted it. Bsically, today I am not going to be a cretin. Hopefully I will spend more days like that

DoYouSpeakClingan? said:

I don't know if this has already been posted, but this is another of a series of incendiary columns by the Daily Telegraph's Peter Oborne:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/p...r-society-is-as-bad-at-the-top-as-the-bottom/

Links to what TheTruthMissPiggy is pointing out

Click to expand...

This is a great find. I know alot of people will read it and find it to be incendiary, but that is because it is about them and it threatens their comfortable notion that a hookey copy of Microsoft Office is our right as we paid for a PC in 1996 that had a printed licence with it for Office '95.
I love reading it, it rips me to pieces but I see that for us to carry on as a race we need to change and start respecting everything.

After such an admission of guild from the truthful piggy, I felt it to be in the public interest that I reported him. Don't sleep too soundly tonight and expect a knock on your door at any moment.

I hope the Didcot Steam and Railway Centre don't send the heavies around!

In seriousness though, this is the other thing. We live safe in the knowledge that the police can do without people reporting "petty" crimes as they don't have time to act. If I knew there was a chance that a police officer knocked on my door to ask why I felt it right to have a copied music CD I would never have accepted it.
Get one to give me a knock, it'll sort me right out.

The may be petty in your book, but as a struggling writer and musician I can barely afford to put food on my table. You should be locked up with the drug dealers and murderers.

I hope you understand that I agree with you Rob. I live with a struggling musician which makes me struggle and I find it absolutley sickening that I can see her work online for free but can't do anything about it. I am getting rid of all digital media that I can and replacing it with physical products.
Music is the first one to change. I have got hold of a record player and am going to buy all of my favourite albums on vinyl (when funds permit).
The last album I bought and didn't play for a week so that I could get familliar with the artwork and think about the lyric meanings. When I did listen to it from start to finish it was really special and reminded me of when I used to save up pocket money and there was suspense for the first listen. Very unlike hearing a song on the radio and thinking "I'll download that album on I tunes for £3.99 and if I don't like it I'll just delete it".

Sorry mate, I'm not taking the p*ss but was only meant as I joke. I don't have a musical or artistic bone in my body. I do agree with your points though

Fair one. You got me there. I thought you were the next tragically deppressed and starved artist who found fame after their untimely death

If it'll help musically, I can go round and shoot him ?