Carsley, what sre you thinking?! (2 Viewers)

AFCCOVENTRY

Well-Known Member
Why upset the apple cart now with appointing a new manager. Let Carsley roll till the end of the season. Good interview after the game where he is still hurting and baffled what went wrong last Sat. Guy is 100% committed to our cause.
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
... I'm not getting bored of being right.

You're not right because you are making false claims.

Pretty much most posters have agreed that the 451 works away from home - put away record is fantastic. It works because it gives defensive strength and means we can play on the break.

It hasn't worked at home because we have to dictate play, teams sit back and we're not good enough to break them down. Played 17 won 5 drawn 5 lost 7.

Everyone except you seems to acknowledge the need to try something different and play 2 strikers. You talk about Man U, there 4411 is with 2 strikers not 1, Rooney plays in the hole and makes runs in beyond van persie and when the ball is out wide is right in te box to get on te end of crosses.

Incidentally - we conceded crewes 2nd after Moussa had came on for Elliott so we were already 451.

451 away from home is perfect, it just isn't that effective at home, not necessarily saying 442 is.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
No you just don't acknowledge when you are wrong

We beat bury and Crewe with 442 but u only pipe up if we lose

Hang on, I've said we were poor v Bury and Crewe, or are we forgetting that? I also remember kicking up a fuss about 4-4-2 despite beating Sheff U 2-1.

I weren't really on SBT to moan about Bury had no internet until I got home v Bury (iPad has no 3G, forget paying for that!) and I did moan about 4-4-2 v Crewe when we beat Crewe 2-0 as well, I've been criticising 4-4-2 all season including in pre-season.

People only largely kicked a fuss over the diamond and 4-5-1 after we loss, are they exempt? That's a bit unfair don't you think?

The facts point out that we are a FAR better side when playing 4-5-1.
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
Hang on, I've said we were poor v Bury and Crewe, or are we forgetting that? I also remember kicking up a fuss about 4-4-2 despite beating Sheff U 2-1.

I weren't really on SBT to moan about Bury had no internet until I got home v Bury (iPad has no 3G, forget paying for that!) and I did moan about 4-4-2 v Crewe when we beat Crewe 2-0 as well, I've been criticising 4-4-2 all season including in pre-season.

People only largely kicked a fuss over the diamond and 4-5-1 after we loss, are they exempt? That's a bit unfair don't you think?

The facts point out that we are a FAR better side when playing 4-5-1.
We didn't play 442 in pre-season is was thorn and his bloody diamond.
 

harvey098

Well-Known Member
Everybody jumps on SBT back and it's starting to piss me off. I'm sure he could say that Coventry play in sky blue and some would argue with him. Fuck off and get a life this is a sad little internet forum.
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
I wouldn't think that, no, but your average British fan would, because they don't have the patience for that style of play, they want strength, power, pace and then technicality, that's why our national team has failed badly and have dropped out of the international elite of football. No, in fact, I'm wrong somewhat, they'd respect the names however, if they weren't 'names', and played like they did, they'd be critcised and would be called lazy.
.

What absolute tosh.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Everybody jumps on SBT back and it's starting to piss me off. I'm sure he could say that Coventry play in sky blue and some would argue with him. Fuck off and get a life this is a sad little internet forum.

I think he can stand up for himself. Still stand by this?

"I would prepare a constructive argument but it would be lost on Grendel and his clear lack of football understanding so instead I will go with this; leon Clark is shit."
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
You're not right because you are making false claims.

Pretty much most posters have agreed that the 451 works away from home - put away record is fantastic. It works because it gives defensive strength and means we can play on the break.

It hasn't worked at home because we have to dictate play, teams sit back and we're not good enough to break them down. Played 17 won 5 drawn 5 lost 7.

Everyone except you seems to acknowledge the need to try something different and play 2 strikers. You talk about Man U, there 4411 is with 2 strikers not 1, Rooney plays in the hole and makes runs in beyond van persie and when the ball is out wide is right in te box to get on te end of crosses.

Incidentally - we conceded crewes 2nd after Moussa had came on for Elliott so we were already 451.

451 away from home is perfect, it just isn't that effective at home, not necessarily saying 442 is.

As I have pointed out, we have lost more games playing 4-4-2 than 4-5-1 at home. we score less and concede a similar amount of goals, down to tactics so it seems because under LC we've kept 3/4 clean sheets.

Interesting you mention Rooney, he's not a typical '9' striker, he is becoming much more a playmaking '10', but with a striker's ability to score goals, also, something that has bugged me for ages about Rooney is that when his team is out-of-possession, he has a habit of dropping far too deep and becomes something of a midfielder in this respect, Rooney has serious potential to become a fantasic '10'. I like playing him striker for England in a 4-3-3 because he can play somewhat as a 'false 9' and England can have that Spainish/Barca 'esque' swag about us, like v Brazil.

I think 4-5-1 will work at home, I think tactics need to be looked at and adjusted, because whatever formation we play, we have underperformed at home, so I think we need to play our best formation which is 4-5-1 and 4-4-2 will never be effective with CCFC until we get another striker who is actually good, not Cody or Elliott (!), and 'orthodox' wingers.

Yes that is correct on Saturday, 5m after we made that transition, and we only played 4-5-1 for 8m as when Wilson came on, we went back to 4-4-2, and nothing happened, on Saturday we struggled because we couldn't play down the middle, and 4-4-2 restricts abilty to play through the middle as there is no 'middle man' to pick up the passes.

Perhaps at home we need to change personnel, approach the game differently?
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
We didn't play 442 in pre-season is was thorn and his bloody diamond.

That was because people were saying we should play 4-4-2, and I practically wrote an essay on the weaknesses of the formation and gave practical examples and how we don't suit and this season hasn't exactly proved me wrong has it?
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
And sheff utd.

You know I was criticising 4-4-2 in that instance, ask CCFC (forum user), he should remember that well.

Not my fault I'm not a nostalgic middle-aged person who has seen 4-4-2 succeed, I'm part of the youth that has seen 4-4-2 fail to much for me to accept it as a suitable formation for England nor CCFC.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
You know I was criticising 4-4-2 in that instance, ask CCFC (forum user), he should remember that well.

Not my fault I'm not a nostalgic middle-aged person who has seen 4-4-2 succeed, I'm part of the youth that has seen 4-4-2 fail to much for me to accept it as a suitable formation for England nor CCFC.

...even though we won two of the last 3 games playing it.
 

covcity4life

Well-Known Member
Hang on, I've said we were poor v Bury and Crewe, or are we forgetting that? I also remember kicking up a fuss about 4-4-2 despite beating Sheff U 2-1.

I weren't really on SBT to moan about Bury had no internet until I got home v Bury (iPad has no 3G, forget paying for that!) and I did moan about 4-4-2 v Crewe when we beat Crewe 2-0 as well, I've been criticising 4-4-2 all season including in pre-season.

People only largely kicked a fuss over the diamond and 4-5-1 after we loss, are they exempt? That's a bit unfair don't you think?

The facts point out that we are a FAR better side when playing 4-5-1.

Don't give me British fan crap. I adore serie a which is tactical as it gets and that teaches you one thing

Any formation can work if tinkered with

If csrsley wants to continue using 442 I'm sure its because he thinks it can work

Dismissing it is just wrong even if it is fashionable

Put down world soccer magazine and actually watch the game mate
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
You know I was criticising 4-4-2 in that instance, ask CCFC (forum user), he should remember that well.

Not my fault I'm not a nostalgic middle-aged person who has seen 4-4-2 succeed, I'm part of the youth that has seen 4-4-2 fail to much for me to accept it as a suitable formation for England nor CCFC.
Yep despite Robins saying the first half was as close to perfect as it gets
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
What absolute tosh.

Tell why so many British fans accept 4-4-2 as a good formation where our fellow foreign counterparts disagree, they best teams, club and international, in the world do not play 4-4-2 and haven't done for sometime.

I'll give you an example for a L1 player who is talented as a footballer and gets accused of being lazy and gets slated for his physicality; John Fleck, is a fantasic player when the ball comes to his feet, sometimes tries too hard to make things happen, like Baker and better off it than some fans make out (you & Grendel) and use call him lazy etc. well no, he's not, he's just a different breed of player, and doesn't run around like a headless chicken with no skill, like Doyle, who many admire, but he isn't a good player at all, just a dick who runs around, Fleck would be appreciated more if he was playing in European leagues such as Germany and Spain.

Many English fans and tabloids were slating Pirlo's physicality before our game v Italy, then he shown us (and Germany) up, then we changed our mind.

Fans in Britain fixate on pace, strength and stamina more than they should and more than their counterparts in South America and continental Europe.
 

hill83

Well-Known Member
Don't give me British fan crap. I adore serie a which is tactical as it gets and that teaches you one thing

Any formation can work if tinkered with

If csrsley wants to continue using 442 I'm sure its because he thinks it can work

Dismissing it is just wrong even if it is fashionable

Put down world soccer magazine and actually watch the game mate

You are a football hipster to be fair chap. You know your shit.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
Don't give me British fan crap. I adore serie a which is tactical as it gets and that teaches you one thing

Any formation can work if tinkered with

If csrsley wants to continue using 442 I'm sure its because he thinks it can work

Dismissing it is just wrong even if it is fashionable

Put down world soccer magazine and actually watch the game mate

I don't read FourFourTwo (accept season preview) nor WorldSoccer and ironically for you, I have formed my opinions watching 4-4-2 fail, over and over, and then reading documents from coaches and people like Cruyff promoting 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1.

You are one instance, I'm generalising the millions of football fans that watch football per week, I also like Serie A, Bundesliga and La Liga, and you know what, not many teams play 4-4-2 in those division do they?
 

kingharvest

New Member
All this bickering is ruining a hilarious thread.

Now, can we please get back to the subject matter and carry on takin the piss out of Liam? Come on Liam, laugh it off mate - we've got it horribly wrong at some point!
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
Tell why so many British fans accept 4-4-2 as a good formation where our fellow foreign counterparts disagree, they best teams, club and international, in the world do not play 4-4-2 and haven't done for sometime.

I'll give you an example for a L1 player who is talented as a footballer and gets accused of being lazy and gets slated for his physicality; John Fleck, is a fantasic player when the ball comes to his feet, sometimes tries too hard to make things happen, like Baker and better off it than some fans make out (you & Grendel) and use call him lazy etc. well no, he's not, he's just a different breed of player, and doesn't run around like a headless chicken with no skill, like Doyle, who many admire, but he isn't a good player at all, just a dick who runs around, Fleck would be appreciated more if he was playing in European leagues such as Germany and Spain.

Many English fans and tabloids were slating Pirlo's physicality before our game v Italy, then he shown us (and Germany) up, then we changed our mind.

Fans in Britain fixate on pace, strength and stamina more than they should and more than their counterparts in South America and continental Europe.

Fleck has only shown talent in small flashes since coming to Cov, he hasn't influenced games enough on a consistent basis like Baker has this season.

Baker isn't fast or strong but isn't regarded as lazy and is thought by a lot of fans to be player of the season so how does that fit?

Fleck has potential but I would be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed so far
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
Yep despite Robins saying the first half was as close to perfect as it gets

Depends what he wanted, AB would've said we played close to perfect in games we've played in, and he's a hoofball merchant...

IMO, we weren't that good v Sheff U even in the 1st half, if I were manager, it wouldn't be what I was looking for, it's based on interpretation isn't it?
 

covcity4life

Well-Known Member
I don't read FourFourTwo (accept season preview) nor WorldSoccer and ironically for you, I have formed my opinions watching 4-4-2 fail, over and over, and then reading documents from coaches and people like Cruyff promoting 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1.

You are one instance, I'm generalising the millions of football fans that watch football per week, I also like Serie A, Bundesliga and La Liga, and you know what, not many teams play 4-4-2 in those division do they?

Wow you read four four two, tjought u wed hate it lol

I agree rigid 442 does not work much anymore but we are playing a more fluid version of it and its doing OK

I actually agree with u that 451 suits us better but can see advantages of both

I'd like to see us do 343 on last day when we already have the title sewn up!
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
Fleck has only shown talent in small flashes since coming to Cov, he hasn't influenced games enough on a consistent basis like Baker has this season.

Baker isn't fast or strong but isn't regarded as lazy and is thought by a lot of fans to be player of the season so how does that fit?

Fleck has potential but I would be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed so far

Baker has a far higher workrate, that wasn't my point, it was that they can try too hard to impress and by doing so, fail, Baker will try take on 'the world' and Fleck would try to do a pass to force the issue, especially when he comes on as a sub, and they fail when they try too hard.

Fleck has been disappointing, but he hasn't had the game time to fufill his potential for numerous factors; team playing well etc. but has shown that he has ability and I hope, and I think he will end up being a key player in our team, and Barton.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
Wow you read four four two, tjought u wed hate it lol

I agree rigid 442 does not work much anymore but we are playing a more fluid version of it and its doing OK

I actually agree with u that 451 suits us better but can see advantages of both

I'd like to see us do 343 on last day when we already have the title sewn up!

Is that because it's my favourite formation as it's title?

Problem is, we play a rigid 4-4-2 when we play 4-4-2!

This is bound to get earn me some criticism, but I don't think Clarke would've scored the goal he did if we were playing 4-4-2 because I think Clarke, when he held the ball up would've passed to his partner, Elliott or Cody instead of taking a chance on his own, I think playing 1 striker is the way forward, puts more attention on Clarke, like it did with McG, and look how McG is doing for Ipswich in a 4-4-2, yes, I do acknowledge the Championship is a better league, but you don't go from smashing L1 to impotent in a month or so.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
...even though we won two of the last 3 games playing it.

V a poor Bury, we could've played 6-3-1 (exaggeration) and still won! Formation, regardless of the game is significant and v Bury, we may have won, but we did play poorly and that was a game you judge performance and the result. Likewise v Crewe in midweek, we won, but we were against a side that set out not to lose by 3-4 goals, that's why they hoofed it whenever they got the ball, and when they mixed it up for the game on Saturday, they smashed us in midfield and 'taught' us a lesson, dominated midfield and shown exactly why we shouldn't play 4-4-2.

Clarke has proven he can play well as a lone striker effectively so the whole reason playing 4-4-2 is therefore irrelevant? I don't think Cody nor Elliott are good enough to start with Clarke.
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
Tell why so many British fans accept 4-4-2 as a good formation where our fellow foreign counterparts disagree, they best teams, club and international, in the world do not play 4-4-2 and haven't done for sometime.

I'll give you an example for a L1 player who is talented as a footballer and gets accused of being lazy and gets slated for his physicality; John Fleck, is a fantasic player when the ball comes to his feet, sometimes tries too hard to make things happen, like Baker and better off it than some fans make out (you & Grendel) and use call him lazy etc. well no, he's not, he's just a different breed of player, and doesn't run around like a headless chicken with no skill, like Doyle, who many admire, but he isn't a good player at all, just a dick who runs around, Fleck would be appreciated more if he was playing in European leagues such as Germany and Spain.

Many English fans and tabloids were slating Pirlo's physicality before our game v Italy, then he shown us (and Germany) up, then we changed our mind.

Fans in Britain fixate on pace, strength and stamina more than they should and more than their counterparts in South America and continental Europe.

GO BACK AND READ THE BIT I QUOTED.

The fans are NOT to blame for the state of the national side, that is down the FA's neglect of youth development for the last 20+ years from grass roots to the elite, which despite brooking and wilkinson banging on about it for 20 years are only just implementing it; and also premier league greed which means they buy in foreign talent both full pros and youngsters and the % of English players is far smaller than the % of Spanish, Germany and Italy in their PL's.

Oh and John fleck isn't a 'fantastic' player, he's a raw younster and the reason he's not starting regularly in either 451 or 442 has nothing to do with fans opinion on him and 100% down to whether the manager rates him enough to start him.
 
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Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
GO BACK AND READ THE BIT I QUOTED.

The fans are NOT to blame for the state of the national side, that is down the FA's neglect of youth development for the last 20+ years from grass roots to the elite, which despite brooking and wilkinson banging on about it for 20 years are only just implementing it; and also premier league greed which means they buy in foreign talent both full pros and youngsters and the % of English players is far smaller than the % of Spanish, Germany and Italy in their PL's.

I never said the fans were, however, if they weren't so arrogant about the EPL being the best, they be more conscious of the fact that nearly 2/3 of plays in the prem are foreign so might develop a consciousness of bringing youth players through, remember, fans are also in the media (writers for national newspapers) who have a big role to play in influencing the views of people a some still say 4-4-2 is a good formation etc.

I have said in other threads we need the FA and clubs up and down England (including CCFC) need to fund youth development more and coaches is a massive, I hope Robinson goes on to 'greatness' as a manager, he's got potential as a manager. Not enough English players or coaches in the English game.
 

Danceswithhorses

Well-Known Member
I see Liam has surfaced on other threads, presumably hoping that this embarrassing one will disappear down the list, and he can just forget about it.
Well, i believe we should keep it going at the top of the thread list, until he comes on and eats some humble pie with his sky blue buddies.
Best to Man up, take the shit, laugh about it, and move on ;)
 

RoboCCFC90

Well-Known Member
The thread should be called Liam what we're you thinking! Do we think Liam was smart enough to play reverse psychology ;)
 
The thread should be called Liam what we're you thinking! Do we think Liam was smart enough to play reverse psychology ;)

Have to admit, this is hilarious :D I was wrong :facepalm: , after what i saw on Saturday and the performances by some of the players, i wasnt happy witt the selection, but they proved me wrong and im so happy they did. PS, that humble pie tastes like shit, wheres Gordon Ramsey when you need him ;)
 

scroobiustom

New Member
Have to admit, this is hilarious :D I was wrong :facepalm: , after what i saw on Saturday and the performances by some of the players, i wasnt happy witt the selection, but they proved me wrong and im so happy they did. PS, that humble pie tastes like shit, wheres Gordon Ramsey when you need him ;)

Is because that humble pie has horse in it mate, don't eat it, stand strong!!!
 

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