Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (186 Viewers)

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Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
Well the EU have been working together, sharing ventilators and resources.

There's a daily conference call between medical advisors of EU countries.

Our petty government decided they don't want to take part in this.
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They are not working together. There are bunch of reactionary idiots in one corner and Germany in the other
 
Ring Of Steel

Ring Of Steel

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
You’re confused. 80% is 80%. When (if) herd immunity is reached the virus doesn’t have the hosts to reach the final 20%, it’s nothing to do with symptom reporting.

You’re also confused about what’s being proposed and why. Leaving aside the fact that we literally don’t know what’ll happen when restrictions lift as it hasn’t happened yet, even if you want the herd immunity approach you still have to flatten the curve to avoid millions of hospitalisations that spikes the mortality rate. That’s where social distancing measures come in. Read the WaPo article I posted earlier in the thread with the model of different scenarios and read up on what different countries approaches have been, you seem spectacularly ill informed on what the various options are. SK for example seems to have contained with minimal lockdown because of early and wide scale testing, tracing and quarantine, though it’s a bit late for us to go for that option now.
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Are you the one who is in isolation? You're using the time well, you seem to be pretty well informed :)
 
Philosoraptor

Philosoraptor

Well-Known Member
Guys, not following this too carefully but isn't the big hope is that the change in seasons in a few weeks and the warmer weather will slow the spread down.

Or are we at the stage now that we are going to take a hit no matter what?
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
You’re confused. 80% is 80%. When (if) herd immunity is reached the virus doesn’t have the hosts to reach the final 20%, it’s nothing to do with symptom reporting.

You’re also confused about what’s being proposed and why. Leaving aside the fact that we literally don’t know what’ll happen when restrictions lift as it hasn’t happened yet, even if you want the herd immunity approach you still have to flatten the curve to avoid millions of hospitalisations that spikes the mortality rate. That’s where social distancing measures come in. Read the WaPo article I posted earlier in the thread with the model of different scenarios and read up on what different countries approaches have been, you seem spectacularly ill informed on what the various options are. SK for example seems to have contained with minimal lockdown because of early and wide scale testing, tracing and quarantine, though it’s a bit late for us to go for that option now.
Click to expand...

No I’m not confused - I’m reading opinions daily and I’m reading the views on various strategies

Have you ever been to South Korea?
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
Your anti-EU agenda is clouding your judgement.

As above, are you on this call?
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No I’m just seeing one economy operating to preserve itself - the fact is every EU country has a different approach if you like it or not.

I can assure you Germany will not be helping basket case countries like Italy and Spain to recover afterwards. it will profit from their misery but it will not help them. Good luck
 
Ring Of Steel

Ring Of Steel

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
Your anti-EU agenda is clouding your judgement.

As above, are you on the call?
Click to expand...

From what I can work out the Chinese are dirty, the EU are all overreacting & are idiots, France are arrogant oafs, Germany are deliberately working against everyone else, and Trump and Johnson are all good.
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
No I’m just seeing one economy operating to preserve itself - the fact is every EU country has a different approach if you like it or not.

I can assure you Germany will not be helping basket case countries like Italy and Spain to recover afterwards. it will profit from their misery but it will not help them. Good luck
Click to expand...

Certain things are down to the individual country, not everything is totally governed and run by the EU.

I've posted several times now that the EU are helping with ventilators and so on.
 
Ring Of Steel

Ring Of Steel

Well-Known Member
Philosorapter said:
Guys, not following this too carefully but isn't the big hope is that the change in seasons in a few weeks and the warmer weather will slow the spread down.

Or are we at the stage now that we are going to take a hit no matter what?
Click to expand...

Nobody knows for sure obviously but all the evidence everywhere suggests everyone is going to take a hit no matter what.
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
Your anti-EU agenda is clouding your judgement.

As above, are you on this call?
Click to expand...

To be fair theres plenty of commentary suggesting otherwise. Individual nations started acting unilaterally and closing their borders (the FT article below, they are pro EU, also I’ve seen many foreign ministers from EU nations complaining about individual nations approaches)

Subscribe to read | Financial Times

like most things I suppose you can position it however you want though.

It makes sense for them and the wider world to all work together on this though.

ps I still don’t quite get the closing of borders when you’re own country is already widely infected (unless it’s to a massively higher risk country) So basically you’re saying a foreign national might bring it into your country so they’re banned but its ok to repatriate your own citizens from those same countries ?!?? Our apparently insular government appear to have been the only ones to have resisted this temptation to date, when surely if they were like many are suggesting would’ve closed borders at the first opportunity ?!
 
Sbarcher

Sbarcher

Well-Known Member
Philosorapter said:
Guys, not following this too carefully but isn't the big hope is that the change in seasons in a few weeks and the warmer weather will slow the spread down.

Or are we at the stage now that we are going to take a hit no matter what?
Click to expand...
Think it's pretty warm in parts of Italy and Spain!
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
Not sure why links not working. It’s an article by Guy Chazan from yesterday m. Should be able to google and read it without subscription. A couple of extracts

‘She had previously argued in favour of close co-ordination between member states and against unilateral actions to slow the spread. As recently as Wednesday, Ms Merkel had said EU countries “should not be isolating ourselves from one another” and that they needed to adopt a “unified approach that is, as far as possible, co-ordinated [between us]”.

‘Ursula von der Leyen, president of the European Commission, warned on Friday that the World Health Organisation did not consider travel bans to be effective. She said sealing off frontiers had a “strong social and economic impact” and would “disrupt people’s lives and business across the borders”.

The article is following Germany and certain other member states closing borders. As you can see nobody’s dealing with this particularly well ! (not just us)....i it’s a global pandemic that nobody has ever faced before !
 
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Astute

Astute

Well-Known Member
Liquid Gold said:
Any excuse to get the Gendarmes out to beat people
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Not had a problem with them myself. One bad apple doesn't mean they are all bad. Both the wife and I have been pulled for a driving offence. Both let go with just a quick warning.
 
Astute

Astute

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
Well because that’s the view of most virologists and the 80% is in their eyes everyone as some will have no symptoms and just carry. The point is it’s impossible to restrict to a few people in the country isn’t it and lockdowns will only mean outbreaks occur again and again and again - I haven’t read any report that believes it’s possible to contain to small numbers of the population
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There is my wife, 3 younger kids and myself that live in France.

Well........ only my wife and the 3 youngest live in France. But that is 80% of us so that means all of us ;)
 
Astute

Astute

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
Well the EU have been working together, sharing ventilators and resources.

There's a daily conference call between medical advisors of EU countries.

Our petty government decided they don't want to take part in this.
Click to expand...
The EU has not worked together.

They were told not to shut borders. But they did.
 
Brylowes

Brylowes

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
Soon will see see elderly people being abused for going out and shopping. This is rapidly descended into the War of the Worlds radio broadcast scenario and media needs align and cut out sensational nonsense

The stark reality is people will die but it’s a small number and economic existence for the many is essential
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Unfortunately we probably have the most morally bankrupt and repugnant press
Of any civilised Country, I don’t think there are any depths they wouldn’t stoop to.
I wouldn’t be relying on them to do their bit in trying to promote rational thought .
 
Ring Of Steel

Ring Of Steel

Well-Known Member
CCFCSteve said:
Not sure why links not working. It’s an article by Guy Chazan from yesterday m. Should be able to google and read it without subscription. A couple of extracts

‘She had previously argued in favour of close co-ordination between member states and against unilateral actions to slow the spread. As recently as Wednesday, Ms Merkel had said EU countries “should not be isolating ourselves from one another” and that they needed to adopt a “unified approach that is, as far as possible, co-ordinated [between us]”.

‘Ursula von der Leyen, president of the European Commission, warned on Friday that the World Health Organisation did not consider travel bans to be effective. She said sealing off frontiers had a “strong social and economic impact” and would “disrupt people’s lives and business across the borders”.

The article is following Germany and certain other member states closing borders. As you can see nobody’s dealing with this particularly well ! (not just us)....i it’s a global pandemic that nobody has ever faced before !
Click to expand...

I think the conclusion that can be drawn from the couple of articles just put on here is that nobody expected the impact to be as great as this and most of the continent- if not world- was caught unprepared. It doesn't help though when you parade experts out in front of the nation then undermine & contradict them 24 hours later while the PM hides away.
 
Brylowes

Brylowes

Well-Known Member
Nick said:
Woohoo Brexit.
Fucking hell.
Click to expand...
Who would have thought that after all those years of arguments over the pros and cons
Of Brexit ‘a virus would come along and render the economic impact of IT ...irrelevant.
I’m a bit gutted I’ll never be proved correct over Brexit :emoji_thinking: and a little relieved I’ll never
Be proved wrong.
 
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