Council could vote on Ricoh takeover as early as Tuesday (2 Viewers)

[AndreasB]

It's obviously for sale. The Wasps negotiations haven't been in secret, have they? If SISU want to be involved, then they need to engage.

But all they're doing is talking about building their own place. Given this is their stated policy - and has been for some time - how else do people expect ACL to behave when a potential purchaser comes along?

thought ACL didnt need a sports franchise? You are right though, there is obviously no love lost for Cov fans about the Ricoh hence the twos up they gave to the place ONE WEEK after returning (even the biggest cynic thought we might get decent crowds for the first 10 games). Lets move on, build a 12-15k stadium of our own, much more suited to our needs. This just helps the process along.

 

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[italiahorse]

If the council lose the JR it's because they've broken the state aid rules. THEY have. Not SISU.

They never lost the JR ??

 

[fernandopartridge]

They never lost the JR ??

Did you miss the IF or bother to read the posts it related to?

 

[jimmyhillsfanclub]

I discussed it with a Wasps player - that's no secret - on May 3rd. It wasn't new, at least within the Wasps camp, back then

Actually, ACL have been courting Wasps as far back as 2010/11.....according to the CT article from Aug. 2013....

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

thought ACL didnt need a sports franchise? You are right though, there is obviously no love lost for Cov fans about the Ricoh hence the twos up they gave to the place ONE WEEK after returning (even the biggest cynic thought we might get decent crowds for the first 10 games). Lets move on, build a 12-15k stadium of our own, much more suited to our needs. This just helps the process along.

Whether or not ACL need a sports franchise isn't the point is it? As they're not trying to attract a franchise to add to their current business mix. They're talking about best part selling up. They're very, very different....

Love lost? It's a business, man. Their directors have a responsibility to that business. I guess you know that. If an offer comes in that's too good to turn down, they won't. They can't.

If you don't like that model; don't sell your soul - as CCFC did to a Limited business many moons ago. Thereafter, a business will always act to protect it's own interest. It's like 'taming' a lion, and then complaining when it bites your arm off. It's doing what it was intended to do.

Again, aim your sarcasm or wit in the direction of SISU. If ACL is an attractive proposition to Wasps and their stakeholders, it should be to SISU too. But Wasps - like it or not - have gone about this as one would a normal business transaction of it's type. SISU, despite having the funds, haven't. That, my friend is where the blame lies. But yet again, in this thread, I see blame being pointed at ACL, the council, the egg-chasers (at least there's a new scapegoat this time); at everyone expect SISU and their farcical, embarrassing, destructive, mythical stadium

 

[spider_ricoh]

Did you miss the IF or bother to read the posts it related to?

Did you complain about illegal state aid when the council stepped in as lender of last resort when CCFC's stadium project got into trouble and no private investor would touch it?

 

[duffer]

I did say as a business they are waiting to see the outcome of WASPs approach = even if WASPs offer is accepted they could still top it. Then what would happen?

I assume they feel the JR is still due in their favour - if CCC are as equally confident why should they worry? It is a side issue and a red herring in my view.

A point still not clear is what happens to the £14m loan if WASPs buy 90% of ACL. Because it will still be there - no one will buy ACL while the JR is determining the position of the loan - UNLESS the deal is the loan is cleared or replaced before the JR

If the Wasps deal is accepted and the contract signed, then it's going to be a little late to make any offer. If you were looking to match or top Wasps' offer then I'd say now is the time to express interest because I suspect the Council would be legally obliged to listen. Beyond that point contract law kicks in, and even SISU will struggle to top that in court.

As for the JR and ACL and the loan, it's a known risk. I don't think this in itself would stop the deal going through.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Actually, ACL have been courting Wasps as far back as 2010/11.....according to the CT article from Aug. 2013....

I can believe that. I'm just telling of my first-hand experiences of events

 

[italiahorse]

Did you miss the IF or bother to read the posts it related to?

Okay lets rephrase it.
Sisu lost the JR so its a big IF.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

and yet it is stated that the consortium is struggling to finance it via the prospectus .......... so how does the council approve a deal three working days from now that hasn't actually been made yet and is apparently unable to be financed? :thinking about:

A fair point well made.

Or are we back to what a 'fair price' is again?

 

[Moff]

If you want to get angry with someone - and I don't just mean you - do so at Fisher. He's CEO and perpetuating the 'new stadium' mantra, and in so doing, leaving ACL, as a private limited business and with directors who hold a legal responsibility to that business - with no choice other than to engage with reputable suitors

Well that reputable that at present they are not sure they have enough cash.
Perhaps Wasps will be calling Wonga over the weekend to prop up the deal.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Actually, ACL have been courting Wasps as far back as 2010/11.....according to the CT article from Aug. 2013....

Courting to sell the business to them or just for use of the stadium?

 

[fernandopartridge]

Did you complain about illegal state aid when the council stepped in as lender of last resort when CCFC's stadium project got into trouble and no private investor would touch it?

No. The council didn't lend CCFC any money though, did it? It invested in a stadium and retained full ownership of it. If only it hadn't.

 

[jimmyhillsfanclub]

Courting to sell the business to them or just for use of the stadium?

I believe as a tenant originally.....part of ACL's "what if" strategy in 2010/11....

...but who knows how those discussions developed....the then head of ACL has since left & refused to comment when questioned for the article & PKWH denied any knowledge of it whatsoever....:thinking about:

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/red-button-ricoh-arena-chairman-5431948

 

[duffer]

And agreed to the sale of Highfield Road and bypassed all the covenants

Ah, it was the Council that sold Highfield Road was it. Not the owners of the club after a grand scheme. That's news to me. Got some evidence of that, or of any 'covenant' that could have prevented a sale between private third parties?

Forgive me, but this looks a little made up and sounds a bit like whining from someone who thinks everything is the Council's fault. Still don't let the facts get in the way of a mindless rant though, eh?

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Well that reputable that at present they are not sure they have enough cash.
Perhaps Wasps will be calling Wonga over the weekend to prop up the deal.

I'm guessing that Due Diligence might be a bit more diligent - on both sides - than it was back in 2008

 

[Sky Blue Dal]

This is the council that demolished the Smithfield Hotel 12 years ago .

That was a sad day. This is what I really hate about Coventry and its Council. Every time they have decent historic buildings, they destroy it. Other Councils and its people around the country would never have allowed this to happen.

I pity our City sometimes.

 

[duffer]

Aren't you forgetting the other third party that damage will be done to you - us the ccfc fans?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

I'm not forgetting them - but what are the council supposed to do if the owners of the club don't want to come to the table, and keep insisting that they are building elsewhere?

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Other Councils and its people around the country would never have allowed this to happen.

If only that were true!

 

[fernandopartridge]

Ah, it was the Council that sold Highfield Road was it. Not the owners of the club after a grand scheme. That's news to me. Got some evidence of that, or of any 'covenant' that could have prevented a sale between private third parties?

Forgive me, but this looks a little made up and sounds a bit like whining from someone who thinks everything is the Council's fault. Still don't let the facts get in the way of a mindless rant though, eh?

I think there was a restrictive covenant that reserved the ground for the club and no other purpose unless they had a suitable alternative. It was part if the s106 agreement with the council as part of plans submitted to demolish the ground / build the estate.

Interesting how such a covenant was never placed on its replacement!

 

[AndreasB]

Whether or not ACL need a sports franchise isn't the point is it? As they're not trying to attract a franchise to add to their current business mix. They're talking about best part selling up. They're very, very different....

Love lost? It's a business, man. Their directors have a responsibility to that business. I guess you know that. If an offer comes in that's too good to turn down, they won't. They can't.

If you don't like that model; don't sell your soul - as CCFC did to a Limited business many moons ago. Thereafter, a business will always act to protect it's own interest. It's like 'taming' a lion, and then complaining when it bites your arm off. It's doing what it was intended to do.

Again, aim your sarcasm or wit in the direction of SISU. If ACL is an attractive proposition to Wasps and their stakeholders, it should be to SISU too. But Wasps - like it or not - have gone about this as one would a normal business transaction of it's type. SISU, despite having the funds, haven't. That, my friend is where the blame lies. But yet again, in this thread, I see blame being pointed at ACL, the council, the egg-chasers (at least there's a new scapegoat this time); at everyone expect SISU and their farcical, embarrassing, destructive, mythical stadium

"Normal business transaction"? Ho ho. A few leaks to the press and a quickie nod from a pliant Council. No consultation with any other stakeholders (fans of either club) I notice. Rotten Boroughs indeed.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[torchomatic]

To be honest, it this happens then it will be best for CCFC if a new stadium is built. It seems after recent games that Fisher's original "vision" of a 15K stadium would just be about right. Leave the Ricoh and the Wasps to have a wonderful future together.

I'm not forgetting them - but what are the council supposed to do if the owners of the club don't want to come to the table, and keep insisting that they are building elsewhere?

 

[chiefdave]

Ah, it was the Council that sold Highfield Road was it. Not the owners of the club after a grand scheme. That's news to me. Got some evidence of that, or of any 'covenant' that could have prevented a sale between private third parties?

There may have been a restricted use covenant, that's not uncommon for football grounds. Something along the lines of the land can only be used for football. That would have needed to be removed prior to any sale as the land would be practically worthless with it in place however I would think it would be the club who requested it be removed to enable them to fund the new ground so I'm not sure how much blame you can place on the council for the whole project going badly wrong.

 

[Otis]

To be honest, it this happens then it will be best for CCFC if a new stadium is built. It seems after recent games that Fisher's original "vision" of a 15K stadium would just be about right. Leave the Ricoh and the Wasps to have a wonderful future together.

Going to be a very sad day if a London sporting team ends up playing at the Ricoh and Coventry City FC end up playing outside of Coventry.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

"Normal business transaction"? Ho ho. A few leaks to the press and a quickie nod from a pliant Council. No consultation with any other stakeholders (fans of either club) I notice. Rotten Boroughs indeed.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That 'offering' acts as undiluted précis of your ignorance of events. Thanks for sharing

 

[torchomatic]

Couldn't agree more, Otis. Couldn't agree more.

Going to be a very sad day if a London sporting team ends up playing at the Ricoh and Coventry City FC end up playing outside of Coventry.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Going to be a very sad day if a London sporting team ends up playing at the Ricoh and Coventry City FC end up playing outside of Coventry.

I nominate Frankie Howerd to play lead in the TV series about it.

 

[Otis]

I nominate Frankie Howerd to play lead in the TV series about it.

I always thought he was a fan of Southampton's big rivals.

Why else would he write a sitcom called 'Up Pompey?'

 

[Woodster]

The rent deal to return to the Ricoh was handled in an incognito manner by the club, which was widely praised.

Seeing as there has been no comment from the club regarding any potential Wasps acquisition, has there been any firm confirmation that SISU aren't trying to thrash out an equivalent deal?

This might be a bit pie in the sky but it's hard to completely rule out at this stage.

 

[duffer]

I think there was a restrictive covenant that reserved the ground for the club and no other purpose unless they had a suitable alternative. It was part if the s106 agreement with the council as part of plans submitted to demolish the ground / build the estate.

Interesting how such a covenant was never placed on its replacement!

So in that case the covenant (if it existed) wasn't actually broken, was it? A suitable alternative had been found (and indeed occupied) before the HR land had been built on.

As for a new covenant on the Ricoh, who could have foreseen the club choosing to move out?

 

[limoncello]

That 'offering' acts as undiluted précis of your ignorance of events. Thanks for sharing

An 'undiluted précis'? Oxymoron.

 

[torchomatic]

I'm amazed that the idiots who agreed to a yearly rental of over a million pounds couldn't have foreseen that.

who could have foreseen the club choosing to move out?

 

[Otis]

The rent deal to return to the Ricoh was handled in an incognito manner by the club, which was widely praised.

Seeing as there has been no comment from the club regarding any potential Wasps acquisition, has there been any firm confirmation that SISU aren't trying to thrash out an equivalent deal?

This might be a bit pie in the sky but it's hard to completely rule out at this stage.

Well I really hope that is the case.

Wasps can bugger off to Birmingham. Or if they have to come here, CCFC buy the Ricoh and Wasps can pay rent to Sisu when they play in our sky blue seated arena.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I'm amazed that the idiots who agreed to a yearly rental of over a million pounds couldn't have foreseen that.

tbf (and back to the old supply and demand thing!) that's why the rent *could* be so high, when there's a monopoly supply of stadiums, and that's what SISU have tried to break to reduce it.

Likewise, ACL appear to be attempting to break the monopoly supply of sports teams, in order to boost the value...

All good business sense, eh.

 

[fernandopartridge]

So in that case the covenant (if it existed) wasn't actually broken, was it? A suitable alternative had been found (and indeed occupied) before the HR land had been built on.

As for a new covenant on the Ricoh, who could have foreseen the club choosing to move out?

Or foreseen attempting to adopt a rugby club from outside of the city!