Court Case Thread! June 2018 (1 Viewer)

[Astute]

Hasn’t OSB explained the valuations a gazillion times now and how they’re not to be confused with a sale price? It’s fast becoming another SISU are taking millions out of the club urban myth which he’s also explained a gazillion times why they’re not. Suits you to dismiss this one though obviously because the amount of times he’s explained it on the Wasps finances threads in the Wasps sub forum there’s no way you haven’t read it. So congratulations, you’ve joined the rank of the conspiracy theorist. Deliberately and not by accident either I would say.

Ah yes. The posts most appreciate and some ignore as they give all the evidence as it is.

 

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[Astute]

So you are saying this solicitor is wrong then?

What To Do When Your Commercial Lease Runs Out- Bird & Co Solicitors

What to do if your lease runs out?

Apples and pears again I see.

 

[Astute]

The council meeting approving it was done a month after..

So OSB is wrong and you are right yet you don't question a word he says.

 

[Nick]

Hasn’t OSB explained the valuations a gazillion times now and how they’re not to be confused with a sale price? It’s fast becoming another SISU are taking millions out of the club urban myth which he’s also explained a gazillion times why they’re not. Suits you to dismiss this one though obviously because the amount of times he’s explained it on the Wasps finances threads in the Wasps sub forum there’s no way you haven’t read it. So congratulations, you’ve joined the rank of the conspiracy theorist. Deliberately and not by accident either I would say.

The lease added no value then?

 

[Nick]

So OSB is wrong and you are right yet you don't question a word he says.

What are you on about? It's fact, it wasn't unused like you keep saying.

If he says it was empty when sold then he is wrong also.

 

[Grendel]

What to do if your lease runs out?

Apples and pears again I see.

You said by law as soon as a lease goes below 50 years then it has to be renewed didn’t you? That article states that the tenant should negotiate with the landlord well in advance. Didn’t you say by law they are entitled to a renewal.

 

[skybluetony176]

The lease added no value then?

Still pretending OSB hasn’t explained it then. That’s it Nick, you keep dealing in fantasy.

 

[sky blue john]

I maybe wrong but the way i see it civil action against wasps or council is only an option if sisu win the JR.

 

[Nick]

Still pretending OSB hasn’t explained it then. That’s it Nick, you keep dealing in fantasy.

I'm happy to be corrected, can you post the link?

 

[SkyBlueScottie]

What a depressing read this is.

 

[Astute]

You said by law as soon as a lease goes below 50 years then it has to be renewed didn’t you? That article states that the tenant should negotiate with the landlord well in advance. Didn’t you say by law they are entitled to a renewal.

Extension yes. I said nothing about leases that have run out as it has nothing to do with the arena. It says talk with freehold owner ASAP. Wasps certainly did that.

It is you that brought up a lease running out as it makes it more difficult. And both sides then have different rights.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

What are the chances that this will be the end of the JR route for Sisu? It it likely to be the end of that road today? If so can they still mount other legal actions?

 

[Grendel]

Extension yes. I said nothing about leases that have run out as it has nothing to do with the arena. It says talk with freehold owner ASAP. Wasps certainly did that.

It is you that brought up a lease running out as it makes it more difficult. And both sides then have different rights.

Eh? The lease wasn’t running out. Also aren’t you accusing the Higgs Charity of mind bombing incompetence?

 

[skybluetony176]

I'm happy to be corrected, can you post the link?

Are you saying that you’ve never read one of the many posts by OSB explaining why the valuation for accounts and the bonds are not to be confused with the sale value of the ACL. Yeah OK.

 

[Astute]

What a depressing read this is.

It certainly is. We got stitched up by CCC. And all because two hedge funds were allowed to take over sporting clubs.

 

[skybluetony176]

Eh? The lease wasn’t running out. Also aren’t you accusing the Higgs Charity of mind bombing incompetence?

Leases are always running out. That’s there nature. They’re set over a fixed term and time doesn’t stand still.

 

[Astute]

Eh? The lease wasn’t running out. Also aren’t you accusing the Higgs Charity of mind bombing incompetence?

So why did you post a link of what to do when a lease runs out?

 

[Nick]

Are you saying that you’ve never read one of the many posts by OSB explaining why the valuation for accounts and the bonds are not to be confused with the sale value of the ACL. Yeah OK.

Or maybe I don't have a photographic memory which is why I said I'm happy to be corrected with a link.

 

[sky blue john]

How would you value the extended lease anyway?
You couldn't base it on current tennants look at ccfc. A yearly contract who is to say we will be playing at the ricoh next year never mind when the extended portion of the lease starts.

 

[Astute]

So you are saying this solicitor is wrong then?

What To Do When Your Commercial Lease Runs Out- Bird & Co Solicitors

Just in case you have forgotten what your link was.....

 

[skybluetony176]

Or maybe I don't have a photographic memory which is why I said I'm happy to be corrected with a link.

You’ve been corrected and you know you have. You’re always all over the threads where he’s explained it repeatedly so there’s no way on earth you haven’t read it more than once. I’m not posting a link for the simple reason it’s funnier watching you pretend you’ve never seen or read his explanation. It’s the equivalent of watching a grown man believing in Father Christmas even though despite it being explained to him by another adult he doesn’t exist.

 

[sky blue john]

Have Sisu applied for J3 yet.

 

[MatthewWallis]

What are the chances that this will be the end of the JR route for Sisu? It it likely to be the end of that road today? If so can they still mount other legal actions?

Probably about as much chance as a thread on here not turning into an argument

 

[Nick]

You’ve been corrected and you know you have. You’re always all over the threads where he’s explained it repeatedly so there’s no way on earth you haven’t read it more than once. I’m not posting a link for the simple reason it’s funnier watching you pretend you’ve never seen or read his explanation. It’s the equivalent of watching a grown man believing in Father Christmas even though despite it being explained to him by another adult he doesn’t exist.

All I've asked for is a link? It's pretty simple, so then I can read through it.

I'm not saying I haven't seen it, I'm saying I can't remember it. That's all.

Whatever gets you excited though.

 

[Grendel]

Leases are always running out. That’s there nature. They’re set over a fixed term and time doesn’t stand still.

So guy agree by law a tenant can demand an extension?

 

[Grendel]

Just in case you have forgotten what your link was.....

Have you read it or just the title?

 

[Astute]

So guy agree by law a tenant can demand an extension?

Leaseholder yes. Tenant no.

 

[Astute]

Have you read it or just the title?

Yes I read it. It was about what to do if the lease has or is about to run out. And as you have said the lease wasn't about to run out.

 

[hill83]

Whats going on then?

 

[Grendel]

FAQs - Commercial leases

Astute have you read this?

 

[Grendel]

Yes I read it. It was about what to do if the lease has or is about to run out. And as you have said the lease wasn't about to run out.

They can demand a renewal below 50 years - yes?

 

[skybluetony176]

All I've asked for is a link? It's pretty simple, so then I can read through it.

I'm not saying I haven't seen it, I'm saying I can't remember it. That's all.

Whatever gets you excited though.

Read an Wasps thread to do with financials. Everytime someone says that the council undersold based on valuation in accounts he’s explained the difference. You know this but are pretending that you don’t. You ask for a link pretending that you need one. I’ve told you several times now where you’ll find them are you now going to pretend that you don’t know how to navigate your own forum to the Wasps sub section? Classic who what me behaviour from you Nick and very entertaining as we all know you know better but carry on pretending that you don’t. Comedy gold.

 

[Astute]

All I've asked for is a link? It's pretty simple, so then I can read through it.

I'm not saying I haven't seen it, I'm saying I can't remember it. That's all.

Whatever gets you excited though.

Wasps effectively paid £18m for the short lease when they took on ACL. That was the value in the accounts of ACL.

At 31/05/2014 the ACL balance sheet showed net assets of 6.8m in the accounts to 2015 ACL made losses which would have decreased the Net asset position. Wasps paid 5.5m plus some add ons for ACL

Strutt & Parker valued the 250 year lease in April 2015, and by that time ACL had a long term lease in place from Wasps Rugby which adds value to the asset held by ACL

Wasps bought ACL not the lease in October 2014 - that's all assets less all liabilities of ACL

The lease extension for 250 years came in to being 15 January 2015. It could only be extended to the benefit of the current owner of the lease ACL, whilst ACL existed there was no open market to sell it to (for at least 39 years)

The lease is charged against the bonds issued May 2015

these surely cant be the best arguments that SISU can come up with can it? There must be something else surely? other than

infamy, infamy they've all got it in for me ........

 

[skybluetony176]

So guy agree by law a tenant can demand an extension?

Just pointing out that leases by their very nature are always running out. The rest is between you and astute to settle.

 

[SkyBlueScottie]

Whats going on then?