Coventry City Council have Failed CCFC (1 Viewer)

[Grendel]

If it was free do you think the club would come back?

What's the most you would pay if you were in charge?

If I'm totally honest if I was them I would have done things very differently.

 

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[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

I don't know about the city ground but portman road - I don't think so. Sorry I don't care less about the council and what they've "done" for the club - as someone else said don't dwell on the past (something Schmeee likes to do when it suits) and the future would be far brighter without ACL and its council puppet master. Why not then explore some grounds like Swansea and see how they have prospered (cue a council troll to post an irrelevant link about an eu investigation).

Presumably we wont be seeing any more posts from you regarding previous owners,previous managers or indeed previous rental figures?

 

[Rusty Trombone]

If I'm totally honest if I was them I would have done things very differently.

I imagine you would, I'd be interested to know what your answers are to the questions though.

No problem if you're worried about answering them though.

 

[chiefdave]

It's 4 times the rent of portman road or the city ground - its hardly a steal.

Given that they are both older grounds who pays the maintenance on those? No idea what maintenance costs on older grounds generally are but as a point of reference I know Pompey had to borrow half a million to even get to the standard of getting a safety certificate this season and speaking to one of their shareholders they are looking at a 'high six figure, low seven figure' amount every season for routine maintenance.

Seems to me that one way or another every club has to pay either in mortgage, maintenance or rent. Of course there may be a handful of clubs that are the exception to the rule but it does make you wonder how all the other clubs have managed to escape the problems we are having.

 

[Grendel]

I imagine you would, I'd be interested to know what your answers are to the questions though.

No problem if you're worried about answering them though.

If I was in charge is calculate a fair rent which is probably around £500,000 including fixed overheads and is want money back on over payments. So 6 years rent free and full revenues. If sign a 10 year deal and pay for the last 4.

I would also want a share of all non football related revenue as I would effectively be maintaining the ground and without the club there would be no ground or named sponsor in the first place.

 

[chiefdave]

Do we get our money back on the grotesque over payments? Do we know the small print on matchday costs on these deals?

Thought not.

So the argument now is not only that we should be given a low / free rent or given the ground for free we should now be expecting ACL to pay us to come back???

 

[Grendel]

So the argument now is not only that we should be given a low / free rent or given the ground for free we should now be expecting ACL to pay us to come back???

I think if you want the club back that's what's needed. A new owner would not entertain the buffoons at the council as landlords who are fit for purpose based on their previous shambolic record.

 

[Rusty Trombone]

If I was in charge is calculate a fair rent which is probably around £500,000 including fixed overheads and is want money back on over payments. So 6 years rent free and full revenues. If sign a 10 year deal and pay for the last 4.

I would also want a share of all non football related revenue as I would effectively be maintaining the ground and without the club there would be no ground or named sponsor in the first place.

I'd hope they would agree to the rent part, works out at £200k a year for a 10 year deal. I would think we'd get some revenue access for free, but not all.

Not sure they would agree to the non football bit, unless the club wanted to buy a share of ACL.

Shame the club won't rent, sounds like it could be a good hypothetical deal.

 

[ccfc92]

I think if you want the club back that's what's needed. A new owner would not entertain the buffoons at the council as landlords who are fit for purpose based on their previous shambolic record.

so the chances of that are....?

 

[ccfcway]

45 million in "debt" yet its the £1.2 million rent that was the problem !

 

[The Gentleman]

Please note: This is NOT a pro SISU thread. I fully acknowledge SISU's many catastrophic mistakes and deplore them. I also acknowledge that one of those mistakes was in not renegotiating the rental deal following due diligence. Having said that, when it became clear that the club would not survive under the existing agreement, CCC should have been instructing ACL (I'm sure the Higgs Charity would have agreed to this) to restructure its business model in favour of the club thus allowing it to maintain it's tenancy and avoiding the eventual situation of the club (rightly or wrongly) withholding rent. I realize that I am inviting accusations of naivety (its just business - would you expect your landlord to knock your door offering a rent reduction, etc etc) but this was not a normal tenant/landlord relationship. The club is not just a business, it is a huge part of our community and loved by thousands. CCC is not just a landlord it is a democratically elected body with a responsibility to its community and its electorate. CCC should have been doing all it could to enable the club to move forward as was its duty. In neglecting to do so it has failed its community, the people of Coventry and the club, costing the city many millions of pounds in the process. At best they stood by, did nothing and watched the club implode, at worst they refused/ignored requests from the club for help.
In my opinion this amounts to dereliction of duty.​

Why should CCC be doing all it could to enable the process of CCFC playing back in Coventry. Firstly, do you not think that CCC has more pressing matters in Coventry other than facilitating our owners lining their pockets further.Secondly, when the club was imploding they offered far better deals than the original one. CCC has an obligation to the 330k+ residents of our city first and foremost. Sisu has an obligation to CCFC only and any dereliction of duty is by them and them alone. I cannot believe that some people on here are still talking about the rent being one of the biggest issues when recent accounts have shown otherwise. Would the rent have been an issue if we were in the PL, no is the answer and that is exactly why Sisu came in for us. Rent wasn't the issue because they thought they could spend a few quid, buy 50% of the ground and get promotion to the PL. Then they could sell us on and make a nice tidy profit. When this grand plan from Sisu failed they then thought how else could we make money and get out, I know lets try and get the Ricoh Arena for peanuts and then flog it on. At no time has the football club been a priority for Sisu, it has always been money and nothing else. It is Sisu who is ignoring attempts to get us playing at the Ricoh again and nobody else and it is Sisu's complete stubborness and complete disregard for it's customers (us the fans) that has pushed us further into the abyss. All this CCC has failed CCFC is complete nonsense.

 

[The Gentleman]

The rent was an issue though as the Club asked for a reduction before Sisu even arrived!

Sisu's actions haven't been fantastic that we can all agree on but to say the figure of the rent was not an issue coupled with the fact that Matchday revenues were non-existent then of course we had a major problem!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

"Sisu's actions haven't been fantastic", are you serious Robo? Sisu's actions have been a complete and utter disaster from start to where we are now and sadly it is not yet finished.

 

[ccfc92]

"Sisu's actions haven't been fantastic", are you serious Robo? Sisu's actions have been a complete and utter disaster from start to where we are now and sadly it is not yet finished.

That's the scary bit. We said we would never play outside Coventry in the summer.... :facepalm:

Now we are saying they won't build a stadium outside the City :thinking about:

 

[letsallsingtogether]

So explain then how the rent put us in so much debt and how without it and with all the pie money we would now be in profit.

After all you keep telling us that the white elephant in Holbrooks makes no money?

Oh and who would then be paying the new mortgage that sisu would have to take out to buy it?
From what I've seen they hardly have the money to buy it themselves.

 

[Samo]

Why should CCC be doing all it could to enable the process of CCFC playing back in Coventry. Firstly, do you not think that CCC has more pressing matters in Coventry other than facilitating our owners lining their pockets further.Secondly, when the club was imploding they offered far better deals than the original one. CCC has an obligation to the 330k+ residents of our city first and foremost. Sisu has an obligation to CCFC only and any dereliction of duty is by them and them alone. I cannot believe that some people on here are still talking about the rent being one of the biggest issues when recent accounts have shown otherwise. Would the rent have been an issue if we were in the PL, no is the answer and that is exactly why Sisu came in for us. Rent wasn't the issue because they thought they could spend a few quid, buy 50% of the ground and get promotion to the PL. Then they could sell us on and make a nice tidy profit. When this grand plan from Sisu failed they then thought how else could we make money and get out, I know lets try and get the Ricoh Arena for peanuts and then flog it on. At no time has the football club been a priority for Sisu, it has always been money and nothing else. It is Sisu who is ignoring attempts to get us playing at the Ricoh again and nobody else and it is Sisu's complete stubborness and complete disregard for it's customers (us the fans) that has pushed us further into the abyss. All this CCC has failed CCFC is complete nonsense.

Nothing to do with my original point at all and i suggested nothing of the kind, please read the OP, its just lazy.

 

[skybluetony176]

The people who really failed us are our custodians

 

[ccfc92]

The people who really failed us are our custodians

blasphemer

 

[ccfcway]

common sense prevails

 

[ccfc92]

common sense prevails

You would have thought, but we are mere mortals to him

edit: that was to ashamed post

 

[The Gentleman]

Nothing to do with my original point at all and i suggested nothing of the kind, please read the OP, its just lazy.

"CCC should have been doing all it could to enable the club to move forward as was its duty".

The above was an extract taken from your OP. So yes my post does has something to do with your OP. Is it that I don't agree with you or your post that matters to you? The line I have taken from your OP should have simply started with SISU. It is them that the responsibility of the football club lies and no-one else. Because if you are looking at other parties who could have helped then why didn't you say that fellow CCFC fans have a responsibility to the club they support to go and watch them and therefore make sure that the club could have payed the rent. However, we all know that the rent is just a smokescreen for what Sisu want and when they (yes I am sure that someone from there reads this forum) read threads like this they probably have a little chuckle to themselves.

 

[Samo]

"CCC should have been doing all it could to enable the club to move forward as was its duty".

The above was an extract taken from your OP. So yes my post does has something to do with your OP. Is it that I don't agree with you or your post that matters to you? The line I have taken from your OP should have simply started with SISU. It is them that the responsibility of the football club lies and no-one else. Because if you are looking at other parties who could have helped then why didn't you say that fellow CCFC fans have a responsibility to the club they support to go and watch them and therefore make sure that the club could have payed the rent. However, we all know that the rent is just a smokescreen for what Sisu want and when they (yes I am sure that someone from there reads this forum) read threads like this they probably have a little chuckle to themselves.

I was talking about BEFORE the club withheld the rent as is clear from my OP. Do you not read very well?

 

[bigfatronssba]

I was talking about BEFORE the club withheld the rent as is clear from my OP. Do you not read very well?

You mean at the time when the club hadn't said there was an issue with the rent?

 

[Samo]

You mean at the time when the club hadn't said there was an issue with the rent?

Good grief

 

[sky blue john]

Good grief

Maybe try living in the here and now !!!
The club is tens of millions in debt to Sisu Arvo and we are playing our home matches 35miles away in another county !!!!!

 

[Samo]

Maybe try living in the here and now !!!
The club is tens of millions in debt to Sisu Arvo and we are playing our home matches 35miles away in another county !!!!!

Is it really? Thanks for letting me know. Again though, nothing to do with my OP. I'm going to do something else now as the standard of response appears to have bottomed out.

 

[sky blue john]

Is it really? Thanks for letting me know. Again though, nothing
to do with my OP. I'm going to do something else now as the standard of response appears to have bottomed out.

Not a problem maybe next time you could have something useful to say !

 

[The Gentleman]

I was talking about BEFORE the club withheld the rent as is clear from my OP. Do you not read very well?

Ahhh, the old before the club was withholding rent so therefore this means that CCC must be guilty of dereliction of duty. One question for you then Samo, before Sisu decided that operation PL wasn't going to work out and therefore needed to look at other options to make money out of us rather than see us progress, would you class what CCC did in stepping in when no-one else did and saved the club from going into oblivion in giving the money they did to finish things as dereliction of duty, not caring about a community asset and making sure that we the people of Coventry had a team in Coventry to follow?

 

[Grendel]

I think Samo has began to realise why I post in the manner I do.

 

[skybluetony176]

I think Samo has began to realise why I post in the manner I do.

He's realised you're a plonker? That's quite an omission!

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Ahhh, the old before the club was withholding rent so therefore this means that CCC must be guilty of dereliction of duty. One question for you then Samo, before Sisu decided that operation PL wasn't going to work out and therefore needed to look at other options to make money out of us rather than see us progress, would you class what CCC did in stepping in when no-one else did and saved the club from going into oblivion in giving the money they did to finish things as dereliction of duty, not caring about a community asset and making sure that we the people of Coventry had a team in Coventry to follow?

Operation PL was the brainchild of Paul Fletcher.

 

[DaleM]

So , what have we learnt ? Sweet F A . BUT in the SBT timeline we have Monday, Tuesday , Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Batshit Mental Insane Day. ( Unless it's a "home"game day and then it's Sunday) :claping hands:

 

[Rusty Trombone]

He's realised you're a xxxx? That's quite an omission!

Not necessary is it. Grow up.

 

[The Gentleman]

Operation PL was the brainchild of Paul Fletcher.

Operation PL should be the aim of every single owner of every single football league team. However, Sisu never have and never will have the clubs best interests at heart. The reason we are where we are is because our greedy owners are only in it for the money and because they have no fucking clue about what a football club actually means to it's fans and the local community, hence the Sixfields debacle, football stadium outside the city where it takes its name, smearing the football clubs own fans trust and constant smug directors who think they know best (but strangely cannot seem to answer straight questions).

 

[stupot07]

Operation PL should be the aim of every single owner of every single football league team. However, Sisu never have and never will have the clubs best interests at heart. The reason we are where we are is because our greedy owners are only in it for the money and because they have no fucking clue about what a football club actually means to it's fans and the local community, hence the Sixfields debacle, football stadium outside the city where it takes its name, smearing the football clubs own fans trust and constant smug directors who think they know best (but strangely cannot seem to answer straight questions).

What do you expect when the club has one of the lowest turnovers in the league, and the promotion sides all have wage bills circa x3 our entire turnover?

 

[The Gentleman]

What do you expect when the club has one of the lowest turnovers in the league, and the promotion sides all have wage bills circa x3 our entire turnover?

How did Yeovil do it?