Do you want to discuss boring politics? (16 Viewers)

shmmeee · Jan 23, 2025

Captain Dart said:
How is global warming going for you?

Amazing. You are the exact reason we don’t call it global warming any more we call it climate change. A rise in average global temperatures doesn’t mean everywhere gets warmer.

But I’m glad you’ve proven my point that you’re willing to throw out hundreds of thousands of papers and decades of accurate predictions because you saw a news report with snow on it.

Gebuinely what do you gain from this? Do you not wonder why the only science you don’t believe is stuff grifters can sell you products for or extremely wealthy people can make money on?

chiefdave · Jan 23, 2025

shmmeee said:
Amazing. You are the exact reason we don’t call it global warming any more we call it climate change. A rise in average global temperatures doesn’t mean everywhere gets warmer.

I was going to reply but I thought surely he's not saying, look there's snow in Florida therefore global warming isn't a thing

wingy · Jan 23, 2025

chiefdave said:
I was going to reply but I thought surely he's not saying, look there's snow in Florida therefore global warming isn't a thing

Poor Florida never gets a break does it?
Boats or snow ploughs, dichotomy!

SkyBlueCharlie9 · Jan 23, 2025

Captain Dart said:
How is global warming going for you?

Utterly daft but predictable, using such 'science' from MAGA loving neanderthals - her and supporter completely oblivious that she is directly undermining her own argument. Captain Dart.... climate change means windier, drier, wetter, sunnier, cloudier, colder and hotter at unusual times and distorted weather/climate patterns. Baffoons the lot of them - but thank god we dont have such dopey deniers in UK eh, CD?

MalcSB · Jan 23, 2025

Today is Labour Day in the Daily Mail. Quite an interesting selection of articles.

Hard for me to argue with what Starmer and Reeves are saying (frame the post @shmmeee ). I have no doubt Milliband and Khan will be unhappy.

PM vows crackdown on 'virtue-signalling' challenges to infrastructure

Keir Starmer vowed to end the 'challenge culture' of spurious judicial reviews that delay major projects such as nuclear power plants, wind farms and roads.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Rachel Reeves insists boosting UK economy must trump dash for net zero

Boosting the economy must trump Labour's dash for net zero, Rachel Reeves said yesterday - as she and Keir Starmer launched a new push for growth.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Rachel Reeves 'to ease Labour's non-dom crackdown'

Chancellor Rachel Reeves told a fringe event at the World Economic Forum in Davos that she was 'listening' to the concerns.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Heathrow expansion: Sadiq Khan warns of `climate emergency´

The mayor of London won a third term in 2024 on a platform of opposing expansion of airports in the capital.

www.dailymail.co.uk

shmmeee · Jan 23, 2025

MalcSB said:
Today is Labour Day in the Daily Mail. Quite an interesting selection of articles.

Hard for me to argue with what Starmer and Reeves are saying (frame the post @shmmeee ). I have no doubt Milliband and Khan will be unhappy.

PM vows crackdown on 'virtue-signalling' challenges to infrastructure

Keir Starmer vowed to end the 'challenge culture' of spurious judicial reviews that delay major projects such as nuclear power plants, wind farms and roads.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Rachel Reeves insists boosting UK economy must trump dash for net zero

Boosting the economy must trump Labour's dash for net zero, Rachel Reeves said yesterday - as she and Keir Starmer launched a new push for growth.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Rachel Reeves 'to ease Labour's non-dom crackdown'

Chancellor Rachel Reeves told a fringe event at the World Economic Forum in Davos that she was 'listening' to the concerns.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Heathrow expansion: Sadiq Khan warns of `climate emergency´

The mayor of London won a third term in 2024 on a platform of opposing expansion of airports in the capital.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Haha I don’t agree with caving to non doms. Do agree on a third runway with or without the insistence of greener fuels. I think that’s a sop to environmental campaigners but I’m not a degrowth environmentalist I’m a techno environmentalist so whatever. Agree with the planning stuff as I’ve said but wish it would go further.

MalcSB · Jan 23, 2025

shmmeee said:
Haha I don’t agree with caving to non doms. Do agree on a third runway with or without the insistence of greener fuels. I think that’s a sop to environmental campaigners but I’m not a degrowth environmentalist I’m a techno environmentalist so whatever. Agree with the planning stuff as I’ve said but wish it would go further.

Will there be trouble at t’mill?

Are they caving to non doms? They are saying the aim is to raise as much revenue as originally intended. They need to keep the non doms here. I did say that they would fuck off elsewhere, looks like the scale of the fucking off has taken the government by surprise. The lack of competence in not realising what would happen is, however, no surprise whatsoever.

shmmeee · Jan 23, 2025

MalcSB said:
Will there be trouble at t’mill?

Are they caving to non doms? They are saying the aim is to raise as much revenue as originally intended. They need to keep the non doms here. I did say that they would fuck off elsewhere, looks like the scale of the fucking off has taken the government by surprise. The lack of competence in not realising what would happen is, however, no surprise whatsoever.

What scale? You’re not believing Telegraph fairytales again are you?

MalcSB · Jan 23, 2025

shmmeee said:
Haha I don’t agree with caving to non doms. Do agree on a third runway with or without the insistence of greener fuels. I think that’s a sop to environmental campaigners but I’m not a degrowth environmentalist I’m a techno environmentalist so whatever. Agree with the planning stuff as I’ve said but wish it would go further.

The planning stuff has to start with something, and what Starmer is saying does address the spurious challenges (bat huts, I ask you).

Slightly amusing that the named culprit is Green Party, not a pensioners alliance which you have previously blamed.

Boswell has probably only just qualifies as a pensioner (subject to NI record), so most of his record of vexatious objection will have been as a working person.

shmmeee · Jan 23, 2025

MalcSB said:
The planning stuff has to start with something, and what Starmer is saying does address the spurious challenges (bat huts, I ask you).

Slightly amusing that the named culprit is Green Party, not a pensioners alliance which you have previously blamed.

Boswell has probably only just qualifies as a pensioner (subject to NI record), so most of his record of vexatious objection will have been as a working person.

Greens are half nimby pensioners same as the Lib Dem’s.

Ian1779 · Jan 23, 2025

Tories just can’t help but Tory….

MalcSB · Jan 23, 2025

shmmeee said:
What scale? You’re not believing Telegraph fairytales again are you?

Nope, it’s in the posted article so it’s even worse than the Telegraph, it’s in the Mail. Is there anything in the article written by Starmer for the Daily Mail that you don’t believe?

MalcSB · Jan 23, 2025

shmmeee said:
Greens are half nimby pensioners same as the Lib Dem’s.

Source?

fernandopartridge · Jan 23, 2025

Captain Dart said:
Of course these projects could have be completed if there wasn't all this insane fantasy net zero bollocks with massive budget implications.

Host of hospital builds delayed by up to 14 years

Ministers say previous government promise for 40 new hospitals by 2030 was undeliverable.

www.bbc.co.uk

Can you point me to the departmental 'net zero' budget?.

fernandopartridge · Jan 23, 2025

shmmeee said:
This is why I have no sympathy for winter fuel payments when these kind of clearly nonsense stories are the ones used to justify it. This woman is 66 and has had at most one winter fuel payment in her life yet apparently is so dependent on it she needs to take out a credit card overdraft and a “credit account” whatever that is. It’s just clear rubbish.

Winter fuel payment: 'I got a credit card after losing the £200'

Pensioners who lost winter fuel money after government changes tell the BBC the last few months have been a struggle.

www.bbc.co.uk

Southport is in the county of Merseyside these days

fernandopartridge · Jan 23, 2025

shmmeee said:
Well this is stupid. Do we want growth or not?

UK politics: ‘It’s not a customs union’: No 10 leaves door open to joining pan-Europe scheme – as it happened

Downing Street says EU’s suggestion of UK joining agreement would not cross its ‘red lines’ for closer ties

www.theguardian.com

I saw that earlier and thought the same, the answer from the Labour minister felt like one of somebody utterly petrified of giving the wrong answer. Would anybody really object to a customs union arrangement with the EU, easy to sell the benefits of it.

shmmeee · Jan 23, 2025

fernandopartridge said:
I saw that earlier and thought the same, the answer from the Labour minister felt like one of somebody utterly petrified of giving the wrong answer. Would anybody really object to a customs union arrangement with the EU, easy to sell the benefits of it.

Especially if as I understand it it’s A customs union not THE customs union so doesn’t touch free movement of people which is what everyone was so up in arms about. Though I wonder if even that has changed when, to be blunt, they’ve been replaced by free movement with India and Nigeria.

shmmeee · Jan 23, 2025

MalcSB said:
Source?

It’s rural Tories basically, no hard source but look at the election results and the positions of their MPs.

Sky Blue Pete · Jan 23, 2025

shmmeee said:
So glad Alison Pearson is fucking off, what an absolute ghoul.

View attachment 40931

Yep cxxt

Captain Dart · Jan 24, 2025

shmmeee said:
Is there any science you believe?

What are your opinions on the laws of thermodynamics?

I never mentioned Science you did, I doubt you have any idea yourself.

I made an economic argument, here is another take.

Thread by @mattwridley on Thread Reader App

@mattwridley: Britain's net-zero-obsessed energy policy came unstuck this week in six different ways: 1. Donald (Drill Baby Drill) Trump tore up electric-vehicle mandates and turned decisively against wind power. Am...…

threadreaderapp.com

Ms Reeves and Mr Miliband will completely screw the GB economy.

fernandopartridge · Jan 24, 2025

Captain Dart said:
I never mentioned Science you did, I doubt you have any idea yourself.

I made an economic argument, here is another take.

Thread by @mattwridley on Thread Reader App

@mattwridley: Britain's net-zero-obsessed energy policy came unstuck this week in six different ways: 1. Donald (Drill Baby Drill) Trump tore up electric-vehicle mandates and turned decisively against wind power. Am...…

threadreaderapp.com

Ms Reeves and Mr Miliband will completely screw the GB economy.

You talk as if the UK economy functions properly or has been doing so? Real wages have still not recovered from a financial crash that was 16 years ago.

Captain Dart · Jan 24, 2025

fernandopartridge said:
You talk as if the UK economy functions properly or has been doing so? Real wages have still not recovered from a financial crash that was 16 years ago.

No I don't. I'm saying their policies will make it even worse.

fernandopartridge · Jan 24, 2025

I don't know how many times I have to say that priority number 1 for the government should be addressing real household disposable income and costs, most specifically energy.

Record jump in businesses in financial distress

Businesses in the most distress include those in hospitality, leisure and retail, say insolvency specialists.

www.bbc.co.uk

This is happening already ahead of the rise in N.I.

shmmeee · Jan 24, 2025

Captain Dart said:
I never mentioned Science you did, I doubt you have any idea yourself.

I made an economic argument, here is another take.

Thread by @mattwridley on Thread Reader App

@mattwridley: Britain's net-zero-obsessed energy policy came unstuck this week in six different ways: 1. Donald (Drill Baby Drill) Trump tore up electric-vehicle mandates and turned decisively against wind power. Am...…

threadreaderapp.com

Ms Reeves and Mr Miliband will completely screw the GB economy.

You posted “how is global warming going for you?” Then a news report of an extreme weather event. JFC.

fernandopartridge · Jan 24, 2025

shmmeee said:
You posted “how is global warming going for you?” Then a news report of an extreme weather event. JFC.

1. Donald (Drill Baby Drill) Trump tore up electric-vehicle mandates and turned decisively against wind power. America, China and India are all going to increase their emissions by much more than we can possibly save.

What does this have to do with us or the economy? The UK needs to transition away from fossil fuels as far as possible for our own security as much as any other reason.

Chris Wright testified how the shale revolution has turned America into now the world’s biggest producer of both oil and gas, ahead of even Saudi Arabia and Russia. That could have been our boom too.

Mining for shale gas is different in a landmass with a population density of 36 people per km2 compared with the UK at 279 people per km2. It's also unclear how this boom has benefited ordinary Americans? They've just booted a president over primarily the cost of living, how with all of this energy wealth is their cost of living rocketing?

On the calm morning of “Dunkelflaute” Wednesday this week just 1 per cent of our electricity came from wind power, even less from solar and a whopping 10 per cent had to be imported at exorbitant cost to prevent the lights going out. How’s that for “energy security”?

If you want to cherry pick statistics, what's the percentage this morning?

The wind business is paid £85 a MWh, well above the price of getting it from gas – and then we add billions to our bills for expanding, backing up and balancing the increasingly stretched and unstable grid that comes with wind. Unreliables are NOT cheaper than reliables

This is not a problem with wind power per se, just a perversity in the privatised energy system.

Britain’s hitherto fabulous strength in AI is being strangled by net zero. Chris Stark of the CCC said he does not believe this and anyway data centres can move to where the wind farms are. He's in denial

I don't believe there is anything in the planning framework to ban the construction of data centres. Plenty exist here already. Where are all the data centres for the AI that doesn't exist!?

Jim Ratcliffe, the boss of Ineos, said on 13 January: “We are witnessing the extinction of one of our major industries as chemical manufacture has the life squeezed out of it” by high energy prices. De-industrialising Britain, he added, achieves nothing for the environment and merely shifts emissions, business and jobs elsewhere.

See answer above. High energy prices are the result of the market. What's Matt's recommendation?

shmmeee · Jan 24, 2025

fernandopartridge said:
What does this have to do with us or the economy? The UK needs to transition away from fossil fuels as far as possible for our own security as much as any other reason.

Mining for shale gas is different in a landmass with a population density of 36 people per km2 compared with the UK at 279 people per km2. It's also unclear how this boom has benefited ordinary Americans? They've just booted a president over primarily the cost of living, how with all of this energy wealth is their cost of living rocketing?

If you want to cherry pick statistics, what's the percentage this morning?

This is not a problem with wind power per se, just a perversity in the privatised energy system.

I don't believe there is anything in the planning framework to ban the construction of data centres. Plenty exist here already. Where are all the data centres for the AI that doesn't exist!?

See answer above. High energy prices are the result of the market. What's Matt's recommendation?

View attachment 40965

Mostly from what I understand because of this:

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/politics/liz-truss-blamed-for-closure-of-north-sea-gas-storage-before-energy-crisis-3810007

shmmeee · Jan 24, 2025

Dart, you’ve been shown the data of it being wholesale prices, you’ve been shown evidence of our reserves being low and making us particularly vulnerable to wholesale rises. All you’ve got is a laughing emoji. I’d be embarrassed if I were you.

PVA · Jan 24, 2025

shmmeee said:
This is why I have no sympathy for winter fuel payments when these kind of clearly nonsense stories are the ones used to justify it. This woman is 66 and has had at most one winter fuel payment in her life yet apparently is so dependent on it she needs to take out a credit card overdraft and a “credit account” whatever that is. It’s just clear rubbish.

Winter fuel payment: 'I got a credit card after losing the £200'

Pensioners who lost winter fuel money after government changes tell the BBC the last few months have been a struggle.

www.bbc.co.uk

This has been community noted - to say that this would be the first year she would even receive the WFA.

Then conveniently the BBC edit the story to say actually she is 67, not 66...Hmm.

shmmeee · Jan 24, 2025

PVA said:
This has been community noted - to say that this would be the first year she would even receive the WFA.

Then conveniently the BBC edit the story to say actually she is 67, not 66...Hmm.

I’d like to see a program of retrofitting or providing new insulated homes prioritising the elderly. But no doubt that’s “fantasy net zero bollocks”

Captain Dart · Jan 24, 2025

shmmeee said:
Mostly from what I understand because of this:

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/politics/liz-truss-blamed-for-closure-of-north-sea-gas-storage-before-energy-crisis-3810007

LOL, Truss was in office for no time & she is being blamed for everything.

As for transitioning from fossil fuels.

The UK needs to transition away from fossil fuels as far as possible for our own security as much as any other reason.

1) It's not necessary to do this at the pace intended for any reason, the pace is insane.
2) Nuclear power which is much more sustainable is being neglected, I think we used to generate ~25% of our load from Nuclear in the 1970's, now its more like 10 to 15% (I'm not sure how much of that is due to a decline in capacity or an increase in demand).
It is reliable base load. EDF/UK government are building Hinkley Point C (3.2GW) & Sizewell C (3.2GW). Hinkley Point is currently projected to finish in 2029-31, but I'd be willing to bet it won't make 2031.
Furthermore a number of older reactors are due to be decommissioned in the next few years.
This paper is useful for background. https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CDP-2024-0036/CDP-2024-0036.pdf
As far as I can see the new projects don't add enough to capacity in the long term, 6.4GW of less whatever is decommissioned to demand that peaks around 47GW on average in winter.
3) Solar and Wind are immature and unreliable technologies, solar isn't very appropriate for the UK climate, practically worthless in winter (I've got solar panels, I've seen it for myself).
4) Energy storage which would make wind and solar power sources far more useful is so far inadequate, either in the technology or facilities available. As it stands the capacity is about 1.2GW and clearly when it discharges into the grid there is a delay before it's available again though I guess they will recharge them overnight. There are however a lot of schemes in the pipeline.
5) The transmission infrastructure is inadequate, do you know the UK pays approx. £2 billion p.a. to wind power generators to disconnect from the grid when it gets overloaded, also much of the generation is too far away on the wrong side of transmission bottlenecks to be used.
6) Regarding security, if you had any idea you'd realise most days the UK imports 10% of its electricity from France, Norway etc and all the gas is imported. Wind and solar generally only contribute a fraction at the moment and gas takes up the load as it can switch in and out swiftly.
7) The idea a struggling grid can supply enough electric vehicles and other increases in demand while replacing petrol and diesel transport is impractical and dangerous. It is far too premature to start banning new internal combustion vehicle sales (if ever), I think Miliband is going for 2030 again, I'm fairly sure it will be set back before then.
8) It was folly to destroy all the coal fired power stations. Some should have at least been mothballed. Ed ordered the last one be decommissioned/demolished quite recently I think.
9) Most UK households are heated by gas fired central heating which for most of us constitute ~80% of our energy usage. I hear the politicians wish us to install heat pumps but that idea has many flaws, their expensive, they are inadequate for old houses and they're noisy. I certainly have no plan to move away from a reliable gas fired system, have you?

Gridwatch is useful to see the current and historical demand supply situation. GB Fuel type power generation production

It's not all doom and gloom but I think Miliband is taking too many risks for political not practical purposes and the bill payer will suffer, we might even get brown outs from time to time, I hope not but I wouldn't bet against it. Expensive energy does not help the UK economy.

shmmeee · Jan 24, 2025

Captain Dart said:
LOL, Truss was in office for no time & she is being blamed for everything.

You didn’t read the article did you? This has nothing to do with her time as PM.

As for the rest of your copy and paste I’m a big supporter of nuclear, check this thread for my comments on it. I’m just not delusional enough to think everything would be fixed with fracking. We import gas and we set prices based on that. That’s why our energy is expensive. You can rant about net zero all you like but the data is there in black and white.

The last government banned onshore wind which is the cheapest form of energy there is and you were silent for 14 years. You’re not fooling anyone.

fernandopartridge · Jan 24, 2025

Captain Dart said:
LOL, Truss was in office for no time & she is being blamed for everything.

As for transitioning from fossil fuels.

1) It's not necessary to do this at the pace intended for any reason, the pace is insane.
2) Nuclear power which is much more sustainable is being neglected, I think we used to generate ~25% of our load from Nuclear in the 1970's, now its more like 10 to 15% (I'm not sure how much of that is due to a decline in capacity or an increase in demand).
It is reliable base load. EDF/UK government are building Hinkley Point C (3.2GW) & Sizewell C (3.2GW). Hinkley Point is currently projected to finish in 2029-31, but I'd be willing to bet it won't make 2031.
Furthermore a number of older reactors are due to be decommissioned in the next few years.
This paper is useful for background. https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CDP-2024-0036/CDP-2024-0036.pdf
As far as I can see the new projects don't add enough to capacity in the long term, 6.4GW of less whatever is decommissioned to demand that peaks around 47GW on average in winter.
3) Solar and Wind are immature and unreliable technologies, solar isn't very appropriate for the UK climate, practically worthless in winter (I've got solar panels, I've seen it for myself).
4) Energy storage which would make wind and solar power sources far more useful is so far inadequate, either in the technology or facilities available. As it stands the capacity is about 1.2GW and clearly when it discharges into the grid there is a delay before it's available again though I guess they will recharge them overnight. There are however a lot of schemes in the pipeline.
5) The transmission infrastructure is inadequate, do you know the UK pays approx. £2 billion p.a. to wind power generators to disconnect from the grid when it gets overloaded, also much of the generation is too far away on the wrong side of transmission bottlenecks to be used.
6) Regarding security, if you had any idea you'd realise most days the UK imports 10% of its electricity from France, Norway etc and all the gas is imported. Wind and solar generally only contribute a fraction at the moment and gas takes up the load as it can switch in and out swiftly.
7) The idea a struggling grid can supply enough electric vehicles and other increases in demand while replacing petrol and diesel transport is impractical and dangerous. It is far too premature to start banning new internal combustion vehicle sales (if ever), I think Miliband is going for 2030 again, I'm fairly sure it will be set back before then.
8) It was folly to destroy all the coal fired power stations. Some should have at least been mothballed. Ed ordered the last one be decommissioned/demolished quite recently I think.
9) Most UK households are heated by gas fired central heating which for most of us constitute ~80% of our energy usage. I hear the politicians wish us to install heat pumps but that idea has many flaws, their expensive, they are inadequate for old houses and they're noisy. I certainly have no plan to move away from a reliable gas fired system, have you?

Gridwatch is useful to see the current and historical demand supply situation. GB Fuel type power generation production

It's not all doom and gloom but I think Miliband is taking too many risks for political not practical purposes and the bill payer will suffer, we might even get brown outs from time to time, I hope not but I wouldn't bet against it. Expensive energy does not help the UK economy.

It's talking about Truss' ministerial roles prior to her stint as PM

Captain Dart · Jan 24, 2025

shmmeee said:
You didn’t read the article did you? This has nothing to do with her time as PM.

As for the rest of your copy and paste I’m a big supporter of nuclear, check this thread for my comments on it. I’m just not delusional enough to think everything would be fixed with fracking. We import gas and we set prices based on that. That’s why our energy is expensive. You can rant about net zero all you like but the data is there in black and white.

The last government banned onshore wind which is the cheapest form of energy there is and you were silent for 14 years. You’re not fooling anyone.

Typical click bait headline.

Copy and paste, was it bollocks, I wrote all that myself, I can construct a reasonably well written argument.

And there you go again, I never mentioned fracking or even oil or gas exploitation in the context of the UK. The article I posted earlier did because it has become part of US energy policy and that effects the UK. What would help the UK would be a peace settlement in the Ukraine which results in UK sanctions on Russian gas imports being lifted and gas falling in price. Did you miss the point I made that gas supplies 80% of the UK's domestic energy demand and no doubt has a fair amount of industrial and commercial applications, the electricity generation component is around 30%, see reference.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/66a7aeb0fc8e12ac3edb0646/DUKES_2024_Chapter_4.pdf

shmmeee · Jan 24, 2025

Captain Dart said:
Typical click bait headline.

Copy and paste, was it bollocks, I wrote all that myself, I can construct a reasonably well written argument.

And there you go again, I never mentioned fracking or even oil or gas exploitation in the context of the UK. The article I posted earlier did because it has become part of US energy policy and that effects the UK. What would help the UK would be a peace settlement in the Ukraine which results in UK sanctions on Russian gas imports being lifted and gas falling in price. Did you miss the point I made that gas supplies 80% of the UK's domestic energy demand and no doubt has a fair amount of industrial and commercial applications, the electricity generation component is around 30%, see reference.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/66a7aeb0fc8e12ac3edb0646/DUKES_2024_Chapter_4.pdf

Yeah that’s fair. I saw wall of text and assumed. Mea cupla

I think you make some reasonable points though many of them like the need to upgrade the grid the government agree with. Some of them like your belief we can’t move to EVs or that solar and wind are immature tech or that heat pumps can’t be used are just ideological nonsense TBH that are a few years out of date.

Battery costs are plummeting like solar costs are. As with EVs you’re acting as if a new technology will always have the same costs as issues when we’ve seen these techs consistently beat even the most optimistic projections on both price and number of installs. We aren’t far off these just being the smart economic choice regardless of your feelings on climate change.

You very clearly don’t think climate change is an issue if you’re willing to entertain ridiculous ideas like keeping coal around. On that you’re hugely wrong I’m afraid and we’re already paying a hefty price for it. And that’s where we part ways ultimately.

Ultimately the tech has matured and the market will make the decision and at that point it’s on the grid to keep up. People like you have been claiming well have blackouts any minute now for twenty years and have consistently been wrong

fernandopartridge · Jan 26, 2025

Lifelong disabilities to be cured I assume

Do you want to discuss boring politics? (16 Viewers)

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