fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
After 5 years of austerity in 2015 they managed to increase the Tory majority. Nobody wants the third way drivel like the silly windfall tax
After 5 years of austerity in 2015 they managed to increase the Tory majority. Nobody wants the third way drivel like the silly windfall taxThe real problem is that the ‘sensible centre’ have fuck all chance of breaking the Tory rule with their commitment to change absolutely fuck all.
The money off will be less than the increase over the next 6 months.After 5 years of austerity in 2015 they managed to increase the Tory majority. Nobody wants the third way drivel like the silly windfall tax
Lol, it's pathetic
Here you go again with that ‘Corbynites’ bollocks….If that's pathetic then what do you make of the government's response?
It's a shame that Corbynites would rather see the Tories and Boris Johnson in power than a Starmer led Labour government.
Starmer isn't perfect, far from it, but he's a million times preferable to Boris fucking Johnson.
It's irrelevant what the government's response is, they are Tories who privatised energy companies in the first place. I know how the government is going to respond. What's more important to me is what the only party I have ever voted for would do differently. Not very much by the sound of it.If that's pathetic then what do you make of the government's response?
It's a shame that Corbynites would rather see the Tories and Boris Johnson in power than a Starmer led Labour government.
Starmer isn't perfect, far from it, but he's a million times preferable to Boris fucking Johnson.
Here you go again with that ‘Corbynites’ bollocks….
The one thing that Corbyn did do was set an agenda of what doing things differently could look like. He wasn’t capable of getting it done sadly but that doesn’t mean you have to expect less as a result.
Starmer had one job - take Corbyn’s ideas and put an ‘electable’ face on it with no baggage or history to hold him back. He has totally and utterly failed in nearly every single aspect.
It's irrelevant what the government's response is, they are Tories who privatised energy companies in the first place. I know how the government is going to respond. What's more important to me is what the only party I have ever voted for would do differently. Not very much by the sound of it.
I am not a Corbynite, it's just my own political beliefs were well matched with Labour's policy agenda in Corbyn's time as leader.
You have such a superficial understanding of politics that you think that Labour's increased popular vote in 2017 was down to adoration for Corbyn
Then I think we just look at things very differently.
To me the most important thing is not what any party would do with the energy crisis if they were in power, because that isn't going to help people pay their bills over the next few months. It's what the government, those who have the power, can do to help people right now when they need it and it's them that should be getting the brunt of people's frustrations, not the bloke who might possibly be in power in 2 years.
Ok then, let's look at it your way. Say the government should do what Labour is suggesting, a windfall tax to reduce the annual increase (average for the poorest is £708) in energy bills by £200.
Can you explain to me how that will solve the chronic poverty that many people are facing?
It is obviously years of Tory government but there is nothing coming from Starmer that suggests he even understands or wants to do anything about it.I never said it would solve chronic poverty.
Why are many people in poverty - because of 12 years of Tory government or because of 2 years of Starmer opposition?
It is obviously years of Tory government but there is nothing coming from Starmer that suggests he even understands or wants to do anything about it.
Why do you seem to have such a blind spot on this?It's not bollocks though, Corbyn fans are so anti-Starmer that they're just presenting the Tories with a victory on a platter. Would you rather Johnson or Starmer was PM?
And how has Starmer failed to put an electable face on it when he took over with a 20 point deficit and now has a 5 point lead? If that's utter failure then blimey what what does that make Corbyn giving the Tories an 80 seat majority?
Why do you seem to have such a blind spot on this?
It’s not about people being Corbyn fans at all - it’s the fact that he set a policy agenda that resonated with lots and lots of people, causing more people to vote for Labour in 2017 then we had seen for many years. Equally you saw that drop when he agreed to a suicidal policy on Brexit in 2019.
Starmer has set to tearing that policy agenda apart under some untrue guise about ‘electability’ and replaced it with nothing other than some shitty 3 word rubbish.
That’s why he’s a failure - a lot of it may well be down to being very poorly advised, but if he can’t see that the public need more than a Blair/Miliband rehash then it’s on him.
I think we're both coming from same direction and both want the same result - an end of Tory government and an improved society, particularly for those less well off.
Tory liteWhat are Labour trying to present themselves as at the next election?
he just sees politics in some binary simplistic manner. He can’t see the reason for labours failure in the north seats was the brexit policy and three words won the election
I think you’re going to end up disappointed, unfortunately.Will be good to have them straight back next GE election though once they realise they made a massive mistake.
It was his attitude to Brexit that caused many of the issues. A well communicated, consistent policy that involved a (democratic!) vote (let's not forget, in pure Greek democracy, every decision is supposed to be voted on by the people!) was fine, but Corbyn was entirely incompetent in delivering, or showing any energy, or capability. He was a massive let-down. Ditto the initial vote, where he couldn't bring himself to get behind his party's position, but nor was he able to show his own convictions.Why do you seem to have such a blind spot on this?
It’s not about people being Corbyn fans at all - it’s the fact that he set a policy agenda that resonated with lots and lots of people, causing more people to vote for Labour in 2017 then we had seen for many years. Equally you saw that drop when he agreed to a suicidal policy on Brexit in 2019.
Starmer has set to tearing that policy agenda apart under some untrue guise about ‘electability’ and replaced it with nothing other than some shitty 3 word rubbish.
That’s why he’s a failure - a lot of it may well be down to being very poorly advised, but if he can’t see that the public need more than a Blair/Miliband rehash then it’s on him.
I think you’re going to end up disappointed, unfortunately.
It was his attitude to Brexit that caused many of the issues. A well communicated, consistent policy that involved a (democratic!) vote (let's not forget, in pure Greek democracy, every decision is supposed to be voted on by the people!) was fine, but Corbyn was entirely incompetent in delivering, or showing any energy, or capability. He was a massive let-down. Ditto the initial vote, where he couldn't bring himself to get behind his party's position, but nor was he able to show his own convictions.
Of course, the biggest criticisms of Corbyn and now Starmer appear to come from the left-leaning people, which I too find absurd. On this board, of the right leaning ones, I can only think of Steve who comes close to criticising Johnson!
it was piss poor but most of those seats would never have gone Tory if the Brexit policy was to honour the referendum
Starmer will trip himself up again over this again before the next election
The real problem is that the ‘sensible centre’ have fuck all chance of breaking the Tory rule with their commitment to change absolutely fuck all.
It was his attitude to Brexit that caused many of the issues. A well communicated, consistent policy that involved a (democratic!) vote (let's not forget, in pure Greek democracy, every decision is supposed to be voted on by the people!) was fine, but Corbyn was entirely incompetent in delivering, or showing any energy, or capability. He was a massive let-down. Ditto the initial vote, where he couldn't bring himself to get behind his party's position, but nor was he able to show his own convictions.
Of course, the biggest criticisms of Corbyn and now Starmer appear to come from the left-leaning people, which I too find absurd. On this board, of the right leaning ones, I can only think of Steve who comes close to criticising Johnson!
Yep but Corbyn starmer and no oppositionYou'd be pretty disgusted if this happened over an government term. Or maybe over a year.
This is just one week.
The level of incompetency and negligence is just mind boggling
I never suggested that the last Labour government did nothing - but the last one elected was 2005 by which point they had regressed hugely from their 1997 high and the world has changed a lot since then.And yet the polling is looking good and the centre left is still the only part of the party to win an election.
Most people don’t want massive change. That scares the shit out of them. They want competence and compassion. It’s students and the like who want to dismantle capitalism or whatever.
The idea the last Labour govenrment changed fuck all is laughable I’m sorry. Labour governments are better than Tory ones always. Socially, economically, environmentally. The idea it’s revolutionary socialism or bust is for 15 year olds.
Oh dear.
For balance this doesn't look great either.Oh dear.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?