So what happens when the Tories get in again? They undo everything that Labour gave back to the working classes without the EU providing the bottom rung of the ladder. Leave has basically put us into a perpetual slide and climb of worker’s rights. Well done.Yet again showing how stupid you are, the left case for brexit is
1. No compulsory privatisation of public services
2. Ability to elect a government that has full control over all legislation enacted in the UK
Surely you've got faith that Keir Starmer and his forthcoming Labour government shall not only keep the best elements of current employment law but also improve them in favour of workers?
So what happens when the Tories get in again? They undo everything that Labour gave back to the working classes without the EU providing the bottom rung of the ladder. Leave has basically put us into a perpetual slide and climb of worker’s rights. Well done.
Is that 2023?We're not going to have to wait for them to get in again, Brexit Freedom Bill comes into effect on New year's eve.
Some of the anti union mob on here will be delighted to see some of our hard won freedoms rolled back no doubt.
Is that 2023?
It’s still good it’s still goodWhile on the subject of the own goal they’re trying to sell us another brexit win, pork exports to South Korea. Sounds good until you look at the reality.
First of all they’re saying it could be worth £1M over five years, or £200K a year. Wow wee. Slight problem, Britain is loosing £4M a year in pork exports to the EU because of brexit.
Secondly. The government and right wing press aren’t going to tell you this but it looks like it’s a partial copy and paste of a deal that the EU did with South Korea back in September. Partial because the EU/South Korea deal also included poultry whereas ours doesn’t seem to. So basically our farmers would be enjoying a better deal had we remained.
Thirdly. We had to cull 10% of the pigs we raised last year because of the loss of freedom of movement meaning we no longer have the skilled workers available to slaughter and butcher the pigs we raised.
So just to recap. “Could” be up to £1M over five years. Isn’t going to replace the known £4M loss a year due to brexit. Could have had a better deal if we were still in. Probably can’t take advantage of the deal anyway as we’ve lost the ability to process what pigs we’ve got already. In other words they think we’re all stupid enough to buy it as a win.
Employment law in the UK originated in the UK, and is generally superior to the minimum EU standards. This despite having had Tory governments for most of the last 100 years.So what happens when the Tories get in again? They undo everything that Labour gave back to the working classes without the EU providing the bottom rung of the ladder. Leave has basically put us into a perpetual slide and climb of worker’s rights. Well done.
A food pub near me is even offering to take somebody on as a chef with no experience, in some respects that is good (creating career opportunities) but does show access to labour has been massively reduced.I’m over at the moment and most places seem to have signs up about staffing and/or supply chain issues impacting service(s)…I wonder why?
Apologies for calling you stupid, it was unfair and I'd had a fewNo I am not confident that Starmer would bring back the employment protections that we will lose because of Brexit. It would take decades of Labour Governments to get those back, which is exactly why we needed the certainty of being part of the EU.
The point of Brexit for the Tories was deregulation and abolishing employment rights. The nonsense about sovereignty and the nationalism and xenophobia was just for the 'plebs' so they would vote against their best interests. I would rather have EU law protections than having the Tories having full control of our laws.
What you fail to acknowledge or understand is that EU law is about protecting its members laws on everything from tax to human rights to workers rights. Our laws may have been created in the UK but they were protected by EU laws. That protection has gone and the Tory government you helped to install with your flawed ideology are going to undo decades and decades of what the unions fought for. It’s happening in front of your very eyes and you’re still in denial of the consequences of your ideology. Maybe I misjudged you when I said you were intelligent enough to understand what you’ve done.Employment law in the UK originated in the UK, and is generally superior to the minimum EU standards. This despite having had Tory governments for most of the last 100 years.
The function of EU employment law is as much about the 4 freedoms as it is about creating better conditions for an employee.
A food pub near me is even offering to take somebody on as a chef with no experience, in some respects that is good (creating career opportunities) but does show access to labour has been massively reduced.
Got any links to studies about a shortage of staff across the west?You’re wasting your breath mate. People ignore the fact that there’s a massive shortage of staff in many western countries due to post pandemic illness and people choosing to leave the workforce…oh, and the fact that we still had 500k-600k net migration this year.
We should be focussing on training and retraining the people we have, getting pay right and encouraging business investment* rather than continue the Ponzi scheme of ploughing more and more cheap labour into the country whatever their skills which is what happened with freedom of movement. Since the financial crisis productivity has been on its arse, yet our population has grown by at least 6% in a decade excluding illegal migrants….that’s 3.5m+ more people who all need public services, housing etc during a period post austerity when government expenditure was squeezed. How is this never mentioned in mainstream media ?! Too easy to shout brexit at everything and anything. It’s crazy
ps didn’t we have a separate thread for this stuff ? I prefer to keep this one for the who’s the most leftie battles
*as well as plugging immediate skills gaps with relaxed visa requirements in specific areas like social care
There was an OECD paper in July but that didn't actually show what he is claimingGot any links to studies about a shortage of staff across the west?
Adding cheap labour to the workforce also happened pre freedom of movement too, BTW.
I have a couple of newspaper recommendations for youour population has grown by at least 6% in a decade excluding illegal migrants….that’s 3.5m+ more people who all need public services, housing etc during a period post austerity when government expenditure was squeezed. How is this never mentioned in mainstream media ?!
No problem mate. I think we've all been called far worse.Apologies for calling you stupid, it was unfair and I'd had a few
IIRC correctly it’s a skills shortage not a labour shortage as such.There was an OECD paper in July but that didn't actually show what he is claiming
What you fail to acknowledge or understand is that EU law is about protecting its members laws on everything from tax to human rights to workers rights. Our laws may have been created in the UK but they were protected by EU laws. That protection has gone and the Tory government you helped to install with your flawed ideology are going to undo decades and decades of what the unions fought for. It’s happening in front of your very eyes and you’re still in denial of the consequences of your ideology. Maybe I misjudged you when I said you were intelligent enough to understand what you’ve done.
What you fail to acknowledge or understand is that EU law is about protecting its members laws on everything from tax to human rights to workers rights. Our laws may have been created in the UK but they were protected by EU laws. That protection has gone and the Tory government you helped to install with your flawed ideology are going to undo decades and decades of what the unions fought for. It’s happening in front of your very eyes and you’re still in denial of the consequences of your ideology. Maybe I misjudged you when I said you were intelligent enough to understand what you’ve done.
Once again your faith in the Tory party flabbergasts me. You seemed to have learned nothing from the last year let alone the last 12. You’re so entrenched in your ideology you’ve had to result to defending the Tories intellect.The EU laws on employment are for the purpose of the functioning of the single market. Yes they offer a minimum standard but what you fail to acknowledge is that those standards are often inferior to those new legislated in the UK where they are even legislated for, the EU employment laws don't even cover the same breadth of issues as the UK laws. For somebody who is such an EU advocate surely you should know a bit more about it!?
Now I trust the Tories less than anybody (unlike you I haven't voted for them or their extremist wing UKIP) but they are really not so stupid as to slash employment rights to a level lower than the minimum EU standards. The Trade and Cooperation agreement between UK and EU I believe expects that the UK will adopt at least comparable standards to the EU in any case (again where they even exist).
You’re wasting your breath mate. People ignore the fact that there’s a massive shortage of staff in many western countries due to post pandemic illness and people choosing to leave the workforce…oh, and the fact that we still had 500k-600k net migration this year.
We should be focussing on training and retraining the people we have, getting pay right and encouraging business investment* rather than continue the Ponzi scheme of ploughing more and more cheap labour into the country whatever their skills which is what happened with freedom of movement. Since the financial crisis productivity has been on its arse, yet our population has grown by at least 6% in a decade excluding illegal migrants….that’s 3.5m+ more people who all need public services, housing etc during a period post austerity when government expenditure was squeezed. How is this never mentioned in mainstream media ?! Too easy to shout brexit at everything and anything. It’s crazy
ps didn’t we have a separate thread for this stuff ? I prefer to keep this one for the who’s the most leftie battles
*as well as plugging immediate skills gaps with relaxed visa requirements in specific areas like social care
Brexit has made those issues worse though and that’s the point. Especially illegal immigration which seems to have shot up now we don’t have any deals for return or processing. The solutions to those are tighter rules on immigration and ID cards really.
I’ve been hearing/reading about it for months, USAs probably one of the worst. This is from a quick google searchGot any links to studies about a shortage of staff across the west?
Adding cheap labour to the workforce also happened pre freedom of movement too, BTW.
I don’t doubt that some of the the issues have been exacerbated by Brexit. My point was more that people are talking like it’s the root cause of the problems, when it’s not. It a majority of cases it’s relatively minor in the grand scheme of things (compared to Covid reproc
That’s not to say the government don’t need to sort their shit out, marginalise the ERG idiots and forge a closer relationship with Europe for both sides sakes.
I’ve been hearing/reading about it for months, USAs probably one of the worst. This is from a quick google search
Germany Faces $85 Billion Hit as Labor Shortages Intensify
As Germany grapples with an energy crisis threatening its future as an industrial leader, an acute shortage of workers is compounding problems for manufacturers already struggling to stay competitive.www.bloomberg.com
German Labor Shortages Menace Half of Companies Across Economy
A half of all German companies are struggling to find skilled workers, threatening to undermine production and inflict more permanent damage on Europe’s largest economy.www.bloomberg.com
Spanish hotels face staff crisis in struggle to fill 200,000 jobs before summer
The holiday season is looking like it may be a little turbulent this year, with bosses in Spanish tourism resorts hiring staff with no experience, no CVs and very little trainingwww.mirror.co.uk
Covid caused huge shortages in US labor market, study shows
At least 500,000 people have permanently disappeared from the workforce, analysis saysamp.theguardian.com
Truck Driver Shortage in Europe | DHL Freight
Road freight transport is suffering from a shortage of truck drivers. What are possible solutions and what does DHL Freight offer its carriers?dhl-freight-connections.com
Hospitality has been impacted in particular, not just because of Brexit, but because workers have been treated poorly for years and covid meant many found alternative employment.
Our workforce has apparently shrunk by 600k post covid.
Edit - if the government pulled their head out their arses, they could demonstrate a flexible migration system outside the EU could be beneficial, however, as I’ve mentioned before you have people on the right of the party not accepting that some migration is always going to be needed
Ps incase people haven’t read, there’s also been health worker strikes in France and Germany, probably other countries as well. Due to extra pressure, wanting more wages etc etc. Most of the issues we face are replicated elsewhere although you wouldn’t realise it from a lot of the media
The first two articles are for skilled jobs shortages - the UK seems to have issues with both skilled and no skilled shortages from what I’ve seen.I’ve been hearing/reading about it for months, USAs probably one of the worst. This is from a quick google search
Germany Faces $85 Billion Hit as Labor Shortages Intensify
As Germany grapples with an energy crisis threatening its future as an industrial leader, an acute shortage of workers is compounding problems for manufacturers already struggling to stay competitive.www.bloomberg.com
German Labor Shortages Menace Half of Companies Across Economy
A half of all German companies are struggling to find skilled workers, threatening to undermine production and inflict more permanent damage on Europe’s largest economy.www.bloomberg.com
Spanish hotels face staff crisis in struggle to fill 200,000 jobs before summer
The holiday season is looking like it may be a little turbulent this year, with bosses in Spanish tourism resorts hiring staff with no experience, no CVs and very little trainingwww.mirror.co.uk
Covid caused huge shortages in US labor market, study shows
At least 500,000 people have permanently disappeared from the workforce, analysis saysamp.theguardian.com
Truck Driver Shortage in Europe | DHL Freight
Road freight transport is suffering from a shortage of truck drivers. What are possible solutions and what does DHL Freight offer its carriers?dhl-freight-connections.com
Hospitality has been impacted in particular, not just because of Brexit, but because workers have been treated poorly for years and covid meant many found alternative employment.
Our workforce has apparently shrunk by 600k post covid.
Edit - if the government pulled their head out their arses, they could demonstrate a flexible migration system outside the EU could be beneficial, however, as I’ve mentioned before you have people on the right of the party not accepting that some migration is always going to be needed
Ps incase people haven’t read, there’s also been health worker strikes in France and Germany, probably other countries as well. Due to extra pressure, wanting more wages etc etc. Most of the issues we face are replicated elsewhere although you wouldn’t realise it from a lot of the media
We discussed the HGV driver shortage on here when it happened on here.
Don't think anyone blamed it solely on Brexit, but Brexit did remove several thousand drivers from the labour market which only exasperated the problem.
The DVLA was dreadful way before Brexit.Agreed. Figure was dwarfed by the backlog of tests and licences. I won’t share thoughts on dvla on here…pushing my luck already
The DVLA was dreadful way before Brexit.
ReassuringView attachment 27912
What’s this? Next leader? Brexit has really done a number on the natural party of government.
Engage the points made for a change eh? I've just pointed out a few facts none of which you dispute. You seem to think it'll be a permanent Tory government despite the fact the opposition is currently in a double digit lead in the polls.Once again your faith in the Tory party flabbergasts me. You seemed to have learned nothing from the last year let alone the last 12. You’re so entrenched in your ideology you’ve had to result to defending the Tories intellect.
You seem to think that the Tories will never get back in again. Hence I said a yo yo of workers rights. The government are looking to remove Direct Effect. This is what protects amongst other things equal pay. This was previously protected under Article 157 as EU members. I quote “EU countries must eliminate discrimination on grounds of sex with regard to all aspects and conditions of remuneration for the same work or for work of equal value”. So when your wife, sister or daughter suddenly find their wages falling behind their male co workers don’t forget that they have you to thank for it. Well done.Engage the points made for a change eh? I've just pointed out a few facts none of which you dispute. You seem to think it'll be a permanent Tory government despite the fact the opposition is currently in a double digit lead in the polls.
Grow up you utter child. The Equality Act 2010 provides legal recourse in the UK for an equal pay claim. I'm not going to bother arguing with you anymore as you clearly do not understand the relationship between UK law and EU law.You seem to think that the Tories will never get back in again. Hence I said a yo yo of workers rights. The government are looking to remove Direct Effect. This is what protects amongst other things equal pay. This was previously protected under Article 157 as EU members. I quote “EU countries must eliminate discrimination on grounds of sex with regard to all aspects and conditions of remuneration for the same work or for work of equal value”. So when your wife, sister or daughter suddenly find their wages falling behind their male co workers don’t forget that they have you to thank for it. Well done.
The equality act of 2010 was brought in to replicate an EU directive into UK law. That is the relationship between UK law and EU. Or should I say was. You voted to do away with that.Grow up you utter child. The Equality Act 2010 provides legal recourse in the UK for an equal pay claim. I'm not going to bother arguing with you anymore as you clearly do not understand the relationship between UK law and EU law.
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