Do you want to discuss boring politics? (51 Viewers)

[shmmeee]

@Sky Blue Pete

just came across this on Twitter. One of those “too good to be true” graphs I reckon but do you know if there’s similar data in the UK that shows prison numbers increasing as we shut mental asylums?

 

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[Brighton Sky Blue]

Ah yes Wea Streeting who says “why aren’t you looking at policy that changed rather than hassling a GCSE student?”

You’ve been on autopilot since Corbyn lost. Sad to see.

Nope, the Wes Streeting who says donations like this are the same as donations to charity.

 

[shmmeee]

Nope, the Wes Streeting who says donations like this are the same as donations to charity.

A long time Labour supporter and friend of Labour MPs buying some clothes so the PM looks nice or helping out his sisters friend is not the problem with money in politics.

YouTube taking Labour figures to Glasto then changing the Digital Sevrices Tax policy, large hedge funds giving millions to whoever looks like everting govt. these are concerning.

It says an awful lot that you and the media are very loud about the first which is just a tactic to take out a major donor similar to the Dianne Abbott racism stuff with the Tories, and absolutely nothing to say about actually buying influence in politics. And that’s because all political parties run like this.

You can’t say what’s wrong or what you’d change. What tax rises you’d put in to replace the party funding. It says a lot about your motivations.

.

 

[SBAndy]

I’m finding this whole episode baffling. Beth Rigby trying to set up the old “do you know how it looks? Most people would want private facilities for their children to study for GCSEs.”

Most people weren’t vying to be Prime Minister. Most people didn’t have journalists camped outside their family home. Stop trying to draw an equivalence.

 

[MalcSB]

I’ve never been convinced that Starmer will remain PM for the entire period. So much sleaze so soon and such unprecedentedly poor early approval ratings just reinforce that feeling,

 

[MalcSB]

I’m finding this whole episode baffling. Beth Rigby trying to set up the old “do you know how it looks? Most people would want private facilities for their children to study for GCSEs.”

Most people weren’t vying to be Prime Minister. Most people didn’t have journalists camped outside their family home. Stop trying to draw an equivalence.

Its just an excuse, and as I said earlier I hope the same consideration to preventing disruption is given to pupils at private schools who are taking exams next year.

 

[MalcSB]

Having taken all the most freebies of any MP, Starmer’s mortgage had been paid off.

 

[shmmeee]

It’s just an excuse, and as I said earlier I hope the same consideration to preventing disruption is given to pupils at private schools who are taking exams next year.

I would support a policy that any 16 year old who has the worlds press camped outside their family home gets a quiet place to study.

 

[fernandopartridge]

I would support a policy that any 16 year old who has the worlds press camped outside their family home gets a quiet place to study.

Does Kier Starmer not have any family?

 

[shmmeee]

Does Kier Starmer not have any family?

Genuinely. Is the problem that this guy is a donor or what? If it was his rich mate from school would that have been better? Lord Ali clearly is close friends with several Labour MPs and a long time supporter of the party. If he’s not allowed to donate literally no one is.

Be clear. What is the actual problem you’ve got and what would you like to happen? Because it comes off just as “politicians shouldn’t have rich friends”, which considering a PM who was a literal multi millionaire who no one commented on it seems a little false outrage.

 

[Grendel]

I would support a policy that any 16 year old who has the worlds press camped outside their family home gets a quiet place to study.

A library?

 

[shmmeee]

Absolutely crazy that we’re concerned about a long time friend buying some glasses and not millions of pounds of cash being exchanged with businesses for who knows what.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

@Sky Blue Pete

just came across this on Twitter. One of those “too good to be true” graphs I reckon but do you know if there’s similar data in the UK that shows prison numbers increasing as we shut mental asylums?

View attachment 38652

Wow that is a powerful chart
There will be the same causal link I’m not aware of a chart
Was recently on a conference call for Imb with national leaders on holistic medical care in prison context
We were showing the harm being done segregating prisoners with mental health issues and diagnosis in isolation
Can’t find a similar chart but this is interesting

https://prisonreformtrust.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Prison-the-facts-2022.pdf

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I’ve never been convinced that Starmer will remain PM for the entire period. So much sleaze so soon and such unprecedentedly poor early approval ratings just reinforce that feeling,

It’s not just starmer it’s the political establishment and hatred of anyone who has it better than you or I

He’s paying for Johnson Blair truss and everyone else and if anyone thinks farage tice and Anderson will be any better they are fuckin imbeciles

 

[Grendel]

It’s not just starmer it’s the political establishment and hatred of anyone who has it better than you or I

He’s paying for Johnson Blair truss and everyone else and if anyone thinks farage tice and Anderson will be any better they are fuckin imbeciles

Which is fine unless you take a moral high ground of cleaning up politics when in reality your snout is firmly in the trough

 

[Sbarcher]

And another one.

Labour MP took £1.2m loan from Lord Alli to buy house for her sister

Siobhain McDonagh says peer was ‘best friends’ with terminally ill sibling Margaret, Labour’s first female general secretary

www.telegraph.co.uk

Loan took out in MPs name but needs to wait for her sister's estate to pay Ali back......... hmmm smells a bit.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Which is fine unless you take a moral high ground of cleaning up politics when in reality your snout is firmly in the trough

It is but it’s not in the trough as much and when everything is challenged as shmmee and sbandy have been saying people just say everyone is just as bad when they’re not

 

[MalcSB]

I would support a policy that any 16 year old who has the worlds press camped outside their family home gets a quiet place to study.

So, selective about what is disruptive then. As in one rule for one, another for everyone else.

Or as socialists might put it, we are all equal but some are more equal than others. Or others might say service to self,

 

[MalcSB]

Genuinely. Is the problem that this guy is a donor or what? If it was his rich mate from school would that have been better? Lord Ali clearly is close friends with several Labour MPs and a long time supporter of the party. If he’s not allowed to donate literally no one is.

Be clear. What is the actual problem you’ve got and what would you like to happen? Because it comes off just as “politicians shouldn’t have rich friends”, which considering a PM who was a literal multi millionaire who no one commented on it seems a little false outrage.

Starmer is a multi millionaire,

 

[MalcSB]

It is but it’s not in the trough as much and when everything is challenged as shmmee and sbandy have been saying people just say everyone is just as bad when they’re not

Starmer has taken the most freebies of any MP, his snout must be further in the trough than anyone’s.

No wonder he won’t take lectures from the likes of us.

 

[MalcSB]

It is but it’s not in the trough as much and when everything is challenged as shmmee and sbandy have been saying people just say everyone is just as bad when they’re not

Is this the competence you were expecting Pete?

 

[SBAndy]

It’s like the world of journalism has only just discovered the register of interests. There’s literally no story around any of this.

 

[shmmeee]

Starmer is a multi millionaire,

Right. So is the problem he has multimillionaire friends? That his friends give him gifts? Walk me through this and why it’s OK for an oil or tech company to give millions to a party in government but a long time close donor to the party can’t pay for clothes during an election campaign.

 

[shmmeee]

It’s like the world of journalism has only just discovered the register of interests. There’s literally no story around any of this.

The story is hide your donations and gifts like the Tories, or give millions in cash and receive no scrutiny.

 

[shmmeee]

Wow that is a powerful chart
There will be the same causal link I’m not aware of a chart
Was recently on a conference call for Imb with national leaders on holistic medical care in prison context
We were showing the harm being done segregating prisoners with mental health issues and diagnosis in isolation
Can’t find a similar chart but this is interesting

https://prisonreformtrust.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Prison-the-facts-2022.pdf

I know the old style asylums rightly had a bad rep, but I wonder if something like that but with a more modern approach might help. I also wonder what the cost difference is and if prison is cheaper that’s why we’ve moved away from asylums.

 

[MalcSB]

You were trying to make some point about Sunak being a multi millionaire. I’m just making the observation that Starmer is also a multi millionaire.

 

[shmmeee]

I’m

You were trying to make some point about Sunak being a multi millionaire. I’m just making the observation that Starmer is also a multi millionaire.

Not anything like the same. Sunak net worth is £750m Starmer is more like £4m and most of that will be property and pensions.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Starmer has taken the most freebies of any MP, his snout must be further in the trough than anyone’s.

No wonder he won’t take lectures from the likes of us.

Johnson beats him pants down

 

[MalcSB]

I’m


Not anything like the same. Sunak net worth is £750m Starmer is more like £4m and most of that will be property and pensions.

I know it’s not of the same magnitude, but in the same way millionaire pensioners shouldn’t need to have their fuel costs subsidised neither should politicians need to have their specs, trousers, football hospitality, concert tickets and child’s library space subsidised.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Is this the competence you were expecting Pete?

There’s no balance whatsoever - much of what he and they’ve done is good and long term
Huge own goal with wfa but dealt with riots well. He’s an intelligent guy

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Johnson beats him pants down

Well he's hardly likely to have his pants up is he..?

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I know the old style asylums rightly had a bad rep, but I wonder if something like that but with a more modern approach might help. I also wonder what the cost difference is and if prison is cheaper that’s why we’ve moved away from asylums.

Staffing would be more per person in there. Google oasis and Steve chalke
Early intervention is the key in fact id go so far as to say it’s a silver bullet

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Staffing would be more per person in there. Google oasis and Steve chalke
Early intervention is the key in fact id go so far as to say it’s a silver bullet

But you would know that from education

 

[skybluetony176]

Starmer has taken the most freebies of any MP, his snout must be further in the trough than anyone’s.

No wonder he won’t take lectures from the likes of us.

There’s an article in the London Economic pointing out that Boris took more in freebies to decorate his flat than Starmer has taken since being leader of the Labour Party (2019) so I don’t think that’s remotely true.

Is it a good look for Starmer that he’s taken as much as he has? No, absolutely not. It’s poor decision making. But there’s no need to exaggerate that he’s taken more than anyone else. Especially when you have someone like Boris in the mix.

 

[shmmeee]

I know it’s not of the same magnitude, but in the same way millionaire pensioners shouldn’t need to have their fuel costs subsidised neither should politicians need to have their specs, trousers, football hospitality, concert tickets and child’s library space subsidised.

Subsidised by donors. Not tax payers.

What are you actually asking for?

Why shouldn’t a politician have campaign costs covered by donors? And why only small gifts from close people and not the millions from vested interests? And if you get rid of them do you want taxpayers to fund campaign costs instead?

It’s just all so random and illogical. Half the time it’s “the PM/LOTO shouldn’t have nice things” and the other it’s “oh corruption, but ignore a petrochemical firm pouring millions in cash in”. Just comes off as confected.