Doyle! (3 Viewers)

[GaryMabbuttsLeftKnee]

It's been pretty obvious that Doyle isn't having anywhere near as positive effect this season as last season for quite a while. He has largely been poor, and had he been a new signing I think would have been scapegoated and slaughtered on here. We have an issue now though, because eventually when Robins' decides to drop him, if Ogogo/Kelly come in and the team as a whole don't put in a performance, there will be a section of the crowd saying 'That's why we need Doyle' when in actual fact it may well have happened (as seen lately) with Doyle in the team. We will need to give whoever comes in time and patience (I know that can be a tall order for some) to gain a foothold in the team and establish themselves as the main man. I'm not sure if it was fitness related but it annoyed me it wasn't tried against Walsall in the FA Cup. As much as I wanted to get through that round, it would have been a great opportunity to ease someone in with some minutes, instead we learnt not a lot from that game and are out the cup anyway.

 

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[steve82]

MR himself said he's always out of position. I forget now who he scored a last minute goal against, but he made the comment then on CWR. He said that he was out of position but (something they've talked about a lot in training) but he'd let him off on this occasion as it resulted in a goal.

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“Michael Doyle, who I’ve asked to make sure he stays in his slot all afternoon, he came out thankfully and got a tap in which was great.

“When you’re a goal down, things change and game-plans change. He’s come up with a really important goal for us.

Last part says it all really

 

[steve82]

A lot of the issue now with Doyle is a secondary impact of teams adjusting to Thomas' pace. Word about Thomas' speed seems to have got around the division now and recently teams have started playing deeper to negate it. This stretches the area that the midfield need to cover which makes his anchor role ineffective and exposes some of his own weaknesses with pace and agility - if he needs to cover more ground he's ended up chasing a lot of shadows.
Ultimately we have to get more bodies in midfield in that circumstance and I think there's a few realistic plan B options without making sweeping changes:

1) Play a high line ourselves to close the gap in midfield (we did it very well at the start of the 2H against Peterborough, both Doyle and the fullbacks starting position was on halfway) but there's higher risk defensively by leaving a big gap in behind our team, and without Willis our back 4 is very pedestrian - none of Brown, Grimmer, Davies, Hyam or Doyle are quick and Burge has been historically poor at coming off his line.

2) Change to a 4-5-1 to get an extra body in midfield - Chaplin has been trying to do it but for me we need a proper midfielder in there to go to a true 4-5-1. It might seem like a negative change to lose a striker but I'd rather have a ball winner like Ogogo or Kelly to link play and let Bayliss play higher. Thomas, Bayliss, Hiwula, JCH should be enough attacking threat with a solid midfield behind them and I think this is a viable option to change for the 2nd half of games when using the subs, rather than just changing personnel in the 4-4-2.

3) Get the fullbacks playing higher up the pitch. Leave Doyle in his anchor role, get the fullbacks higher up the pitch, tuck the wide players inside a bit to bulk out the midfield and give us 2 extra options for shorter forward passes This option I see as an interim change e.g. something to try for 10 minutes to drag the opposition out of their own box as they try to match up with our change.

Just some thoughts anyway. As teams are adjusting to our strengths it is exposing unexpected weaknesses and I'd like to see a better plan B in those circumstances.

Very good post!
Positive and Productive to understand what could be done to eradicate current issues.


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[steve82]

Not as silly as Chaplin and he scores when he wants.

I’ll raise you 20 goals Bakayoko. ;-)


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[Mucca Mad Boys]

It's been pretty obvious that Doyle isn't having anywhere near as positive effect this season as last season for quite a while. He has largely been poor, and had he been a new signing I think would have been scapegoated and slaughtered on here. We have an issue now though, because eventually when Robins' decides to drop him, if Ogogo/Kelly come in and the team as a whole don't put in a performance, there will be a section of the crowd saying 'That's why we need Doyle' when in actual fact it may well have happened (as seen lately) with Doyle in the team. We will need to give whoever comes in time and patience (I know that can be a tall order for some) to gain a foothold in the team and establish themselves as the main man. I'm not sure if it was fitness related but it annoyed me it wasn't tried against Walsall in the FA Cup. As much as I wanted to get through that round, it would have been a great opportunity to ease someone in with some minutes, instead we learnt not a lot from that game and are out the cup anyway.

I don’t think he’s the issue per se. At 37, to be playing week in, week out and is/was leading the league in ‘progressive’ passing shows his influence goes under the radar. However, this said, he’s been partly responsible for the goals in our last 2 home games. In my view, it’s because we have such an attacking midfield with Bayliss, Thomas and Hiwula he gets isolated somewhat. Personally, if Kelly was fully fit, he’d be the ideal partner. Why? If anyone was at the Stanley game, you could see how Kelly being on the field took the burden off Doyle playmaking wise as Kelly has a wider range of passing. But Kelly just hasn’t been able to get fit so going forward, we should rest Hiwula and move Bayliss on either wing with Ogogo and Doyle in the middle. A problem with that is probably that neither player is comfortable carrying the ball like Bayliss is nor the range of passing. For me, Doyle is an important player for us because we have such an inexperienced side. But, it ought to be his last season as a starter because we could do with someone younger in that role.

Just going over a few options in my head, if Kelly and Ogogo can stay fit, they could potentially form a well balanced pairing, if you shift Bayliss outwide. Otherwise the alternative is Bayliss behind the striker in a 4-2-3-1. Bayliss and Ogogo (in a 4-4-2) don’t seem like they would compliment each other because they both play high up the pitch, so unless we have 3 CMs, that’s probably untenable.

 

[higgs]

I can't see Doyle stepping a side in the summer I'd say he will play until he's 40 he has lost some pace but he's still full of running for the 90 mins week in week out

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[steve82]

Personally I think he will sign a player/coach role deal mainly to be used as cover only and but will play in cup games like the checkatrade trophy and should we get non league sides in the FA Cup.

I think he’s lot to offer the younger lads coming through that could help them while cutting his teeth coaching


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[Esoterica]

Personally I think he will sign a player/coach role deal mainly to be used as cover only and but will play in cup games like the checkatrade trophy and should we get non league sides in the FA Cup.

I think he’s lot to offer the younger lads coming through that could help them while cutting his teeth coaching


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There's a Robert Page joke in there somewhere!