David O'Day
Well-Known Member
Yep it's looking at the deal between CCC and Wasps. It doesn't matter who runs CCFC or if CCFC exist at the time. It's purely the alleged use of state aid.
Yep it's looking at the deal between CCC and Wasps. It doesn't matter who runs CCFC or if CCFC exist at the time. It's purely the alleged use of state aid.The investigation and potential loss for Wasps flowing from it is CCFC owner agnostic.
Yes, it included the club rather than just SISU.I stand to be corrected but I am fairly certain Wasps were holding both the club and SISU accountable in their terms. So they are already insisting on this regardless of SISU.
Its almost as if sisu never wanted a rent deal......To me, it's the negotiating in bad faith argument. You make a commitment, sign documents to the order of that commitment, and don't mention the fact you've tried to set something off in Europe. When this comes to light I find... interesting, and I'm not beyond a conspiracy theory that the timing was SISU's doing, in order to push Wasps to the decision they made as, much like Northampton, SISU actually wanted to push towards that position.
If parties are to be believed (and not the obvious ones, either), SISU did a remarkable job in keeping that complaint quiet from just about everybody. That approach, in itself, I find... interesting.
Anyway despite all that, please can we have an owner untainted by incompetence and disaster, just once in my lifetime? That means no Forest failures please!
The top issue is that we now play in Birmingham in front of crowds less than half of what we would be getting at the Ricoh. This makes it even more likely that promising players will be sold simply to make up that shortfall. (Yes they would have been sold had we been at the Ricoh but because the shortfall is bigger Robins is less likely than ever to see much of the money). Why are we playing in Birmingham? Well that is down to a whole host of historical issues many of which are due to Sisu trying to get the Ricoh on the cheap. We are also there now because two hedge funds, one of which is Sisu, are flexing their muscles at each other.Right as of now, I suspect we are one of the better run clubs in the bottom two tiers. It has taken them a long time to work out how to run a medium sized football club without going broke but they have done it - finally. Crucially they have ring fenced the club from the bigger dispute as far as possible (not totally). I would rather we were run by a sugar daddy with shit loads of cash, but in the absence of that, SISU in their current frame of mind is better than some medium sized business owner or wannabe who fancies themselves as a Roman Abramaovitch.
Football clubs are businesses, with a market, costs, wages and tax return. They are not in some alternate universe where such things don't matter. Unless there is a Sugar Daddy, the issues will be identical and the outcome little, different to what pertains now.
The top issue now, bar none, is the inability to score goals. SISU and the rest comes after that.
Hypothetical:
If this dude came in with a clear plan for a new ground and the finance to build it, would that swing it?
Would we take a crappy owner who built us a ground?
Im really not sure. In some ways short term pain for long term gain, in others out of frying pan into fire.
If we’re talking historically we can go back before SISU... shitty rental deal, council only preferring SISU and all thatThe top issue is that we now play in Birmingham in front of crowds less than half of what we would be getting at the Ricoh. This makes it even more likely that promising players will be sold simply to make up that shortfall. (Yes they would have been sold had we been at the Ricoh but because the shortfall is bigger Robins is less likely than ever to see much of the money). Why are we playing in Birmingham? Well that is down to a whole host of historical issues many of which are due to Sisu trying to get the Ricoh on the cheap. We are also there now because two hedge funds, one of which is Sisu, are flexing their muscles at each other.
Until we have a stadium in Coventry in which to play what happens on the pitch will never be the most important issue.
Sisu need to go closely followed, hopefully, by Wasps.
Maybe the better phrasing is, rather wait for a more appropriate potential owner?I’m afraid I’d prefer the devil we know rather than the one we don’t. The guy has too much past baggage for us to risk it
I'd need two things to get me to back Fawaz:Hypothetical:
If this dude came in with a clear plan for a new ground and the finance to build it, would that swing it?
Would we take a crappy owner who built us a ground?
Im really not sure. In some ways short term pain for long term gain, in others out of frying pan into fire.
Yeah yeah, he promises.I'd need two things to get me to back Fawaz:
A) Promise or concrete plans for a new ground.
B) A promise that Mark Robins and the current coaching/scouting/technical set-up won't be touched unless things go drastically wrong.
Probably also keeping Dave Boddy in his position. Someone to act as a barrier between Fawaz and the football side of things. Then I'd be more open to him owning the club.Yeah yeah, he promises.
Now what?
That’s exactly what I feel! I’m glad I’m not the only one.Sisu are like a limpet, once attached impossible to remove, or like one of those snakes that wrap you up and squeeze the life out of you. I wouldn’t worry so much if the next owner were terrible as they are unlikely to hang around losing money in the way Sisu have. We need these people gone.Maybe the better phrasing is, rather wait for a more appropriate potential owner?
Only reason I could see of moving the club on to somebody else is that (in theory!) they'd hold less of a vice like grip on it than SISU. Between Robinson, McGinnity, and SISU, we've been cursed with owners who don't want to sod off easily!
But as mentioned, Robinson and McGinnity also hung on for seemingly ever.That’s exactly what I feel! I’m glad I’m not the only one.Sisu are like a limpet, once attached impossible to remove, or like one of those snakes that wrap you up and squeeze the life out of you. I wouldn’t worry so much if the next owner were terrible as they are unlikely to hang around losing money in the way Sisu have. We need these people gone.
We are where we are. It isn’t Richardson or McGinnity that are holding onto our coat tails, it’s Sisu. It is them with their strangle hold on the club, not for the club’s benefit but as a pawn to be used in their power game first with ACL and the council, now with Wasps and the council. I’d be quite happy for them all to carry on their ludicrous camaigns. I couldn’t care less who sues who and who wins in court. Just let the football club go as ultimately none of this is really about CCFC.If we’re talking historically we can go back before SISU... shitty rental deal, council only preferring SISU and all that
according to Clive Eakin we pay more but the income deal is actually better than the Ricoh deal
What was their time at the helm, 2 or 3 years? We must be into the 12th year of Sisu’s “reign” and they are still here and with no sign of them going. They have been here nearly a fifth of my CCFC supporting life.But as mentioned, Robinson and McGinnity also hung on for seemingly ever.
Not sure I could cope with the hattrick!
McGinnity joined the board in 1994, Robinson in 1996.What was their time at the helm, 2 or 3 years? We must be into the 12th year of Sisu’s “reign” and they are still here and with no sign of them going. They have been here nearly a fifth of my CCFC supporting life.
Why? Because they are not a billionaire sugar daddy who pumps millions into the club with no expected return? Because they try to make the club self sufficient as much as possible and run it like a functioning business so we don't end up like Bury?
Their PR and relationship with the fans has been shite, and certainly in the first 5 years they were guilty of putting too much trust in idiots who knew nothing about football.
Since then they have:
- Got us out of a crippling lease with the council, paying 1.2mGBP a year in rent for access to a stadium 24 days a year. They had to do this the hard way as the Council would not negotiate...and they were already dropping their pants for Wasps (before the sixfields move).
- Challenged, through the legal system, as to why the Council sold the stadium (that is, a full 250 year leasehold) that was built for the football club to a London based, hedgefund owned, Rugby club, for a mere figure of around 4x what our aforementioned annual rent was.
- Refused to conform to Wasps outrageous demand of agreeing to indemnify them if they are financially impacted by any legal challenge. Which I fully agree is not something we can ever agree to. As a result we were kicked out of the Ricoh.
- Seemingly learned their lesson, if Mowbrays and Robins words mean anything, and handed over pretty much full control of a budget to footballing people managing the club.
Did I miss anything? Without getting aggressive, I'd love it if you could reply directly to the above bullet points with your considered viewpoints, as well as then add anything which i'll gladly discuss objectively with you.
I don't know where to start on this but you are totally delusional.
I made it really clear where to start I though? Just follow the really simple bullet points and give me your considered view on each of them?
That’s not hard at all...literally just comment on each point...?
Kevin Moron the Labour councillor piped up on twitter about it, doesn't usually pay any attention to CCFC. Don't disagree that getting back to the Ricoh is essential but think Maton's motivations are nothing to do with the good of CCFC
The city council have invested (socially and politically - small p) so much in Wasps, they can't afford to let them fail.Kevin Moron the Labour councillor piped up on twitter about it, doesn't usually pay any attention to CCFC. Don't disagree that getting back to the Ricoh is essential but think Maton's motivations are nothing to do with the good of CCFC
Update on what?Hi - just wondered if you had any update on this?
Update on what?
They didn't get us out of a crippling lease they went on a rent strike. They upped sticks and left with a plan to bust acl. It was nothing to do with the rent. How often did sisu complain about the rent before they relegated us to the 3rd division? How can you moan about rent whilst the wage bill was over 7 million a season? Ideally we should of had a peppercorn rent and access to revenue but we sold that privilege didn't we. You rant on about wasps but if its wasnt for the sixfields move and leaving the ground vacant then wasps wouldn't be here would they? Wasps sniffing about must of been a blessing from god for the council as they just wanted shot of the whole thing. The council sold to wasps purely out of spite. Totally cuntish but you can kind of understand why cant you.Even when it came out that wasps were moving in fisher still carried on with his bollocks about a new stadium and we don't want the ricoh blah blah. Fucking hell he even said they paid to much didn't he? Why are they dragging everyone through the courts for a ground they said they didn't want? This shit had been done to death. Theres only one organisation to blame for us being homeless and that's those wankers that have moved our club twice.
Only remember once, was it fletcher asking for a reduction? I may be wrong.The club asked for a reduced rent multiple times didn't they?
Only remember once, was it fletcher asking for a reduction? I may be wrong.
I don't remember fisher mentioning but I'm with you. It was to high.Robinson did aswell, they said they realised weeks into the first term it wasn’t going to work.
fisher did before the rent strike aswell
Yeah it was one of his snippets (and I’ll agree with you atm) before they went off the cliff edge.I don't remember fisher mentioning but I'm with you. It was to high.
Tbh I'm actually wondering why I bothered myself.Out of interest what did you actually sign up for? Is it to tell us SISU are wankers? - because we know this.
Out of interest what did you actually sign up for? Is it to tell us SISU are wankers? - because we know this.
Reckon we can survive for years. However the bigger question is how long can we survive while maintaining a fanbase and not tumbling down the leagues. Not hard to see a vicious circle of crowds dropping, budget being cut and ever lower league positions.Let's face it people, with our current situation as a club, our time isn't long anyway. How long can we sustain our existence whilst in exile from Coventry? Once the Wilson money arrives then goes, we really are clutching onto our future with not much hope and optimism in front of it at all.
There is no agenda. Don't listen to that boring tit. Just got a bit sick of reading the woe is me comments on here and how it seems to be everyone else's fault why we're in this mess. Some of our fans remind if liverpool fans. Always the victims. Yes I hate sisu,I despise them. Certain people on here cant seem to handle that well that's there problem. Agenda lol. Holy shit it's a football forum ffs. Some people need to get a grip.Yeah it was one of his snippets (and I’ll agree with you atm) before they went off the cliff edge.
they escalated really quickly
2bh were at our lowest point now - I think we are down to the hardcore fanbase anyway.Reckon we can survive for years. However the bigger question is how long can we survive while maintaining a fanbase and not tumbling down the leagues. Not hard to see a vicious circle of crowds dropping, budget being cut and ever lower league positions.
There is no agenda. Don't listen to that boring tit. Just got a bit sick of reading the woe is me comments on here and how it seems to be everyone else's fault why we're in this mess. Some of our fans remind if liverpool fans. Always the victims. Yes I hate sisu,I despise them. Certain people on here cant seem to handle that well that's there problem. Agenda lol. Holy shit it's a football forum ffs. Some people need to get a grip.
No we are well above our hardcore.2bh were at our lowest point now - I think we are down to the hardcore fanbase anyway.
best we can hope for us that we yo yo between league one and two until this all blows over
5k and the Coventry City name should be enough to compete at top end of league two (although I shudder at the depths we’ve sunk)
I was thinking more of their time as ChairmanMcGinnity joined the board in 1994, Robinson in 1996.
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