General Election (5 Viewers)

oucho

Well-Known Member
The sneering elite are people like Abbott and Thornberry who benefit from wealth and privilege and are outraged when the underclass dare to have an independent thought that contradicts their view of order and structure.

You've talked more sense in this thread than on all the other threads on this website combined!

Oh dear Jeremy.

That assumnes that most of those voters will go to the Tories rather than Labour. In traditional Labour areas, they will be mostly ex-Labour voters many of whom may well baulk at voting Tory. It may help Labour i.e. given a straight choice between Labour and Tory they'd chose Labour, but would previously have chosen Ukip thus letting the Tories through the middle.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
The Conservative party contains nobody like that for sure.



You entirely miss the point. You believe the likes of Thornberry and the ghastly Labour Party represent ordinary people

It no longer does. More importantly it's utterly bewildered why the core labour vote no longer views them as a serious representative of their beliefs

I hate to break this to you but Thatcher was backed predominantly by the working classes. No social media mind probing existed then.

So why was it that this occurred?

What's your opinion on that?
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
The sneering elite are people like Abbott and Thornberry who benefit from wealth and privilege and are outraged when the underclass dare to have an independent thought that contradicts their view of order and structure.

Not the only ones.... some relatively well paid people on here also get easily outraged when the under classes contradict their view...
 

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
You entirely miss the point. You believe the likes of Thornberry and the ghastly Labour Party represent ordinary people

It no longer does. More importantly it's utterly bewildered why the core labour vote no longer views them as a serious representative of their beliefs

I hate to break this to you but Thatcher was backed predominantly by the working classes. No social media mind probing existed then.

So why was it that this occurred?

What's your opinion on that?

I never said that. My point to you is what makes Boris fucking Johnson and Theresa May any better a representative? The conning of the working classes that cutting their services all over the place is in their best interest is one of the biggest crimes of our national media. Control the narrative, control the public. When polls continue to show that people like Labour policies but won't vote for them anyway, what other conclusion is there to draw?

A conclusion similar to that which I pointed out to you on the effects of building more grammar schools. What point am I missing on David Cameron pretending to be on side with 'scum'?
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
“This country, like a depressed teenage self-harmer, takes out a razor to scour a forearm and now contemplates its own throat,” the author said.

“Truly, Brexit has stirred something not heroic or celebratory or generous in the nation, but instead has coaxed into the light from some dark, damp places the lowest human impulses, from the small-minded to the mean-spirited to the murderous.”

According to Ian McEwan

Ex NF fan, Nigel Farage spent 20 years creating this atmosphere and some want a knighthood for him.

His attempt to link Brexit with Trump, and wish to be the link between the UK and the Trump presidency, must be his biggest tactical blunder. The claim that 'we' have taken our country back - both in the US and Britain is in unraveling before our eyes. A massive con bolstered by fake news and fake claims targeted at certain groups of the population, has given more power to the rich and powerful than ever before. The checks on workers rights are being taken apart on both sides of the Atlantic and the UK looks set to vote for more of that.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
When polls continue to show that people like Labour policies but won't vote for them anyway, what other conclusion is there to draw?

You keep mentioning this point. There's no conspiracy associated with it - the answer is very obvious.

It's like you are asked to pick one of 3 meals - you have the pictures but don't know the chef. You pick one and find the other two were chosen by Michelin starred chefs. Your choice is going to be prepared by a chap who runs a burger bar on a lay by. He instead gives you a cold greasy burger.

Once people know whose policies they are they know the policies are not remotely capable of being delivered.
 

SIR ERNIE

Well-Known Member
“This country, like a depressed teenage self-harmer, takes out a razor to scour a forearm and now contemplates its own throat,” the author said.

“Truly, Brexit has stirred something not heroic or celebratory or generous in the nation, but instead has coaxed into the light from some dark, damp places the lowest human impulses, from the small-minded to the mean-spirited to the murderous.”

According to Ian McEwan

Ex NF fan, Nigel Farage spent 20 years creating this atmosphere and some want a knighthood for him.

His attempt to link Brexit with Trump, and wish to be the link between the UK and the Trump presidency, must be his biggest tactical blunder. The claim that 'we' have taken our country back - both in the US and Britain is in unraveling before our eyes. A massive con bolstered by fake news and fake claims targeted at certain groups of the population, has given more power to the rich and powerful than ever before. The checks on workers rights are being taken apart on both sides of the Atlantic and the UK looks set to vote for more of that.

You seem utterly obsessed with Trump and Farage; it seems almost every post you make has to mention them.

Here's the news: The UK voted to leave the EU. They didn't vote for Nigel Farage. They didn't vote for Trump.

There's a massive anti-EU sentiment here in the UK. I accept that living in Germany, you may find that difficult to fully understand, but that's the way it is and my impression is that that sentiment is stronger now than it was on June 23rd.
 

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
“This country, like a depressed teenage self-harmer, takes out a razor to scour a forearm and now contemplates its own throat,” the author said.

“Truly, Brexit has stirred something not heroic or celebratory or generous in the nation, but instead has coaxed into the light from some dark, damp places the lowest human impulses, from the small-minded to the mean-spirited to the murderous.”

According to Ian McEwan

Ex NF fan, Nigel Farage spent 20 years creating this atmosphere and some want a knighthood for him.

His attempt to link Brexit with Trump, and wish to be the link between the UK and the Trump presidency, must be his biggest tactical blunder. The claim that 'we' have taken our country back - both in the US and Britain is in unraveling before our eyes. A massive con bolstered by fake news and fake claims targeted at certain groups of the population, has given more power to the rich and powerful than ever before. The checks on workers rights are being taken apart on both sides of the Atlantic and the UK looks set to vote for more of that.

Sorry, Brexit doomsayers, the outlook is good on global growth
 

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
Anyone who voted to stay in the EU should turn away now. There is disturbing news from far-off continents that could prove upsetting. The news is that Britain’s negotiations to leave the EU will take place against the backdrop of strong global growth. Such is the magnitude of this turnaround from the wobbles of 2015 that it could save the Tory administration from the inevitable cuts or extra borrowing that would follow a stagnating economy.

We are not talking about a Trump-inspired dash for growth, although the US president is part of the story. The underpinnings for a year of high employment and solid wage growth across the globe are survey figures showing the largest improvement in worldwide manufacturing business conditions for more than five-and-a-half years.


Built on the expansion of manufacturing output from Europe to China and the US to Japan are February figures showing global trade grew at the fastest rate for just under six years.

An index of global manufacturing health – the JP Morgan Global Manufacturing purchasing managers index (PMI) – has risen to its highest since May 2011.

The icing on the cake is a measure of optimism about business conditions that is continuing to show company bosses are upbeat about the year ahead.

Markit’s chief economist Chris Williamson said the latest reading continued an improving trend that had been evident since the JP Morgan survey signalled stagnation this time last year.

“The February index reading is broadly indicative of global manufacturing output growing at a robust annual rate of 4-5%,” he said.

Employers are paying higher wages and “commonly reported the need to expand capacity in line with rising demand and brightened prospects”.


It doesn’t stop there. The stock markets in all major financial centres are tearing through historic ceilings and most investors have a benign outlook for at least the next two years. The world is awash with cash and consumers want to spend it.

It means that much like the European Exchange Rate Mechanism crisis of 1992, when Britain crashed out of the precursor to the euro, the blow was cushioned by a buoyant global economy.

The doomsayers may yet have their day. Theresa May could lead Britain to a position where it leaves the EU, the single market and the customs union with terrible consequences for trade, business investment and GDP growth.

There is the prospect of destabilising political rows between the west and Russia, terrorism is still a lurking danger and China remains wild card that could drag the global economy under.

Greece could yet go bust, there have been dire warnings about the state of Italian banks and the elections in the Netherlands, France and Germany could change the complexion of Europe for the worse.


Some leading leftwing economists in the US predict the Trump surge will evaporate as soon as the autumn. Former treasury secretary Larry Summers and Nobel prizewinner Paul Krugman both agree on a return to the “new normal” or “secular stagnation” of low growth and low wages within months, not years.

Another crash could be coming if Trump does loosen banking regulations and allow credit to surge. But for the moment, it looks good for the US and the global economy.

For instance, most investors think the return to robust global growth has little to do with Trump. It is more about believing even the scariest political flash points can be contained.

They are betting that far-right groups in Europe will lose out to centre-right groupings and that the financial problems in Greece are ring-fenced; that the Chinese communist party will retain its grip on the economy to keep things moving forward; and that Russia will consider it too risky to encroach further into Ukraine.

They also take a generous view of Donald Trump’s plans for tax cuts and infrastructure spending while dismissing his tub-thumping demands for a wall with Mexico and a trade war with almost anyone who wants to have a fight over tariffs.


Across the road from the White House, the US central bank, the Federal Reserve, is firmly in the optimists’ camp. Bill Dudley, a member of its interest rate-setting committee and a confidant of boss Janet Yellen, said in December that a Trump presidency created “considerable” uncertainty. Last week, his frown had turned into a smile and he said the prospect of a rate rise was getting closer. On Friday, Yellen hinted it could be little more than a week away.

A colleague of Dudley’s, Federal Reserve Governor Jerome Powell, said not only was the US looking “solid”, but global risks had diminished. “So we see a slightly brighter picture abroad and I think that will help us,” he said.

Britain’s economy is slowing and it may slow further. But slowing is all it will do. There will be no recession. The global economy will see to that.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
You seem utterly obsessed with Trump and Farage; it seems almost every post you make has to mention them.

Here's the news: The UK voted to leave the EU. They didn't vote for Nigel Farage. They didn't vote for Trump.

There's a massive anti-EU sentiment here in the UK. I accept that living in Germany, you may find that difficult to fully understand, but that's the way it is and my impression is that that sentiment is stronger now than it was on June 23rd.

There's not a massive anti EU sentiment at all, most people were not overly bothered until the referendum lies came up. And still, 52%-48% is hardly a massive landslide.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
Brexit will hit the poorest and neediest within British society the most, especially when we see red tape/workers rights broken down and the introduction of private healthcare. Still, who gives a shit about that? Very much looking forward to getting out before it all goes horribly wrong.
 
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RegTheDonk

Well-Known Member
Brexit will hit the poorest and neediest within British society the most, especially when we see red tape/workers rights broken down and the introduction of private healthcare. Still, who gives a shit about that? Very much looking to getting out before it all goes horribly wrong.

That will be for our government to decide - which EU laws to adopt into our law. If anybody wants to screw workers over, dillute their rights, pay them peanuts, and privitise health care...nawt to do with europe, that'll be the job of who we vote for in a few weeks.

My money is on Mrs May to deliver the hammer blow to put us all in our place - something poor David couldn't get away with under a coalition and a slender majority.
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
You seem utterly obsessed with Trump and Farage; it seems almost every post you make has to mention them.

Here's the news: The UK voted to leave the EU. They didn't vote for Nigel Farage. They didn't vote for Trump.

There's a massive anti-EU sentiment here in the UK. I accept that living in Germany, you may find that difficult to fully understand, but that's the way it is and my impression is that that sentiment is stronger now than it was on June 23rd.

I am increasingly worried about Trump - hardly surprising. Farage is a clown who helped a campaign of lies, and then tried to link us to Trump's USA.
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
Anyone who voted to stay in the EU should turn away now. There is disturbing news from far-off continents that could prove upsetting. The news is that Britain’s negotiations to leave the EU will take place against the backdrop of strong global growth. Such is the magnitude of this turnaround from the wobbles of 2015 that it could save the Tory administration from the inevitable cuts or extra borrowing that would follow a stagnating economy.

We are not talking about a Trump-inspired dash for growth, although the US president is part of the story. The underpinnings for a year of high employment and solid wage growth across the globe are survey figures showing the largest improvement in worldwide manufacturing business conditions for more than five-and-a-half years.


Built on the expansion of manufacturing output from Europe to China and the US to Japan are February figures showing global trade grew at the fastest rate for just under six years.

An index of global manufacturing health – the JP Morgan Global Manufacturing purchasing managers index (PMI) – has risen to its highest since May 2011.

The icing on the cake is a measure of optimism about business conditions that is continuing to show company bosses are upbeat about the year ahead.

Markit’s chief economist Chris Williamson said the latest reading continued an improving trend that had been evident since the JP Morgan survey signalled stagnation this time last year.

“The February index reading is broadly indicative of global manufacturing output growing at a robust annual rate of 4-5%,” he said.

Employers are paying higher wages and “commonly reported the need to expand capacity in line with rising demand and brightened prospects”.


It doesn’t stop there. The stock markets in all major financial centres are tearing through historic ceilings and most investors have a benign outlook for at least the next two years. The world is awash with cash and consumers want to spend it.

It means that much like the European Exchange Rate Mechanism crisis of 1992, when Britain crashed out of the precursor to the euro, the blow was cushioned by a buoyant global economy.

The doomsayers may yet have their day. Theresa May could lead Britain to a position where it leaves the EU, the single market and the customs union with terrible consequences for trade, business investment and GDP growth.

There is the prospect of destabilising political rows between the west and Russia, terrorism is still a lurking danger and China remains wild card that could drag the global economy under.

Greece could yet go bust, there have been dire warnings about the state of Italian banks and the elections in the Netherlands, France and Germany could change the complexion of Europe for the worse.


Some leading leftwing economists in the US predict the Trump surge will evaporate as soon as the autumn. Former treasury secretary Larry Summers and Nobel prizewinner Paul Krugman both agree on a return to the “new normal” or “secular stagnation” of low growth and low wages within months, not years.

Another crash could be coming if Trump does loosen banking regulations and allow credit to surge. But for the moment, it looks good for the US and the global economy.

For instance, most investors think the return to robust global growth has little to do with Trump. It is more about believing even the scariest political flash points can be contained.

They are betting that far-right groups in Europe will lose out to centre-right groupings and that the financial problems in Greece are ring-fenced; that the Chinese communist party will retain its grip on the economy to keep things moving forward; and that Russia will consider it too risky to encroach further into Ukraine.

They also take a generous view of Donald Trump’s plans for tax cuts and infrastructure spending while dismissing his tub-thumping demands for a wall with Mexico and a trade war with almost anyone who wants to have a fight over tariffs.


Across the road from the White House, the US central bank, the Federal Reserve, is firmly in the optimists’ camp. Bill Dudley, a member of its interest rate-setting committee and a confidant of boss Janet Yellen, said in December that a Trump presidency created “considerable” uncertainty. Last week, his frown had turned into a smile and he said the prospect of a rate rise was getting closer. On Friday, Yellen hinted it could be little more than a week away.

A colleague of Dudley’s, Federal Reserve Governor Jerome Powell, said not only was the US looking “solid”, but global risks had diminished. “So we see a slightly brighter picture abroad and I think that will help us,” he said.

Britain’s economy is slowing and it may slow further. But slowing is all it will do. There will be no recession. The global economy will see to that.

So the rest of the world is booming and we should be happy with a slowing economy because it could have been worse because of Brexit. I'm with the rest of the world on this one.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member

yet 1 week later the FT prints an article stating UK manufacturing has fallen, (sorry can't link it's a subscriber service). so who knows what the fuck is going on.
As someone who works in manufacturing I can assure you there's definitely a down turn. Whether that has anything to do with Brexit or not is a different matter. It's always been a sector that goes in cycles of feast then famine.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
That will be for our government to decide - which EU laws to adopt into our law. If anybody wants to screw workers over, dillute their rights, pay them peanuts, and privitise health care...nawt to do with europe, that'll be the job of who we vote for in a few weeks.

My money is on Mrs May to deliver the hammer blow to put us all in our place - something poor David couldn't get away with under a coalition and a slender majority.

Indeed it will, yet it will no doubt get blamed on the EU or the latest scapegoat.
 

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
You keep mentioning this point. There's no conspiracy associated with it - the answer is very obvious.

It's like you are asked to pick one of 3 meals - you have the pictures but don't know the chef. You pick one and find the other two were chosen by Michelin starred chefs. Your choice is going to be prepared by a chap who runs a burger bar on a lay by. He instead gives you a cold greasy burger.

Once people know whose policies they are they know the policies are not remotely capable of being delivered.

The Tories consistently miss their own targets and break their promises, what makes them more reliable? Even suppose they didn't, why vote for the party that vows to make you worse off? Funny how nobody questions the affordability of increased military expenditure above the rate of inflation.
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
It's like you are asked to pick one of 3 meals - you have the pictures but don't know the chef. You pick one and find the other two were chosen by Michelin starred chefs. Your choice is going to be prepared by a chap who runs a burger bar on a lay by. He instead gives you a cold greasy burger.
I don't think its that simple. There was similar polling last time for Milliband so the blame can't all be heaped on Corbyn.

Besides, as much as May would like it, we're not a dictatorship and even if Corbyn was PM he couldn't do whatever he felt like. To vote for the Tories rather than Labour purely on the basis of Corbyn is cutting your nose off to spite your face. Is a Corbyn defeat so important people will happily accept the dangers of 4 more years of a Conservative government? Sure thats true for some but my personal opinion is that a large chunk of the population just go off the soundbites they see and hear and couldn't actually tell you much about each parties policies.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
I don't think its that simple. There was similar polling last time for Milliband so the blame can't all be heaped on Corbyn.

Besides, as much as May would like it, we're not a dictatorship and even if Corbyn was PM he couldn't do whatever he felt like. To vote for the Tories rather than Labour purely on the basis of Corbyn is cutting your nose off to spite your face. Is a Corbyn defeat so important people will happily accept the dangers of 4 more years of a Conservative government? Sure thats true for some but my personal opinion is that a large chunk of the population just go off the soundbites they see and hear and couldn't actually tell you much about each parties policies.

Is not just Corbyn though its Abbot, Thornberry and the puppet masters in this whole grizzly circus - McDonnell and McLuskey

McDonnell is the most dangerous person in British politics and needs stopping - ultimately its that simple
 

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
I don't think its that simple. There was similar polling last time for Milliband so the blame can't all be heaped on Corbyn.

Besides, as much as May would like it, we're not a dictatorship and even if Corbyn was PM he couldn't do whatever he felt like. To vote for the Tories rather than Labour purely on the basis of Corbyn is cutting your nose off to spite your face. Is a Corbyn defeat so important people will happily accept the dangers of 4 more years of a Conservative government? Sure thats true for some but my personal opinion is that a large chunk of the population just go off the soundbites they see and hear and couldn't actually tell you much about each parties policies.

Same for me as Grendel. McDonell is probably a man I fear most. To see him chancellor would scare the shit of me let alone other stuff he might do and influence. He is dangerous.

Let alone Abbott who doesn't have any credibility and thornberry who makes fun of white van drivers showing her real colours. I don't mind Corbyn per se but a man who looks a scruff ball and doesn't sing the national anthem might do it for some people it certainly doesn't for me.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
Isn't Corbyn a republican? Would you not prefer someone who stuck to their principles, as opposed to someone u turning and going with whatever makes them most popular?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Isn't Corbyn a republican? Would you not prefer someone who stuck to their principles, as opposed to someone u turning and going with whatever makes them most popular?

Like Mr Corbyn and Europe you mean?
 

ccfc92

Well-Known Member
Isn't Corbyn a republican? Would you not prefer someone who stuck to their principles, as opposed to someone u turning and going with whatever makes them most popular?

You're right and I agree.

However, it's his ideas and policies that stop him getting support.

The "we'll do this, and we'll do that" is easily dismantled with the question; "Where's that money coming from?"
 

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
You're right and I agree.

However, it's his ideas and policies that stop him getting support.

The "we'll do this, and we'll do that" is easily dismantled with the question; "Where's that money coming from?"

Labour Party in a nutshell there mate. Nice ideas and frankly they can say anything this election they won't be voted in. I think that's essentially what they are doing. Coming up with the best ideas in the world and then Diane Abbott was asked twice how it's funded and she either completed miscalculated the cost or she didn't have a clue. I think she even sends her kids to private school?
 

ccfc92

Well-Known Member
Labour Party in a nutshell there mate. Nice ideas and frankly they can say anything this election they won't be voted in. I think that's essentially what they are doing. Coming up with the best ideas in the world and then Diane Abbott was asked twice how it's funded and she either completed miscalculated the cost or she didn't have a clue. I think she even sends her kids to private school?

Are hospital car parks owned by the hospitals (generally) do you know?
 

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
Are hospital car parks owned by the hospitals (generally) do you know?

Isn't it half and half? So about half let a private company do it like at the Ricoh and tesco for example and others do it themselves. Even staff have to pay for their own parking.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
It's actually about time all politicians become honest about the NHS and admit a completely public funded organisation is impossible to sustain.

Both parties prop it up and neither are honest enough to admit a state funded system for all is utopia

It's pathetic that no one will admit this and work to alternate solutions.
 

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