George Floyd (3 Viewers)

[Deleted member 5849]

Ok, let me rephrase it slightly.

"The athlete, the guy not paying for the train ticket, and the guy on the bike. All of them have behaved incorrectly and then played the race card, apart from the guy on the bike where in the comment section of the video people were pointing out the driver reacted badly because the guy being a prick on the bike was black and played the race card on his behalf".

When you are arguing points like that and trying to initiate I am racist because of it, then perhaps it is not me that is the problem.

You have a knack of intervening on certain threads and not others, where you're conspicuous by your absence. You got all excited on the NZ shootings thread once it deviated from that, onto more comfortable ground for you. After missing it for an eternity, suddenly it was:

I think it's more the case that when the man bites the dog, it gets coverage. When the dog bites the man, it's yesterday's news.

Saw a post earlier on Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. Posted 14 tweets about New Zealand. Not a single one about Sri Lanka.

Only came on the thread when @covcity4life called you out. Ignored the thread altogether about nazi police officers, frantically tried to make this thread about you.

Wouldn't be such an issue if you didn't claim that was what others did. You have a knack of trying to take threads off topic when they get too uncomfortably close to the bone, you decide people are making you feel guilty for being white when they're not, you generalise and have an unfortunate knack of being like a dog on heat when it's something about Islam. You come up with conspiracy theories where somehow, the Left are an entity, who are all about covering things up, you choose conspiracy theory people to back up your claims and select a very partial argument, conveniently omitting where elements *have* actually been dealt with.

Yes, not all Muslims are terrorists, but most terrorists pledge their allegiance to Islam.

I'm not bashing Muslims,

The irony is astounding.

Give me thecoventrian any day. I'm pretty sure that's not thought about and isn't done to try and push people towards their POV. unfortunately you're one who, if people say you're exhibiting racist behaviour, will try and weasle out of it and continue in that way, safe in the knowledge they're all out to get you. I won't even get to thr tropes about how you're losing your country.

I'll leave you with one quote which you'll try and weasle out of

If there were no refugee's how many of these attacks would have happened?

You guessed right, it would be zero.

You'll justify the context, wilfully missing the fact you're tarring all refugees with that brush, demonising them, making them an object of fear and trouble and worry. It's about trends, not isolated cases. One-offs are fine, a consistent pattern is... not, and suggests something more sinister than just misunderstanding / a difference of opinion. To clarify, just about everybody on this board is not racist, and I certainly won;t go down the path of saying the Right is racist.

And with that, I'm joining hill in ignoring, as why should I have sly propaganda thrust down my throat, with the attempts to weasle out.

All I've said is that when he [Tommy Robinson] talks about the issues with Islam, he knows what he's talking about.

 

---

[Ring Of Steel]

You have a knack of intervening on certain threads and not others, where you're conspicuous by your absence. You got all excited on the NZ shootings thread once it deviated from that, onto more comfortable ground for you. After missing it for an eternity, suddenly it was:




Only came on the thread when @covcity4life called you out. Ignored the thread altogether about nazi police officers, frantically tried to make this thread about you.

Wouldn't be such an issue if you didn't claim that was what others did. You have a knack of trying to take threads off topic when they get too uncomfortably close to the bone, you decide people are making you feel guilty for being white when they're not, you generalise and have an unfortunate knack of being like a dog on heat when it's something about Islam. You come up with conspiracy theories where somehow, the Left are an entity, who are all about covering things up, you choose conspiracy theory people to back up your claims and select a very partial argument, conveniently omitting where elements *have* actually been dealt with.



The irony is astounding.

Give me thecoventrian any day. I'm pretty sure that's not thought about and isn't done to try and push people towards their POV. unfortunately you're one who, if people say you're exhibiting racist behaviour, will try and weasle out of it and continue in that way, safe in the knowledge they're all out to get you.

I'll leave you with one quote which you'll try and weasle out of



You'll justify the context, wilfully missing the fact you're tarring all refugees with that brush, demonising them, making them an object of fear and trouble and worry. It's about trends, not isolated cases. One-offs are fine, a consistent pattern is... not, and suggests something more sinister than just misunderstanding / a difference of opinion. To clarify, just about everybody on this board is not racist, and I certainly won;t go down the path of saying the Right is racist.

And with that, I'm joining hill in ignoring, as why should I have sly propaganda thrust down my throat, with the attempts to weasle out.

Jesus, Tommy Robinson as well, not much more to be said really.

 

[shmmeee]

It'll never happen, but social media accounts being legally linked to someone's identity would change society for the better overnight

Yeah. Facebook as an absolute haven of enlightened thinking!

No thanks. You’ll take my right to anonymous Internet from my cold dead hands (and it’s literally impossible anyway).

A better solution might be a government backed safe space for debate? Linked to ID and moderated with sensible banning policies. People can then be a c**t on Twitter but if they want the “official” national conversation they need to behave themselves? Not sure.

I sure Nick doesn’t fancy doing a load of ID checks and storing records safely so we can post on here and I doubt many would want to contribute to a central DB that stores their online preferences like we saw attempted with the wank pass.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Jesus, Tommy Robinson as well, not much more to be said really.

There are some who are genuinely unaware, genuinely get the wrong end of the stick, genuinely just... hold different beliefs to me and you.

With those, we might get annoyed, but that's life.

The trends are what you look at though, the desire to explain away, the careful choice of words. Far worse than a coventrian who, however much he deserved his ban, has nothing but his own perception to deal with.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

I’m not ‘initiating’ anything, you did that yourself very effectively with your posts and views, as you demonstrate above with the backtracking. Anyway enough of this.

Translation: I don't have any counter arguments so I will call you racist.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

You have a knack of intervening on certain threads and not others, where you're conspicuous by your absence. You got all excited on the NZ shootings thread once it deviated from that, onto more comfortable ground for you. After missing it for an eternity, suddenly it was:




Only came on the thread when @covcity4life called you out. Ignored the thread altogether about nazi police officers, frantically tried to make this thread about you.

Wouldn't be such an issue if you didn't claim that was what others did. You have a knack of trying to take threads off topic when they get too uncomfortably close to the bone, you decide people are making you feel guilty for being white when they're not, you generalise and have an unfortunate knack of being like a dog on heat when it's something about Islam. You come up with conspiracy theories where somehow, the Left are an entity, who are all about covering things up, you choose conspiracy theory people to back up your claims and select a very partial argument, conveniently omitting where elements *have* actually been dealt with.



The irony is astounding.

Give me thecoventrian any day. I'm pretty sure that's not thought about and isn't done to try and push people towards their POV. unfortunately you're one who, if people say you're exhibiting racist behaviour, will try and weasle out of it and continue in that way, safe in the knowledge they're all out to get you. I won't even get to thr tropes about how you're losing your country.

I'll leave you with one quote which you'll try and weasle out of



You'll justify the context, wilfully missing the fact you're tarring all refugees with that brush, demonising them, making them an object of fear and trouble and worry. It's about trends, not isolated cases. One-offs are fine, a consistent pattern is... not, and suggests something more sinister than just misunderstanding / a difference of opinion. To clarify, just about everybody on this board is not racist, and I certainly won;t go down the path of saying the Right is racist.

And with that, I'm joining hill in ignoring, as why should I have sly propaganda thrust down my throat, with the attempts to weasle out.

So basically what you are saying is that I'm too difficult to argue against so you're putting me on ignore? I'll take that victory. In fact, every time someone blocks me for having a slightly different opinion then all it proves is that you really have lost the argument. Also we are supposed to be adults, ignoring someone is extremely babyish if you cannot handle a few words on the internet.

Nothing I have said there is racist whatsoever and all you have proved is that I argue the opposite on some things where I see double standards. As for 'propaganda', give me a break. I am kind to nearly everyone on here and to say I am worse than Coventrain who got banned for actually saying something racist is just ridiculous,

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Translation: I don't have any counter arguments so I will call you racist.

Look, claim as many ‘victories’ as you want if it makes you happy, I don’t care, nobody seems to care- your views are there for all to see, and they ain’t pleasant.

 

[covcity4life]

Wow missed all this as like @hill83 I decided to sit this thread out as i dont like seeing fellow cov fans letting themselves down. I want to feel like we are all on same team!

That said i saw this all coming with earlsdon for few years now and drew attention to it. Unforuntley he has continued this path

Look the world is messed up right now and people are scared .and that's all races that are scared for one reason or another

They key is to try and understand and move past it. That requires both sides to listen and take stuff on board. People like Tommy Robinson are taking advantage of scared people because no one is listening to them.

I don't think earladon hates people based on colour but he defintley does judge them on it. And that's what fundemntically makes racism stupid. Having an opinion on someone you have never met. We are all unique souls.

Let's have dialogue and try to come together. Social media is killing this world. Let's never use words like gammon, Karen or snowflakes . I hate them personally.

Every race has issues because we are all human and not perfect.

Hippy as it sounds we are all ONE so lets come together and solve this shit!

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Wow missed all this as like @hill83 I decided to sit this thread out as i dont like seeing fellow cov fans letting themselves down. I want to feel like we are all on same team!

That said i saw this all coming with earlsdon for few years now and drew attention to it. Unforuntley he has continued this path

Look the world is messed up right now and people are scared .and that's all races that are scared for one reason or another

They key is to try and understand and move past it. That requires both sides to listen and take stuff on board. People like Tommy Robinson are taking advantage of scared people because no one is listening to them.

I don't think earladon hates people based on colour but he defintley does judge them on it. And that's what fundemntically makes racism stupid. Having an opinion on someone you have never met. We are all unique souls.

Let's have dialogue and try to come together. Social media is killing this world. Let's never use words like gammon, Karen or snowflakes . I hate them personally.

Every race has issues because we are all human and not perfect.

Hippy as it sounds we are all ONE so lets come together and solve this shit!

That's actually one of the most sensible posts I have ever seen you make, barring some of the accusations about me.

I have said above that I judge people in the exact way they present themselves. I don't need to explain that any further. The fact some people have blocked me because I have said a few things about grooming gangs being swept under the carpet is completely ridiculous and I worry for those people who cannot handle some basic debate. I haven't kicked off or abused anyone once.

Again, talking about me being some kind of racist right wing biggot (which is completely false), does not do anything to help resolve racism. In fact, I have seen very little in the way of genuine ideas of how to resolve it. It's either 'silence is violence', 'you're a racist' or 'no he wasn't playing the race card'. The very people that seem to be deciding everything is racist have absolutely no ideas about how to resolve it other than call everyone a racist and trying to take some kind of moral high ground.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Look, claim as many ‘victories’ as you want if it makes you happy, I don’t care, nobody seems to care- your views are there for all to see, and they ain’t pleasant.

I don't really care what your opinion of my views are, you are well entitled to disagree with them.

Calling me a racist and blocking me is extremely childish, as it just demonstrates that an adult discussion cannot be had. The person above saying that I am apparently worse than coventrian before blocking me absolutely lost the plot.

 

[Skybluefaz]

So basically what you are saying is that I'm too difficult to argue against so you're putting me on ignore? I'll take that victory. In fact, every time someone blocks me for having a slightly different opinion then all it proves is that you really have lost the argument. Also we are supposed to be adults, ignoring someone is extremely babyish if you cannot handle a few words on the internet.

Nothing I have said there is racist whatsoever and all you have proved is that I argue the opposite on some things where I see double standards. As for 'propaganda', give me a break. I am kind to nearly everyone on here and to say I am worse than Coventrain who got banned for actually saying something racist is just ridiculous,

Does it really all boil down to point scoring and taking victories where there are none?The evidence is there for all to see, people will make their own minds up.

 

[covcity4life]

Well maybe hill and client can unblock you and we can try change the conversation

Understand if they dont though. Sometimes its good to avoid negativity too

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Well maybe hill and client can unblock you and we can try change the conversation

Understand if they dont though. Sometimes its good to avoid negativity too

I've put a few points forward on my views on how I think racism could be solved but no one wants to discuss them, or even tell me why I'm wrong on them.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Does it really all boil down to point scoring and taking victories where there are none?The evidence is there for all to see, people will make their own minds up.

Well if people cannot debate in an adult fashion and resort to blocking me when they don't like my opinions, I would say that says more about them than me.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Well if people cannot debate in an adult fashion and resort to blocking me when they don't like my opinions, I would say that says more about them than me.

Which is a very well trodden & predictable stance for you to take, it’s what you always say, as NW put so clearly. Start with yourself before you make out it’s everyone else with the problem and “claiming victories”, which is just a bit sad tbh

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

Mr Dugdale,

I like you really (I apologise). Although you can be a bit baity, there's more to you than that and actually when you get down to it, we seem to have a similar world view on how to treat people face to face etc. That frightens me a bit, but it is what it is.

Tbh I don't even get what this argument's about, or why. Could I suggest you and Tony move on to the next pointless argument?

Remember, Black Skin, White Masks. It's very good.

You can lead the way . You're the expert on pointless.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

You can lead the way . You're the expert on pointless.

I feel snubbed.

 

[David O'Day]

This is quite good

Pork Legs Are Shaking Up British Politics

How gammon, a traditional English meal, became a leftist insult—and why it's igniting a debate about racism

www.google.co.uk

“The insult is like the mirror image of “snowflake,” a slight used by the political right to denote a hypersensitive generation of young people on the left who struggle to deal with dissenting viewpoints and therefore require “safe spaces” lest they get “triggered.”

It’s more ageist than racist I would say.

nah you you get young gammons as well

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

I feel snubbed.

Get in the queue behind me.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

Which is a very well trodden & predictable stance for you to take, it’s what you always say, as NW put so clearly. Start with yourself before you make out it’s everyone else with the problem and “claiming victories”, which is just a bit sad tbh

What problem does Earlsdon actually have, because much as I read, i can't see he has any whatsoever. You on the other hand like to go the way with whatever is trending at the moment. A very well trodden and predictable stance as usual.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

What problem does Earlsdon actually have, because much as I read, i can't see he has any whatsoever. You on the other hand like to go the way with whatever is trending at the moment. A very well trodden and predictable stance as usual.

you are a poor troll who pretends to be a teacher for some reason, I have no plans to interact with you this fine evening, therefore I suggest you go somewhere else and cast your net

 

[Macca]

Wow missed all this as like @hill83 I decided to sit this thread out as i dont like seeing fellow cov fans letting themselves down. I want to feel like we are all on same team!

That said i saw this all coming with earlsdon for few years now and drew attention to it. Unforuntley he has continued this path

Look the world is messed up right now and people are scared .and that's all races that are scared for one reason or another

They key is to try and understand and move past it. That requires both sides to listen and take stuff on board. People like Tommy Robinson are taking advantage of scared people because no one is listening to them.

I don't think earladon hates people based on colour but he defintley does judge them on it. And that's what fundemntically makes racism stupid. Having an opinion on someone you have never met. We are all unique souls.

Let's have dialogue and try to come together. Social media is killing this world. Let's never use words like gammon, Karen or snowflakes . I hate them personally.

Every race has issues because we are all human and not perfect.

Hippy as it sounds we are all ONE so lets come together and solve this shit!

Brilliant post. Sending virtual elbow bump!

 

[skybluetony176]

Covtarian is back

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Spent the last 3-4 days in Brighton, first time I’ve had more than a passing visit in years. While the city has its issues with homelessness and drugs, the atmosphere where people can be comfortable being themselves is a breath of fresh air. As CC4L said it does turn you into being a bit of a hippy but as places go in this country it’s a model for how to break some of the divides you can see on here.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Spent the last 3-4 days in Brighton, first time I’ve had more than a passing visit in years. While the city has its issues with homelessness and drugs, the atmosphere where people can be comfortable being themselves is a breath of fresh air. As CC4L said it does turn you into being a bit of a hippy but as places go in this country it’s a model for how to break some of the divides you can see on here.

love Brighton, purely because you can be a bit of a hippy and fit in

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

and if he sees racism where there is none that's probably why, you should be able to see his point of view if he's had to put up with this shit all his life. See my post 3949 on previous page.

I see you're point - if you're used to encountering a certain problem issue so often you can sometimes look for it or see it even when it's not there.

But at the same time why would you comment on a very minor/mild perceived slur whose racial overtones can be questioned instead of incidents where outright racism has occurred? It does dilute the problem with detractors saying "well if he's got to a point where he's complaining that's racist it can't be that bad" when he's probably suffered hundreds of more vile slurs than that. If you're pointing out the problem choose the biggest examples. Make people uncomfortable that this issue is still a massive problem. The timing of it all as well with BLM also gives the bandwagon impression.

I can understand recalling and talking about worse abuse could be more upsetting for him compared to the more mild buffalo reference but sadly it's not going to help correct the injustices and if anything makes the problem appear more trivial.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

but you're saying hes probably experienced racism all his life and then telling him he's dealing with it incorrectly. Do you not realise how that sounds?

Isn't that what a lot of counselling does, just with a sugar coating? People who've been abused in some way but kept it hidden due to feeling shame or fearing reprisals are told "you shouldn't do that - you need to accept it happened and talk about it. It's not your fault".

When the adverts come on for the NSPCC or whatever they're effectively saying "are you someone who's experienced years of suffering and neglect and are keeping it to yourself? Well, that's wrong."

 

[clint van damme]

I see you're point - if you're used to encountering a certain problem issue so often you can sometimes look for it or see it even when it's not there.

But at the same time why would you comment on a very minor/mild perceived slur whose racial overtones can be questioned instead of incidents where outright racism has occurred? It does dilute the problem with detractors saying "well if he's got to a point where he's complaining that's racist it can't be that bad" when he's probably suffered hundreds of more vile slurs than that. If you're pointing out the problem choose the biggest examples. Make people uncomfortable that this issue is still a massive problem. The timing of it all as well with BLM also gives the bandwagon impression.

I can understand recalling and talking about worse abuse could be more upsetting for him compared to the more mild buffalo reference but sadly it's not going to help correct the injustices and if anything makes the problem appear more trivial.

What you and others are basically saying (I think) is in racially sensitive times a black person should be 100 percent sure that the comments aimed at them have racist intent.

No one is saying in racially sensitive times, don't compare a black person to a large black wild animal. Putting the onus on the offended person rather than the person making the comment. I find that strange.

 

[Nick]

What you and others are basically saying (I think) is in racially sensitive times a black person should be 100 percent sure that the comments aimed at them have racist intent.

No one is saying in racially sensitive times, don't compare a black person to a large black wild animal. Putting the onus on the offended person rather than the person making the comment. I find that strange.

Well yeah, before calling somebody a racist they should be sure that it is actually racist. Surely that's common sense for somebody to be sure something is racist before accusing somebody of it?

The point is, the offended person also compared himself to a large black wild animal a couple of months previously.

 

[clint van damme]

Well yeah, before calling somebody a racist they should be sure that it is actually racist. Surely that's common sense for somebody to be sure something is racist before accusing somebody of it?

The point is, the offended person also compared himself to a large black wild animal a couple of months previously.

but again, unless you'v experienced racism all your life you're not really in a position to criticise, or at least say he got it wrong but I empathise with why. This isn't just about the Akinfenwa case either.
Again, you're a white person telling a black person how to react to racism or perceived racism without any criticism aimed at the initial slur, it doesn't sit well with me.

 

[Nick]

but again, unless you'v experienced racism all your life you're not really in a position to criticise, or at least say he got it wrong but I empathise with why. This isn't just about the Akinfenwa case either.
Again, you're a white person telling a black person how to react to racism or perceived racism without any criticism aimed at the initial slur, it doesn't sit well with me.

In which case a black person could decide completely if something is racist and everybody should act as if it was?

How far do we go with being able to abuse it? Until somebody can't be arrested for a crime because them saying it is racist means it was racist and police will get fired?

Somebody gets fired from their job because somebody decides something non-offensive is racist that day?

Somebody who has suffered sexual abuse can accuse people of sexual abuse even if it wasn't?

It detracts away from ACTUAL racism, same when the woman was banging on about Coco Pops being racist. Fuck the facts, as a black woman said it then it can't be questioned.

Like I said, Gammon could be deemed as racist and explained why but you are able to say categorically it isn't?

 

[clint van damme]

In which case a black person could decide completely if something is racist and everybody should act as if it was?

How far do we go with being able to abuse it? Until somebody can't be arrested for a crime because them saying it is racist means it was racist and police will get fired?

Somebody gets fired from their job because somebody decides something non-offensive is racist that day?

Somebody who has suffered sexual abuse can accuse people of sexual abuse even if it wasn't?

It detracts away from ACTUAL racism, same when the woman was banging on about Coco Pops being racist. Fuck the facts, as a black woman said it then it can't be questioned.

Like I said, Gammon could be deemed as racist and explained why but you are able to say categorically it isn't?

People make incorrect allegations of wrong doing all the time for a variety of reasons unfortunately, that's why there are procedures for investigating complaints in place in all parts of society.
You're showing no empathy with people who have potentially been racially abused which is strange considering you claim you want to educate yourself. You seem to be refusing to entertain the idea that maybe he has a case, (none of us will ever know so that part of the argument is pointless).
My position is even if the complaint is incorrect if someone has suffered a lot of racial abuse I can understand their sensitivity, you don't afford them that leeway, fair enough, but that's a very black and whiter postion of you'll forgive the pun, where comments either are racist or not and there's no room margin for error.

You only have to look at some of the slyness on this thread, not all racist remarks are a stream of obvious racist slurs.

Anyway, agree, disagree, I'm bailing out of this thread for a bit.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Well yeah, before calling somebody a racist they should be sure that it is actually racist. Surely that's common sense for somebody to be sure something is racist before accusing somebody of it?

The point is, the offended person also compared himself to a large black wild animal a couple of months previously.

He never did call somebody a racist, though.

Regardless of whether or not there was deliberate racial intent by using that language, if we are to make real and long-standing change then we must strive to educate each other about these issues.

 

[Nick]

People make incorrect allegations of wrong doing all the time for a variety of reasons unfortunately, that's why there are procedures for investigating complaints in place in all parts of society.
You're showing no empathy with people who have potentially been racially abused which is strange considering you claim you want to educate yourself. You seem to be refusing to entertain the idea that maybe he has a case, (none of us will ever know so that part of the argument is pointless).
My position is even if the complaint is incorrect if someone has suffered a lot of racial abuse I can understand their sensitivity, you don't afford them that leeway, fair enough, but that's a very black and whiter postion of you'll forgive the pun, where comments either are racist or not and there's no room margin for error.

You only have to look at some of the slyness on this thread, not all racist remarks are a stream of obvious racist slurs.

Anyway, agree, disagree, I'm bailing out of this thread for a bit.

How do you investigate it though if somebody makes an accusation of racism to HR for example? If you have NW saying "If they say it's racism then it is" and you not allowing people to say "Is it actually racist?" then what do HR do?

It is a very dangerous precedent in this day and age to set though, surely? To go to the media making accusations when it may be that something might not be racist? Meanwhile people lose their jobs and get a witch-hunt. (Not disagreeing when things are actually racist by the way).

 

[Nick]

He never did call somebody a racist, though.

A good start to changing them is when people themselves, don't make the same comparisons surely?