Get behind the team (1 Viewer)

[mark82]

Sisu set the plan in motion years ago, they know the die hards will show come what may and are planning the structure of the club around this model.

The evidence is for all to see, no matter what we as fans do they have picked the plan and are sticking with it. It could be in the next few years if normal practice is resumed the Butts or Nuneaton will be to big for the club. But it's ok for Sisu it's what they want for the football side of the business, they really just need it's GS and its loyal solid fan base to allow them to carry on playing courts, appeals and silly buggers with all included. Aslong as they appease the FL with delay's, misdirection and claiming to be the victim, the fix will be in.

It's an opinion and in not anyway a dig at those who go, it's an individual decision and should be respected by us all.

Funds for court cases don't seem to be coming out of club funds. The club has been set up to be self sufficient one way or another. Less fans will mean lower playing budget. More fans will mean higher playing budget. Not going isn't impacting Sisu in any way but will impact Mark Robins and the team.

 

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[Chipfat]

Funds for court cases don't seem to be coming out of club funds. The club has been set up to be self sufficient one way or another. Less fans will mean lower playing budget. More fans will mean higher playing budget. Not going isn't impacting Sisu in any way but will impact Mark Robins and the team.

I didn't say court costs were a liability against club. I said Sisu have driven the club to a point where as the die hards will cover the running costs of the club so they can pursue court cases, appeals or claiming to be the victim.

It's a plan, it's not by default we are in L2, as for more turn up more money MR will get? Nearly a million from the cup run and we still don't have the biggest budget in L2? Better ST sales than normal with TM and we got relegated. I don't think more fans mean a bigger budget, I think that has been proved.

 

[Astute]

Have to say I always preferred away games myself. New places to explore, better atmosphere with the fans that travelled (who but a die-hard nutter would turn up to half the places we've been?!?)

So forgetting the old finance argument...

Hit the nail on the head.

I don't do as many home games as away. That is because I put more effort into going to away games. But why would I do this?

Home game.

Drive for about 4 and a half hours. Decide where I will pay to leave my car. Meet up with whoever I arrange to meet. Have a beer or two. Watch the lads have lots of beer. Make way to the stadium. Lack of atmosphere. And for most of the time lack of passion. Watch game. Find car. Travel back home.

Away game.

Book hotel somewhere if the game is further than Coventry. Could be Coventry or near where we are playing. Either drive to Coventry and get on a coach with the lads or drive there depending where the hotel is. Meet up with the lads. Hammer the pubs. Have a laugh with the natives. Have all our supporters close together. Watch the game. Go back to the pubs wherever I am staying.

Game closer to home.

Get the train and meet the lads in the pubs or drive to where we are playing, send the wife shopping and meet the lads in the pub or drive to Coventry and get on the coach with the lads. Have a laugh with the natives. And so on.

So called die hard supporters? Try looking at some of our away supporters. Hardly miss home or away. Prefer to go to the game than a family do.

My first game of the season I have arranged is Yeovil away. 700 mile round trip. Would have gone if it was a home game. Family get together that weekend. But they understand. Well worth it because it will be a good laugh. Taking my little girl to her first game. So will have a 7 and 8 year old with me. Her little brother has been going for 3 years now. But it had to be an away game to take her for the first time. Everyone's in a better mood. Everyone's there for a day out. All standing together and not spread all over. Even my little boy prefers away games. Our fellow supporters always look after him and talk to him. At home games he is just another kid.

 

[Skyblueloyal]

When the going get tough, you turn your back. That's loyal, Skyblueloyal.

I seen more bad times than you will ever know plus over the last 37 season missed only 4 games at home and about 15 away so I think my loyalty is not in question, when you've done the same then speak to me.

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

Do people only go depending on the league we are in then/

A lot yes, that's why we are different to any other club in the country.

 

[Esoterica]

I love these type of threads where one half of our fan base tells the other what to do. They always end up well. I hope SISU leave soon so people can go back to just being dickheads instead of dickheads with differing opinions to me on the politics surrounding our football club!

 

[Astute]

I seen more bad times than you will ever know plus over the last 37 season missed only 4 games at home and about 15 away so I think my loyalty is not in question, when you've done the same then speak to me.

Know the feeling. Been going to games for about the same amount of time. Nowhere near as dedicated as yourself though.

So what have I seen? What I thought was not very good years....many of them where we were the perennial relegation battlers. We had a couple of great seasons at the end of the 80's. But soon brought down to earth by Sutton. But we kept going. Eventually we ran out of luck. Welcome to Division 2.

Hey ho. At least we will see a top 6 finish. But no. Same old City. Then comes along Dennis Wise. Almost single handed took us to 7th. Then same old City again. Then it happens again. Welcome to Division 3. But we still go.

Hey ho. At least we will get the long awaited top 6 finish. We are going to smash it. OMG same old City. But we occasionally get our hopes raised. But eventually the impossible happens. But at least we get a day out at Wembley. A reason to feel proud for once.

Hey ho. Welcome to Division 4. At least we will smash it this time and get a top 6 finish.......

And yes we will still go.

 

[fernandopartridge]

I didn't say court costs were a liability against club. I said Sisu have driven the club to a point where as the die hards will cover the running costs of the club so they can pursue court cases, appeals or claiming to be the victim.

It's a plan, it's not by default we are in L2, as for more turn up more money MR will get? Nearly a million from the cup run and we still don't have the biggest budget in L2? Better ST sales than normal with TM and we got relegated. I don't think more fans mean a bigger budget, I think that has been proved.

What exactly is wrong with the concept of the club's running costs being covered by fans? It was a model that worked in football for many number of years until the Sky era.

I doubt very much it was a plan to relegate the club twice. If you believe that you're even more deluded than I thought.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

How would you be supporting the owners? I didn't know there was a hedge fund league.

Oh yeah there fucking isn't. If you're fed up of us being shit then don't go fine but blaming it on the owners is pathetic. Newcastle got shit owners, using the club as a branding exercise, have their fans given up? nope. Just our cowards.

Why is blaming it on the owners being pathetic? Whose fault is it that we are in the predicament we are in ten years on from Sisu taking over? Who do you say has got us in this state? The fans?
When Ashley finally leaves Newcastle they will have their stadium, training ground and academy. When Sisu go what will we have? There is no comparison between Newcastle's "state" and ours.
It would seem that for some on here there is no acceptable protest against Sisu including staying away. Nothing must upset the lads on the pitch. I support the team. I go home and away. However, without a club to support there will be no lads on the pitch. Until Sisu go, I can't see our situation improving. (I think we will be promoted this year. Success for the team, but as a club our situation is still likely to be dire).
There will never be a complete boycott of City games. People like me and thousands of others find it too hard to stay away. However, it is true that if nobody went Sisu would have to fund things to keep it going, CCFC would be costing them money which is more likely to see them go.At the moment they rely on the loyalty of fans to get enough through the gate so that the amount that they put in is minimal.Sisu are a fantastic example of NOPM.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

I can understand why fans stay away from the Club and don't buy tickets, merchandise, etc, but then I do appreciate the argument for supporting the team.

My question would be to those fans (NOPM or whatever your stance be), why do you do it, is it because you don't approve of the way SISU run CCFC or is it just because you don't like SISU to the extent, that you don't want CCFC to strive?

I think it's pretty clear now in the public domain that SISU don't give a about Coventry City, if we do well or fall into the abyss and they have alienated themselves from the Club. SISU have no involvement in the day to day running, they haven't made any decisions, in aspect of the Clubs operation since their tenure began, they don't invest and they don't take anything out.

The Club therefore runs on self-funded model and this needs the support of the fans, imagine the financial power Mark Robins would have in this division if we had 20,000 through the gate each week (half of the attendance at Wembley), it would be unbelievable.

It's time to separate CCFC and SISU, the people in charge at the Club are and so should the fans.

Which ever way you look at it Sisu are still involved with the club and can't simply be ignored. The fact that when you go into the stadium that was built for us, you are bombarded by Wasps paraphernalia, something that annoys and irritates me every time I go, is a reminder of what Sisu have done. As a fan, unfortunately, you can't just watch the team and forget or ignore what they have done and are doing to our club. Last year all of the media were aware of the way almost all of our fans view Sisu and want them out of our club. Just follow the team, no protests, everyone including the media, the football authorities and even Parliament (who were all forced to consider and comment on our plight last season) will assume everything is okay.

 

[mark82]

Why is blaming it on the owners being pathetic? Whose fault is it that we are in the predicament we are in ten years on from Sisu taking over? Who do you say has got us in this state? The fans?
When Ashley finally leaves Newcastle they will have their stadium, training ground and academy. When Sisu go what will we have? There is no comparison between Newcastle's "state" and ours.
It would seem that for some on here there is no acceptable protest against Sisu including staying away. Nothing must upset the lads on the pitch. I support the team. I go home and away. However, without a club to support there will be no lads on the pitch. Until Sisu go, I can't see our situation improving. (I think we will be promoted this year. Success for the team, but as a club our situation is still likely to be dire).
There will never be a complete boycott of City games. People like me and thousands of others find it too hard to stay away. However, it is true that if nobody went Sisu would have to fund things to keep it going, CCFC would be costing them money which is more likely to see them go.At the moment they rely on the loyalty of fans to get enough through the gate so that the amount that they put in is minimal.Sisu are a fantastic example of NOPM.

For me the biggest problem we have at the moment is the ground situation. Unfortunately people staying away is giving Sisu more ammo to move is to a smaller stadium like the Butts or Liberty Way once this year's contract runs out, or even worse outside the local area. They will point out that we don't have the supporter base to warrant renting a stadium like the Ricoh Arena. They'll say we need a maximum capacity of 12,000 like they have before.

Who is to blame if we do get moved away from the Ricoh? Definitely Sisu
Would I also apportion some blame to those that have stayed away and enabled them to do so? Damn right I will.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

40 years without a top 6 finish, SISU have been here 10 years. Who's fault was it for the previous 30? Are SISU to blame for where we are? Yes of course, not entirely though. Surely some blame must be laid at the door of previous managers and players. We paid money for Eastwood, he wasn't worth it. Coleman had money to spend and got us nowhere. It's not as simple as saying SISU have got us relegated, they have contributed towards it but didn't plan it as some like to think.

Regarding the stadium, it wasn't ours when they arrived. Blame Richardson, McGinnity and CCC for that. The training ground is still ours, it just has a charge on it. The academy? Well we'll have to wait and see.

If no one went they would still receive some income which they would just run the club with, they don't care if that meant relegation. They care about nothing but money. The notion a total boycott would see them running is wishful thinking IMO.

SISU have invested money into CCFC, admittedly badly. I have to admit if I'd invested 20m+, and got nothing for it from different managers and players, I would be reluctant to put any more in.

 

[mark82]

What exactly is wrong with the concept of the club's running costs being covered by fans? It was a model that worked in football for many number of years until the Sky era.

I doubt very much it was a plan to relegate the club twice. If you believe that you're even more deluded than I thought.

This is probably the only good thing they've done in their time here. Football, particularly in the lower leagues, needs to move back to a more sustainable model.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Which ever way you look at it Sisu are still involved with the club and can't simply be ignored. The fact that when you go into the stadium that was built for us, you are bombarded by Wasps paraphernalia, something that annoys and irritates me every time I go, is a reminder of what Sisu have done. As a fan, unfortunately, you can't just watch the team and forget or ignore what they have done and are doing to our club. Last year all of the media were aware of the way almost all of our fans view Sisu and want them out of our club. Just follow the team, no protests, everyone including the media, the football authorities and even Parliament (who were all forced to consider and comment on our plight last season) will assume everything is okay.

SISU done? They are not the only guilty party in the Ricoh mess.

 

[skybluebeduff]

Funds for court cases don't seem to be coming out of club funds. The club has been set up to be self sufficient one way or another. Less fans will mean lower playing budget. More fans will mean higher playing budget. Not going isn't impacting Sisu in any way but will impact Mark Robins and the team.

Wasn't going to bother getting into one of these debates, but you're wrong. Higher crowds has never produced bigger budgets since we've been in the bottom two leagues, please back it up with evidence and people may start believing you, I just know you won't find that evidence, because it's BS.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

This is probably the only good thing they've done in their time here. Football, particularly in the lower leagues, needs to move back to a more sustainable model.

This is what they should have done at the start. Address the massive wage bill and the stadium deal, whether that was the rental cost or purchasing half or all. They should have examined every cost and every possible revenue stream and essentially started from scratch. They didn't, so costs were sky high without the income to cover it, meaning they lost money. They didn't address the rental deal so paid 1m too much a year for too many years.

Does that mean they are to blame for anything and everything? No.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Wasn't going to bother getting into one of these debates, but you're wrong. Higher crowds has never produced bigger budgets since we've been in the bottom two leagues, please back it up with evidence and people may start believing you, I just know you won't find that evidence, because it's BS.

Has it led to profit then? If expenditure remains the same and income goes up, surely the surplus is profit?

 

[Nick]

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

SISU done? They are not the only guilty party in the Ricoh mess.

Exactly Sisu done. The move to Northampton lost us the chance to own the stadium and allowed Wasps to arrive. They used and are still using CCFC as a pawn.
Ten years they have been here, how far back do you want to go? They should have looked at finances properly before they took us over. It is also their fault appointing managers like Coleman who wasted money on players like Eastwood. Is it ten or eleven managers they have appointed. If all have been useless and failed whose fault is that. (I don't think they all have been useless by the way, just given an impossible task). The buck stops with the owners. They put 20 million in and got us into this state, yes that is their fault. The major issues of stadium, training ground and academy are all down to them.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

For me the biggest problem we have at the moment is the ground situation. Unfortunately people staying away is giving Sisu more ammo to move is to a smaller stadium like the Butts or Liberty Way once this year's contract runs out, or even worse outside the local area. They will point out that we don't have the supporter base to warrant renting a stadium like the Ricoh Arena. They'll say we need a maximum capacity of 12,000 like they have before.

Who is to blame if we do get moved away from the Ricoh? Definitely Sisu
Would I also apportion some blame to those that have stayed away and enabled them to do so? Damn right I will.

This is an argument for why we can never simply forget who owns us and just concentrate on the team.

 

[torchomatic]

Are Newcastle in league 2? I think not.

Doesn't matter what league your team is in. You support them regardless as a fan.

 

[mark82]

Wasn't going to bother getting into one of these debates, but you're wrong. Higher crowds has never produced bigger budgets since we've been in the bottom two leagues, please back it up with evidence and people may start believing you, I just know you won't find that evidence, because it's BS.

Crowds have reduced so the budget has got lower. At the point where crowds increase I will be able to show evidence. More money coming in would absolutely mean more money available to spend. There is no evidence of money being taken out of the club, unless I have missed something?

 

[mark82]

This is an argument for why we can never simply forget who owns us and just concentrate on the team.

I agree, but there are ways to protest that don't involve staying away. For me that would just be cutting my nose off to spite my face.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

This is probably the only good thing they've done in their time here. Football, particularly in the lower leagues, needs to move back to a more sustainable model.

I agree. If you wanted a return you would never "invest" in a football club. The problem is that Sisu's form of break even means cutting and running the club into the ground. Why don't they take a real interest, build the club's infrastructure, forge cooperative links with the community and so build turnover? They don't know how to do it or they don't care?

 

[skybluebeduff]

Crowds have reduced so the budget has got lower. At the point where crowds increase I will be able to show evidence. More money coming in would absolutely mean more money available to spend. There is no evidence of money being taken out of the club, unless I have missed something?

Never mentioned it being taken, but you claim better crowds increases the budget. 2 years ago when we were flying high, I never seen this budget increase, did you? Al I remember was the has beens that got signed up and wasted our season.

 

[torchomatic]

Wasn't going to bother getting into one of these debates, but you're wrong. Higher crowds has never produced bigger budgets since we've been in the bottom two leagues, please back it up with evidence and people may start believing you, I just know you won't find that evidence, because it's BS.

Similarly those who say our ST money is used for court costs or new shoes for Joy have zero evidence.

People can go and support or not. The club and the fans and the history will be there regardless.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

I agree, but there are ways to protest that don't involve staying away. For me that would just be cutting my nose off to spite my face.

The problem , as mentioned above, is that no protest is acceptable, or perhaps only those that are out of sight and out of mind such as a sit in in an empty stadium.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

Similarly those who say our ST money is used for court costs or new shoes for Joy have zero evidence.

People can go and support or not. The club and the fans and the history will be there regardless.

Just hope that the club will still be there and not consigned to history.

 

[skybluebeduff]

Has it led to profit then? If expenditure remains the same and income goes up, surely the surplus is profit?

CCFC owners Sisu's accounts show profits and payments to bosses

 

[Nick]

CCFC owners Sisu's accounts show profits and payments to bosses

Yeah, that's SISU's accounts.....

 

[skybluebeduff]

Similarly those who say our ST money is used for court costs or new shoes for Joy have zero evidence.

People can go and support or not. The club and the fans and the history will be there regardless.

Joy buying shoes dosen't effect the club, investment or in SISU's case lack of, does. Think you missed my point, increased attendances haven't increased the budget, you only have to go back 2 years to see that.

 

[skybluebeduff]

Yeah, that's SISU's accounts.....

Coventry City accounts show £700,000 profit but debts of £44m
Sorry wrong link lol

 

[Grendel]

Coventry City accounts show £700,000 profit but debts of £44m
Sorry wrong link lol

It's an operating loss.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Exactly Sisu done. The move to Northampton lost us the chance to own the stadium and allowed Wasps to arrive. They used and are still using CCFC as a pawn.
Ten years they have been here, how far back do you want to go? They should have looked at finances properly before they took us over. It is also their fault appointing managers like Coleman who wasted money on players like Eastwood. Is it ten or eleven managers they have appointed. If all have been useless and failed whose fault is that. (I don't think they all have been useless by the way, just given an impossible task). The buck stops with the owners. They put 20 million in and got us into this state, yes that is their fault. The major issues of stadium, training ground and academy are all down to them.

Can you provide evidence that if we hadn't moved to Northampton we would own the Ricoh? The information and evidence available suggests otherwise. CCC didn't want CCFC to own the stadium, sorry if that ruins the SISU are to blame for everything picture you're painting but it's true.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Never mentioned it being taken, but you claim better crowds increases the budget. 2 years ago when we were flying high, I never seen this budget increase, did you? Al I remember was the has beens that got signed up and wasted our season.

The has beens would have cost money. I can't imagine Ramage, Henderson and Hunt being on low wages.