Has the penny dropped yet? (2 Viewers)

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lewys33

lewys33

Well-Known Member
Wasn't there something about the council wanting the football club to pay for the development of the land around the Ricoh?

Hmmm ...... I'm sure the wasps owner said that the council own the land around the Ricoh and it is up to them what they do with it.
 
skybluetony176

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
lordsummerisle said:
Don't think that they had much choice in the matter.

They should certainly have got an awful lot more for a 50% share of a 250 year lease on the Ricoh and surrounding land than they did get.

Of course, neither they, nor the Council had to sell an allegedly profitable enterprise at all, and ACL should have negotiated a much longer lease than they had when the loan was rejigged.

As OSB said, this would have added far more value to the ACL asset, value that would have been in the hands of a local charity and local authority, rather than a London Rugby club backed by a Maltese Financial Services company.

This isn't saying that it should have been sold to Sisu at all by the way, just bad business for local taxpayers and charities.
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Were Higgs selling a 250year lease with their share of ACL or were they just selling their share which only ever had the remainder of the original lease?
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
skybluetony176 said:
Were Higgs selling a 250year lease with their share of ACL or were they just selling their share which only ever had the remainder of the original lease?
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Their share. The council never allowed such a lease when they had the shares. How charitable
 
Rusty Trombone

Rusty Trombone

Well-Known Member
lordsummerisle said:
Don't think that they had much choice in the matter.

They should certainly have got an awful lot more for a 50% share of a 250 year lease on the Ricoh and surrounding land than they did get.

Of course, neither they, nor the Council had to sell an allegedly profitable enterprise at all, and ACL should have negotiated a much longer lease than they had when the loan was rejigged.

As OSB said, this would have added far more value to the ACL asset, value that would have been in the hands of a local charity and local authority, rather than a London Rugby club backed by a Maltese Financial Services company.

This isn't saying that it should have been sold to Sisu at all by the way, just bad business for local taxpayers and charities.
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It wouldn't appear to be a great list of choices, I think it was get out now for a large loss, or get out later for a possibly larger one. Too much of a gamble for them.

Of course the lease hadn't been extended before the Higgs deal was agreed with wasps, so Higgs couldn't get more for their share on the basis of the lease extension, so this was still a better deal than the SISU one.

I agree with you about the rest of the post.
 
skybluetony176

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
lordsummerisle said:
If I'd been them I'd have kept the 50% share as soon as the lease was extended to 250 years by CCC for Wasps, instant jump in value of their share without having to do anything.
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Did the lease on their half automatically get extended to 250 years when Wasps bought the council share with a 250 year lease? I can see how the council could issue a 250 year lease with their share as they own the freehold but i would imagine Higgs share only had the original lease attached to it.
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
skybluetony176 said:
Did the lease on their half automatically get extended to 250 years when Wasps bought the council share with a 250 year lease? I can see how the council could issue a 250 year lease with their share as they own the freehold but i would imagine Higgs share only had the original lease attached to it.
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The lease is on the property so they would be the same. As stated from the beginning this was a 100% deal for wasps.
 
oldskyblue58

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
skybluetony176 said:
Were Higgs selling a 250year lease with their share of ACL or were they just selling their share which only ever had the remainder of the original lease?
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No the charity never owned the lease or part of it. The lease is an asset of the company it is not directly attached to the shareholders

ACL owned the original lease which was granted. The Charity did not. The charity owned the 50% shares in ACL, which were represented by the combined value of the assets and liabilities

Not sure the timings of the lease and who got it. Did London Wasps holdings get it? or did ACL? Was that before or after Wasps getting 50% or 100% of the shares. What became of the old lease? If the old lease were cancelled then where is the refund on the premium paid? Was the refund added to the extra payment by Wasps? Did the old lease provide extra value transferred to the new lease? Was a refund infact due? etc etc
 
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lordsummerisle

lordsummerisle

Well-Known Member
oldskyblue58 said:
No the charity never owned the lease or part of it. The lease is an asset of the company it is not directly attached to the shareholders

ACL owned the original lease which was granted. The Charity did not. The charity owned the 50% shares in ACL, which were represented by the combined value of the assets and liabilities

Not sure the timings of the lease and who got it. Did London Wasps holdings get it? or did ACL? Was that before or after Wasps getting 50% or 100% of the shares. What became of the old lease? If the old lease were cancelled then where is the refund on the premium paid? Was the refund added to the extra payment by Wasps? Did the old lease provide extra value transferred to the new lease? Was a refund infact due? etc etc
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Commercial confidentiality, nda, blah de blah, etc, etc.

All good questions, which really require good answers, not hiding behind the above,

Open and transparent local government, "localism" in action at it's very best.
 
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