Could Wasps veto the sale to CCFC Ltd? I believe the council could have ?
Just asking, as I haven't a clue.... (about this or anything else - thought I would say this before anyone else did...)
Its a good question and the transfer of right to veto I believe has happened so in theory one must assume yes - I wonder who their preferred bidder is
Am not an insolvency expert but as I see it.............
CCFC Ltd still exists. Other than keeping the option live I see no real reason why it hasn't been wound up previously.
Its only asset is the option to make the first bid on the Higgs Charity. The formula included in the option can not be utilised because of the debts owed to ACL by CCFC Ltd
Against that asset is set all the creditors. The administration listed the following creditors ACL £636K ARVO 10.2m CCFC Holdings 44.7m SBS&L 14.5m
The proposed CVA that was rejected August 2013 has no effect on those values so the write off of loans by SISU are ignored unless they offer to do that again - ie the amounts stay at full value.
What I am less certain of is the value of the ACL creditor that may well be reinstated under the liquidation at the full contractual value in excess of 56m. Also has the liquidation of CCFC H removed that 44.7m debt from the equation or did Otium acquire the rights to that debt?
If, as I believe the full value of the ACL contract is now included in the list of creditors then that puts ACL in a far stronger position when deciding a creditors settlement - in fact they could even be the biggest creditor. ACL are of course now owned by the Charity and Wasps
The option remains in CCFC Ltd and can not be transferred without the Charity Trustees permission. CCFC Ltd has no funds to make a bid. To bring funds in to CCFC ltd you have to sell it and do a deal with its creditors - all apparently within 30 days.
For a third party to acquire the rights under the option then they would have to purchase CCFC Ltd from the liquidator and to complete a settlement (CVA?) with its creditors before making a bid for the shares the Charity own. That bid is not guaranteed to succeed, it can be rejected by the charity and as I understand it once the option is used then you cant go back and reuse it - ie the option dies.
Would either Otium or SBS&L be a third party? Well it depends where the shares in CCFC Ltd now reside and that is not clear. They could write off their loans in CCFC H and SBS&L in any settlement but that then leaves the ARVO and ACL plus HMRC. Write down the CCFC H & SBSL loans and ACL could be the biggest creditor and be in control of the process.
Add in the possibility of a Wasp veto of any share sale - speculation no facts released on that - but it could be
I would imagine there are feverish discussions between lawyers, advisors and liquidators going on right now as to how to get round all this. Also that they keep hitting brick walls
Can't help but think that this is keeping to the letter of the law, so that any sale can not be challenged and that ownership by anyone other than Wasps is a non starter.
Sorry to disappoint peoples hopes but I don't see CCFC owning 50%
But we will shall see. Clock ticking again.......
Its a good question and the transfer of right to veto I believe has happened so in theory one must assume yes - I wonder who their preferred bidder is
A
I would imagine there are feverish discussions between lawyers, advisors and liquidators going on right now as to how to get round all this. Also that they keep hitting brick walls
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I expect the lights will be on at Ryton late into the night.
Looking at how Wasps have conducted themselves (purchase,New local sponsor, PR etc) to this point they appear to be very organised and I would not expect that they would enter into any open ended agreement.
I see it the same way as oldskyblue58. Think its a process thing to ensure all the i's are dotted and T's crossed.
Looking at how Wasps have conducted themselves (purchase,New local sponsor, PR etc) to this point they appear to be very organised and I would not expect that they would enter into any open ended agreement. There will be a due process with a defined outcome we are just going through the motions.
I see it the same way as oldskyblue58. Think its a process thing to ensure all the i's are dotted and T's crossed.
Looking at how Wasps have conducted themselves (purchase,New local sponsor, PR etc) to this point they appear to be very organised and I would not expect that they would enter into any open ended agreement. There will be a due process with a defined outcome we are just going through the motions.
This is not what was said. The liquidator can buy the shares if in their judgement it would benefit the major creditors of the liquidated entity.
That's a very very different scenario I'm afraid.
But Sisu have always said that they wanted the freehold of the Ricoh and the freehold isn't up for grabs is it. They would be doing a U turn if they make a bid.
The major creditors of CCFC Ltd are SISU aren't they?This is not what was said. The liquidator can buy the shares if in their judgement it would benefit the major creditors of the liquidated entity.
That's a very very different scenario I'm afraid.
Who is the major creditor
It is quite straight forward
SISU have a choice that many are outraged they never had.
This wasps deal is finally going to bring an end to this rubbish.
Do they buy 50% of ACL for 2.77 million or not. 30 days to decide I believe
The major creditors of CCFC Ltd are SISU aren't they?
Originally Posted by oldskyblue58
I would imagine there are feverish discussions between lawyers, advisors and liquidators going on right now as to how to get round all this. Also that they keep hitting brick walls
excellent post osb58, the thing is, all the brick walls are dead ends all put in place by our illustrious owners as part of their plans to thwart anybody else buying into the ground. Now it has come back to feck them over :jerkit:
Who is the major creditor
It is quite straight forward
SISU have a choice that many are outraged they never had.
This wasps deal is finally going to bring an end to this rubbish.
Do they buy 50% of ACL for 2.77 million or not. 30 days to decide I believe
What does it matter if Wasps have the right to veto anyway?
The major creditors of CCFC Ltd are SISU aren't they?
covcity4life............... you know fuck all about me but after 47 years a supporter that could be my nickname, so how dare you say I'm happy!! all I am saying is SISU had the chance to get everything Wasps have taken from us, and it's their own fault they haven't. so if you want to say things face to face you can find me in my ST seat in block 31 row m seat 1 for a friendly discussion on things:wave:bet your well happy
I think that battle was lost in the administration process. I might be wrong.I would imagine ACL would claim the 44 years remaining on the lease is a debt owed
OSB do you think this could a very clever way to force SISU to sell CCFC to the wasp owners or another bidder for the 50% of ACL that is forsale?
It is interesting that Anne Lucas was quite open on Sky TV about CCFC having an option to buy the Higgs share, why would she do that if it were not possible? Pointing it out as she did would piss off Wasps you would have thought, and surely she would want to avoid that. So why say it?
Because it is possible and she wants it happen?
Because it is possible and was part of the plan all along?
Because she doesn't understand that its not possible?
Because she knows its not possible and is giving SISU the finger?
Any other suggestions?
SISU had the chance to get everything Wasps have taken from us, and it's their own fault they haven't.
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