Otis
Well-Known Member
I do agree with much of what you are saying.
I do agree with much of what you are saying.On the homophobic stuff. I think it's wrong to chant anything at people who were born that way. Black, homosexual, Ginger, Bald, facial disfigurement, handicapped. If genetics did something to u that you had no control over it's scummy to make people feel like sh*t for something they can't change and probably makes them feel self conscious/marginalised to differing degrees.
The next level down is things people can change such as weight, hairstyle etc.
...and so ends the debate.If you need to draw a line why not start with a basic understanding of structural disadvantage? Very few people have excrement put through their letterboxes because they are bald, drawing attention to their baldness is a different order of insult to that experienced by minorities, women and the marginalised. You might hurt an individual’s feelings by being rude about their hairline but it doesn’t tap into an endemic and systematic level of bias against bald people as a category.
Alternatively as you hint, we might want to start to construct a positive view of our own support and team that doesn’t depend on a jaundiced view of the opponents and their fans. Let’s not hold our breath though
On the homophobic stuff. I think it's wrong to chant anything at people who were born that way. Black, homosexual, Ginger, Bald, facial disfigurement, handicapped. If genetics did something to u that you had no control over it's scummy to make people feel like sh*t for something they can't change and probably makes them feel self conscious/marginalised to differing degrees.
The next level down is things people can change such as weight, hairstyle etc.
I'm not really sure any of it is ok, whether they can change it or not. And who is not to say something like weight is down to something genetic or medical? Or hairstyles could be due to something like alopecia? Some disabilities are self inflicted, would this make it ok to mock? Where is the line you draw when you decide if something is self-inflicted or can be changed?
Yeah, really good natured, that.
Wolf whistling at a guy in a pink shirt at a football match is banta!
Marching a guy to the top of the tallest building and throwing him off, so he plummets to his death is Homophobic.
So can all the pc nazi's please get some perspective on the issue.
Wolf whistling at a guy in a pink shirt at a football match is banta!
Marching a guy to the top of the tallest building and throwing him off, so he plummets to his death is Homophobic.
So can all the pc nazi's please get some perspective on the issue.
Not at all, as racist language is usually (if not always ) used to cause offence.Using that logic the use of racist language could be considered ‘banta’ and a premeditated murder would be racist.
Not at all, as racist language is usually (if not always ) used to cause offence.
Banta is a Micky take, a harmless leg pull etc.
By all accounts, the guy in the pink shirt just ignored his detractors, until they got bored, and in doing so, gained the moral high ground.
He didnt appear offended, or break down in floods of tears, or rush home and start a thread on an online forum.
Maybe he thought there was enough loonies around to get offended for him.
Now, before the keyboard judges, jurors and executioners on here start to go into total meltdown, I'm NOT condoning any anti social behaviour, what I AM saying is let's just put things into perspective. On a day when 2 famous clubs may disappear for ever, a bit of harmless, probably good natured banta is not the biggest problem with football.
Yep was blatantly homophobic and not ok. I suppose there was no physical danger to the person that makes it a little differentI'm not sure that's fair. Whose to say it is harmless? How do you know he wasnt just putting a brave face on?
Bottom line it IS homophobic. They were taking the piss out of someone for potentially being gay because he wore pink...
I'm not personally offended but I can see how some people would be. To brush it off as "banta" (another cringe word often used to defend bullying) is just ignorant.
I'm not sure that's fair. Whose to say it is harmless? How do you know he wasnt just putting a brave face on?
Bottom line it IS homophobic. They were taking the piss out of someone for potentially being gay because he wore pink...
I'm not personally offended but I can see how some people would be. To brush it off as "banta" (another cringe word often used to defend bullying) is just ignorant.
By all accounts, the guy in the pink shirt just ignored his detractors, until they got bored, and in doing so, gained the moral high ground.
He didnt appear offended, or break down in floods of tears, or rush home and start a thread on an online forum.
But that's just your opinion, it isn't fact. I thought the chanting was silly, immature and not welcome. Did it display a fear of homosexuality? That's a bit of a stretch.
I think it is self-evident that people did not appreciate it and on the back of that, I think it is very unlikely we'll hear this again. So calling this stuff out is fine, but people are trying a little too hard to virtue signal here.
What’s fear got to do with it? Homophobia is about more than a fear. It also covers slurs and discrimination. The football authorities prosecute now for it, so it’s more just someone’s opinion.
Totally agree, the level of outrage has gone far beyond what was required for this particular incidentYou know I was talking about the definition of the word and what it actually means. If you think that word has broader connotations, fine, but I think it devalues the word personally. I say this as someone who has several family members who are gay including my daughter. I know what real homophobia looks like. In my opinion this was simply a display of stupidity and immaturity, but I'll leave it there.
You know I was talking about the definition of the word and what it actually means. If you think that word has broader connotations, fine, but I think it devalues the word personally. I say this as someone who has several family members who are gay including my daughter. I know what real homophobia looks like. In my opinion this was simply a display of stupidity and immaturity, but I'll leave it there.
Some of you are mad.
If a large group of young lads shout and point at someone they dont know and say "whose the gay boy in the pink" suggesting they think A. He might be gay and B. That if he is it's funny and they should single him out for abuse....how the hell is that NOT homophobic?
No. The joke isn’t “you’re gay and being gay is funny”. It’s “you’re not gay but you look like you are”.
Just like if my mate turns up looking like a Rasta or a WW1 soldier I’ll take the piss because he’s not those things. I’m not making a value judgement on the things he looks like. Incongruence is the very basis of comedy.
Aside from anything else, this constant language policing isn’t effective at changing people’s behaviours. It’s a selfish act designed to make you feel better, as I said before people pick and choose which offences to take on behalf of others which kind of pops their sense of superiority.
I doubt anyone in this thread would be OK with actual homophobic bullying of actual gay people.
Ah yes, I too remember the horror stories of people being scared to come out as fat/bald/ginger....
Wearing pink clearlyWhat makes a person look gay?
What makes a person look gay?
Having a cock in their mouth is usually a clue.What makes a person look gay?
I congratulate you Shmmeee on the use of the word “incongruence”No. The joke isn’t “you’re gay and being gay is funny”. It’s “you’re not gay but you look like you are”.
Just like if my mate turns up looking like a Rasta or a WW1 soldier I’ll take the piss because he’s not those things. I’m not making a value judgement on the things he looks like. Incongruence is the very basis of comedy.
Aside from anything else, this constant language policing isn’t effective at changing people’s behaviours. It’s a selfish act designed to make you feel better, as I said before people pick and choose which offences to take on behalf of others which kind of pops their sense of superiority.
I doubt anyone in this thread would be OK with actual homophobic bullying of actual gay people.
Having a cock in their mouth is usually a clue.
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